Is Divine Emissary (de)buff broken

gexenn

So I noticed it several times in PE, when there is a cleric around with full Divine Emissary set, it gives me a nasty debuff lowering my GS significantly. Am I missing something or does it seem really not working as intended as the description says:

You passively grant your allies 250 Defense and Deflection

daswildbret

odd111out

I've tested it extensively outside of PE and in dungeons and my set gives its bonus correctly. I suspect there must be some sort of counter-buff in PE to keep people from qualifying for dungeons they would otherwise not be geared for, as I get a gear score boost, not a buff like you get from the cat or the stone. The only problem I've had is Q systems when someone barely qualifies for T2. In that case I just move off 20 feet and we are good to go.

gexenn

Well I never had full set so I cannot tell how it works for the wearer, but when I stand near such a cleric I get a skull icon (meaning debuff) saying "divine emissary bonus" and my GS is lowered from 10,665 to 10,165. I am a cleric so not sure if this is meant as anti dual cler thingy... just seems weird to me.

mantera47

I just tested this in Protector's Enclave and in Neverdeath Graveyard. The set gives an ally standing near you the correct bonus but for some reason it lowers their gear score. I think the bug is that the gs is lowered.

kiralia

Yeah there is definitely a debuff in pe related to it. My partner made a cw and we were waiting for a delve to pop and it suddenly kicked him from the q because he didn't have high enough gs (even though he did when we started to q) and he noticed the debuff.

*edit*
And it wasn't me giving the debuff cos I don't have the 4 pc it was some random cleric passing by.

odd111out

Finding some random person, a Guardian Fighter at level 60. With my gear off, he has a GS of 9,778 with a Defense of 4332 and a Deflect of 975. If I slap my gear on the little green skull appears ( which is the active boost mark in dungeons btw) and his GS 9,277. But his Defense is now higher at 4582 and his Deflect is at 1225.

There appears to be some sort of mechanism meant to counter having someone randomly boost your gear score by 500 points just by being in the area. Else all of PE might be inadvertently qualified for Castle Never. It may be an inelegant solution. That being said, if you are only 500 some points over the threshold for T2s to begin with....

fondlez

Gives me one more reason not to stand around mail boxes or indeed anyone else while assessing my gear!

kiralia

odd111out wrote: »

That being said, if you are only 500 some points over the threshold for T2s to begin with....

Then it is time to start running T2s. As long as people in the group are not complete idiots there is no reason for someone who meets the games gear check requirement not to do so.

odd111out

Kiralia: If someone's damage resistance is so low they are a one-shot-kill or if they can't do sufficient damage, they will do more than just die. The team dies. And there's not much of a learning experience to be had lying face down 10 feet from the entrance.

Now I have a GS over 11,000 and just blew through Spider twice in a Delve. It went well, people got loot. I ran a Mad Dragon as a PUG twice the day before, and both were wipes. Not because people died, I could have kept them alive for hours. But they could not survive outside of Astral Shield and they could not do enough damage. Most of their GS qualified them for T2s.

You are always going to learn more in a successful Idris run then 60 seconds in Karrandux before people start DCing. If you have done your round of T1s and have picked a set of gear, but you barely qualify for a T2, then is a good time to sit down and figure out how to push yourself up a little more so that you can be a good team player. 8300 to 9000 or a little more is not far to go, and makes a huge difference.

kiralia

And what is the point in having a gs threshold at all if people are not supposed to even attempt the content marked for that gs until they exceed it by a certain amount? Its not always about the gs often its about the player, plus gs in this game is pretty messed up anyway.

odd111out

It's like having enchantment slots on your epic gear. You got the set, which is the basic minimum, but it won't do until you make it better. That goes for your GS overall.

And as good as a player is or not, there is a threshold of damage that if you can't deliver, no amount of skill makes up for. If you can't come up with the damage to kill an eyrinye before she self heals, no amount of speed pushing buttons will compensate.

Back to the original topic, I was at the mailbox and looked up to see I have x3 boost from Divine Emissary. I looked around and sure enough there were 2 other clerics with a complete set. My GS was down 1000 but my Defense was up 500 and my Deflect also by 500. So the buff does stack.

spani4rd

odd111out wrote: »

Kiralia: If someone's damage resistance is so low they are a one-shot-kill or if they can't do sufficient damage, they will do more than just die. The team dies. And there's not much of a learning experience to be had lying face down 10 feet from the entrance.

