When are the class balancing changes and Lostmauth set changes happening?

satniteeduardo · May 2016

Do we have a date yet when the changes are happening ie bubble down to 6 second max, haste being nerfed and Lostmauth set doing what it says?

sax1993 · May 2016

Nope just a few weeks after mod 9 launched.

ltsmithneko · May 2016

@strumslinger "It'll be in a few weeks time. I don't have an exact date yet as it's still undergoing testing."

stpensive · May 2016

I do hope they rethink the Cleric haste deal... Think it got inappropriately married to the Paladin bubble issue.

The tragedy is that they are devaluing (if not outright eliminating) a compelling paragon path.

draco16 · May 2016

satniteeduardo said:
Do we have a date yet when the changes are happening ie bubble down to 6 second max, haste being nerfed and Lostmauth set doing what it says?

So anxious to nerf the Paladins, lol. I can't wait to see which class will need to be nerfed next.

soonergm · May 2016

draco16#8040 said:

satniteeduardo said:
Do we have a date yet when the changes are happening ie bubble down to 6 second max, haste being nerfed and Lostmauth set doing what it says?
So anxious to nerf the Paladins, lol. I can't wait to see which class will need to be nerfed next.

there are 2 classes that have rendered all other DPS virtually obsolete, and only 1 of those classes is over used by the community. i'm actually surprised about the lack of outrage so far, but i am sure that it is coming.

strumslinger · May 2016

We'll give you guys a heads up when it happens, but it shouldn't be too long from now.

zak3056 · May 2016

stpensive said:
I do hope they rethink the Cleric haste deal... Think it got inappropriately married to the Paladin bubble issue.

The tragedy is that they are devaluing (if not outright eliminating) a compelling paragon path.

With a good Haste cleric, I can spam my daily every 1-2 seconds--I can drop an Ice Knife or Oppressive Force about as fast as I can get off a full cycle of magic missile or chilling cloud.

Not saying that I agree with the nerf, but I can understand it.

armadeonx · May 2016

The trouble is the Healadin out-heals a full heal spec DC and the GF out-aggros the Protection Pally (so does every other class...).

The introduction of the Paladin class was an act of insanity & it's balance was completely out of sync with all the other classes but the bubble is/was extremely helpful for players below 3k.

However, you do not rebalance it by making it pointlessly ineffective. The lack of thought is amazing.

ltsmithneko · May 2016

armadeonx said:
The trouble is the Healadin out-heals a full heal spec DC and the GF out-aggros the Protection Pally (so does every other class...).

The introduction of the Paladin class was an act of insanity & it's balance was completely out of sync with all the other classes but the bubble is/was extremely helpful for players below 3k.

However, you do not rebalance it by making it pointlessly ineffective. The lack of thought is amazing.

You must note that you can kill a healadin a lot easier than a bubble making it more balanced toward others, since a dc has more choices than just healing to do they have invincablilty as well so I really don't see why it's a problem since a dc can act like a bubble when it comes to dmg taking to teammates depending how they play.

armadeonx · May 2016

I do hope we're not talking about pvp. I know AA in pve is a powerful team protection but DC's will lose haste so it will fire less frequently but the point that troubles me is that a cleric (to be desirable) will now be almost forced to run as a buffer and a pally will be forced to run as a healer - there is something just so messed up with that - it should be the other way around!

But this game so likes to nerf entire paragons and paths (archer anyone?) that it makes you wonder what they were thinking when they were designing them (let alone "correcting" them).

hornfan93 · May 2016

With the Lostmauth set nerf, what will be considered the top set for a gwf crit build?

firepats12 · May 2016

hornfan93#0553 said:
With the Lostmauth set nerf, what will be considered the top set for a gwf crit build?

Most likely the Orcus set. There are real numbers describing the differences between the two, and it showed the Orcus set being best for GWF. But the one positive is that Vorpal is still best weapon enchant for the GWF! So you don't have to take the time to level up a Dread enchant...unless you also have a HR/CW/SW of course.

armadeonx · May 2016

Yeah only a dps that fires their encounters almost continuously would go Dread - on that point however, I've started making one up for my CW.

With close to non stop encounters, going from 50 to 75% crit severity will really help level the playing field.

masteroga · May 2016

Dread for CW's is almost a tie with Trans Vorpal (as far as damage is concerned). The reason is your incredibly powerful and frequent dailies get no benefit from Dread.

However....the debuff DOES makes it slightly better. But IMO its not worth making the switch quite yet with the current inflated prices. Give it a few more weeks, might save you a million or so: )

satniteeduardo · May 2016

I don't agree with the comments about clerics. I think the new version of a haste cleric will be crucial to most bubble paladins, and they will be in high demand like hasters were early in the life of most bubbles. All that will happen is the combination of a Paladin / Haste will need to be a little more organised.

