I cant contact directly, but is it possible to post on the Dev Tracker forum?
I've reported many bugs via the forums, via the in-game tools, and the result is always the same: no one gives a **** about what happens on these forums. They're probably full of badly written bug reports, incomplete ones, well, we can't completely blame the devs only. But the fact is that these tools are useless.
I've reported many bugs via the forums, via the in-game tools, and the result is always the same: no one gives a **** about what happens on these forums. They're probably full of badly written bug reports, incomplete ones, well, we can't completely blame the devs only. But the fact is that these tools are useless.
I think they get the idea somehow though. Things do get looked into. Sometimes it takes awhile, sometimes its for the wrong reason(class pandering/QQing, for example).
The fact is, I like my SW. If something's not WAI, I say fix it. Its already happened for Tyrannical Threat for example. That's an example of a "fix". I just don't like nerfing over biased reports like what most of this thread is composed of. Too many things get unbalanced when "x class cant handle y power, so y class must be OP" complaints get pandered to.
I hear "learn to play" all the time, but it seems to me that it should be defined as "my class is balanced, except when others beat it, then THAT class is OP"...
I think they get the idea somehow though. Things do get looked into. Sometimes it takes awhile, sometimes its for the wrong reason(class pandering/QQing, for example).
The fact is, I like my SW. If something's not WAI, I say fix it. Its already happened for Tyrannical Threat for example. That's an example of a "fix". I just don't like nerfing over biased reports like what most of this thread is composed of. Too many things get unbalanced when "x class cant handle y power, so y class must be OP" complaints get pandered to.
Yes I agree, currently the SW class does way too much damage but first such bugs have to be fixed to examine the case when everything is working as intended. Then the devs can make a better decision.
People saying that too much damage isn't an issue are wrong. I've been trying to get a second set of gloves for my DC in IWD. When there's a SW in the vicinity my chances to get a great success (and thus my gloves) are 0. I have never gotten a great success in IWD with my DC when there's a SW spamming TT and the bugged deadtheft. They just kill stuff way too fast and it's impossible to score some damage (healing only doesn't work in IWD and when stuff dies too fast, there's nothing to heal anyway). So yeah something has to be done, bugs first, then let's see what happens.
I think it's too soon to say how powerful SWs can be. Once the really geared ones and new builds appear, we can discuss balance. For now, i just met a few being a bit tankier than usual and one who could zoom for more than i could sprint with stamina feats and boons and BF. Pretty much from one base to the other in rivenscar and more. I was amazed :P
Was he a Templock? There's a feat at the top tier of the Temptation tree that replenishes Stamina when you take damage. A Templock with the right feats and a DoT ticking on him has almost unlimited sprint distance while the DoT lasts.
No. Some high-geared SWs with certain gear and power loadouts MAY be doing too much damage. Although I'd be interested in your criteria for how much damage is enough. But those of us with average/starter gear/enchants are not.
No. Some high-geared SWs with certain gear and power loadouts MAY be doing too much damage. Although I'd be interested in your criteria for how much damage is enough. But those of us with average/starter gear/enchants are not.
They are because they're using bugged spells and sets. Maybe you should read what people post instead of clicking "answer" after reading the first 5 words.
Using "bugged" spells and sets SW damage is still fine. Accursed Diabolist set may not be wai, but Dread Theft certainly is. If you think how it works is a bug, they can address it immediately after Steal Time and Icy Terrain as it functions exactly the same as those powers with the same interactions with procs. Also people wear AD set because it is the only DPS set that warlocks have. Even if the bonus was changed to something else you act like we would suddenly switch to the healing set? lol
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bajornorbertMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 272Arc User
edited October 2014
I don't see how DT is bugged. It's a focus attack that's channeled for 6 seconds, hitting 4 times /sec, each hit being ~2k damage on average. Add that up, that's 48k damage dealt in 6 seconds. There are several encounters that can do more damage in <1 sec. A focus attack's ticks should always be considered separate encounters since it prevents you from doing anything else.
