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Corrupted or Purified Armor/Weapons?
haven112
Member Posts: 38 Arc User
Now with the new expansion giving us new armor and weapons, which one will you pick? Which combination of armor and weapons do you think is best for future perma-stealth and combat rogues is? For the perma-stealth, I think corrupted armor for extra recovery + purified weapons for healing while staying in stealth. Although, the corrupted weapons might be good for that 2500 damage, but will it have a 60 second internal cool down timer or not?
Or, will you be sticking with your profound gear, because 20% extra stealth from feats for you guys isn't enough?
Or, will you be sticking with your profound gear, because 20% extra stealth from feats for you guys isn't enough?
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● IIRC, TR stealth is 6 secs or so by default. The 20% from feats + 30% provided through armour set bonuses extend the total stealth duration by 50% or so, to max 10 secs (9~10 secs)
● SS is around 15? 16? secs at default recharge. ITC is 18. With high INT/REC both powers are brought down to under 15secs.
● ITC lasts 5 secs at rank1.
● Hence, the "unkillable" TR rotation is a well-knit combo of the above 3 factors, which has become the current build standard for TRs. Not a "true-perma" per se, as is the case with using BnS, but rather a "semi-perma" which allows glimpses of the TR to be seen in between rotations, and yet remains "impossible to catch".
● Thus, the basic principle behind the standard rotation is: "Whenever you are visible, ITC and/or SS is ready. Whenever ITC and/or SS is in recharge, you are in stealth" Its the sheer overpowering efficiency of this specific rotation that fires up the TR's current King of PvP status.
IMO; TRs are not going to switch to BI gear. It is highly unlikely any TR is going to give the OP rotation up. You may be weaker in defense without BI gear, but the stealth/ITC/SS rotation still easily guarantees you stay unkillable. You may be weaker in offense without BI gear, but you will eventually kill or seriously wound the opponent as long as you stay unkillable.
However, switch to BI gear, and would that increased offense/defense allow you to be still bullshi* unkilllable as to be able to troll nodes against 3~4 enemies, with only 6~7 secs of stealth? Unlikely.
My anticipation is BI gear will be a suitable option for Combat TRs in most cases, assuming they fight other classes. However, even with that much increased stats with the latest gear, Combat TRs would still stand zero chance against high-INT/REC TRs. Same with any other class. High-INT/REC builds are that much solid and OP.
(ps) However, it is possible that increased defensive stats may make other classes/TR builds a lot tougher to bring down with the standard INT/REC build that uses Profound-tier armour. It may be possible the INT/REC builds could be sort of relatively nerfed, since they are forced to use inferior gear if they want to maintain the perma/semi-perma setting -- which might bring it down to the position the early perma-TRs once had. Unkillable, but weak damage, less proficient in killing power, etc.. Especially with SE nerfed a bit in damage as well.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
We'll probably have to wait and see couple of more mods to really confirm if that's the case... but something tells me the developers may add in additional, latest-tier equipment that has some stealth bonuses. As it is I'm not too confident if leaving out stealth features from BI equipment was on part a conscious decision from the developers or not. My guess is not.
What I guess, is BI gear was probably intended for PvE purposes. In any MMORPG you can see similar gear progression as time goes by, and usually newer/more powerful PvE gear are introduced into the game, and then subsequently PvP gear. I think it is highly likely the next big patch or mod may feature PvP gear with a higher tier than the current Profound set, acquired through the usual glory, and that set would most probably feature stealth bonuses.
...
As for the stealth issues, my attitude is yeppers, undeniably quite sour and deeply frustrated as it wasn't just some 'nerf' -- ie. sentinel GWFs getting "nerfed" Unstoppable through heal depression -- but rather, an entire build path/concept simply crushed and destroyed. Like I may have mentioned the build now performs around 1/4th capacity of what it used to be, as well as all the techniques and tactics developed around it simply made null and void. Most of the frustration comes from the fact that instead of duely nerfing a path/build concept that simply kills PvP balance in all meaning of the word (check the leaderboards. TRs are officially dominating everything else in the top ranks), they nerfed an alternate path that was budding and developing.
