Is it WAI that if you hit a stealthed targed with Repel that it will become visible for you and all your allies even if the enemies stealth bar is not fully drained?
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Eots is only a 3s buff. if you actually played cw, you would know this. please go back to whatever class forums u came from
Eye of the Storm: This power now has an internal cooldown of 90 seconds. Base Duration increased to 4 seconds (up from 2). Duration increase per rank increased to 1 (up from .5).
While the ICD is no longer 90 seconds, I don't remember any patch notes about the duration decreasing back to 3s. I even double checked all of the preview patch notes so far to see if there was any mention of it, yet there isn't.
Edit: I even got a screenshot of the description currently on Preview and just tested it to confirm that the time is correct.
As a reminder for everyone complaining about the EotS cooldown, before it was changed to how it acts on Live, it had an 8 second duration with a 30 second ICD and the devs said that it was providing "too much burst damage" at the time. Now, its even better than that, so I'm not sure what they are expecting to get out of this.
Eye of the Storm: This power now has an internal cooldown of 90 seconds. Base Duration increased to 4 seconds (up from 2). Duration increase per rank increased to 1 (up from .5).
It's been buffed to six seconds on the preview server. 4+1+1 = 6.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
0
sokolnichiyMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 187Arc User
Can you be more specific about the tests you've done and especialy your character lvl but also if you are playing the exact same character with same equipment on live server (just be honest).
Why i ask you that it's beacuse i have a 15k wizard with ioun stone and enchant and with that i'm doing more than twice the damage a fresh 10 gs CW will do. and if i can do encounter in second map of IWD on the test server only requiring twice time as on live server (but still doable) on the bugged encounter in the first map or in briggin i can already feel the difficulty so i can easely imagine what it give for a fresh CW in IWD.
some encounter in the first map of IWD look like to have epic life (it is the case on live server but it was also the case when i did my first test around 3 weeks ago on the previous server) In the second map encounter have more life barr than the normal mob on the map but they are not with epic statut
Dang lad i dont understand washa toking about... ((
I have a 15k with Ioun Stone MoF/THAUM CW Legion/Black Ice gear, Plaguefire chant. Transfered him to preview, respeced into the same Thaum/MoF CW just changing feats to max out pve effectivnes. and i steamroll every god darn mob on any map of high level content and heroic encounters in dwarven valley cause i get damage, i have controll with stun slow and freeze + debufing and burning stuff and lots of lifesteal to keep me up thx for large and constant burn damage.
On live server in open world pvp i easely burn TR's no matter what spec....even DC's and other CW...HR...here it's rather complicated with em....GWF GF...no sir...
Now, Shard of the Endless Avalanche (henceforth referred to as SotEA) is an impressive and complicated power. The damage it could pump out on a single target was admirable, but it was way out of line on multiple targets. We looked at a couple options for adjusting it and finally went with an outright nerf because in too many cases in both PVP and PVE it felt pretty necessary to use it because it offered so much (Strong Damage, Chain Prone, Arcane Stacks, Explosive damage at the end, etc). We looked at letting damage divide down by number of targets but we found the same problem. It was pretty close to always a right choice and that didn't feel appropriate with one of the cornerstones of the Wizard philosophy in PNP (which is Preparing spells and being flexible with your casting choices). As such we adjusted lots of casting times and damages to provide spells with much more in line breakpoints where AoE started trumping single target damage more clearly. Before all of these adjustments that breakpoint fell somewhere around 1.6 targets. This meant, for all intents and purposes, you should generally NEVER use a single target power with some minor exceptions (MM being a major one). Given this we tuned AoE damage down and made the single target powers perform much closer to each other in terms of what they brought to the table. Given this goal we *don't* want to push SotEA back into that position of being great in all circumstances. This is why we improved the prone duration on it and why we won't be buffing the damage on it up. However we are aware of PVP wizards struggle right now, and so some of the above buffs should help bring back more single target damage opportunities (as well as some more utility for those who are working with groups).
I would trade a reduction in these things -- (Chain Prone, Arcane Stacks, Explosive damage at the end, etc) -- for an increase in damage. You mentioned that before 'you should generally NEVER use a single target power with some minor exceptions' in place of shard and now you have made it so that shard is NEVER a better option.
