I've been waiting for this complaint to crop up.
Let me get my popcorn.
Im waiting to see what mod 6 bring because losing the 25-30% more stealth from set bonus means much less in stealth CoS spamming.
However the initial DESIGN of "piercing damage" was because it was a % of damage that would be "double mitigated" by DR.
Piercing Blades (HR feat) was the first of this, and then they started adding it as a damage type that was never "post-DR factored".
So as an example: Shadow of Demise - it does "Post DR" damage so in theory it SHOULD be "piercing" Shadowy Opportunity - is a flat 75% of weapon damage, NEVER was mitigated by DR once. Shocking Execution - piercing, never mitigated by DR.
Its the abilities that are never mitigated ONCE by DR that need addressing, not necessarily the ones that have ALREADY been mitigated down once.
Oh and as always to make sure the DEVs see it:
BUG: KNIFE'S EDGE: Abilities like Blood Bath, it procs off EVERY hit giving the TR a FULL encounter cooldown on all encounters. So you can hit "ITC" "Blood Bath" then ITC again back to back.
Dude, you are a really good CW and beat me as a Saboteur.
Thanks, told you I wasn't all-talk.
Brownie points for your Trickster Rogue's appearance.
There is a long list of MI Saboteurs who can beat you.
No, I'm serious when I say there's only a handful of Sabs that can defeat me in a duel.
Why? Because the general skill of the TR population (Even in high-end) is really low/skillless, MOST are VERY predictable. Only a handful are truly lethal.
I'm far more worried of Executioner than Saboteur if you ask me. Exe is better at dealing with CW due to the SoD double proc bug.
The way I see it.... is like this
To deal with:
Control Wizard (Good): Exe > Sab > Scoundrel
Control Wizard (Pug-level): Scoundrel > Exe = Sab
Hunter Ranger: Scoundrel > Sab > Exe
Guardian Fighter: Sab > Scoundrel > Exe
Great Weapon Fighter: Sab > Exe > Scoundrel
Devoted Cleric: Sab > Exe > Scoundrel
Warlock: Just press 1 button.. but incase of WhisperKnife, then Scoundrel > Sab > Exe
While I agree that MI Saboteurs are grossly OP, as per usual, you want to take things to the extreme against TR to fix the wrong things.
Not me personally.. but I agree the population does.
There is only minor tweaks to be done... to make TR balanced. I've always said it and will keep saying it. WhisperKnife is the closest thing to a balanced TR.
Devs need to:
1) Fix the dam Knife Edge feat already
2) ITC ends when you use any power OR ITC only makes you break free of CC, no deflect.
3) Piercing Into Physical.
4) Shocking Execution respecting Tenacity
That's it... Nothing more.
Overall, there are just as many things wrong with the CW as their are the TR.
Far from that... let's be real here. There are only two things wrong with CW (PVP) at the moment. And it's Shield and Storm Spell.
How to Kill the Control Wizard class in two steps:
1) Nerf Shield
2) Nerf Storm Spell
Tada, you now have a CW worse than a Warlock.
Beta player
One of the many Control Wizards that misses Shard Of The Endless Avalanche. RIP Shard (Beta-Mod3)
They simply need to remove piercing and proccing damage completely from the game. If i don't hit you, I don't do damage, if you don't hit me, you don't do damage. Easy fix, take away all the crutches and force people to learn to play instead of looking for exploits. Because let's face it, in this game, it seems he who can push the least buttons is the best. TR with arti main for COS, can hit tab and left click and kill, GWF can swing a sword in a circle and take out a whole team, really no need to even see anyone.
Like I've said before, all those BS mechanics were put in place for the pay to play. Every class has a build that can be OP with money. Cryptic made sure that if you like the game, but just suck at it, you can pay to become a skill less one button beast because of these mechanics. The thing is, to become that one button beast with a tr, it's just cheaper, therefore, we have thousands of Tr's that are really useless for the most part (as team members).
The mechanics were introduced to keep the crazy people that spend thousands on a character from crying that someone with 6k gs less is killing them, hence the ridiculous proccing damage that does massive stupid damage, most of the time more then the triggering attack which if you have a thousand dollar toon, the damage you proc is going to be considerable compared to lower gs toon, where the procced damage is minimal, alway's giving the whales the advantage.
