Ok guys i checked out the test server i could go point by point but all those have already been made here.
I am left with one simple truth, There is no reason for anyone to invite a GF into a group when a GWF can do the same job better ( guess that is subjective) and DPS on top of it. Can you give groups a reason to invite us ?
I am not saying ill quit blah blah i am saying ill be paying attention to the new games that comes out that i can actually TANK in.
edit: kinda funny suggestion a HR made.. Maybe give us a second active companion so we can get a couple dps'ers or healers or something to be equal to another class. not serious just had to share.
Ok guys i checked out the test server i could go point by point but all those have already been made here.
I am left with one simple truth, There is no reason for anyone to invite a GF into a group when a GWF can do the same job better ( guess that is subjective) and DPS on top of it. Can you give groups a reason to invite us ?
I am not saying ill quit blah blah i am saying ill be paying attention to the new games that comes out that i can actually TANK in.
edit: kinda funny suggestion a HR made.. Maybe give us a second active companion so we can get a couple dps'ers or healers or something to be equal to another class. not serious just had to share.
Nobody will invite us because we have 2 healers, maybe if we have 2 stones xD, but those are things that will never happend anyway...
For me (Swordmaster / Protector) the +48% more damage in Weaponmaster's Strike is nice, but again, it's only for SW, I think the entire GF class (no matter what spec) need a little buff in damage and something realistic could be getting like +10~15% Damage in all our weapons and maybe reducing our encounter's CD (for example, making the feat Fight On reduce our CD by 3/6/9/12/15% or 4/8/12/16/20%), other thing could be increase the Lunging Strike cap (Idk how much it is but I think I never hit more than 5 foes with this) just like what they did with Enforced Threat.
And why say "think before you type" ? I said clerics have more dmg than a gf and im right our weapon dmg is around 660 there is over 800 and what has you beating top clerics got anything to do with that ? and i know how to fight clerics... all i was saying is that its stupid that a gf has less dmg than a cleric and you saying thats not true because you have beaten top clerics is like me saying i guardian fighters have more dmg than a destroyer gwf because i have beaten a player in a 1v1.
Today i also met a cleric in pvp, i beat him but im a full dps gf with all feats on dmg i have 8.5 k power with 2k crit and 2k armor pen and the cleric was hitting me way more than i was hitting him and he has less power and armor pen than me...
Crixus - PVP GF
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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epclipseingmoonMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2014
lifesteal and swordmaster seem to be the way to go mod 4 onwards with the defective new block.
epclipseingmoonMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2014
I think if the new block has to say we need to have fighters recovery to come with cc imunity like the gwfs unstoppable and no villians menance does not heal before someone comes in and says that. Its a daily for us not some tab power so this would be much more ballenced.
I think if the new block has to say we need to have fighters recovery to come with cc imunity like the gwfs unstoppable and no villians menance does not heal before someone comes in and says that. Its a daily for us not some tab power so this would be much more ballenced.
I was imagined if Dev can combine GF and GWF to 1 fighter class, it will use tab to switch between Grate weapon and shiled & long sword like HR, then unstoppable move to daily power...,will it be a op class?:cool:
Block is permanent. With block full until it is drained you block 100% of incoming damage. However, once the bar is depleted you only block 20% of incoming damage. Your block won't recharge until you release it or use a power that restores your stamina bar. The Protector path could have feats that increase the depleted guard block percentage. Maybe rework the Iron Guard capstone feat into doubling your depleted guard block, so 40%. Remove the CC and stun immunity though when guard is depleted, so as to avoid GFs running around PVP with guard up constantly.
As for other powers:
Indomitable Strike needs to CC the target upon activation (like Crescendo) or have a Duelist Flurry-type lock-on. In PVP it is far too easy to dodge and in PVE the boss or target can just walk away and there goes your daily, blown into fresh air. Sure, if you are fast enough you can cancel it, but that isn't the point.
Villain's Menace & Fighter's Recovery need to have CC immunity when casting. I've died many times while trying to activate one of them as I got proned/CC'd/stunned into oblivion. Don't mind taking damage when trying to use it, but it is very irritating to have 3-4 Golems explode in succession right next to you and chain prone you.
Please turn Cleave into a 180-degree AOE with a slight speed buff.
PSA: You don't need to grind Spinward Rise for your Elemental artifact main hand if you have some AD lying around. You can craft it via the Tyranny of Dragon's campaign screen.