As for AD set, there's at least 3 sets that are as powerful, if not more, the only difference is that they don't show up in ACT under the outgoing damage tab. High Vizier, High Prophet, Valiant Warrior all increase the DPS of every member of the team by at least 5%-30%, the diff is that's since it's a party wide dmg boost they are not considered OP, while the AD set which increases only the wearer's DPS by 15%-20% is considered OP.
DT+Ad set, if the target lives long enough for all the ticks to proc, will do 100k-200k damage in 12 seconds. That's really far from being OP imo.
Edit: I've just realized why we're having this discussion. It's because of PvP & the Red Glyphs. When will people realize that it's the Red Glyph that's broken & OP and not the classes using it. Sooner or later we'll have every class nerfed to the ground because of the freakin' Red Glyphs. The red glyph needs a nerf, or better yet, needs to be removed completely from the game. SoS was already destroyed because of the red glyphs, if the devs don't do something about it, we'll have every single class nerfed, one by one, because of the Glyphs.
They are because they're using bugged spells and sets. Maybe you should read what people post instead of clicking "answer" after reading the first 5 words.
I read the entire thread. I see a claim that DT is bugged and/or the Accursed Diabolist set bonus. I see no proof of either. And in any case this would come under 'certain gear and power loadouts' as mentioned in my post.
As someone else mentioned, DT is far from the only channelled encounter that counts as multiple encounter uses during the duration of the channel. The obvious one is Steal Time which has been that way forever. Since both lock you out from using any other powers during the duration of the channel I see no reason to assume that this is a bug.
As I've posted before, the solution to this kind of issue is to separate powers/skills into a PvP or PvE setup. If a player is in PvP, a database flag gets checked which causes these powers to do X damage for Y duration. If they're in PvE, same thing, different effects.
Changing stuff to placate PvP players causes PvE players to suffer and vice versa. As for the the original question about SWs being OP I say this - are they really OP or are you just complaining because you can no longer own in PvP? Constructive criticism is one thing; complaining with no offered solution is another.
Was he a Templock? There's a feat at the top tier of the Temptation tree that replenishes Stamina when you take damage. A Templock with the right feats and a DoT ticking on him has almost unlimited sprint distance while the DoT lasts.
Yeah yeah that's the case. Today i asked to a guy i was facing in PvP and he said it was damage replenishing his stamina. Which is fair enough for me. Was kinda funny to see my sprinter chasing him around the node while he zoomed around. But i like it, footwork and timing. He said he'd like a proper dodge though. But may be GWFs and SWs in their own rights are fine this way, with no real dodge but very high mobility if properly specced/ feated.
Them SWs sure are proving hard to face as they gear up in PvP. Hands down strongest DPS and high mobility. They're proving to be fearsome opponents when in the right hands. I started targeting them even before CWs cause their DPS is a bigger threat imho, if left alone doing their job from behind their team.
I refuse to use TT with my SW. I struggle here and there, but not too badly overall. Of course, my SW is not my main, so its current GS is only about 9.5k. . .
Try playing a SW without TT and see how much DPS you have.
myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!" pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all." looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
Everything in SW is now WAI, the only thing that was bugged and giving too much DPS to the SW was TT, now its fixed and you can see alot of improvement.
About those people calling Threadtheft not working as intended:
Do you think the devs would give you a power that only deals 11k dmg (no crit/resists) but needs 10 seconds to pull it off? Come on, most classes have a power that does that with almost instant cast time, they needed to add some bonuses there to make it worth the 10 seconds of vulnerability to CC/tons of damage, In total I can deal about 40k DMG per target, per use (remember, no resists but with crits [36%]) with all the bonuses and I think that's fair for a 10 second cast time ability!
To all the complaining cw's here:
What are you even doing here? You got some competition in your DPS and you are already mad like that? As far as I know, CW's ca solo basicly all the dungeons and meanwhile SW... nope, don't even try, you will get a time where there are too many mobs and you can't dodge their attacks!