Some groups will learn to live without, some will want the cleric/pally combo.

This really just sets pally's back to their early lives when they wanted a haster although a 6 sec perma bubble is not too far from reality.

firepats12 · May 2016

satniteeduardo said:
I don't agree with the comments about clerics. I think the new version of a haste cleric will be crucial to most bubble paladins, and they will be in high demand like hasters were early in the life of most bubbles. All that will happen is the combination of a Paladin / Haste will need to be a little more organised.

Some groups will learn to live without, some will want the cleric/pally combo.

This really just sets pally's back to their early lives when they wanted a haster although a 6 sec perma bubble is not too far from reality.

Agreed. And with a Haste DC's ability to use Annoited Army during the bubbles brief down time, the changes won't make that much of a difference.

mcgwarface · May 2016

Still wish you guys would keep pvp powers separate from pve. Nerf pally bubbles in pvp but only nerf pve pallys to 10 sec or give us new power set that provides outstanding and continuous aggro. You listen to a minority on these forums that are primarily angry pvpers

stpensive · May 2016

mcgwarface said:
Still wish you guys would keep pvp powers separate from pve. Nerf pally bubbles in pvp but only nerf pve pallys to 10 sec or give us new power set that provides outstanding and continuous aggro. You listen to a minority on these forums that are primarily angry pvpers

I don't know why anyone, including Paladins themselves, would be upset that the bubble is getting a nerf. It removes all challange from the game; PVP and PVE alike. Personally, I chose not to run with them if I can avoid it; nothing personal, it's just not fun.

draco16 · May 2016

stpensive said:

mcgwarface said:
Still wish you guys would keep pvp powers separate from pve. Nerf pally bubbles in pvp but only nerf pve pallys to 10 sec or give us new power set that provides outstanding and continuous aggro. You listen to a minority on these forums that are primarily angry pvpers
I don't know why anyone, including Paladins themselves, would be upset that the bubble is getting a nerf. It removes all challange from the game; PVP and PVE alike. Personally, I chose not to run with them if I can avoid it; nothing personal, it's just not fun.

You are correct , the Paladins can't wait to get one shotted by bosses. The only consolation will be that we won't be alone at the fire when it happens.

undeadcomrade · May 2016

Everyone in pvp is excited including myself. Dungeons were done successfully before the pally the bubble just helped low geared players limp their way through. As far as 1 shot makes no difference my bubble pally is all about HP and recovery and defense. The snail and burning set refund pretty much my whole daily. And my artifacts are HP stamina and AP gain based so I fill the last 50% in 2 encounters without a haste, with a haste dc i always have my daily. I won't be getting 1 shot anytime soon. Orcus can get me to 1/4 or 1/8th but a few buffs and i'm back to full. Unless he catches me unbuffed in my inventory then squish. Of course I run around slapping mobs with a pool noodle, but dps isn't my job. I do wish I could hold agro better. This is my only complaint on the pally. Going to swap for the bull ring I guess. Half the time my taunts are ignored by the mobs and they molest my poor cleric. Who somehow creates more threat then me. And she has a low health pool, cue fatality sound effect. We need some love in the threat department maybe a weapon enchant that creates extra threat and defense or something? I've used everything else in our toolbox. Or possibly my pally is glitched not sure if anyone else is having the same problem keeping agro. I'll have to try a respec, But I know my control wizard can out agro my pally and that doesn't seem right. Pally is a tank and tank should = agro the class features for pulling agro passively don't seem to be working for me or my RB so I'm thinking it's a bug. I might put the trans lightning enchant on my palladin to help pull agro. As of now it's not a huge deal with the coming nerf I'd like to be able to hold the mobs attention better.

Unknown · May 2016

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curygreenleaf69 · May 2016

Logic would say we get all this stuff June 7th, that is when we get other stuff and since XBOX gets rare mid-mod updates this is just my best guess.

Unknown · May 2016

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mcgwarface · May 2016

First, I understand why the devs are doing it but they could have handled it better for PVE. PVP they were right.

The issue isnt the pally getting one shotted or 2.8 ILs surviving by staying out of red. You will hurt PUGs and min geared players.

They will give up running T1s and T2s w PUGs. I loved helping low geared players get their equipment wout them having to join a guild. There are many who dont like guild drama or guild requirements (I dont mind either way - I like PUGs and guild teams)

When I let my bubble drop on purpose ...I see instant deaths or severe health drops from trash mobs unless you are 2.8+ and a good build...and fast movement off of red.