Block is permanent. With block full until it is drained you block 100% of incoming damage. However, once the bar is depleted you only block 20% of incoming damage. Your block won't recharge until you release it or use a power that restores your stamina bar. The Protector path could have feats that increase the depleted guard block percentage. Maybe rework the Iron Guard capstone feat into doubling your depleted guard block, so 40%. Remove the CC and stun immunity though when guard is depleted, so as to avoid GFs running around PVP with guard up constantly.
My shelved protector GF would be more than happy with your proposed changes to shield mechanic They don't even seem OP (no irony)
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zhaofuoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 129Bounty Hunter
edited June 2014
RECKLESS ATTACKER *REWORK*:
Because of the pathetic status of block meter, Reckless attacker would be worthless. Not only should it provide a higher damage boost,
but I dont think it should be tied to guard meter at all. What I would propose is IF the stat changes go live, GFs will have a minimum of 5-7% more crit on most GFs. This would allow GFs to STILL have the lowest crit in the game but put them in a decent range (30%ish for PVP and 35%ish for PVE).
So, Changing Reckless attacker to 30% damage bonus for 8 seconds AFTER dealing a critical strike.
As i have mentioned before changing the reckless attacker to trigger via crit is not what we want, 30% increase is too small for a GF
GWF have almost 40 to 50% in their destroyer capstone and have a bigger wpn damage and yet you want 30% increase only in our DPS path?
Block is permanent. With block full until it is drained you block 100% of incoming damage. However, once the bar is depleted you only block 20% of incoming damage. Your block won't recharge until you release it or use a power that restores your stamina bar. The Protector path could have feats that increase the depleted guard block percentage. Maybe rework the Iron Guard capstone feat into doubling your depleted guard block, so 40%. Remove the CC and stun immunity though when guard is depleted, so as to avoid GFs running around PVP with guard up constantly.
As for other powers:
Indomitable Strike needs to CC the target upon activation (like Crescendo) or have a Duelist Flurry-type lock-on. In PVP it is far too easy to dodge and in PVE the boss or target can just walk away and there goes your daily, blown into fresh air. Sure, if you are fast enough you can cancel it, but that isn't the point.
Villain's Menace & Fighter's Recovery need to have CC immunity when casting. I've died many times while trying to activate one of them as I got proned/CC'd/stunned into oblivion. Don't mind taking damage when trying to use it, but it is very irritating to have 3-4 Golems explode in succession right next to you and chain prone you.
Please turn Cleave into a 180-degree AOE with a slight speed buff.
Thats how it should be! 100% until depleted then 20% until you recharge... I see no reason in PVE / PVP this cannot be feasible. Many classes have DR mitigation some better then the GF we should never ever be without DR mitigation ever!
EDIT: With plaguefire, bronzewood, terror, and a plethora of other defense mitigating debuffs coupled with everyone having massive Armor Penetration the GF should never be left with Negative Defense! He should always have his trusty shield to block damage.
Shieldbash60 GF ~ Iron Vanguard19.0k Overpowered60 CW~ Thaumaturge14.5k ==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
Block is permanent. With block full until it is drained you block 100% of incoming damage. However, once the bar is depleted you only block 20% of incoming damage. Your block won't recharge until you release it or use a power that restores your stamina bar. The Protector path could have feats that increase the depleted guard block percentage. Maybe rework the Iron Guard capstone feat into doubling your depleted guard block, so 40%. Remove the CC and stun immunity though when guard is depleted, so as to avoid GFs running around PVP with guard up constantly.
Love this idea. I think 20% is FAR too weak though. I thought of this but didnt want it to be too confusing for the DEVs. I think what would need to happen here then is:
- Current PTR block doubled.
- Block blocks 100% while you have stamina.
- When stamina depletes its about "half" as effective so it would only mitigate 40% damage.
- Iron guard Capstone could add an additional 20% to this for 60%.
I still think though that CC immunity would be NEEDED. I dont think this weakened version of block would be So strong that people would want to run around in it 24/7.
*Remember all numbers also THEN are multiplied by DR and Tenacity in PVP so:
100 = 100%
40% block = 74% "DR" + Deflect.
60% block = 84 % "DR" + Deflect.
As for other powers:
Indomitable Strike needs to CC the target upon activation (like Crescendo) or have a Duelist Flurry-type lock-on. In PVP it is far too easy to dodge and in PVE the boss or target can just walk away and there goes your daily, blown into fresh air. Sure, if you are fast enough you can cancel it, but that isn't the point.
