rinethMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited June 2013
As many have pointed out, this is an atrocious idea. As someone with near BiS everything, I will have absolutely zero incentive to run dungeons. I'm already getting fairly bored with the lack of endgame content, i.e., nothing to really do unless Delves is up. When this change goes live I'm not going to immediately rage quit the game or anything, but I would imagine it will only take a matter of a week or two before there's literally nothing for me to do.
I have been a regular supporter of this game, with a $60 dollar founders pack and several Zen purchases. Almost all of my gear I ground the drops for, rather than buying it. I think the only piece of gear I'm wearing that I bought with AD was my boots. The issue for me with this change isn't so much about making it harder to get gear, it's about incentive for endgame players. If I can't go farm a dungeon to grab a piece to throw into the guild bank or sell off for some AD there is literally no reason for me to play other than leveling alts. And why in gods name would I level an alt towards a complete lack of endgame?
I have loved every minute of this game so far, even with some of the questionable design choices and rampant exploiting. I've built it up via word of mouth and by encouraging newer players to stick with the game. Unless Cryptic has plans for some seriously compelling new content coming very soon, this game has lost me completely.
Like a some person posted a few pages back, how are going to gear our pets/augments, do we need to stock with one copy of each great pet gear in advance? or do pets after this patch would only be able to wear lv 58 gear from now on?
I have one copy of each piece that might be equipped on pet slot, if you like pets i would suggest do the same. Better safe than sorry
I don't understand why people are crying about this. A gear treadmill is far more interesting than an enchant treadmill. People are sitting here complaining that they won't be able to get the tier sets they want, or specific jewelery or some such nonsense but that's kind of the point - you most likely don't have perfect enchants with rank 10s either, it's something you work towards, it gives you a reason to play.
A reason to play if we're getting a reasonable reward for Epic Dungeons in a reasonable amount of time.
Which is no longer the case with this change.
Previously - at least if I got an item I couldn't use personally, it could go to a guild-mate. With the change, there's not much point to running Epic Dungeons.
If I can't go farm a dungeon to grab a piece to throw into the guild bank or sell off for some AD there is literally no reason for me to play other than leveling alts. And why in gods name would I level an alt towards a complete lack of endgame?
We'll be able to salvage those items for AD, right?
We'll be able to salvage those items for AD, right?
The salvage return is pitifully low. T1 arms, legs, helm only give 4000 AD, chest gives 5000 AD. You can probably get more AD by selling the item for gold and trading that for AD.
I think the salvage idea is a good one, and I think ONLY making the "best" tier items BoP is a good one as well... Makes players have to actually play to get the best gear...
I don't quite understand how putting this in the test server will help test this. It's not like the test server has an actual economy. We won't really see the effects.
IMHO that's a step in the right direction for the long run. There's more incentive for people to earn their gear from running dungeons rather than just spend money to buy it. It's not a total loss even if you don't get what you wanted at least now you can transform your gear directly into AD. Currently lvl 60 epics have flooded the market and this is a good way to reduce the amount of items in the economy.
IMHO that's a step in the right direction for the long run. There's more incentive for people to earn their gear from running dungeons rather than just spend money to buy it. It's not a total loss even if you don't get what you wanted at least now you can transform your gear directly into AD. Currently lvl 60 epics have flooded the market and this is a good way to reduce the amount of items in the economy.
I cant understand how being subject to the random whims of the RNG equals "Earning it"
Buying gear via seals, tokens, glory, or AD. is no less earning it. Simply because folks had to EARN the currency in the first place. Only they can do it with much less frustration and randomness. If I wanted to gamble id open lock boxes.
Keep in mind the plan is to expand the classes. How rare will that one drop you need to complete a set be once there are 7 or 8 classes now competing for that one or two precious purple items at the end of the run. Anyone care to calculate your odds, I expect they wont be good.
And the salvage value is a joke. Sure you can a bit of AD, but I expect you'll find the gold value to be more worthwhile. Gota keep stocked up on potions to grind another useless run in the hopes you'll get what you really want after all.
I think this change is good.
Actually, I think they should make all lvl 60 purple BOP.
This would actually remove some of the P2W smell from this game.
You have my official stamp of approval, make it all BOP. Go, make it so.
Not all purple gear will be BoP...
there will be BoE gear also.... you know, like every other MMO does it...
Really cant understand why all this *****ing and complaining, you will get less AD, thats the real problem right?
but hey you can exchange purple BoP on the salvage thing, and you get something like 4k AD for T1 gloves.... in the AH today they only worth 2k AD, so we are getting more diamonds by salvaging then by sellling in the AH...
you guys just want to get full geared without playing the game and then you come to the forums complaining that you have nothing to do....right?
Im sad to see that the kind of people that are playing this game is one of the worst of all MMos i have played... too many whiners and self entitled kids that are forgetting that they are playing a FREE to PLAY game...
I think the AD reward is substantial. 4000-6000 AD depending on Tier and piece (or 2-3g). Maybe it can be adjusted more. This also reduces the psychological effect of people NEEDing items to sell. Maybe now everyone can greed instead of NEED.