I was in the middle of refining and changing some key points/features of the build in accordance with my experiences of combat against some premade level TRs, and it was looking good with major improvement possibilities coming up here and there. Well, that's gone now.
Although, the frustration is not something new, since for some peculiar reason I cannot seem to point out, I've seen Cryptic retaining basically the same attitude with certain build/paths that were clearly overboard in the previous game -- Champions Online. "Invul-Dodge" build, we used to call it. A customization of powerchoices in a character build that features:
■ high damage-resistance based defenses
■ shielding type defenses (which means any damage under that threshold is 0)
■ evasion/dodge mechanic with very high severity (as with how TRs are in NW)
■ multiple stacking damage buffs that can still blow half-chunks from HP
■ main damage type being ranged
■ invisibility, fastest travel speed in game
■ multiple powerful heal powers that allow self-sustenance without any healers nearby
■ multiple "emergency defenses" that grants greatly enhanced resistance or dodge chance, which can be cycled in intervals
It was basically "godmode". THE FotMs of all FotMs. And why that reflects to NW is that it also relied on the INT stat in the EXACTL same way. The INT stat cutting down recharge time is a relic from Champions Online. There's no such concept in D&D. It would
And essentially, with TRs, they have done the same thing. The exact same, "fast rotation of emergency defenses" made possible through INT stat which basically destroys the meaning of default recharge time, coupled with an extremely reliable defense mechanic that also grants damage buff stacking at the same time, which can be endlessly refreshed. the end-result produces unkillable opponents in game. At least, unkillable under equal conditions... and yet again they fail to address the issue early on. Now, TRs are already used to the build. Any balance or change with each passing moment is going to seem like forceful deprivation, instead of "correcting a mistake".
That's probably what gets me miffed. That and the ELO resetting left me stuck with a cesspool of players to form a team when queued, making the initial crawl from the pits of suckage simply agonizing. I troll the enemy node forever with a build that was never even meant to use perma/semi-perma tactics, operating at best 25% efficiency of what it was truly capable of in its prime... and still, the average teammates still can't take two nodes with 4 people against 2 enemies defending.
Joyous times.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Colour me intrigued- do you recall/did you notice what he was doing? I have a weakness for slightly odd specs and making them work, so this makes me curious.
Stealth tracking + All ranged at-wills (CoS/DHS)
This build can in theory, win against MI TRs.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
My guess would be that he used VP mainly to mark you, so he always knew where you are. That makes fighting a TR a whole lot easier.
Imagine how interesting it was to fight another TR with a no cooldown VP. Aah, how I miss these times...
Anyways, I would like to know which other encounters and which at-wills he used.
One more remark: If my theory about his use of VP is true, then I think this would only work well against other TRs. I can't see how the nerfed VP is useful against other classes.
It's basically the "WK All-ranged Build" theory. During the development of my old melee based build, there was a time I've looked into the possibility of taking BOTH CoS and DHS as at wills. I've tested out and found it a bit lacking in efficiency against tougher melees, since those were mod2 days and the GWF was everyone's nemesis. However, theoretically I did see some very promising results against the (then) common TRs.
In theory, as of current, both parties peel stealth at equal rates due to PotB. ITC doesn't present THAT much of a disadvantage because both parties don't deal any major CCs anyway. When both parties are peeled, the fight initially starts out as a knife flinging contest. WKs hold the advantage with Dagger Threat + DHS ticks.
After this initial contact PotB is in recharge, usually around maybe 10~15secs left till recharge. After having finished thrown all CoS charges the MI will attempt to go back in stealth through SS. The WK will mark the MI before he goes into SS, and when the MI starts throwing CoS damage on the WK (this means the MI is standing still, due to self-root), the WK will immediately react with VP(teleport), get within visible range and start flinging CoS shots, DHS as well, if possible. We all know even a few hits of Bilethorn CoS will quickly diminish a huge chunk of the stealth meter.