Villain's Menace & Fighter's Recovery need to have CC immunity when casting. I've died many times while trying to activate one of them as I got proned/CC'd/stunned into oblivion. Don't mind taking damage when trying to use it, but it is very irritating to have 3-4 Golems explode in succession right next to you and chain prone you.
Please turn Cleave into a 180-degree AOE with a slight speed buff.
Agree as well on the CC immunity. I have also died many times while casting those abilities. Especially now that Fighters Recovery is lessened in PVP due to HD, I think its fair if it is either sped up ALOT or provides CC immunity. Villians - Dont know why this already wasnt done...
That would mean around 8-10 secs of complete invulnerability, and after that unlimited 50% damage resistance. (of course only works with damage coming from the front, and the GF can't do much while blocking. I'd like to see what other GFs think of it.
Posted a newer "Summary" taking into consideration changes to block as suggested here PLUS changed Reckless Attacker. Post feedback in the official thread.
NOTE: If you disagree, dont just say "this wont work" but post YOUR suggestion/change as to what you think it should be. No need to flame as we all are trying to accomplish the same goal.
2) Armor of Bahamut Should be moved deeper into the Protector Tree. Basically this is a 10% DR boost which is about 4x stronger than the 5% more deflect T1 feat. For a T1 feat this is too strong.
Nah, for me the problem is that +5% Deflect is very poor, plate agility should be +2/4/6/8/10% Deflect Chance (so it would be like having +5% DR, cause 10% Deflect Chance * 50% Deflect Severity = - 5% Incoming Damage app.), also shield Defence should be +2/4/6/8/10 AC so we could have +5% flat DR (up from +2.5% DR which again, is a very poor feat) and then Armor of Bahamut would be on par with the these feats, cause that +10% DR wouldn't be forever, it would be active in some situations.
It may sound too much, but in the actual situation with the Protector tree we are getting just a -5% Incoming Damage app. with 2 feats at 5/5 (Plate Agility [T1] and Shield Defence [T2]) while other feats (in this class and others) give much more Damage.
Nah, for me the problem is that +5% Deflect is very poor, plate agility should be +2/4/6/8/10% Deflect Chance (so it would be like having +5% DR, cause 10% Deflect Chance * 50% Deflect Severity = - 5% Incoming Damage app.), also shield Defence should be +2/4/6/8/10 AC so we could have +5% flat DR (up from +2.5% DR which again, is a very poor feat) and then Armor of Bahamut would be on par with the these feats, cause that +10% DR wouldn't be forever, it would be active in some situations.
It may sound too much, but in the actual situation with the Protector tree we are getting just a -5% Incoming Damage app. with 2 feats at 5/5 (Plate Agility [T1] and Shield Defence [T2]) while other feats (in this class and others) give much more Damage.
But that's just my opinion .
if you want that to happen plate agility or Shield Defence would need to move to t3 as it could be a bit much when going to another capstone. And then have the shield recharge(10%) put in place there to help with the new stamina mechanic so other paths would have access to that and make protector a more solid tank.
if you want that to happen plate agility or Shield Defence would need to move to t3 as it could be a bit much when going to another capstone. And then have the shield recharge(10%) put in place there to help with the new stamina mechanic so other paths would have access to that and make protector a more solid tank.
Agreed. The big issue is making really good DR feats deeper into Prot tree making it unique. Armor of Bahamut is very strong, actually TOO strong for a T1 IMO.
Things like 5% deflect, or even 5 AC are pretty appropriate T1 feats, plenty of other classes have similar 5% deflect as T1. If its to be buffed IMO should be deeper in the tree.
Also, I dont think Conq or Tact should have access to Armor of Bahamut as 10% DR is pretty big...
Agreed. The big issue is making really good DR feats deeper into Prot tree making it unique. Armor of Bahamut is very strong, actually TOO strong for a T1 IMO.
Things like 5% deflect, or even 5 AC are pretty appropriate T1 feats, plenty of other classes have similar 5% deflect as T1. If its to be buffed IMO should be deeper in the tree.
Also, I dont think Conq or Tact should have access to Armor of Bahamut as 10% DR is pretty big...
If you think so, then you play the protector not well. My block is barely under 30% on live and on PTS it's useless. When i look to sentinel, then i see a big gap. As i said: A protector gain NO additionally defense for anything(out of the 'useless' KV feat), which the other path can't get too! THERE must be more implemented. Out of Ferocious Reaction, which is a paragon path power, NO extra benefit for passives are granted through the feats... that's so burdensome!