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prismaticpulseMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I cant understand how being subject to the random whims of the RNG equals "Earning it"
Buying gear via seals, tokens, glory, or AD. is no less earning it. Simply because folks had to EARN the currency in the first place. Only they can do it with much less frustration and randomness. If I wanted to gamble id open lock boxes.
^ This.
So basically from what I'm gathering from these changes, the devs are deciding that including an AH was a terrible idea from the start? I myself like the AH, because if I'm having trouble getting a piece I need, I can always just sell what gear I've picked up, and then earn what I need that way.
It's funny that everyone was freaking about the economy during Caturday. Now we will have no economy! (Except for what, runestones?) I'll just use my Astral Diamonds to buy Zen. Then no more money for Cryptic....
ph4ng4nMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited June 2013
i didn't like at first seeing everything BoE, but i have come to think that BoE is a good thing.
Personally i had to buy maybe 50% of my gear.. BiS or close to. then later it dropped for some parts, but at the end i still miss 25%, who know? i could still be doing specific runs if some items weren't BoE, al
Unlucky players can do their hundred runs for that single item that wont drop
Shortage of players in dungeons at some point if players cant resell some BiS, high end items, less incentive
Bad for the economy
Honestly, If the company doesn't make a profit we don't have a game. I can understand the push back behind the motive, but I don't think anyone should really be surprised that a company made for profit would like to make a ... um ... profit.
I'm confused.....
I've seen you supporting the change everywhere.....You're reason being "Ppl should not be allowed to buy gear"
Then you say something like the above....
So ummmm it's ok to stop selling farmable gear...just sell stuff that none can get thru farming so it's TOTALLY cash shop?
PITY,REGRET, AND MERCY are just EXCUSES for the strong not to kill the weak!
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bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Yea, if this comes out.... I think I will be leaving the game. I really liked being able to sell gear I did not need in order to get upgrades/enchantments/etc that I did need. This will have a huge trickle down effect, and I bet their zen sales will greatly reduce since a huge section of things to purchase with AD will be gone.
Please do not do this. I am very active player who enjoys running dungeons with friends, and we always sell our un-needed loot to help gear each-other up.
Also I see no logical reason why the need/greed system cannot just be tweaked/updated to prevent ninja looters. I find this a horrible way to work around this main issue. I know you guys only want the best for the game, but this is really not the best direction.. please listen to us!
I don't get why people are reacting... you can salvage BoP items you don't need for AP directly.. heck you are getting even more value than what the AH offers. People selling stuff for 2K when you can at least get 4-6K AD out of the crappiest purples.
I guess good medicine are often bitter.
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bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So... maybe the AH prices are too high.
I'm still not sure what we'll be buying in the AH once the Purple 60 gear becomes BoP.
Enchants, and profession items.... I guess. =/
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insomeatMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 25Arc User
edited June 2013
Once again the great majority will speak out against a poor design decision when asked for feedback and once again the developers will simply ignore it without even bothering to comment or explain their reasoning. This is coming from a Cleric who hates being the one spell trick pony in PvE and the free kill in PvP which the devs simply ignore after hundreds of posts and reasoning against the changes. Why bother at all, the next promising MMO can't come out quick enough at this stage..
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bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't get why people are reacting... you can salvage BoP items you don't need for AP directly.. heck you are getting even more value than what the AH offers. People selling stuff for 2K when you can at least get 4-6K AD out of the crappiest purples.
Apparently you have no looked at the AH recently to see what some of the best tier set items go for. If you are seriously comparing a 2k item to a potential 500k item then you are... sigh im too nice to say it.
Apparently you have no looked at the AH recently to see what some of the best tier set items go for. If you are seriously comparing a 2k item to a potential 500k item then you are... sigh im too nice to say it.
That's the thing here... if you want the best item then go earn it.. not open your wallet and tada expect it to fall down on your lap. Are you one of those who pay 2 win ?
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bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Once again the great majority will speak out against a poor design decision when asked for feedback and once again the developers will simply ignore it without even bothering to comment or explain their reasoning. This is coming from a Cleric who hates being the one spell trick pony in PvE and the free kill in PvP which the devs simply ignore after hundreds of posts and reasoning against the changes. Why bother at all, the next promising MMO can't come out quick enough at this stage..
I agree, if this comes out with this large ammount of negative feedback..... then I am out.. I think their are plenty of potential mmo's out there who know what the player wants because they respond to feedback.
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bellaralodunMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
That's the thing here... if you want the best item then go earn it.. not open your wallet and tada expect it to fall down on your lap. Are you one of those who pay 2 win ?
Nope. I make alot converting advents to heros... but why even bring it up? Why even try to make that a "bad thing". Its like "hey person who helps support this game... stop supporting the game... so I can feel better when the servers close because they too broke to run it"
Apparently you have spent money on the game judging by your founders pack, why you even making comments like this? (maybe you did not notice, but you sorta insulted yourself, LOL)
Comments
I have been a regular supporter of this game, with a $60 dollar founders pack and several Zen purchases. Almost all of my gear I ground the drops for, rather than buying it. I think the only piece of gear I'm wearing that I bought with AD was my boots. The issue for me with this change isn't so much about making it harder to get gear, it's about incentive for endgame players. If I can't go farm a dungeon to grab a piece to throw into the guild bank or sell off for some AD there is literally no reason for me to play other than leveling alts. And why in gods name would I level an alt towards a complete lack of endgame?