Now I have a GS over 11,000 and just blew through Spider twice in a Delve. It went well, people got loot. I ran a Mad Dragon as a PUG twice the day before, and both were wipes. Not because people died, I could have kept them alive for hours. But they could not survive outside of Astral Shield and they could not do enough damage. Most of their GS qualified them for T2s.

You are always going to learn more in a successful Idris run then 60 seconds in Karrandux before people start DCing. If you have done your round of T1s and have picked a set of gear, but you barely qualify for a T2, then is a good time to sit down and figure out how to push yourself up a little more so that you can be a good team player. 8300 to 9000 or a little more is not far to go, and makes a huge difference.

GS is only an indication of total amount of stats, a lot of people have a bunch of worthless stats or overcapped stats adding to their GS but hardly giving them any bonuses. You can have a much better balanced setup with less GS, actually it's pretty common, you simplyt give up some of an overcapped stat to get a useable amount of another one.
Also, if the only problem is damage resistance then simply buff defense and problem solved. Very few bosses in this game are damage dependant, will it take longer, sure; but if people have adecuate defensive stats and don't stay static in red circles all the time (no cure for that) then as a knowledgeable cleric you shouldn't have many issues keeping your group up and allowing them to complete the content

odd111out

If you are enchanting epic or level 60 gear with 5-9 enchantment levels all towards one stat or another, your problem might be diminishing returns. However, when I inspect PUG people before I explain to people that it's a wipe, that's not what I'm finding. The most common case is a complete lack of buffed GS because people have slapped loot drops on themselves and not bothered to enchant anything. If you have gear you intend to upgrade, it's still worth it to put lower level enchantments on it and buff yourself by a few hundred. Which is why I said to take a close look at your GS and figure out if you can improve your damage/heal and your defense. It shouldn't take forever, but PPPPPP.

And in the end, you can be as knowledgable a Cleric as you like, but you don't kill things. If your team simply can't do the damage, you can keep the team alive for hours in the same room with the same immortal Eyrinyes. And you are going to learn more running Idris 3-5 times with what you think is your T2 gear (kill faster, more heals) dying 3-5 times to the first mob in a T2. After all, the next step up in loot in a T2 is only available when you kill bosses, not when your corpse becomes the new doormat.

spani4rd

odd111out wrote: »

If you are enchanting epic or level 60 gear with 5-9 enchantment levels all towards one stat or another, your problem might be diminishing returns. However, when I inspect PUG people before I explain to people that it's a wipe, that's not what I'm finding. The most common case is a complete lack of buffed GS because people have slapped loot drops on themselves and not bothered to enchant anything. If you have gear you intend to upgrade, it's still worth it to put lower level enchantments on it and buff yourself by a few hundred. Which is why I said to take a close look at your GS and figure out if you can improve your damage/heal and your defense. It shouldn't take forever, but PPPPPP.

And in the end, you can be as knowledgable a Cleric as you like, but you don't kill things. If your team simply can't do the damage, you can keep the team alive for hours in the same room with the same immortal Eyrinyes. And you are going to learn more running Idris 3-5 times with what you think is your T2 gear (kill faster, more heals) dying 3-5 times to the first mob in a T2. After all, the next step up in loot in a T2 is only available when you kill bosses, not when your corpse becomes the new doormat.

Fair enough. I wasn't trying to call your skills into question. I just feel like people toss around GS like it's some sort of all telling number when for the most part it seems pretty arbitrary. I lost just about 500 GS by using 4 piece miralce healer vs 2 and 2 so that's sort of my point.
TBH I don't find this game overly gear dependant, so much as a lot of people don't have a good understanding of what the function of their calss is, yet alone what skills to be using and how. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a GF not use into the fray when running to the end of an instance passed all the mobs etc.
I honestly think I ran less than 5t1 dungeons, too **** boring. So yeah I did a bunch of t2's being undergeared with t1/pvp items and not socketed etc. Went fine for the most part, of course I would not recomend for a pug group but with friends who knew what they were up too and had good comunication it was alright. Of course the game was somewhat different back then, although I'd say it was harder, but maybe it's just because I'm more geared now. It's pretty easy to pull 1 or 2 slightly undergeared people through an instance, but not an entire pug.