Tactical Superiority 5
Combat Superiority deals 1/2/3/4/5% more damage. At the 5th tier of this feat, Combat Superiority will not require that the target hits you first.
That's one for the conquerer path!
Same problem on the tactician path. No benefit for slotting any passive!
1) Knights Challenge - May be too strong for a single target burst with 30% more damage from Mark (doubles with KC). I dont have a solution here, but it could be too "cheesy" with more crit and more damage and cause an issue.
So maybe look at dropping the damage, but also look at possible giving the GF and advantage on others when using it. So something Like: Locks you and your foe in combat, dealing 50% more damage to eachother, HOWEVER additional ranks increase damage by 15% AND extend duration putting the GF at 80% bonus damage (down from 100%) while foes only deal 50% more damage. This leaves the net effect close to the same as on LIVE, but enemies wont deal quite as much damage in return.
It would be too much of a nerf to what we are currently lacking, which is Damage... So idk if this would actually work, because 100% for other classes is like 500% for ourselves and with a whooping -20% (way more actually, if all damage addons are factored in) we would hit like a wet noodle, even more than we currently do, while our targets will still be able to happily flail away on us... Nice idea but the values are not well thought out.
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On a sidenote, aren't you playing fotm classes exclusively? (TR,HR,GWF when they used to be ZOMG l33t111!!!?) I believe i can remember you saying you quit your GF when the stalwart got reworked (aka you could not 1 shot people anymore) and you kind of quit your GWF when tenebrous couldn't really roflstomp anything anymore? Why are you suggesting nerfs to this class? In order to kill it more easily with your new fotm, or? I don't really get it.
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IF anything, we should do considerably MORE damage as conquerors, not the other way around.
The problem is it will be too good on the current block meter and it still doesnt address the problem of fast small attacks draining it in two seconds. It gives certain classes like TR an advantage and classes who cant attack as fast no way of dropping block meter - which makes it too strong IMO, along with the damage buffs and DR boosts.
Since GFs will have PLENTY of uptime now, I think this system is MORE than fair. Now the GF chooses between Conq Spec and the ability to deal good damage but be less tanky, or Defensive Protector where they deal less damage but are ALOT tankier.
With THESE changes (SEE PREVIOUS POST - THESE ARE NOT TO BE TAKEN IN ISOLATION), there MAY be some possible imbalance with some feats.... So...
Changes to CONSIDER:
1) Knights Challenge - May be too strong for a single target burst with 30% more damage from Mark (doubles with KC). I dont have a solution here, but it could be too "cheesy" with more crit and more damage and cause an issue.
So maybe look at dropping the damage, but also look at possible giving the GF and advantage on others when using it. So something Like: Locks you and your foe in combat, dealing 50% more damage to eachother, HOWEVER additional ranks increase damage by 15% AND extend duration putting the GF at 80% bonus damage (down from 100%) while foes only deal 50% more damage. This leaves the net effect close to the same as on LIVE, but enemies wont deal quite as much damage in return.
This cuts down on damage "cheese" and gives slightly more "utility".
2) Armor of Bahamut Should be moved deeper into the Protector Tree. Basically this is a 10% DR boost which is about 4x stronger than the 5% more deflect T1 feat. For a T1 feat this is too strong.
Simple SWAPPING it for "shieldmaster (T3 feat)" would more than suffice. Now players cant go full Conq OR Full Tact and still get this feat - reserved for basically Protector Tree.
3) Re-Inforced Surge This does nothing in PVP. Suggestion would be, BASE frontline surge acts as a STUN, RE-Inforced Surge returns the PRONE both in PVE and PVP.[/QUOTE]
I have to strongly disagree in that our base Frontline Surge even stepping into the area of a near pointless stun for pvp would make it a darn near joke so no however if the devs deem so they are free to differentiate between GWF and GF... we keep the prone and the GWF can get the stun.
I could really get behind this. My GF would love having a party buff as a tab ability. The only down side would be the loss of the enduring mark, but they could make all GF marks enduring and then put this on the tab mechanic. That would make them more powerful than GWFs marks (a GF should have more threat generation than even a Sentinel GWF, in my opinion).
Please make this happen, devs!
- B
people should not make ideas based on just pve though....the tab skill should not be a team buff ability since they could just buff the gf encounter powers better to help the team.