I have loved every minute of this game so far, even with some of the questionable design choices and rampant exploiting. I've built it up via word of mouth and by encouraging newer players to stick with the game. Unless Cryptic has plans for some seriously compelling new content coming very soon, this game has lost me completely.
I have one copy of each piece that might be equipped on pet slot, if you like pets i would suggest do the same. Better safe than sorry
Which is no longer the case with this change.
Previously - at least if I got an item I couldn't use personally, it could go to a guild-mate. With the change, there's not much point to running Epic Dungeons.
The salvage return is pitifully low. T1 arms, legs, helm only give 4000 AD, chest gives 5000 AD. You can probably get more AD by selling the item for gold and trading that for AD.
For a fraction of what they would be worth in an open market.
I'm still not sure what we'll be buying in the AH once the Purple 60 gear becomes BoP.
I cant understand how being subject to the random whims of the RNG equals "Earning it"
Buying gear via seals, tokens, glory, or AD. is no less earning it. Simply because folks had to EARN the currency in the first place. Only they can do it with much less frustration and randomness. If I wanted to gamble id open lock boxes.
Keep in mind the plan is to expand the classes. How rare will that one drop you need to complete a set be once there are 7 or 8 classes now competing for that one or two precious purple items at the end of the run. Anyone care to calculate your odds, I expect they wont be good.
And the salvage value is a joke. Sure you can a bit of AD, but I expect you'll find the gold value to be more worthwhile. Gota keep stocked up on potions to grind another useless run in the hopes you'll get what you really want after all.
Actually, I think they should make all lvl 60 purple BOP.
This would actually remove some of the P2W smell from this game.
You have my official stamp of approval, make it all BOP. Go, make it so.
there will be BoE gear also.... you know, like every other MMO does it...
Really cant understand why all this *****ing and complaining, you will get less AD, thats the real problem right?
but hey you can exchange purple BoP on the salvage thing, and you get something like 4k AD for T1 gloves.... in the AH today they only worth 2k AD, so we are getting more diamonds by salvaging then by sellling in the AH...
you guys just want to get full geared without playing the game and then you come to the forums complaining that you have nothing to do....right?
Im sad to see that the kind of people that are playing this game is one of the worst of all MMos i have played... too many whiners and self entitled kids that are forgetting that they are playing a FREE to PLAY game...
^ This.
So basically from what I'm gathering from these changes, the devs are deciding that including an AH was a terrible idea from the start? I myself like the AH, because if I'm having trouble getting a piece I need, I can always just sell what gear I've picked up, and then earn what I need that way.
It's funny that everyone was freaking about the economy during Caturday. Now we will have no economy! (Except for what, runestones?) I'll just use my Astral Diamonds to buy Zen. Then no more money for Cryptic....
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?352831-Your-take-on-Bind-on-Pickup-%28BoP%29-Vote-here
Personally i had to buy maybe 50% of my gear.. BiS or close to. then later it dropped for some parts, but at the end i still miss 25%, who know? i could still be doing specific runs if some items weren't BoE, al
Unlucky players can do their hundred runs for that single item that wont drop
Shortage of players in dungeons at some point if players cant resell some BiS, high end items, less incentive
Bad for the economy
I'm confused.....
I've seen you supporting the change everywhere.....You're reason being "Ppl should not be allowed to buy gear"
Then you say something like the above....
So ummmm it's ok to stop selling farmable gear...just sell stuff that none can get thru farming so it's TOTALLY cash shop?
Please do not do this. I am very active player who enjoys running dungeons with friends, and we always sell our un-needed loot to help gear each-other up.
Also I see no logical reason why the need/greed system cannot just be tweaked/updated to prevent ninja looters. I find this a horrible way to work around this main issue. I know you guys only want the best for the game, but this is really not the best direction.. please listen to us!
I guess good medicine are often bitter.
Enchants, and profession items.... I guess. =/
Apparently you have no looked at the AH recently to see what some of the best tier set items go for. If you are seriously comparing a 2k item to a potential 500k item then you are... sigh im too nice to say it.
That's the thing here... if you want the best item then go earn it.. not open your wallet and tada expect it to fall down on your lap. Are you one of those who pay 2 win ?
I agree, if this comes out with this large ammount of negative feedback..... then I am out.. I think their are plenty of potential mmo's out there who know what the player wants because they respond to feedback.
Nope. I make alot converting advents to heros... but why even bring it up? Why even try to make that a "bad thing". Its like "hey person who helps support this game... stop supporting the game... so I can feel better when the servers close because they too broke to run it"
Apparently you have spent money on the game judging by your founders pack, why you even making comments like this? (maybe you did not notice, but you sorta insulted yourself, LOL)