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Forums > Home› PvP Discussion

how to counter a Oathbound paladin

foxxy#4211 foxxy
foxxy#4211
 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 563 Arc User
edited May 2015 in PvP Discussion
Is there any way to counter them?
As far as i see and experience, this class has an amazing tankiness, almost impossible to kill. Additionally to this, he has skills that buffs their damage as well. Their main outgoing damage is divine judgement, a daily that is dodgeable but not always successful to do it, as it has a low cast animation and 40' range. this range should be reduced as well as its damage. Just leveling a new character and all i see, OP are in top with so many kills and few deaths.
My humble question is how can u introduce a class that is unbalanced in some aspects (not all). I have analized some OP and my conclusion is either going healing or defensive, the result will be the same, an unkillable class with a insta kill daily. seriously?

Oh! and rogues next to them in top. Its nearly hard to see a wizard, warlock, ranger, cleric or weapon figther in top 1.
Post edited by foxxy#4211 on
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Comments

  • rversantrversant Member Posts: 896 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    What I've been doing is saving combo for when Sanc goes down, without sanc if they havnt spammed too much temp hp they drop pretty quick however I'm in 60-69 pvp still atm because I'vebeen lazy. Can still drop them on my TR, and on my GWF (if I get IBS crit and have Savage advance for more CC), Paladin vs paladin ends up with us both just sitting on the point talking about stuff. If you have a TR on your team you can chain stuns / dazes so they cant get their sanc or temp hp back up and melt. they do take 2+ people too kill usually though if they are good, but a "tank" with low overall DPS should be hard to kill.
    People are way too negative, Why cant we just all get along.


    Drunken Goose of MidNight Express. - 3.3k Paladin , 3.6k GWF , 3.1k GF,
  • pando83pando83 Member Posts: 2,564 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Yup, i noticed too that it's all up to timing your burst and CC when specific powers are not up. Just have to learn the specific visual effects of each power lol :D
  • greatweaponarmygreatweaponarmy Member Posts: 352 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Bring a CW.
  • overdriver13overdriver13 Member Posts: 1,521 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Seems like cc>burst is the way to go against the more tricky classes. On my tr it is dazing strike>stealth>duelists>smoke bomb>duelists. If a daily is up that goes in place of the first duelists. On my gf it is [mark] bullrush>lunging>anvil..cw you pretty much look at it and its frozen then do what you want. Patience and timing. I think a lot of it is just the old chess match of who is going to mess up the timing of their cd's first. Some paladins seem outright invincible, though that is true of any class with good gear driven by a good player imho.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • fastrean3fastrean3 Member Posts: 281 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    openforbreakfast wrote: »
    You counter the Paladin the same way you counter any other class, by knowing what to use and when to use it. Very high success rate vs Paladin comes with using Terror but since its price skyrocketed recently thats not a good option for most people.

    If I meet an equal gear Paladin with my own Protection Pala the only way to kill him is to catch him off sanctuary with the daily. Like posters above have stated well timed cc and then heavy burst is the way to go.

    Op vs op is like a turtle fight....
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • vitizaxvitizax Member Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    If op is tank ignore him, if he is healer cc him. Kill both last, not even killing them if not in a spot.
  • ivantomdisplayivantomdisplay Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Freeze him. Choke him. Push him...Dodge. And watch for cc immunity frame. Repeat until bloody thing is dead.
    [10:49] [Combat (Self)] Your Proton Barrage deals 96581 (43411) Proton(Critical) to Seto.
    Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
  • packrat0packrat0 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 132 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    The paladin is very vulnerable to both chill stack freezing and whatever is that stun shot from the HR. Those appear to bypass their shift feature. Then you have a small window of time to dps before they use their CC break power.
    Also, rooting powers, while not completely disabling, do root through shift, so it can buy you time, keep them away from you, and force them to deplete their stamina as they can't close in to do their own attacks.
    Further, something like courage breaker or the slowing feature on deft strike, followed by a smoke bomb, can be used to great effect.
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    From a GF point of view: Stack tons of arpen, debuff as much as possible, terror/plaguefire helps a lot, wait for their cheap/silly skill to wear off, prone, apply damage, pray the OP is dead, if not rinse and repeat.