Thanks for the other buffs, but all we've been asking for is damage back on shard and if that were done this thread would be over except for the others asking for Renegade changes (which should also be done).
So...now all CW rotation will be -> thauma-> chill strike-> entangling force-> icy terrain- tab shield-> and jump around point waiting to assaling force will kill your enemy-> sounds interesting, thank you for incredible changes ^.^
Personally, i stopped to use shard becouse it was mighty bugged (missed, stuck, disappear when we were stunned) but using it was really fun, sometimes i was using it to refresh my ability to control this power becouse it is really hard (probably hardest skill to learn in pvp in all game, and players were learning their combo through many many days and battles), now 33% down +66% down + all ours feats down = no damage, and sorry maby when i was fighting with another CW dmg was high but during the battle with good GWF/HR dmg was funny low, there is no problem with dmg in this skill, it is problem with paper classes with their survivabiliy. I was waiting when you fix this skill, that i can use it more often in pvp matches, but you really completely burn it down...well looks like my RoE still reigns on TAB.
Control Wizard: Eye of the Storm: ICD has been reduced to 20 seconds.
Control WIzard: Eye of the Storm: Activation chance is now 100% from any power while off cooldown.
Control Wizard: Storm Spell: Activation Chance increased to 35%. Damage increased by roughly 100%.
Wow , Thanks for these two changes , in PvE these alone will at least boost CW dps a fair amount back up , as for Shard I can't say I am happy about losing it but fair enough ,it is painful to lose the skill but I guess it is also a reason to try something new and I am sure many appreciate the above changes to make up for the damage loss , I've had pretty much the same build in PvE for 2 modules so time for a change.
Is it WAI that if you hit a stealthed targed with Repel that it will become visible for you and all your allies even if the enemies stealth bar is not fully drained?
Now, Shard of the Endless Avalanche (henceforth referred to as SotEA) is an impressive and complicated power. The damage it could pump out on a single target was admirable, but it was way out of line on multiple targets. We looked at a couple options for adjusting it and finally went with an outright nerf because in too many cases in both PVP and PVE it felt pretty necessary to use it because it offered so much (Strong Damage, Chain Prone, Arcane Stacks, Explosive damage at the end, etc). We looked at letting damage divide down by number of targets but we found the same problem. It was pretty close to always a right choice and that didn't feel appropriate with one of the cornerstones of the Wizard philosophy in PNP (which is Preparing spells and being flexible with your casting choices). As such we adjusted lots of casting times and damages to provide spells with much more in line breakpoints where AoE started trumping single target damage more clearly. Before all of these adjustments that breakpoint fell somewhere around 1.6 targets. This meant, for all intents and purposes, you should generally NEVER use a single target power with some minor exceptions (MM being a major one). Given this we tuned AoE damage down and made the single target powers perform much closer to each other in terms of what they brought to the table. Given this goal we *don't* want to push SotEA back into that position of being great in all circumstances. This is why we improved the prone duration on it and why we won't be buffing the damage on it up. However we are aware of PVP wizards struggle right now, and so some of the above buffs should help bring back more single target damage opportunities (as well as some more utility for those who are working with groups).
Yes SotEA is complicated power that requires skill (more so in PvP) to use and that should be rewarded but with these nerfs there is no point in using it
This shows a lack of understanding of the CWs roll and what these "balances" will accomplish there are many many posts from what I would consider veteran Players (both PvP and PvE) against these changes please listen to them as combined they have far more hours using than the devs could even hope to get.
Please listen to you players who actually play the class.
so the take away message is DONT NERF SotEA
0
aulduronMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,351Arc User
edited August 2014
Still no love for the renegades, I see.
Will we at least be getting respec tokens so we can drop Focused Wizardry, or are we all to stay at campfires from now on.
Also, when will be able to put our points back into Nightmare Wizardry so we can test it?
Dang lad i dont understand washa toking about... ((
I have a 15k with Ioun Stone MoF/THAUM CW Legion/Black Ice gear, Plaguefire chant. Transfered him to preview, respeced into the same Thaum/MoF CW just changing feats to max out pve effectivnes. and i steamroll every god darn mob on any map of high level content and heroic encounters in dwarven valley cause i get damage, i have controll with stun slow and freeze + debufing and burning stuff and lots of lifesteal to keep me up thx for large and constant burn damage.
