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TR in mod 6
pufy2010
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 301 Arc User
Hello guy's A.A here.
I had the pleasure to test some more..with a friend TR.
Me ( full Mythical/rank 12) and him basic..just purple artifacts ,and rank 7-8.
Regarding my damage..was like nothing compared to the TR.
What i see is :
TR mod 6 have :
Same incredibile move speed..if he dodges u cant catch him..even mounted.
Same ITC whenever i menage to CC him , so he easy escapes Dangerous CC and repeat stealth and etc.
Same Daze.
Incredible Damage ( 2 hits .>Rarely 3 hits till it kills me).
ON GWF i can tank better ), but then its the problem with Move Speed , if i CC him he will use ITC to dodge away and enter perma mode.
So my question is : Mod 5 was not enough ??? Did players not offer feedbacks and everything towards TR ?
Mod 6 will be a TR feast ?
Im not tryng to troll , im tryng to find the Logic in all this.
My Feedback would be :
ITC keep deflect , keep duration and CD, But remove the CC immunity ( not fair to be CC'ed then instantly escape CC and immune to it for 5 seconds .
Restore the Old Dodges , The range size of dodge is to Big.
Do something with the dazes , add higher CD or something.
May the Bacon Bless.
I had the pleasure to test some more..with a friend TR.
Me ( full Mythical/rank 12) and him basic..just purple artifacts ,and rank 7-8.
Regarding my damage..was like nothing compared to the TR.
What i see is :
TR mod 6 have :
Same incredibile move speed..if he dodges u cant catch him..even mounted.
Same ITC whenever i menage to CC him , so he easy escapes Dangerous CC and repeat stealth and etc.
Same Daze.
Incredible Damage ( 2 hits .>Rarely 3 hits till it kills me).
ON GWF i can tank better ), but then its the problem with Move Speed , if i CC him he will use ITC to dodge away and enter perma mode.
So my question is : Mod 5 was not enough ??? Did players not offer feedbacks and everything towards TR ?
Mod 6 will be a TR feast ?
Im not tryng to troll , im tryng to find the Logic in all this.
My Feedback would be :
ITC keep deflect , keep duration and CD, But remove the CC immunity ( not fair to be CC'ed then instantly escape CC and immune to it for 5 seconds .
Restore the Old Dodges , The range size of dodge is to Big.
Do something with the dazes , add higher CD or something.
May the Bacon Bless.
/color][color=#fc0602]Q[/color][color=#fa0d04]_[/color][color=#f81406]Q[/color][color=#f61a08 Any depression should be met with a smile. Depression will think you are an idiot and will run away /color][color=#0f51ef]^[/color][color=#0d4bf1]_[/color][color=#0b44f3]_[/color] [color=#0637f8]_[/color][color=#0431fa]^[/color][color=#022afc
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it should not be. the tr facetanks the fighter right now.
the fighter should wipe the floor with the tr face to face, a tr is supposed to be physically weak and only attack from weak points, not dominate the fighter face to face liek they currenlky do
regards
because this **** is not supposed to happen. a 12k tr is NOT supposed to one shot a 26k GWF with SE. and yet it happens.
The Holy Crusaders guild leader ♚ Mod 10 PVE Destroyer GWF guide ♚ Founding member of the Relentless Alliance
Try this ALL against TR is a bad match PERIOD-
SOME extreamly geared extreamly well played cw - dc - hr can hold against avarage to good TRs non withstand bis geared well played TR.
Lets just do a simple example...using old gs as new is not established yet.
Put a 14k gs TR against all other classes having 20 gs and see how many times he wins out of 3 matches
Put then put all classes 14 k gs against a 20 k gs Tr and see how many matches anybody wins out of 3.
We can expand this example and it will just become even more obvious how EXTREAMLY BROKEN TR IS IN PVP.
Devs are blind as bats to this and when we played with the devs the TR went 27-1 next in kills was cw with 5 kills.
When I asked about this they said either am not handling that class or stayed silent without a comment........
I play TR since open Beta and have 21K GS myself. CWs with shield on Tab and Ice to CC me are the hell. DCs dodge and heal themself and can still do a good amount of damage and SW can give you some DOTs of death.