TL;DR CW mains don't deserve a spot in this thread.
Everything in SW is now WAI, the only thing that was bugged and giving too much DPS to the SW was TT, now its fixed and you can see alot of improvement.
This isn't fixed. Why would you claim this? Cause they said it? They also said to fix the bugged CN doors...
Here is an ACT of a Hrimnir fight after the patch:
It's just not possible to get a max TT hit doubled the damage of the next encounter. It should be half of the highest damage source at best. TT isn't working as intended and will get further nerfs.
This isn't fixed. Why would you claim this? Cause they said it? They also said to fix the bugged CN doors...
Here is an ACT of a Hrimnir fight after the patch:
It's just not possible to get a max TT hit doubled the damage of the next encounter. It should be half of the highest damage source at best. TT isn't working as intended and will get further nerfs.
Well... If what you say is true and it isn't fixed, I accept the nerf but honestly, I think this class deserves that DPS. Its like the opposite of CW. CW's have CC AND tons of damage meanwhile SW have damage. I think its fair that if the devs think they don't deserve the damage that the CW gets nerfed alot in PVE.
You do know if warlocks miss their rotation their dead meat right? Whilst you have 4 spells, I'm not claiming wizards are op. Its's just funny how of every class wizards claim that SW the glass cannon is OP, please there is no need for another thread that just because they got killed another class is OP. Can't warlocks be good without people crying their OP?
Well... If what you say is true and it isn't fixed, I accept the nerf but honestly, I think this class deserves that DPS. Its like the opposite of CW. CW's have CC AND tons of damage meanwhile SW have damage. I think its fair that if the devs think they don't deserve the damage that the CW gets nerfed alot in PVE.
I am truely with you. SWs need to deal alot of damage. They are supposed to be are hard hitter.
The issue I see is the balancing of SWs skills is currently non existent. If they fix TT, what's left...
Look at the ACT and take away TT, Hellfire and Creeping Death (latter ones because they are passive dps sources). There is nothing left to divide a trashy Warlock from a pro. You don't have to do anything different from a BiS SW as long as you press two buttons. TT and your set deal with the rest.
Just look at your at wills. 5% of the damage you deal? Blades of vanq. armies? 8% of your damage.
That's nothing... I'm inclined to say SWs have less room for error than even CWs, who are utterly stupid.
This isn't fixed. Why would you claim this? Cause they said it? They also said to fix the bugged CN doors...
Here is an ACT of a Hrimnir fight after the patch:
It's just not possible to get a max TT hit doubled the damage of the next encounter. It should be half of the highest damage source at best. TT isn't working as intended and will get further nerfs.
that's normal and tyrannical is meant to be that strong. against 2 mobs, it should be quadruple damage with dreadtheft but you put an act parse of a mob heavy fight like hrimnir. every last mob in range is being nuked by the echoing damage from each marked target.
I read the entire thread. I see a claim that DT is bugged and/or the Accursed Diabolist set bonus. I see no proof of either. And in any case this would come under 'certain gear and power loadouts' as mentioned in my post.
It's very easy to test, I don't need to add any "proof". Takes 5s at most to notice that the bug i've mentioned do exist.
Also TT hasn't been fixed. There's no way in hell they fixed it. SWs are still leeching my CW's damage. I know when i'm having damage spikes and that's precisely when TT clears the whole room (30-50 npcs) in 2-3 seconds in any dungeon. Without heavy damage from other members of the team TT is a normal spell. Edit: I just read the above poster with the ACT report. It only confirms what I was suspecting about TT not being fixed.
I also suspected that TT was not fixed (or something else was amiss) as I noticed that an SW get 3.3 million by the time my TR got 300k. Without TT as it is now, though, it seems that many SW are even worse than my TR (and that is just bad) with a CW doing at least two and up to four times their total damage. We really need some better balancing and I would welcome an outline of where we should expect to fall within damage when equally geared/skilled so that we can better track when things get awry and more readily isolate and document the problems.