On live server in open world pvp i easely burn TR's no matter what spec....even DC's and other CW...HR...here it's rather complicated with em....GWF GF...no sir...
So that's all i can say...
That what i suspected, 1 some test for pvp part are already out out of date since after they cut by half damage done by assaillant on player, they also cut by half the unstable absorption of shield and the last fact is don't forget that your build is not a standard build that will arrive in IWD. A player that just do and follow solo part arrive at IWD with 10-11 k GS and no enchant and not have even full T1 set yet. it same as saying that you don't have problem doing a lvl 30 map with a lvl 60. It same for your equip you already have ice gear equip. player that arrive their doN,t have it, it why they start the map.
For the rest of comment of the community about the last change given by gentleman, i will say i doN,t get it anymore, for the first time since the beginning of this mess it the first positive return we get. And you still crying.
the onlive CW is a big mess overperforming PVE and under performing in PVP (actually only some professionnal dodger are able to make 1VS1 but it's not a standard CW and that why every one running on us to do their kill). the only thing we had for pvp was some party help). The CW on the previous server without the last annouced change is barrely performing PVE (and underperforming on leveling part) and is nowhere in pvp. the change announced seems to correct a going in the right direction but Need to be tested.
What i only and personnaly ask for dev is to have a character that can perform in both pvp and pve. i neither want some semi god class in both aspect. else i would have already taken HR or GWF (in actual server) or GF on the previous for the pvp.
So if those change permit me to have one build that stop other class running on me like i'm a call girl. as long as those change permit me to be able to do all the content with an equal chance as other class. I'm ok with it.
And even for those who absolutly want the name renegade and it appears and at the end that is no more the best way for PVP. put a stick on your screen and write renegade
So...now all CW rotation will be -> thauma-> chill strike-> entangling force-> icy terrain- tab shield-> and jump around point waiting to assaling force will kill your enemy-> sounds interesting, thank you for incredible changes ^.^
Personally, i stopped to use shard becouse it was mighty bugged (missed, stuck, disappear when we were stunned) but using it was really fun, sometimes i was using it to refresh my ability to control this power becouse it is really hard (probably hardest skill to learn in pvp in all game, and players were learning their combo through many many days and battles), now 33% down +66% down + all ours feats down = no damage, and sorry maby when i was fighting with another CW dmg was high but during the battle with good GWF/HR dmg was funny low, there is no problem with dmg in this skill, it is problem with paper classes with their survivabiliy. I was waiting when you fix this skill, that i can use it more often in pvp matches, but you really completely burn it down...well looks like my RoE still reigns on TAB.
honestly that absolutly not what i have in mind for my CW for pvp
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ironzerg79Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,942Arc User
edited August 2014
So, we're now able to start a fight with 6 seconds of guaranteed crits? That's pretty powerful on paper...wonder how it's going to work in practice.
"Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
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kieranmtornMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 382Arc User
This definitely demands a new line of testing, but one thing straight up: When used with all sorts of DoTs, Storm Spell already contributed roughly 10% of the DPS in AoE situations and the best combination of class features for a Thaum wizard remained Storm Spell and EotS (closely followed by Evocation) for PVE.
Now with the buffs the gap beween Evocation should widen again and I fully expect Storm Spell to contribute a massive 25% of AoE DPS.
Looking at an ACT parse of the test dummies in the Dread Ring (using Storm Spell), adjusting for the this buff (7 times more effective that previously) to Storm Spell, we're looking at Storm Spell being 30% of our DPS (using a rotation of COI[tabbed], Steal Time, Icy Terrain, feated Sudden Storm). Expect to see this nerfed soonest (I can't see giving us back 1/2 of our lost DPS from Mod 3). And that's with no skill required.
Looking at the change to EoTS, I can't see it going live either - I can see the DC artifact and the new PVP rotation ending in Ice knife.