YES, the TR has a clear advantage and best would be if the class would lose 25% deflect severity and get one dodge less because to get a high deflect chance in ADDITION to a high deflect severity is a game breaker (I play now an DC which should be really Tanky but my TR feels much more like an Tank) and to play against classes with 4 dodges is annoying as hell.
SW counter a TR and you played since beta daaaam and daaaam again and some sweeet jeesus on top of it.
That is worst scenario when you are bizzy killing somebody else lets see what you can do to them in their worst case scenario.
Dont even try to defend Tr **** in pvp I will destroy you with clear facts and examples if you do am more then tired of how TRs dominate pvp and try to justify that ******ness...
Bad enough it is as it is saying its ok is another thing.................
Crappy TR's can barely do anything against teh current SW, but this will change in Mod 6 thanks 2 a few things
1: Lifesteal = Chance to Life steal, and all AoE attacks produce 30% reduced heals from Lifesteal awesome.
2: No In Combat Regen = As our health gets lower, we will simply continue to die, rather than start healing for larger amounts.
3: Incoming Healing Bonus = Was great because it increased yoru self heals from regen and lifesteal, now kind of useless without a healer..
With these changes in mod 6, the use of SW with Hellbringer Fury spec becomes almost pointless in a casual solo queue situation, would be REQUIRED to have a premade to run with, but whos going to take the SW over a CW in that Premade?
Sopi SW Youtube channel pvp brickabrack
The solution they chose effectively killed the scoundrel for PvP, but you will hear no less crying about being dazed than is heard now. Also if the changes to executioner remain as they are on test then it will also likely be the death knell of the executioner in PvP. This will leave every one facing the saboteur (perma stealth, greater damage and more frequent long dazes than the scoundrel (the supposed daze tr). Nerfing the scoundrel capstone so that it is worse at dazing than three encounter powers seems a bit silly to me considering GWF were already impervious to the capstone and especially considering the scoundrel was the lowest damage and most visible of the trees.
Actually the best solution to TRs that would NOT affect PVE at all would to give them a movement speed REDUCTION when going Stealth.
This should be ABOUT a 20% movement speed reduction - w.e Guardian Fighters have when blocking.
Because that ALONE would make them much easier to catch - however STILL allowing TRs to slot max movement and move MUCH faster in stealth, just not AS fast as they are right now.
This is the PAINFULL obvious answer that keeps getting over looked for "damage nerfs/buffs" and other things like "deflect nerfs"
People dont understand that when you lower movement, it lowers their ability to stay OUT of range of stealth detection - which allows them to hide less often, choose more carefully when to attack.
I would even say there is very little you need to do with the class BUT adjust movement speed and it would be a squishier/high DPS class. Currently tho its movement + stealth + ITC make it a very tanky class.
And trust me most non-over-geared TR need this to survive, and mod 6 will simply increase the need tu spend your life running.
running for combat advantage, running to avoir damage, running for wathever team-play reason you can imagine.
i predict mod 6 pvp will be disaster just like mod 5
let's hit lv 70 and if you not TR don't bother que for pvp let's wait for mod 7
daze is already nerf, deflec sev is already nerf great decision
my suggestion is
nerf roll animation
make 100% change crit stealth only affect atwill only and
make when in ITC mode only can use atwill only and can't roll
Don't misunderstand me, I am against a loot of thing the TR actually have, but "nerfing" will not improve the situation. The only thing you can expect is PvE TR being useless again and PvP TR going back to perma-stealth + stun build. And for this last detail, it will most probably be a real annoyance in mod6 because of the scoundrel's nerf and the induced respecs... What do you mean ? I can understand the need of nerfing the dodge itself, but it's animation ? It is already one of the slowest dodge in game. You need half a second after hitting the button before it effectively start, and 1 second before you can dodge again.
+1,
But still TR need to some damage reduce.
Daze and deflc sev already been nerf
perma stealth is no longer available because of stealth reveal when attacking
They still can do all crit damage with atwill but no 1 hit kill encounter or daily skill anymore only if they got lucky
Wanna do encounter or daily crit damage? then stack critical stat like other class
i don't care if dev only nerf pvp state and buff pve state what we need is pvp balance here
what i mean nerf roll animation is to speed up dodge time frame or give the after effect animation after roll so they will be vunerable at least 1s after roll so no more roll spwan
Why? TR are a striker are they not? As a current WK scoundrel (soon to be a saboteur since the scoundrel nerfs force me to choose a saboteur if I want to be an effective daze TR) I can already tell you that on control immune targets my damage is already behind an CW/SW/HR/GWF -- and even a DC. I don't see how making sure I was also behind a defensive build GF would solve anything.