It's very easy to test, I don't need to add any "proof". Takes 5s at most to notice that the bug i've mentioned do exist.
Also TT hasn't been fixed. There's no way in hell they fixed it. SWs are still leeching my CW's damage. I know when i'm having damage spikes and that's precisely when TT clears the whole room (30-50 npcs) in 2-3 seconds in any dungeon. Without heavy damage from other members of the team TT is a normal spell. Edit: I just read the above poster with the ACT report. It only confirms what I was suspecting about TT not being fixed.
i just did a simple check by waiting to see if my dps goes up while doing nothing and it barely went up by a few thousand (which is probably from my pet/puppet). tyrannical only echoes my damage so we are not leeching your wizard dps anymore.
accursed diabolist i know out-paces the healing from healing sets, but that's mostly because those constant dot ticks heal everything b4 i can. but i don't own it so you gotta find someone else to prove it for you.
Maybe it has something to do with the deadtheft bug I mentioned a few pages ago then but still double-checking TT wouldn't hurt, some patterns are VERY suspicious about this spell.
Maybe it has something to do with the deadtheft bug I mentioned a few pages ago then but still double-checking TT wouldn't hurt, some patterns are VERY suspicious about this spell.
i used dreadtheft and it's normal for me without accursed diabolist proccing on all 18 or so hits
I refuse to use TT with my SW. I struggle here and there, but not too badly overall. Of course, my SW is not my main, so its current GS is only about 9.5k. . .
Try playing a SW without TT and see how much DPS you have.
I have TT slotted as one of my Dailies when soloing in campaigns. I only use it on large groups of heavy-hitting mobs. Everything else just melts anyway. And I don't have particularly high GS - only drops from DR and a couple of pieces of Draconic gear (arms and legs) dropped from HEs.
SW does plenty of DPS without TT if built and played right.
This isn't fixed. Why would you claim this? Cause they said it? They also said to fix the bugged CN doors...
Here is an ACT of a Hrimnir fight after the patch:
It's just not possible to get a max TT hit doubled the damage of the next encounter. It should be half of the highest damage source at best. TT isn't working as intended and will get further nerfs.
TT was doing 65-80% of SW DPS before, I see morons in here saying stuff like "OMG SW's ARE STILL LEECHING MY DMG"... No, they're not, they didn't even do that before, at all, I think 40% of SW DPS being TT is far more reasonable... If this MUST be nerfed again (it will) then other SW powers NEED BUFFS or it all goes back to 5x CW being meta for PVE...
Also, I don't know what PVP you guys are playing (pug matches) but in premade games SW's are roaming support and THAT'S IT. In 1v1 encounter against pretty much any class (except maybe DC or another SW) it's a death sentence for an SW unless all of your attacks/daily crit right off the bat. Anything other than temptation is non-viable for PVP.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2014
TT is doing 24% for me over the course of about 35 dungeons.
it does more in certain situations with very high hp mobs like bosses, who happen to have tons of high hp adds. Hrimnir fight is probably the highest you'll ever see it.
SW is not that overpowered, the only problem this class has is Dreadthef. It should have either lesser damage or lesser proc rate, even if you can "stun" then to stop the ray.
No.
Right now the SW is in a good place for PVE. Not better than a CW but at least desirable for groups. I see no reason to relegate them to TR status.
Comments
I've reported many bugs via the forums, via the in-game tools, and the result is always the same: no one gives a **** about what happens on these forums. They're probably full of badly written bug reports, incomplete ones, well, we can't completely blame the devs only. But the fact is that these tools are useless.
I think they get the idea somehow though. Things do get looked into. Sometimes it takes awhile, sometimes its for the wrong reason(class pandering/QQing, for example).
The fact is, I like my SW. If something's not WAI, I say fix it. Its already happened for Tyrannical Threat for example. That's an example of a "fix". I just don't like nerfing over biased reports like what most of this thread is composed of. Too many things get unbalanced when "x class cant handle y power, so y class must be OP" complaints get pandered to.