I just love it , people complain non stop for page after page that single target dps needs to be buffed back up , GC finally buffs control wizard back up to a reasonable place and now people complain it is buffed too much , you have got to be kidding me .... GC has said no matter what happens shard is not getting any further adjustments so we got these class feature buffs and the other couple of minor MoF buffs , I'm happy with that and thank GC for at least giving us some damage back and I'm sure newer players leveling CW's will thank him too.
While I appreciate that they have returned even a very minimal amout of damage to single target spells the fact that AOE has been completely gutted makes it extremely hard to play PVE questing alone. Sorry but the more I look at the changes and play them in beta with my friend, the more this looks like a straight forward cash grab to make CW not viable in either PVE or PVP so that people will play the new Warlock class and dump more money into the game. Very,very disappointing. Devs please listen to your community and pull back on the changes. They are far too extreme.
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ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
edited August 2014
Really don't get it. They consider shard too OP, but they toss in assailing force plus now, an easy 100% free cycle of crit encounters to unload on someone.
Is it WAI that if you hit a stealthed targed with Repel that it will become visible for you and all your allies even if the enemies stealth bar is not fully drained?
The devs commented on it back in Module 1 (specifically, on Steal Time) that if you get stunned by an encounter, you become visible to the caster for the duration of the stun. Since Repel is a stun, it makes you visible. If you become visible to the caster's allies from it, it is probably a bug. But I haven't noticed this effect yet. And I use a lot of Repel.
On test they took the 5 points out of nightmare wizardry, moving it, and I can't put them back in.
Yeah same with me , that's why I'm thinking it will be a full forced respec ,in other words unless they find a way to fix the issue you described you will log in after module 4 patches and your character will be reset and you will have to do a full respec for free ofc.
I'm trying to give Maelstrom of Chaos a chance again. It can crit nice now, thank you for that, but still:
MAELSTROM OF CHAOS doesn't go well with new dodge mechanics that allows us to cancel casting while dodging and re-cast later.
I am able to cancel Oppressive Force, Singularity, Ice Storm and Ice knife no problems, and re-cast it right away after dodge. For MoC i loose 50% AP because tooltip says so. Please, consider changing that, otherwise MoC will be the only daily that doesn't work with dodge.
In addition could we have range of this daily bigger? Oppressive force, ice storm, singu - all have v. nice range. MoC could follow suit. Remember that casting time is very long and movable targets currently can very easy get out of this tiny tiny range, and with current 50% AP loss we cannot even cancel casting to reposition.
Bids he then the spruces to singer him an anthems!
And the Woodsie Lord binders them fleshes to stone!
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charkanramonMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 51Arc User
edited August 2014
Feedback: Critical Conflagration
Add bonus critical. Rank 3 could give +5% critical chance and maybe give that bonus to the group.
0
someonediesMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,257Arc User
edited August 2014
Feedback: Shard of the Endless Avalanche: Restore base damage, leave "live" prone duration.
Brisk Transport Bugged (Or Incorrect Tooltip):
When you Teleport your Run Speed is increased by 2/4/6/8/10% for 3 seconds.
Can stack 3 times up to 20-30% run speed for 1-3 sec.
-show me reason why you nerf shard so much? becouse as you can see on video it deals 1,5- max 7k crit ? average is 2/3k dmg crit and non crit. Now after your nerf it will be maby 500 dmg?
-show me our powerful single target dps which you also nerf- look at 6:15 - 740 ice knife d(-.-)b and later 7:16 - Icy Rays deals 87 dmg from critical strike. Compare all of this with GWF IBS which can hit for even 20k-this is sick
-look on our survivability, we are paper as hell, please look on scoreboard after match- the result is dazzling...
Tell me how should we fight against another classes if our single target dmg is already broken? This video perfectly show how weak in pvp is CW and you don't do anything to change it and what's more you are nerfing us. I dont know is that role of all CW- we have to be pvp meat or you dont know anything about your own game? pathetic guys, realy pathetic.
Comments
Is it WAI that if you hit a stealthed targed with Repel that it will become visible for you and all your allies even if the enemies stealth bar is not fully drained?
We are always looking for new models --- Borderline Fashiondolls ---
While the ICD is no longer 90 seconds, I don't remember any patch notes about the duration decreasing back to 3s. I even double checked all of the preview patch notes so far to see if there was any mention of it, yet there isn't.
