He is correct in what he says, macjae. Basically your entire view is irrational and emotional. You view balance based on the single assumption that you should survive every situation (your bias is that you hold your skills as superior and are the sort that is honestly unwilling to adapt and instead you wish to conform the environment to your style -- at least this is how it comes off it is as if you expect to be unbeatable and cannot handle being outplayed). Balance can never be achieved with the sort of brute force you seem to expect -- you cannot balance a hammer against a screwdriver.
He is correct in what he says, macjae. Basically your entire view is irrational and emotional. You view balance based on the single assumption that you should survive every situation (your bias is that you hold your skills as superior and are the sort that is honestly unwilling to adapt and instead you wish to conform the environment to your style -- at least this is how it comes off it is as if you expect to be unbeatable and cannot handle being outplayed). Balance can never be achieved with the sort of brute force you seem to expect -- you cannot balance a hammer against a screwdriver.
Even if 100% balance can never be achieved, there are steps to take to make it more balanced than the current situation for CW.
You have control, damage and survivability in PvP. The CW lacks in control and survivability and that makes it hard for us to deal the damage that we could do if we got the chance. This puts our class on the lower end of the ladder. And that's why we need a buff in control and survivability.
DC/OP are extremely good in survivability and they have some control too. And those parts makes up for the damage they don't have. The way it should be except for maybe the pally has to much survivability.
TR has damage and extremely good survivability. Makes it a very good class.
GWF has really high damage and good survivability and that makes it a good class to play too.
GF has high survivability, high damage and high control.
SW has high damage but little control and survivability. Could probably get a buff maybe? Not sure how its doing against other classes.
HR has extremely broken OP control ATM. Good damage, good survivability.
Another problem is the Elven battle that is making it even worse. 80% more resistance to stuns/slows etc and lower duration. There goes our small portion of control that we actually have out the window. And what do we have left? Damage that we cant deal because either we are controlled or we are dying. Makes the CW a lame duck.
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
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icyphishMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,255Arc User
Schenider is a really good CW from our guild, might worth consulting him for some tips
@drkbodhi please stop posting here, please! Everything you said is irrelevant and somehow off-topic.
OP is talking about equal playground = BiS level. You talking about your 2k ilvl TR... what the .... ?!?!?
I have mixed opinions about CW. On one side CW is a strong team player in 2v2 / 5v5 which can apply buffs & debuffs, control and damage is also nice. A good All-rounder!
In 1vs1 situations macjae is completely right! But is a buff really necessary?
I don't think so, to be honest.... in my opinion: - It's HRs perma daze/stun which has to go.
- It's TEB which has to be fixed
- It's GFs damage which has to be nerfed by 10-20%
- It's perma TRs damage which has to be lowered
- It's Paladin bugs (CD reduction bug mainly) which has to be fixed
- It's GWFs insane damage which has to be lowered (look ayroux suggestions about stacking system!)
0.0 i agree with you 0.0 must take a screenshot
btw i would go further with nerfing gfs and fix boons
@drkbodhi please stop posting here, please! Everything you said is irrelevant and somehow off-topic.
OP is talking about equal playground = BiS level. You talking about your 2k ilvl TR... what the .... ?!?!?
I have mixed opinions about CW. On one side CW is a strong team player in 2v2 / 5v5 which can apply buffs & debuffs, control and damage is also nice. A good All-rounder!
In 1vs1 situations macjae is completely right! But is a buff really necessary?
I don't think so, to be honest.... in my opinion: - It's HRs perma daze/stun which has to go.
- It's TEB which has to be fixed
- It's GFs damage which has to be nerfed by 10-20%
- It's perma TRs damage which has to be lowered
- It's Paladin bugs (CD reduction bug mainly) which has to be fixed
- It's GWFs insane damage which has to be lowered (look ayroux suggestions about stacking system!)
I also find myself in agreement with you on this. The problems encountered are hidden behind other problems and fixes in the wrong areas will not help. The root problems need to be tackled and you have indicated some of the major ones here. This is a reason devs need to get on top of bugs/broken issues/overpowered states quickly as they perpetuate and get concealed and crop up later undetected in other issues and corrections are implemented or requested to counter the issues that should instead be dealt with.
The devs for this game are totally useless when it comes to PvP balance. Really broken stuff takes months to fix and sometimes they don't even get fixed at all. They just don't care or they don't understand what the game is like in PvP because they don't play it themselves. There are so many examples of this already so I probably just wont PvP anymore and when I'm bored of the PvE I'm taking a break.