Yes I agree, currently the SW class does way too much damage but first such bugs have to be fixed to examine the case when everything is working as intended. Then the devs can make a better decision.
People saying that too much damage isn't an issue are wrong. I've been trying to get a second set of gloves for my DC in IWD. When there's a SW in the vicinity my chances to get a great success (and thus my gloves) are 0. I have never gotten a great success in IWD with my DC when there's a SW spamming TT and the bugged deadtheft. They just kill stuff way too fast and it's impossible to score some damage (healing only doesn't work in IWD and when stuff dies too fast, there's nothing to heal anyway). So yeah something has to be done, bugs first, then let's see what happens.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
They are because they're using bugged spells and sets. Maybe you should read what people post instead of clicking "answer" after reading the first 5 words.
Using "bugged" spells and sets SW damage is still fine. Accursed Diabolist set may not be wai, but Dread Theft certainly is. If you think how it works is a bug, they can address it immediately after Steal Time and Icy Terrain as it functions exactly the same as those powers with the same interactions with procs. Also people wear AD set because it is the only DPS set that warlocks have. Even if the bonus was changed to something else you act like we would suddenly switch to the healing set? lol
As for AD set, there's at least 3 sets that are as powerful, if not more, the only difference is that they don't show up in ACT under the outgoing damage tab. High Vizier, High Prophet, Valiant Warrior all increase the DPS of every member of the team by at least 5%-30%, the diff is that's since it's a party wide dmg boost they are not considered OP, while the AD set which increases only the wearer's DPS by 15%-20% is considered OP.
DT+Ad set, if the target lives long enough for all the ticks to proc, will do 100k-200k damage in 12 seconds. That's really far from being OP imo.
Edit: I've just realized why we're having this discussion. It's because of PvP & the Red Glyphs. When will people realize that it's the Red Glyph that's broken & OP and not the classes using it. Sooner or later we'll have every class nerfed to the ground because of the freakin' Red Glyphs. The red glyph needs a nerf, or better yet, needs to be removed completely from the game. SoS was already destroyed because of the red glyphs, if the devs don't do something about it, we'll have every single class nerfed, one by one, because of the Glyphs.
As someone else mentioned, DT is far from the only channelled encounter that counts as multiple encounter uses during the duration of the channel. The obvious one is Steal Time which has been that way forever. Since both lock you out from using any other powers during the duration of the channel I see no reason to assume that this is a bug.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
Changing stuff to placate PvP players causes PvE players to suffer and vice versa. As for the the original question about SWs being OP I say this - are they really OP or are you just complaining because you can no longer own in PvP? Constructive criticism is one thing; complaining with no offered solution is another.
Yeah yeah that's the case. Today i asked to a guy i was facing in PvP and he said it was damage replenishing his stamina. Which is fair enough for me. Was kinda funny to see my sprinter chasing him around the node while he zoomed around. But i like it, footwork and timing. He said he'd like a proper dodge though. But may be GWFs and SWs in their own rights are fine this way, with no real dodge but very high mobility if properly specced/ feated.
Them SWs sure are proving hard to face as they gear up in PvP. Hands down strongest DPS and high mobility. They're proving to be fearsome opponents when in the right hands. I started targeting them even before CWs cause their DPS is a bigger threat imho, if left alone doing their job from behind their team.
Try playing a SW without TT and see how much DPS you have.
myles08807 said, "Back in my day, we didn't have any of this fancy Mulhorand gear while we were leveling . . . we walked uphill both ways while dying once every five seconds while leveling, and we liked it fine!" . . . Now, get off my lawn, you kids!"
pointsman said, "I don't rue the game. In fact I don't feel any regret for the game at all."
looomis said, "I don't like people changing to alts and then bragging about their mains like schizophrenic role players."