Im a pvp player and most other chars are already way better than the gf so why would i want to buff them more ? i would rather have a tab skill that helped me in some way like cc immunity or a rage like tab skill, could be like villains menace.
people should not make ideas based on just pve though....the tab skill should not be a team buff ability since they could just buff the gf encounter powers better to help the team.
Im a pvp player and most other chars are already way better than the gf so why would i want to buff them more ? i would rather have a tab skill that helped me in some way like cc immunity or a rage like tab skill, could be like villains menace.
i am a pvp player also and i can tell you that into the fray and iron warrior would be amazing for pvp. why? because of moving speed, temporal hit points and guard regen. Enough said.
i am a pvp player also and i can tell you that into the fray and iron warrior would be amazing for pvp. why? because of moving speed, temporal hit points and guard regen. Enough said.
i would rather have dmg skills than just running around with good regen untill i die.
i dont know any gf that slots either of those powers in pvp because the slots are already full with more needed powers and having a team buff on the tab ability when your team is probably all gwf, hr and TR is just pointless i would rather something to help me like i said before. Gf have a harder time getting double and triple kills already so a dmg option on tab would be great
Also the skills you listed are terrible, all the buffs are low apart from into the freys movement speed.
i would rather have dmg skills than just running around with good regen untill i die.
i dont know any gf that slots either of those powers in pvp because the slots are already full with more needed powers and having a team buff on the tab ability when your team is probably all gwf, hr and TR is just pointless i would rather something to help me like i said before. Gf have a harder time getting double and triple kills already so a dmg option on tab would be great
Also the skills you listed are terrible, all the buffs are low apart from into the freys movement speed.
exactly dont you get it? they are to weak to be used as encounters. But as tab abilities they will suffice. You say kite until you die? man you kite gwfs to survive their unstoppable and you need the run speed if you are swordmaster gf because you wont have threatening rush. Please think about the possibilities. I know how to pvp and having these skills as a tab ability would be a great much needed buff. Ofc you get to pick between the 3. no knights challenge
exactly dont you get it? they are to weak to be used as encounters. But as tab abilities they will suffice. You say kite until you die? man you kite gwfs to survive their unstoppable and you need the run speed if you are swordmaster gf because you wont have threatening rush. Please think about the possibilities. I know how to pvp and having these skills as a tab ability would be a great much needed buff. Ofc you get to pick between the 3. no knights challenge
you are a protector based gf though and im a conqueror so you can understand why i would rather the dps skill there but even so yes i would rather have one of them powers rather than our current tab.
But the powers would need a buff, like iron warriors temp hitpoints are very bad and same for into the frey. If they had a little buff then that would be great but atm they are a little too weak.
and yeah kiting gwf and dodging them while they are in unstoppable would be good with a movment speed tab but again if it gave decent temp hitpoints then that would make it way better.
Crixus - PVP GF
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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brynicstormbornMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 41
WAR CRYs i say, war cry insted of that mark, which will be omnidirectinal and give multi buffs to allys and debuffs to enemy. but not the LAME kind of buff u gave us before, but real buffs/debuffs that will make a diff.
and change the sword into a brom, and the shield into a trey, since our SWORD is not for dps, and our shield hardly blocks, it just look rediculous. or maybe ponpons? and a skirt as an armor? that will feet what we do now: runing around try to stay alive
How is this constructive? The rest of us are trying to make honest suggestions to shape the class into a more useful role, both in PvE and PvP (even though we PvE and PvP players don't always see eye to eye - lmao).
Crix - You're correct. I mostly play PvE. I like it a lot better than PvP. Just personal preference. I do dip into PvP though, mostly because I'd really like a Vanguard Banner for the stats and wasn't able to get one before they went BoP. However, I don't think that fixing GFs is as simple as "fix it the way the PvP players want" or "Fix it the way the PvE players want" - you have to take both aspects into consideration.
I'd like to see GFs get an increase in damage, but I also don't want to see them become carbon-copy duplicates of GWFs, but with block/mark instead of unstoppable/sprint. The Iron Vanguard/Swordmaster crossover is already bad enough. I'm still a proponent for increasing GF weapon damage but leaving all skills at the same scaling. This would give us a flat damage buff across the board (I think 15-20% would be sufficient) while also helping weapon enchantments be a little more meaningful.