Edit: I even got a screenshot of the description currently on Preview and just tested it to confirm that the time is correct.
As a reminder for everyone complaining about the EotS cooldown, before it was changed to how it acts on Live, it had an 8 second duration with a 30 second ICD and the devs said that it was providing "too much burst damage" at the time. Now, its even better than that, so I'm not sure what they are expecting to get out of this.
Reading is FUNdamental.
It's been buffed to six seconds on the preview server. 4+1+1 = 6.
Dang lad i dont understand washa toking about... ((
I have a 15k with Ioun Stone MoF/THAUM CW Legion/Black Ice gear, Plaguefire chant. Transfered him to preview, respeced into the same Thaum/MoF CW just changing feats to max out pve effectivnes. and i steamroll every god darn mob on any map of high level content and heroic encounters in dwarven valley cause i get damage, i have controll with stun slow and freeze + debufing and burning stuff and lots of lifesteal to keep me up thx for large and constant burn damage.
On live server in open world pvp i easely burn TR's no matter what spec....even DC's and other CW...HR...here it's rather complicated with em....GWF GF...no sir...
So that's all i can say...
I would trade a reduction in these things -- (Chain Prone, Arcane Stacks, Explosive damage at the end, etc) -- for an increase in damage. You mentioned that before 'you should generally NEVER use a single target power with some minor exceptions' in place of shard and now you have made it so that shard is NEVER a better option.
Thanks for the other buffs, but all we've been asking for is damage back on shard and if that were done this thread would be over except for the others asking for Renegade changes (which should also be done).
twitch.tv/ezracw | absolutegaming.guildportal.com
#BringBackShard | M5 CW Bug List | My M3 PvP Gameplay
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
Personally, i stopped to use shard becouse it was mighty bugged (missed, stuck, disappear when we were stunned) but using it was really fun, sometimes i was using it to refresh my ability to control this power becouse it is really hard (probably hardest skill to learn in pvp in all game, and players were learning their combo through many many days and battles), now 33% down +66% down + all ours feats down = no damage, and sorry maby when i was fighting with another CW dmg was high but during the battle with good GWF/HR dmg was funny low, there is no problem with dmg in this skill, it is problem with paper classes with their survivabiliy. I was waiting when you fix this skill, that i can use it more often in pvp matches, but you really completely burn it down...well looks like my RoE still reigns on TAB.
Wow , Thanks for these two changes , in PvE these alone will at least boost CW dps a fair amount back up , as for Shard I can't say I am happy about losing it but fair enough ,it is painful to lose the skill but I guess it is also a reason to try something new and I am sure many appreciate the above changes to make up for the damage loss , I've had pretty much the same build in PvE for 2 modules so time for a change.
Should and shouldn't and should and shouldn't and - ye.
I'm not asking for a nerf I'm nor asking for a buff. I'm asking if it's WAI. Only the Devs can answer that question.
They should... P:
We are always looking for new models --- Borderline Fashiondolls ---
Yes SotEA is complicated power that requires skill (more so in PvP) to use and that should be rewarded but with these nerfs there is no point in using it
This shows a lack of understanding of the CWs roll and what these "balances" will accomplish there are many many posts from what I would consider veteran Players (both PvP and PvE) against these changes please listen to them as combined they have far more hours using than the devs could even hope to get.
Please listen to you players who actually play the class.
so the take away message is DONT NERF SotEA
Will we at least be getting respec tokens so we can drop Focused Wizardry, or are we all to stay at campfires from now on.
Also, when will be able to put our points back into Nightmare Wizardry so we can test it?
We will probably need a forced respec due to the moving of Nightmare wizardry .
That what i suspected, 1 some test for pvp part are already out out of date since after they cut by half damage done by assaillant on player, they also cut by half the unstable absorption of shield and the last fact is don't forget that your build is not a standard build that will arrive in IWD. A player that just do and follow solo part arrive at IWD with 10-11 k GS and no enchant and not have even full T1 set yet. it same as saying that you don't have problem doing a lvl 30 map with a lvl 60. It same for your equip you already have ice gear equip. player that arrive their doN,t have it, it why they start the map.