  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    colonelwing wrote: »
    From a GF point of view: Stack tons of arpen, debuff as much as possible, terror/plaguefire helps a lot, wait for their cheap/silly skill to wear off, prone, apply damage, pray the OP is dead, if not rinse and repeat.

    ArPen? Really? You do realize that with tenacity gear you easily get 80%+ ArPen resistance in PvP? It's the worst stat to stack in PvP.
  • packrat0packrat0 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 132 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    I have gone up against colonelwing, and while my pally is not particularly well-geared by this point, whatever they have going on when fighting OP does seem more effective where other GFs have failed miserably.
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    zvieris wrote: »
    ArPen? Really? You do realize that with tenacity gear you easily get 80%+ ArPen resistance in PvP? It's the worst stat to stack in PvP.

    Blubb, i have 75% resistance ignored from stats alone. Add pf, 2x mark on top of that, then enjoy your 5% ~ -(minus)20% arpen resistance.

  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    colonelwing wrote: »
    Blubb, i have 75% resistance ignored from stats alone. Add pf, 2x mark on top of that, then enjoy your 5% ~ -(minus)20% arpen resistance.

    What the hell are you talking about? 80% arpen resistance means that your arpen is only 20% effective. Meaning your 75% RI becomes 15%. Have fun with that. Also, PF reduces def of the target, mark reduces DR of the target, they do not reduce tenacity in any way.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    embracemysword wrote: »
    Even though hes wrong, arpen is still more effective than anything else. Especially against high DR targets such as OP. Plaguefire reduces defense, defense is DR. And that is the question being asked 'how to counter an OP?' The answer is not by stacking power, because +10% damage addon does the job. Nope.

    Imho, crit is what you should be stacking. While crit damage is affected by tenacity it's not as severe as ArPen. Lifesteal is an option too if you plan to stalemate a Paladin. Which, by the way, seems like the only option to "counter" geared protection paladins at the moment.

    As for healer paladins, they're rather easy to take care of. Most of their healing comes from active use of encounters and at-wills so if you can prevent that, they're dead.
  • blackxxwolf3blackxxwolf3 Member Posts: 1,539 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    stuns are a great way to counter a paladin. just watch out for the shift feature. hit around that try to fake it a lot of pallys try to use ti like a gf shield and it doesnt work at all. wait for their damage immunity encounter to wear away and let it all go jsut use at wills until that point. i never lose to a pally in pvp because i outplay them its very possible as long as they arent using broken feats.
  • pando83pando83 Member Posts: 2,564 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    I faced a temp HP tank OP. Didn't understand yet how to...understand when you must attack.
    Explanation: he was sitting there on 2, we hitting him, damage was there but even with 20k-30k hits his HPs didn't bounce. So we stop, wait a bit, then randomly retry to burst and he goes down fast.

    Question: the temp HP tank path has its tools, but how do you get a clue about when you need to time your burst?
    I mean, the shift ability is a large blue shining circle...so you can't really miss it. But didn't understand how the temp HP tank works.
  • blackxxwolf3blackxxwolf3 Member Posts: 1,539 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    pando83 wrote: »
    I faced a temp HP tank OP. Didn't understand yet how to...understand when you must attack.
    Explanation: he was sitting there on 2, we hitting him, damage was there but even with 20k-30k hits his HPs didn't bounce. So we stop, wait a bit, then randomly retry to burst and he goes down fast.

    Question: the temp HP tank path has its tools, but how do you get a clue about when you need to time your burst?
    I mean, the shift ability is a large blue shining circle...so you can't really miss it. But didn't understand how the temp HP tank works.
    honestly there isnt a real way to know except how the pally acts. he usually trys to get away when the times up.
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    pando83 wrote: »
    I faced a temp HP tank OP. Didn't understand yet how to...understand when you must attack.
    Explanation: he was sitting there on 2, we hitting him, damage was there but even with 20k-30k hits his HPs didn't bounce. So we stop, wait a bit, then randomly retry to burst and he goes down fast.