Problem is Tr, because most people for whatever reason look for the easiest cheese build they can find, has so much craziness, you can achieve all this passive damage with a low GS because of bugs and exploits. The simple statement you see often in this game is:
"How can 14kgs whatever kill a 20kgs whatever", well this statement alone show's the mentality of the players in this game. It is expected that if I have a higher GS that I should win regardless of skill level. If you took away all the piercing, proccing, 20 seconds dots etc away that why shouldn't the 14gs win, if he's better and you can't hit him or what not he should win. For me, I love the fact the all these scrub TR's with 13k are going around slaughtering 20K+ toons. Because all the crying about such and such being OP and nerf this and nerf that, dev's introduced piercing and the likes to make up for the lack of skill and because of these new mechanics you have broken TR nubs wrecking destroying you with simple at will from steal and all that money and time you spent mean nothing.
The saying you reap what you sow is almost a fact in life.
How to Kill the Control Wizard class in two steps:
1) Nerf Shield
2) Nerf Storm Spell
Tada, you now have a CW worse than a Warlock.
nah you still have more cc that can be cast more quickly as well as a way to boost it more easily(orb of imposition, wisdom as one of main atts, whole oppressor paragon path)
They simply need to remove piercing and proccing damage completely from the game. If i don't hit you, I don't do damage, if you don't hit me, you don't do damage. Easy fix, take away all the crutches and force people to learn to play instead of looking for exploits. Because let's face it, in this game, it seems he who can push the least buttons is the best. TR with arti main for COS, can hit tab and left click and kill, GWF can swing a sword in a circle and take out a whole team, really no need to even see anyone.
Like I've said before, all those BS mechanics were put in place for the pay to play. Every class has a build that can be OP with money. Cryptic made sure that if you like the game, but just suck at it, you can pay to become a skill less one button beast because of these mechanics. The thing is, to become that one button beast with a tr, it's just cheaper, therefore, we have thousands of Tr's that are really useless for the most part (as team members).
The mechanics were introduced to keep the crazy people that spend thousands on a character from crying that someone with 6k gs less is killing them, hence the ridiculous proccing damage that does massive stupid damage, most of the time more then the triggering attack which if you have a thousand dollar toon, the damage you proc is going to be considerable compared to lower gs toon, where the procced damage is minimal, alway's giving the whales the advantage.
Problem is Tr, because most people for whatever reason look for the easiest cheese build they can find, has so much craziness, you can achieve all this passive damage with a low GS because of bugs and exploits. The simple statement you see often in this game is:
"How can 14kgs whatever kill a 20kgs whatever", well this statement alone show's the mentality of the players in this game. It is expected that if I have a higher GS that I should win regardless of skill level. If you took away all the piercing, proccing, 20 seconds dots etc away that why shouldn't the 14gs win, if he's better and you can't hit him or what not he should win. For me, I love the fact the all these scrub TR's with 13k are going around slaughtering 20K+ toons. Because all the crying about such and such being OP and nerf this and nerf that, dev's introduced piercing and the likes to make up for the lack of skill and because of these new mechanics you have broken TR nubs wrecking destroying you with simple at will from steal and all that money and time you spent mean nothing.
The saying you reap what you sow is almost a fact in life.
I'm in partial agreement with this. I think the auto proccing damage should never be so strong and be inflicted with such frequency. Stormspell and Scoundrel dazes for instance.
However I think Peircing damage is fine, but only as something that you have manual control on inflicting. I dont think piercing damage should just be automatic. it should be build into a specific ability thats ment to bypass defenses (aka things like Wicked Reminder and specced for part of the damage inflicted by Lashing Blade as example.) the way all this auto proccing damage currently is going, is having the mechanics play for the person rather the person playing themselves, and thus many people become reliant on them. Intimidation being another instance where soon as that damage been decreased, all Sentinel GWF's had a panic attack (where in that particular case, the problem lies with the class itself rather than just that one thing many are relying on as a crutch )
the current implementation of auto proccing damage and piercing damage is flawed. And the automatic system of applying them should be altered to a more manual application from the player, built into the skills they are using so they control when and how they are used instead of just spamming or just using the le ol same rotation and letting the mechanics do the work for them.
Comments
Im waiting to see what mod 6 bring because losing the 25-30% more stealth from set bonus means much less in stealth CoS spamming.
However the initial DESIGN of "piercing damage" was because it was a % of damage that would be "double mitigated" by DR.
Piercing Blades (HR feat) was the first of this, and then they started adding it as a damage type that was never "post-DR factored".
So as an example:
Shadow of Demise - it does "Post DR" damage so in theory it SHOULD be "piercing"
Shadowy Opportunity - is a flat 75% of weapon damage, NEVER was mitigated by DR once.
Shocking Execution - piercing, never mitigated by DR.
Its the abilities that are never mitigated ONCE by DR that need addressing, not necessarily the ones that have ALREADY been mitigated down once.