For the rest of comment of the community about the last change given by gentleman, i will say i doN,t get it anymore, for the first time since the beginning of this mess it the first positive return we get. And you still crying.
the onlive CW is a big mess overperforming PVE and under performing in PVP (actually only some professionnal dodger are able to make 1VS1 but it's not a standard CW and that why every one running on us to do their kill). the only thing we had for pvp was some party help). The CW on the previous server without the last annouced change is barrely performing PVE (and underperforming on leveling part) and is nowhere in pvp. the change announced seems to correct a going in the right direction but Need to be tested.
What i only and personnaly ask for dev is to have a character that can perform in both pvp and pve. i neither want some semi god class in both aspect. else i would have already taken HR or GWF (in actual server) or GF on the previous for the pvp.
So if those change permit me to have one build that stop other class running on me like i'm a call girl. as long as those change permit me to be able to do all the content with an equal chance as other class. I'm ok with it.
And even for those who absolutly want the name renegade and it appears and at the end that is no more the best way for PVP. put a stick on your screen and write renegade
honestly that absolutly not what i have in mind for my CW for pvp
Looking at an ACT parse of the test dummies in the Dread Ring (using Storm Spell), adjusting for the this buff (7 times more effective that previously) to Storm Spell, we're looking at Storm Spell being 30% of our DPS (using a rotation of COI[tabbed], Steal Time, Icy Terrain, feated Sudden Storm). Expect to see this nerfed soonest (I can't see giving us back 1/2 of our lost DPS from Mod 3). And that's with no skill required.
Looking at the change to EoTS, I can't see it going live either - I can see the DC artifact and the new PVP rotation ending in Ice knife.
The devs commented on it back in Module 1 (specifically, on Steal Time) that if you get stunned by an encounter, you become visible to the caster for the duration of the stun. Since Repel is a stun, it makes you visible. If you become visible to the caster's allies from it, it is probably a bug. But I haven't noticed this effect yet. And I use a lot of Repel.
On test they took the 5 points out of nightmare wizardry, moving it, and I can't put them back in.
Yeah same with me , that's why I'm thinking it will be a full forced respec ,in other words unless they find a way to fix the issue you described you will log in after module 4 patches and your character will be reset and you will have to do a full respec for free ofc.
I thought this class ability now had an ICD, meaning if its 10% or 35% it could still only proc once per so many seconds.
Am I mistaken?
MAELSTROM OF CHAOS doesn't go well with new dodge mechanics that allows us to cancel casting while dodging and re-cast later.
I am able to cancel Oppressive Force, Singularity, Ice Storm and Ice knife no problems, and re-cast it right away after dodge. For MoC i loose 50% AP because tooltip says so. Please, consider changing that, otherwise MoC will be the only daily that doesn't work with dodge.
In addition could we have range of this daily bigger? Oppressive force, ice storm, singu - all have v. nice range. MoC could follow suit. Remember that casting time is very long and movable targets currently can very easy get out of this tiny tiny range, and with current 50% AP loss we cannot even cancel casting to reposition.
Add bonus critical. Rank 3 could give +5% critical chance and maybe give that bonus to the group.
Shard of the Endless Avalanche: Restore base damage, leave "live" prone duration.
Brisk Transport Bugged (Or Incorrect Tooltip):
When you Teleport your Run Speed is increased by 2/4/6/8/10% for 3 seconds.
Can stack 3 times up to 20-30% run speed for 1-3 sec.
Dead🔪-show me reason why you nerf shard so much? becouse as you can see on video it deals 1,5- max 7k crit ? average is 2/3k dmg crit and non crit. Now after your nerf it will be maby 500 dmg?
-show me our powerful single target dps which you also nerf- look at 6:15 - 740 ice knife d(-.-)b and later 7:16 - Icy Rays deals 87 dmg from critical strike. Compare all of this with GWF IBS which can hit for even 20k-this is sick
-look on our survivability, we are paper as hell, please look on scoreboard after match- the result is dazzling...
Tell me how should we fight against another classes if our single target dmg is already broken? This video perfectly show how weak in pvp is CW and you don't do anything to change it and what's more you are nerfing us. I dont know is that role of all CW- we have to be pvp meat or you dont know anything about your own game? pathetic guys, realy pathetic.