And only after having damaged the MI within stealth that way, knowing his stealth will end prematurely, then you go into stealth. Voila. You've won the stealth fight. Until PotB is fully recharged, during that time you get to fling CoS and DHS all you want, all buffed up with Dagger Threat. This is usually when MI TRs decide to just bolt. The bolder ones will try to wait it out for AP to fill up for AP. After PotB recharges, rinse and repeat above process.
......
I've tested it out but never used it much because;
(a) its only interesting against TRs. Its basically a specialized version of ranged WK that focuses on killing other TRs only... do everything they do, but hit harder with knives and track stealth. Because of the lack of ITC, when you're out of stealth, against classes with ranged CCs... not good at all.
(b) I hate CoS. I hate the whole "fling knives from stealth" thing. I wanted to build up a melee-based TR that worked.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Not so. Out of lack of Zen and waiting for Mod 3, I've been running the ranged WK ... with great success ... and I am not that good and only have 7s and reg bile and barkskin. I cause opponents fits (I'm not perma either). I am often top of board and have a PB of 47 assists. What I really believe, is that I make my team much much more effective. Yes, HRs and CWs are far more difficult of opponents because of lack of ITC but you have to adjust and pick your battles. They are also squishy enough that HKnives followed by either a LB or IS can take them out, although HRs are getting so tough now. I am totally spec'd around DiS and have no points in VP ... maybe I should adjust that. I was going to abandon WK on my next respec but now am thinking some tweaks and it may get interesting.
Just dont play WK, your not any good morenthar there are loads of people who can own you. Dont bother mirrorin everyone who does.
On topic: Keep using the profound scoundrel armor, the corrupted daggers are worth getting imo
99% of the posters and readers on here are trying to get better or trying to help others get better. Part of finding new paths and builds that work is making mistakes and trying new things. It's so nice that people throw up both their successes and failures here to help us all.
What's really sad is when a punk with no grace and little to say resorts to ridiculing another's build, play style, or ability. It says nothing about the target and everything about the poster.
Hi, I think you might confused names cuz im Eric Cartman, im a TR, pvping a lot, playing since day 1 of open beta and I never in my life played WK. Also never met any1 with that name (in 1 year) plus I checked first 150 pages of leaderboard today and there is only me (page 3)
For Combat Rogues, it's most likely the Purified Armor and Weapon Set + Corrupted Accessories, in terms of set effects.
As for me, I'll be sticking with my Profound Set and I'll be getting the Corrupted Weapons + Purified Accessories. That's a total of 20% Resistance to Black Ice damage, enough to take me regularly to Kessel's Retreat. But then again, in order to get the accessories I have to get other gear with resistance to Black Ice Damage because most of those items are from Kessel's Retreat.
Thanks for kind words:) Youre right im running high deflect (unfortunately cant go super-high cuz i rolled half-orc with 12 base CHA, but 38% which i am at now is almost enough). My main idea was to find something that will kept me alive while my stealth and itc r down and deflect works really well. Deflect and movement speed. This "in out atack" was probably me jumping around doing DF (im using standard rotation pob-itc-se), and with high movement u can really land almost every df, and u can even dodge with just a jump sometimes:)
What i also like about going deflect is u dont have to give up ur damage (like when ur going int/con/recovery). Im at 3,6k power, 3k ArPen, 46%+ crit and 20STR. With my P.Vorpal I can burn ppl hp really fast (and i mean REALLY fast). It is posible to keep ur offensive stats that high cuz most of deflect u need is already in a gear (profound scoundrel set/cn weps), and u can get LOTS of it from feats and powers. In reallity Im using 3 x rank 9 silver enchants and a boon which gives 250 deflect and Im at 2k+ deflect stat. That leaves me with an option with either boost my damage even more or get some more hp/regen.
Anyway if u have any specific questions u can pm me in game, or just write here i guess