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
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icyphishMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,255Arc User
edited September 2015
ejziponken, try speaking with other more senior CWs from our guild for option, Rolen, Schneider, Isode are all pretty experienced fighting various classes using CW (there is another good CW with very high kill number in NCL board in our guild, can't remember his name sorry!), personally my GWF murders 95%+ of the CWs but those few CWs can definitely put up some challenge.
The key is not just to think about how to burst kill or how to utilise your skills, the top CW and the next tier makes a big difference in knowing, WHEN to do their burst, you toy your target, do accmulative damage from time to time, drain their stamina or whatever, then hit them the hardest when your target is least valunable and kill them off before they have the chance to recover. Or, comboing your attacks with different classes to effectively team-kill ur target. (HR and CW is an awesome combo, both are ranged and can toy melee attacks really well when standing from both ends of the target.) In fact, many classes are HAMSTER when it comes to 1 vs 1, we just need to find out how to best counter our opponents in 1 vs 1, and if its not to your favor, then find out how to best utilise your class in a TEAM fight. This is from my past 11 months of premading experience...
PS: I can give you some tips about when is the most vunluable time for some classes, pm me in game to find out the little things that could make huge difference
Disgusting post from a crier CW who want to be a god, simple and plain! You're BiS man and complain about high 1v1?? CWs are fine, they deserve what they have. I'm sure you were pretty confortable in Mod4 without whinning, uh? Just practise other ways to counterback for god's sake!! The only thing you're right is about broken OP palis, broken HRs stuns and that permaS TRs have a too easy tree compare with the other 2. I REPEAT, you just want to be able to kill every BiS player always.
Disgusting post from a crier CW who want to be a god, simple and plain! You're BiS man and complain about high 1v1?? CWs are fine, they deserve what they have. I'm sure you were pretty confortable in Mod4 without whinning, uh? Just practise other ways to counterback for god's sake!! The only thing you're right is about broken OP palis, broken HRs stuns and that permaS TRs have a too easy tree compare with the other 2. I REPEAT, you just want to be able to kill every BiS player always.
I guess when GWFs do the same as always everybody should be all ears...?
stock and stone I can master, but there's a Wizard to manage here!
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icyphishMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,255Arc User
CWs are fine, learning every other classes' mechanics and encounters helps a lot fighting them. Remember you dont always have to kill to win a fight, but knowing your role and ultilizing your class' strength would make u shine.
I don't play cw but imo CW is good class for pvp and i don't think it needs boost, I'd say it needs nerf on chaotic growth - cw shouldnt be a healer of any point, but i do agree some of other classes need to be wiped out of being too overpowered
Comments
haha thats funny.
For a CW pretty much all classes (except SW) are hard to kill when equal geared BiS. When I say hard i mean impossible in many scenarios.
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
You have control, damage and survivability in PvP. The CW lacks in control and survivability and that makes it hard for us to deal the damage that we could do if we got the chance. This puts our class on the lower end of the ladder. And that's why we need a buff in control and survivability.
DC/OP are extremely good in survivability and they have some control too. And those parts makes up for the damage they don't have. The way it should be except for maybe the pally has to much survivability.
TR has damage and extremely good survivability. Makes it a very good class.
GWF has really high damage and good survivability and that makes it a good class to play too.
GF has high survivability, high damage and high control.
SW has high damage but little control and survivability. Could probably get a buff maybe? Not sure how its doing against other classes.
HR has extremely broken OP control ATM. Good damage, good survivability.
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
"Unless you can improve on silence, do nothing, say nothing."
I don't take bait because I am not a fish... or easy prey.
must take a screenshot
btw i would go further with nerfing gfs and fix boons
▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ ▇ █ Gankdalf The Icehole █ ▇ ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁
The key is not just to think about how to burst kill or how to utilise your skills, the top CW and the next tier makes a big difference in knowing, WHEN to do their burst, you toy your target, do accmulative damage from time to time, drain their stamina or whatever, then hit them the hardest when your target is least valunable and kill them off before they have the chance to recover. Or, comboing your attacks with different classes to effectively team-kill ur target. (HR and CW is an awesome combo, both are ranged and can toy melee attacks really well when standing from both ends of the target.) In fact, many classes are HAMSTER when it comes to 1 vs 1, we just need to find out how to best counter our opponents in 1 vs 1, and if its not to your favor, then find out how to best utilise your class in a TEAM fight. This is from my past 11 months of premading experience...
PS: I can give you some tips about when is the most vunluable time for some classes, pm me in game to find out the little things that could make huge difference
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
Author of GWF Speed Demon PvP Build (Mod 11) <- Click to reveal the Speedy Beast! >:)
This would cut down the the chances for classes to outlast them and burst them down.
Especially if repel can be completely avoided.
^^^
The most important thing in life is to be yourself. Unless you can be Batman. Always be Batman.