    Question: the temp HP tank path has its tools, but how do you get a clue about when you need to time your burst?
    I mean, the shift ability is a large blue shining circle...so you can't really miss it. But didn't understand how the temp HP tank works.

    What you witnessed is binding oath encounter. Paladin takes 50% of the damage he received within the duration of the skill (6-8s) which can be further reduced by DR or sanctuary if it's up when the buff runs out. It's a really OP encounter. Imho it should be reworked to do piercing damage when the buff runs out or better, take 50% damage for the duration of the skill instead of adding it all up and then dealing the damage when buff runs out.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • mehguy138mehguy138 Member Posts: 1,803 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Tried to play domination (big mistake), faced overgeared tankadin and it was................ I don't even know what to say. Zero damage, literally zero damage ALL THE TIME. And they don't even need to actually hit you with that atwill to build shield stacks. It's so freaking ******ed, like faithful DC and TR combined.
    M6 almost drains your soul given how boring it is. (c) joocycuzzzzzz
  • zvieriszvieris Member Posts: 1,261 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    mehguy138 wrote: »
    Tried to play domination (big mistake), faced overgeared tankadin and it was................ I don't even know what to say. Zero damage, literally zero damage ALL THE TIME. And they don't even need to actually hit you with that atwill to build shield stacks. It's so freaking ******ed, like faithful DC and TR combined.

    Faithful DC and TR combined? Where do you see TR in there? :) Paladin is the complete opposite of TR. Unless you meant the dazing part. Which is a result of a bugged offhand.

    Although the survivability is indeed off the charts. It's not uncommon for my paladin to solo tank 3-6 players in GG and live to tell the story. Ofc, mostly scrubs but still.
  • foxxy#4211 foxxy
    foxxy#4211
         Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 563 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    zvieris wrote: »
    Faithful DC and TR combined? Where do you see TR in there? :) Paladin is the complete opposite of TR. Unless you meant the dazing part. Which is a result of a bugged offhand.

    Although the survivability is indeed off the charts. It's not uncommon for my paladin to solo tank 3-6 players in GG and live to tell the story. Ofc, mostly scrubs but still.

    im sure he meant by TR, their OP daily "divine judgement, which is a massive reworked of shocking execution". Shocking execution ignores ur defense, dealing around not more than ur HP (currently). if u have 0 defense, it might deal 120k on crit. I saw someone posted divine judgement dealt 300k+ in a crit. so TR and DC combined, for sure.
  • quspivquspiv Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,087 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Tanks should be hard to kill but they shouldnt have burst dmg, that's why Paladin's daily need's to be nerfed in pvp only. Same with few GF encounters. (imo)
  • fastrean3fastrean3 Member Posts: 281 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Yeah, take the "divine judgement " away from the pally daily and replace a stronger daily like group defence buff /group healing/group cc immunity/low damage but huge distance repel aoe. Pally only need to protect their teammates, don't need damage
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    quspiv wrote: »
    Tanks should be hard to kill but they shouldnt have burst dmg, that's why Paladin's daily need's to be nerfed in pvp only. Same with few GF encounters. (imo)

    Sorry but my GF, is not a tank. I've told you this before. I spec for damage and that's what i have. If i get caught off guard once, i am as squishy as a SW.

    Thanks and bye.

    P.S. here's a video of an actual Neverwinter 'tank' Enjoy :)

  • sentineltitaniasentineltitania Member Posts: 63 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    fastrean3 wrote: »
    Yeah, take the "divine judgement " away from the pally daily and replace a stronger daily like group defence buff /group healing/group cc immunity/low damage but huge distance repel aoe. Pally only need to protect their teammates, don't need damage

    By your logic:

    - A control wizard should have his damage greatly reduced as well.. since you know? It's a CONTROL wizard.

    - A devoted cleric shouldn't DPS at all.. since you know? Its destiny is to be devoted to helping others, a lifetime support

    - A Great Weapon Fighter should be able to completely brutalize people and cut them off to pieces.. since you know? He sacrifices a shield for a two-handed GreatSword



    Etc etc.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
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