Devs should have kept it at 10 sec or added improved aggro from a power or enchantment.

That....or lowered the damage from trash mobs in epics and vast amount of red on ground in tight spaces.

Now you will have to have a well geared GF or GF plus healadin. Pally will be the buffing dodo bird....shunned but still kept around for kicks.

Cant wait to see the forums erupt w pissed off pve players.

satniteeduardo · May 2016

mcgwarface said:
First, I understand why the devs are doing it but they could have handled it better for PVE. PVP they were right.

The issue isnt the pally getting one shotted or 2.8 ILs surviving by staying out of red. You will hurt PUGs and min geared players.

They will give up running T1s and T2s w PUGs. I loved helping low geared players get their equipment wout them having to join a guild. There are many who dont like guild drama or guild requirements (I dont mind either way - I like PUGs and guild teams)

When I let my bubble drop on purpose ...I see instant deaths or severe health drops from trash mobs unless you are 2.8+ and a good build...and fast movement off of red.

Devs should have kept it at 10 sec or added improved aggro from a power or enchantment.

That....or lowered the damage from trash mobs in epics and vast amount of red on ground in tight spaces.

Now you will have to have a well geared GF or GF plus healadin. Pally will be the buffing dodo bird....shunned but still kept around for kicks.

Cant wait to see the forums erupt w pissed off pve players.

I just don't get why people keep saying this.

A good perma bubble build will still be close to perma bubble if not perma bubble.

You may need to be a one trick pony although you can still power share.

Another thing that really grinds my gears is Paladins using Relentless Avenger and advising other Paladins to use it. It makes it harder for DPSers and it is not part of what I believe to be the best perma bubble build from mmominds.

It has its place to knock enemies away in Tiamat and maybe in Spider but other than that it is a hindrance to team performance in my opinion. off topic I know but had to say it lol

armadeonx · May 2016

It's easy for Pallys to achieve 70-80%% DR passively. Once geared they can face off elol scorpions etc without needing to bubble - and yes I mean stand in the red.

That does not help a team however. The entire point of a tank is to pull aggro and the pally is terrible at this. I'm hoping the LM fix will reduce DPS aggro generation and I've been experimenting with 3 points in Aura of Radiance. It helps, but it really needs a faster tick. Once every 3 seconds is not enough.

vaultingfrog · May 2016

satniteeduardo said:

I just don't get why people keep saying this.

A good perma bubble build will still be close to perma bubble if not perma bubble.
For high geared players this might be the case but it still is difficult even for them at times. Being tossed around kind of slows down the process. That and not everybody can afford a snail.

You may need to be a one trick pony although you can still power share.
I agree, but you can do the same sort of thing as a healadin. And the healadin is really good at healing and buffing. The bubble not so much.

Another thing that really grinds my gears is Paladins using Relentless Avenger and advising other Paladins to use it. It makes it harder for DPSers and it is not part of what I believe to be the best perma bubble build from mmominds.

It has its place to knock enemies away in Tiamat and maybe in Spider but other than that it is a hindrance to team performance in my opinion. off topic I know but had to say it lol
I agree, that particular power is not a good choice for pallys. Yes it is a major AP generator but it slows groups down as a whole for DPS. Personally I think Templars Wrath and Binding Oath are better choices alongside Smite.

armadeonx said:
It's easy for Pallys to achieve 70-80%% DR passively. Once geared they can face off elol scorpions etc without needing to bubble - and yes I mean stand in the red.

That does not help a team however. The entire point of a tank is to pull aggro and the pally is terrible at this. I'm hoping the LM fix will reduce DPS aggro generation and I've been experimenting with 3 points in Aura of Radiance. It helps, but it really needs a faster tick. Once every 3 seconds is not enough.

I am not sure how easy it is to gear for 70%-80% DR passively. But ok then.

And yes I agree that threat generation is pathetic for pallys and it needs to be raised.

soonergm · May 2016

i'm not saying that it's perfect all the time, but i really don't understand why so many pallys have a hard time holding aggro. i hold aggro with mine really well in most situations, and even pull the aggro away from GF when i run with them. i especially have no problems holding aggro with scorpions in LM.

thefiresidecat · May 2016

What build are u using? My pally can't get aggro for anything. My DC holds it better lol annoying

andyufcfan · May 2016

I was hoping to get the castle never achievement done for killing the boss 25 times before the change , not happening since I haven't beat it yet. Maybe if these dungeons were not so difficult with one hit deaths every one wouldn't have needed permanent bubbles. Maybe that will change in the future.

When are the class balancing changes and Lostmauth set changes happening?

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