I'd also like to see a rework of some kind - and I've seen several good suggestions but don't have a personal preference among them - to reckless attacker in light of guard changing to a stamina based system. Perhaps something similar to destroyers purpose? +X% damage each time you are hit, but all stacks are removed when you block an attack?
- B
How is this constructive? The rest of us are trying to make honest suggestions to shape the class into a more useful role, both in PvE and PvP (even though we PvE and PvP players don't always see eye to eye - lmao).
Crix - You're correct. I mostly play PvE. I like it a lot better than PvP. Just personal preference. I do dip into PvP though, mostly because I'd really like a Vanguard Banner for the stats and wasn't able to get one before they went BoP. However, I don't think that fixing GFs is as simple as "fix it the way the PvP players want" or "Fix it the way the PvE players want" - you have to take both aspects into consideration.
I'd like to see GFs get an increase in damage, but I also don't want to see them become carbon-copy duplicates of GWFs, but with block/mark instead of unstoppable/sprint. The Iron Vanguard/Swordmaster crossover is already bad enough. I'm still a proponent for increasing GF weapon damage but leaving all skills at the same scaling. This would give us a flat damage buff across the board (I think 15-20% would be sufficient) while also helping weapon enchantments be a little more meaningful.
I'd also like to see a rework of some kind - and I've seen several good suggestions but don't have a personal preference among them - to reckless attacker in light of guard changing to a stamina based system. Perhaps something similar to destroyers purpose? +X% damage each time you are hit, but all stacks are removed when you block an attack?
- B
Yeah i understand, i dont do pve at all really but i would not want them to base any changes around just pvp. both pve and pvp should be taken into all changes so its a more enjoyable game for all players.
Damage damage damage, we need some! The game is going to get bigger better faster and stronger, yet GF still do less damage then Mod 1!
We need change and stamina shield wasn't it! Our class is the same same same nomatter how we spec what path we take SAME!!!!! Either we get a modicum more damage or a modicum more Defense. Make the paths MEAN something, right now SM / IV feats are identical! The only difference from an IV GF and a SM GF is one has different passives and the other loses FLS and Threatening Rush....
Geesh.
Shieldbash60 GF ~ Iron Vanguard19.0k Overpowered60 CW~ Thaumaturge14.5k ==========================================
~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
Comments
I am left with one simple truth, There is no reason for anyone to invite a GF into a group when a GWF can do the same job better ( guess that is subjective) and DPS on top of it. Can you give groups a reason to invite us ?
I am not saying ill quit blah blah i am saying ill be paying attention to the new games that comes out that i can actually TANK in.
edit: kinda funny suggestion a HR made.. Maybe give us a second active companion so we can get a couple dps'ers or healers or something to be equal to another class. not serious just had to share.
Nobody will invite us because we have 2 healers, maybe if we have 2 stones xD, but those are things that will never happend anyway...
For me (Swordmaster / Protector) the +48% more damage in Weaponmaster's Strike is nice, but again, it's only for SW, I think the entire GF class (no matter what spec) need a little buff in damage and something realistic could be getting like +10~15% Damage in all our weapons and maybe reducing our encounter's CD (for example, making the feat Fight On reduce our CD by 3/6/9/12/15% or 4/8/12/16/20%), other thing could be increase the Lunging Strike cap (Idk how much it is but I think I never hit more than 5 foes with this) just like what they did with Enforced Threat.
And why say "think before you type" ? I said clerics have more dmg than a gf and im right our weapon dmg is around 660 there is over 800 and what has you beating top clerics got anything to do with that ? and i know how to fight clerics... all i was saying is that its stupid that a gf has less dmg than a cleric and you saying thats not true because you have beaten top clerics is like me saying i guardian fighters have more dmg than a destroyer gwf because i have beaten a player in a 1v1.
Today i also met a cleric in pvp, i beat him but im a full dps gf with all feats on dmg i have 8.5 k power with 2k crit and 2k armor pen and the cleric was hitting me way more than i was hitting him and he has less power and armor pen than me...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
Princess Amber - DC
Shieldmaiden Amber - GF
Valkyrie Amber - GWF
Huntress Amber - HR
I was imagined if Dev can combine GF and GWF to 1 fighter class, it will use tab to switch between Grate weapon and shiled & long sword like HR, then unstoppable move to daily power...,will it be a op class?:cool:
Block is permanent. With block full until it is drained you block 100% of incoming damage. However, once the bar is depleted you only block 20% of incoming damage. Your block won't recharge until you release it or use a power that restores your stamina bar. The Protector path could have feats that increase the depleted guard block percentage. Maybe rework the Iron Guard capstone feat into doubling your depleted guard block, so 40%. Remove the CC and stun immunity though when guard is depleted, so as to avoid GFs running around PVP with guard up constantly.