About those people calling Threadtheft not working as intended:
Do you think the devs would give you a power that only deals 11k dmg (no crit/resists) but needs 10 seconds to pull it off? Come on, most classes have a power that does that with almost instant cast time, they needed to add some bonuses there to make it worth the 10 seconds of vulnerability to CC/tons of damage, In total I can deal about 40k DMG per target, per use (remember, no resists but with crits [36%]) with all the bonuses and I think that's fair for a 10 second cast time ability!
To all the complaining cw's here:
What are you even doing here? You got some competition in your DPS and you are already mad like that? As far as I know, CW's ca solo basicly all the dungeons and meanwhile SW... nope, don't even try, you will get a time where there are too many mobs and you can't dodge their attacks!
TL;DR CW mains don't deserve a spot in this thread.
Here is an ACT of a Hrimnir fight after the patch:
It's just not possible to get a max TT hit doubled the damage of the next encounter. It should be half of the highest damage source at best. TT isn't working as intended and will get further nerfs.
Well... If what you say is true and it isn't fixed, I accept the nerf but honestly, I think this class deserves that DPS. Its like the opposite of CW. CW's have CC AND tons of damage meanwhile SW have damage. I think its fair that if the devs think they don't deserve the damage that the CW gets nerfed alot in PVE.
The issue I see is the balancing of SWs skills is currently non existent. If they fix TT, what's left...
Look at the ACT and take away TT, Hellfire and Creeping Death (latter ones because they are passive dps sources). There is nothing left to divide a trashy Warlock from a pro. You don't have to do anything different from a BiS SW as long as you press two buttons. TT and your set deal with the rest.
Just look at your at wills. 5% of the damage you deal? Blades of vanq. armies? 8% of your damage.
That's nothing... I'm inclined to say SWs have less room for error than even CWs, who are utterly stupid.
that's normal and tyrannical is meant to be that strong. against 2 mobs, it should be quadruple damage with dreadtheft but you put an act parse of a mob heavy fight like hrimnir. every last mob in range is being nuked by the echoing damage from each marked target.
It's very easy to test, I don't need to add any "proof". Takes 5s at most to notice that the bug i've mentioned do exist.
Also TT hasn't been fixed. There's no way in hell they fixed it. SWs are still leeching my CW's damage. I know when i'm having damage spikes and that's precisely when TT clears the whole room (30-50 npcs) in 2-3 seconds in any dungeon. Without heavy damage from other members of the team TT is a normal spell. Edit: I just read the above poster with the ACT report. It only confirms what I was suspecting about TT not being fixed.
i just did a simple check by waiting to see if my dps goes up while doing nothing and it barely went up by a few thousand (which is probably from my pet/puppet). tyrannical only echoes my damage so we are not leeching your wizard dps anymore.
accursed diabolist i know out-paces the healing from healing sets, but that's mostly because those constant dot ticks heal everything b4 i can. but i don't own it so you gotta find someone else to prove it for you.
i used dreadtheft and it's normal for me without accursed diabolist proccing on all 18 or so hits
SW does plenty of DPS without TT if built and played right.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
TT was doing 65-80% of SW DPS before, I see morons in here saying stuff like "OMG SW's ARE STILL LEECHING MY DMG"... No, they're not, they didn't even do that before, at all, I think 40% of SW DPS being TT is far more reasonable... If this MUST be nerfed again (it will) then other SW powers NEED BUFFS or it all goes back to 5x CW being meta for PVE...
Also, I don't know what PVP you guys are playing (pug matches) but in premade games SW's are roaming support and THAT'S IT. In 1v1 encounter against pretty much any class (except maybe DC or another SW) it's a death sentence for an SW unless all of your attacks/daily crit right off the bat. Anything other than temptation is non-viable for PVP.
it does more in certain situations with very high hp mobs like bosses, who happen to have tons of high hp adds. Hrimnir fight is probably the highest you'll ever see it.
Dreadtheft is wai
No.
Right now the SW is in a good place for PVE. Not better than a CW but at least desirable for groups. I see no reason to relegate them to TR status.
Now all they have to do is buff PVE skills of all the other classes to make them viable