Oh and as always to make sure the DEVs see it:
BUG: KNIFE'S EDGE:
Abilities like Blood Bath, it procs off EVERY hit giving the TR a FULL encounter cooldown on all encounters. So you can hit "ITC" "Blood Bath" then ITC again back to back.
Thanks, told you I wasn't all-talk.
Brownie points for your Trickster Rogue's appearance.
No, I'm serious when I say there's only a handful of Sabs that can defeat me in a duel.
Why? Because the general skill of the TR population (Even in high-end) is really low/skillless, MOST are VERY predictable. Only a handful are truly lethal.
I'm far more worried of Executioner than Saboteur if you ask me. Exe is better at dealing with CW due to the SoD double proc bug.
The way I see it.... is like this
To deal with:
Control Wizard (Good): Exe > Sab > Scoundrel
Control Wizard (Pug-level): Scoundrel > Exe = Sab
Hunter Ranger: Scoundrel > Sab > Exe
Guardian Fighter: Sab > Scoundrel > Exe
Great Weapon Fighter: Sab > Exe > Scoundrel
Devoted Cleric: Sab > Exe > Scoundrel
Warlock: Just press 1 button.. but incase of WhisperKnife, then Scoundrel > Sab > Exe
Not me personally.. but I agree the population does.
There is only minor tweaks to be done... to make TR balanced. I've always said it and will keep saying it. WhisperKnife is the closest thing to a balanced TR.
Devs need to:
1) Fix the dam Knife Edge feat already
2) ITC ends when you use any power OR ITC only makes you break free of CC, no deflect.
3) Piercing Into Physical.
4) Shocking Execution respecting Tenacity
That's it... Nothing more.
Far from that... let's be real here. There are only two things wrong with CW (PVP) at the moment. And it's Shield and Storm Spell.
How to Kill the Control Wizard class in two steps:
1) Nerf Shield
2) Nerf Storm Spell
Tada, you now have a CW worse than a Warlock.
One of the many Control Wizards that misses Shard Of The Endless Avalanche. RIP Shard (Beta-Mod3)
Like I've said before, all those BS mechanics were put in place for the pay to play. Every class has a build that can be OP with money. Cryptic made sure that if you like the game, but just suck at it, you can pay to become a skill less one button beast because of these mechanics. The thing is, to become that one button beast with a tr, it's just cheaper, therefore, we have thousands of Tr's that are really useless for the most part (as team members).
The mechanics were introduced to keep the crazy people that spend thousands on a character from crying that someone with 6k gs less is killing them, hence the ridiculous proccing damage that does massive stupid damage, most of the time more then the triggering attack which if you have a thousand dollar toon, the damage you proc is going to be considerable compared to lower gs toon, where the procced damage is minimal, alway's giving the whales the advantage.
Problem is Tr, because most people for whatever reason look for the easiest cheese build they can find, has so much craziness, you can achieve all this passive damage with a low GS because of bugs and exploits. The simple statement you see often in this game is:
"How can 14kgs whatever kill a 20kgs whatever", well this statement alone show's the mentality of the players in this game. It is expected that if I have a higher GS that I should win regardless of skill level. If you took away all the piercing, proccing, 20 seconds dots etc away that why shouldn't the 14gs win, if he's better and you can't hit him or what not he should win. For me, I love the fact the all these scrub TR's with 13k are going around slaughtering 20K+ toons. Because all the crying about such and such being OP and nerf this and nerf that, dev's introduced piercing and the likes to make up for the lack of skill and because of these new mechanics you have broken TR nubs wrecking destroying you with simple at will from steal and all that money and time you spent mean nothing.
The saying you reap what you sow is almost a fact in life.
nah you still have more cc that can be cast more quickly as well as a way to boost it more easily(orb of imposition, wisdom as one of main atts, whole oppressor paragon path)
so yeah you could still kill a warlock
However I think Peircing damage is fine, but only as something that you have manual control on inflicting. I dont think piercing damage should just be automatic. it should be build into a specific ability thats ment to bypass defenses (aka things like Wicked Reminder and specced for part of the damage inflicted by Lashing Blade as example.) the way all this auto proccing damage currently is going, is having the mechanics play for the person rather the person playing themselves, and thus many people become reliant on them. Intimidation being another instance where soon as that damage been decreased, all Sentinel GWF's had a panic attack (where in that particular case, the problem lies with the class itself rather than just that one thing many are relying on as a crutch )
the current implementation of auto proccing damage and piercing damage is flawed. And the automatic system of applying them should be altered to a more manual application from the player, built into the skills they are using so they control when and how they are used instead of just spamming or just using the le ol same rotation and letting the mechanics do the work for them.