Now if you have a more detailed explanation of what damage you think needs to be reduced then please don't be so general as to simply say "damage reduce" as I am already feeling the results of devs listening to poor input from players and it has decimated my chosen path to play in.
you mean 50% instead of 75% severity ?
If yes, no it is back to 75. Also TR can stack a lot of deflect thanks to their dexterity and charisma, so, we are not the most affected by new curves for this particular stats. At least, if builded for deflect...
The problem is that TR in PvE is supposed to be the single target damage dealer. The consequence is that what make him efficient in PvE also make him OP in PvP (where single target is the rule), but what balance him in PvP make him useless in PvE.
The class would be easier to fix if redesigned from scratch, but I don't think that it will ever happen...
most TR already stack more crit than other class (for an equivalent GS). The problem is that the actual balance allow us to fit in PvE team-play only via our crits. If the LB don't crit, it's just 8000 damages on a single target, and that is nearly useless for a 17s cooldown.
Also, our damages boost always take effect thanks to stealth and critical hits. We stack damage when we have both, and if we don't, we are a single-target DPS class with no single target DPS.
That's what happened until mod5.
About the dodge, I don't know, it is a really strange thing. I often take damage during the first part of the dodge, but get the immunity for the second part AND a few time after. In my opinion, TR's dodge is a broken ability. Also, yes, it is "too much", but in the same way that the old dodge was "not enought".
To give that to a character that also has stealth and hits you before you even know is a tremendous **** up of the game design.
If this is not mitigated somewhat in Mod 6, then no, the devs have not been listening.
When i started the game and only had my utterly broken GF, i told my self go on and make another class and then another one. Now that i have them all, i know one thing for sure, if you want to spare yourself a ton of pain and money or AD, just make a CW or/and TR, always a winner bet. Others are only good for your solo fun (as it seems with Mod 6 even this isn't totally true) or simply AD slaves (sadly even this is going to get nerfed).
Maybe it's me and i am totally dumb, but in all my years with DnD i could never find a one shot class, with perma stealth. LOL all DnD novels would be pretty fast to read, maybe 1 page long.
Oh and i have a TR, but still find the entire perma and 1 shot thing disgusting.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
I guess it's perspective, if your fighting a sab or exec I can see the problem, they can rely on piercing damage and procced abilities to do massive damage with low gs and no skill. That is the majority of tr's and that is why I think it is the most notable problem. Anyone that pvped but just plain sucked heard about TR builds that do massive damage just holding down a button from stealth and proc crazy damage so they flocked to it. Hr's are definitely bugged out and DC's are just crazy if they are DPS. The difference is that those 2 classes still take skill to take advantage of the broken mechanics, unlike the TR so there is just alot more tr's that really have no skill but the dev's gave them the crutch of piercing damage and procced abilities. The skilless will always flock to the OP build and then complain if you try and change and remove the crutches.
Sadly, the complaints got the wrong path nerfed. Why asked for the removal of dazes but not the ridiculously stupid concept of piercing damage and any form of damage procced off at wills. Really anything to me that procs damage should be deleted. I hated wow for the button mashing and random aspect of it, now they are introducing more of that garbage in this game and no ones complains. Now you are going to have nothing but sabs running around in perma stealth and the only sound you will hear in pvp from the tr's will be that of glooming cut and cloud of steal. To powers I have alway's despised since mod 1. I for one will retire my TR instead of play any tree that requires less skill.
Have fun with the new influx of perma stealth noobs and the sweet sound of glooming cut as you are killed with simply someone holding down the same button until your dead. Oh, and dazing, from my test on preview, my attemp at sab gave me insight to the path. I can actually daze longer now in sab then I could as scoundrel. Now for everyone whining about things they didn't even take the time to understand more then then fact they have been <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> by 10k gs tr's that somehow had all the feats in one. Well now they is exactly what they have down. Sab is the only choice for a TR now in mod 6, and PVP will be filled with carbon copies TR's.
Enjoy