As for other powers:
Indomitable Strike needs to CC the target upon activation (like Crescendo) or have a Duelist Flurry-type lock-on. In PVP it is far too easy to dodge and in PVE the boss or target can just walk away and there goes your daily, blown into fresh air. Sure, if you are fast enough you can cancel it, but that isn't the point.
Villain's Menace & Fighter's Recovery need to have CC immunity when casting. I've died many times while trying to activate one of them as I got proned/CC'd/stunned into oblivion. Don't mind taking damage when trying to use it, but it is very irritating to have 3-4 Golems explode in succession right next to you and chain prone you.
Please turn Cleave into a 180-degree AOE with a slight speed buff.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
My shelved protector GF would be more than happy with your proposed changes to shield mechanic
Because of the pathetic status of block meter, Reckless attacker would be worthless. Not only should it provide a higher damage boost,
As i have mentioned before changing the reckless attacker to trigger via crit is not what we want, 30% increase is too small for a GF
GWF have almost 40 to 50% in their destroyer capstone and have a bigger wpn damage and yet you want 30% increase only in our DPS path?
GF = lowest wpn damage 30% is too pitiful
Thats how it should be! 100% until depleted then 20% until you recharge... I see no reason in PVE / PVP this cannot be feasible. Many classes have DR mitigation some better then the GF we should never ever be without DR mitigation ever!
EDIT: With plaguefire, bronzewood, terror, and a plethora of other defense mitigating debuffs coupled with everyone having massive Armor Penetration the GF should never be left with Negative Defense! He should always have his trusty shield to block damage.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
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~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!
Agree as well on the CC immunity. I have also died many times while casting those abilities. Especially now that Fighters Recovery is lessened in PVP due to HD, I think its fair if it is either sped up ALOT or provides CC immunity. Villians - Dont know why this already wasnt done...
NOTE: If you disagree, dont just say "this wont work" but post YOUR suggestion/change as to what you think it should be. No need to flame as we all are trying to accomplish the same goal.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?692701-Official-Feedback-Thread-Guardian-Fighter-Changes&p=8291761&viewfull=1#post8291761
Also some "Feat Considerations" On the next page that I think should be considered....
Nah, for me the problem is that +5% Deflect is very poor, plate agility should be +2/4/6/8/10% Deflect Chance (so it would be like having +5% DR, cause 10% Deflect Chance * 50% Deflect Severity = - 5% Incoming Damage app.), also shield Defence should be +2/4/6/8/10 AC so we could have +5% flat DR (up from +2.5% DR which again, is a very poor feat) and then Armor of Bahamut would be on par with the these feats, cause that +10% DR wouldn't be forever, it would be active in some situations.
It may sound too much, but in the actual situation with the Protector tree we are getting just a -5% Incoming Damage app. with 2 feats at 5/5 (Plate Agility [T1] and Shield Defence [T2]) while other feats (in this class and others) give much more Damage.
But that's just my opinion
if you want that to happen plate agility or Shield Defence would need to move to t3 as it could be a bit much when going to another capstone. And then have the shield recharge(10%) put in place there to help with the new stamina mechanic so other paths would have access to that and make protector a more solid tank.
Agreed. The big issue is making really good DR feats deeper into Prot tree making it unique. Armor of Bahamut is very strong, actually TOO strong for a T1 IMO.
Things like 5% deflect, or even 5 AC are pretty appropriate T1 feats, plenty of other classes have similar 5% deflect as T1. If its to be buffed IMO should be deeper in the tree.
Also, I dont think Conq or Tact should have access to Armor of Bahamut as 10% DR is pretty big...
Would you mind keeping your "suggestions" and discussions about them in other threads ?
Enorla, Oh so devoted cleric.
If you think so, then you play the protector not well. My block is barely under 30% on live and on PTS it's useless. When i look to sentinel, then i see a big gap. As i said: A protector gain NO additionally defense for anything(out of the 'useless' KV feat), which the other path can't get too! THERE must be more implemented. Out of Ferocious Reaction, which is a paragon path power, NO extra benefit for passives are granted through the feats... that's so burdensome!
Tactical Superiority 5
Combat Superiority deals 1/2/3/4/5% more damage. At the 5th tier of this feat, Combat Superiority will not require that the target hits you first.
That's one for the conquerer path!
Same problem on the tactician path. No benefit for slotting any passive!
It would be too much of a nerf to what we are currently lacking, which is Damage... So idk if this would actually work, because 100% for other classes is like 500% for ourselves and with a whooping -20% (way more actually, if all damage addons are factored in) we would hit like a wet noodle, even more than we currently do, while our targets will still be able to happily flail away on us... Nice idea but the values are not well thought out.
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On a sidenote, aren't you playing fotm classes exclusively? (TR,HR,GWF when they used to be ZOMG l33t111!!!?) I believe i can remember you saying you quit your GF when the stalwart got reworked (aka you could not 1 shot people anymore) and you kind of quit your GWF when tenebrous couldn't really roflstomp anything anymore? Why are you suggesting nerfs to this class? In order to kill it more easily with your new fotm, or? I don't really get it.
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IF anything, we should do considerably MORE damage as conquerors, not the other way around.
people should not make ideas based on just pve though....the tab skill should not be a team buff ability since they could just buff the gf encounter powers better to help the team.
Im a pvp player and most other chars are already way better than the gf so why would i want to buff them more ? i would rather have a tab skill that helped me in some way like cc immunity or a rage like tab skill, could be like villains menace.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
i would rather have dmg skills than just running around with good regen untill i die.
i dont know any gf that slots either of those powers in pvp because the slots are already full with more needed powers and having a team buff on the tab ability when your team is probably all gwf, hr and TR is just pointless i would rather something to help me like i said before. Gf have a harder time getting double and triple kills already so a dmg option on tab would be great
Also the skills you listed are terrible, all the buffs are low apart from into the freys movement speed.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
exactly dont you get it? they are to weak to be used as encounters. But as tab abilities they will suffice. You say kite until you die? man you kite gwfs to survive their unstoppable and you need the run speed if you are swordmaster gf because you wont have threatening rush. Please think about the possibilities. I know how to pvp and having these skills as a tab ability would be a great much needed buff. Ofc you get to pick between the 3. no knights challenge
you are a protector based gf though and im a conqueror so you can understand why i would rather the dps skill there but even so yes i would rather have one of them powers rather than our current tab.
But the powers would need a buff, like iron warriors temp hitpoints are very bad and same for into the frey. If they had a little buff then that would be great but atm they are a little too weak.
and yeah kiting gwf and dodging them while they are in unstoppable would be good with a movment speed tab but again if it gave decent temp hitpoints then that would make it way better.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
How is this constructive? The rest of us are trying to make honest suggestions to shape the class into a more useful role, both in PvE and PvP (even though we PvE and PvP players don't always see eye to eye - lmao).
Crix - You're correct. I mostly play PvE. I like it a lot better than PvP. Just personal preference. I do dip into PvP though, mostly because I'd really like a Vanguard Banner for the stats and wasn't able to get one before they went BoP. However, I don't think that fixing GFs is as simple as "fix it the way the PvP players want" or "Fix it the way the PvE players want" - you have to take both aspects into consideration.
I'd like to see GFs get an increase in damage, but I also don't want to see them become carbon-copy duplicates of GWFs, but with block/mark instead of unstoppable/sprint. The Iron Vanguard/Swordmaster crossover is already bad enough. I'm still a proponent for increasing GF weapon damage but leaving all skills at the same scaling. This would give us a flat damage buff across the board (I think 15-20% would be sufficient) while also helping weapon enchantments be a little more meaningful.
I'd also like to see a rework of some kind - and I've seen several good suggestions but don't have a personal preference among them - to reckless attacker in light of guard changing to a stamina based system. Perhaps something similar to destroyers purpose? +X% damage each time you are hit, but all stacks are removed when you block an attack?
- B
Yeah i understand, i dont do pve at all really but i would not want them to base any changes around just pvp. both pve and pvp should be taken into all changes so its a more enjoyable game for all players.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
We need change and stamina shield wasn't it! Our class is the same same same nomatter how we spec what path we take SAME!!!!! Either we get a modicum more damage or a modicum more Defense. Make the paths MEAN something, right now SM / IV feats are identical! The only difference from an IV GF and a SM GF is one has different passives and the other loses FLS and Threatening Rush....
Geesh.
Overpowered 60 CW ~ Thaumaturge 14.5k
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~ GF Buffs were great we are much better, please fix the bugs now... Thank you!