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aeroth001
Member Posts: 420 Bounty Hunter
The world in nw online will be the entire forgotten realms ? What are all the towns that we can visit ?
A map of the ingame world would be perfect :d
A map of the ingame world would be perfect :d
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It would be awesome to see a map like that, of the explorable area of the game, but I don't think we can expect a huge complete world. Forgotten Realms is comprised of a massive space, spanning great land masses, oceans, and desserts. I know WoW and others have done this, but FR is far to expansive, filled with stories and lore, to do that. In my own opinion of course! Perhaps if the game is a hit and goes on for years, and if Cryptic supports and expands over time. I personally would love to see that myself. My ranger would love nothing more than to explore the greater world of Forgotten Realms. Pull together a team of friends and travel the map.
I just wouldn't expect a world map of the entire Forgotten Realms.
You gravely underestimate the power of D&D community. Check Part 3 of FAQs in the forums by truthseeker. Also there is old thread by Darren. Darren you see, is making a map of the whole world (forget forgotten realms, it includes both Abeir and Toril after their merger). Though no official map of Toril exists, official map of forgotten realms both before and after spellplague does exist.
I'd forgotten about that thread. I read that long ago. And yes, this would be great to have in game. But actual covered, explorable area, will likely be very small. I'd have to expect that a world map by Cryptic would only include areas that can be travelled to. I'm all for a huge world to explore! It would be like a gamers dream come true for me! I guess my hopes just aren't that high that we'll see a vast world like WoW has.
I'm more inclined to think of it as vangald, it's more likely to be Neverwinter city and the surrounding areas. Let's hope we're wrong eh?
The game is probably based on locations described in pnp Neverwinter campaign book. I suspect it because the game is cannon and was supposed to release along with pnp. So that book should have been based on this game.
...
or not.
Probably. :-)
Link
In this interview, towards the end, andy says something about icewind dales environment also. So I guess rest of planar locations of other worlds can be added later using signils(planes) as WotC would perhaps be happy to license them if game is a hit. Except for perhaps the Lolth's one which was recently licensed to DDO.
EDIT: Its all speculation though.
@gillrmn
That link is actually a 2011 video where Andy mentions release would be in late 2011. So it's pre-PW. A lot has changed since the buy-out, going from a co-op game to a full on MMO. I had thought that when Atari was involved, it would be more of a DDO style game where you have one major city to work from and all adventures start or launch from there, jumping you all over the world to where you can do this quest or that. Maybe that's changed?
The point I'm getting to here is that as I think it through more, perhaps there is a larger world being developed here than I first thought.
See, this is why it's great to banter back and forth on this stuff. Disagreeing or challenging an opinion is great. I'm glad we can do that here!
As many users have adapted a unique persona by font colors, I will also try it out by using silver color. Though this color is a bit sneaky and you wouldn't find it until you look hard ;-P
The Neverwinter Campaign setting is largely intended for low-level characters (1-10). It's an example of developing settings in detail, over a small area, versus developing settings from a large area and going inward.
Now, the game has been revamped. There's no real way of telling how much has changed without input from the devs. I will say that there's a difference between saying a game world is vast, and saying that a campaign setting is vast. You can have many varied areas and environments within a small area within a game. To give an example, to a walking man, New York City is vast, if you are unable to rely on public transportation. Compare this to the rest of the world.
I expect the game world to be large and the environments varied. If Neverwinter Nights is any indication, the game will likely focus around Neverwinter, but you'll move reasonably away from the city as the story progresses.
To create the whole realm would be an undertaking that would be overbearing even if years were spent in developing just the playable map. Honestly I can't even imagine a video game version of the complete Toril which wouldn't be an injustice to it.
I would say that it's likely Neverwinter and the surrounding areas would be including by Cryptic at NWO's release which some might think as small but if only Luskan to Waterdeep and as far East as Neverwinter Wood were included in a half the detail that could possibly be done then the playable realm would rival any other MMO's current map.
I would love to see them spend a lot of time and effort creating the world. Ultimately more cities should be developed but the last thing I'd want is to feel like the world was rushed and tiny. The majority of Toril is wildlands full of long lost knowledge and treasure and that can't be expressed if the distance between the major cities is a few minutes walk.
I'm all for caravan's or teleportation hubs like Skyrim introduced. In fact that's the closest comparison of distance that I'd like to see in Neverwinter. Those towns felt like a long distance apart. That's how I'd like to see the distance between Luskan and Waterdeep, if not a bit larger.
As far as Neverwinter is concerned, we're focusing on the city itself, and the surrounding areas. As many of you have already mentioned, the world of Toril is vast, and Faer?n itself is a very large continent.
There are naturally quite a few different areas outside of Neverwinter's surroundings we would like to look into, and be able to bring to life. However, I think that focusing on this one area, and the myriad of adventures that you can find there, will make for a better game at release.
We'll be talking some more about the different areas in the game as we move closer to launch. Some of them (such as Vellosk) you'll recognize immediately from the source material. Other areas however, you will find have been created specifically for Neverwinter.
Thanks,
Stormshade
Something to celebrate!
b:thanks
I checked it out. Very nice page.
Apparently the information is still coming out on the game. But your Wiki page showed that at least they will have areas around the city. Sadly it looks like Neverwinter is looking like it will be just Neverwinter and the areas immediately around it. Hopefully this is a huge area which requires us to eventually get mounts and travel around in. As a huge part of the D&D and MMO experience is traveling and "random" encounters.
I fear that will make it alot like DDO. Maybe with more areas to travel around to. But very limited compared to most MMO's world size. Speaking of DDO, does it also mean we will be doing the same old instances over and over again?
The upside is if the game is good, they should be able to make new content with the other cities, and eventually other areas of the FR universe.
Well that should make the D&D pnp fans happy.
I felt that it would be a small DDO, based around 1 city thing.
But it would be very nice if Neverwinter ended up being a sandbox with a huge world.
It is certainly not impossible as games like EQ seemed to have worlds that dwarf all the other MMO's. It's just a matter of is this game a themepark or a sandbox. It looks like a themepark. But as you pointed out maybe we are just prejudiced by DDO. After all EQ next looks themepark and will probably be a huge sandbox.
I think this game could be a to notched game if it was sandbox huge. So I personally hope your correct and the game is huge.
Isn't D&D produced by Wizards of the Coast but owned by Hasbro? As when I played DDO it pretty much said Wizards of the Coast was owned by Hasbro. I only bring this up because the biggest flaw in DDO in my opinion was it's lack of any real game world. Which I blame on Hasbro. So Wizards of the Coast still have a good reputation. But Hasbro seems to be in the driver's seat.
Nothing wrong with a area intended for low-level characters. And settings in detail, over a small area. But the only MMO I can remember doing that is DDO. And it basically felt like you just teleported or walked from one instance to another. Which just totally seemed to step on and crush immersion.
I hope your correct that the world is large and environments varied. And I hope we will move reasonably away from the city.
I'm sure a game that is 10 levels can be done in a small area, without seeming like one big instance fest. But unfortunately I feel the D&D reputation was hurt badly by the DDO lack of any real game world. And I think many will be apprehensive when going to Neverwinter because of their DDO experience.
Fortunately in my case the class mechanics and leveling of DDO are enough for me to give this game a chance. I am also prejudiced by the F2P model. But then again, in this case, there is no financial risk. So I will still give the game a try.
Even 13 years ago Everquest made a game that seemed huge. So it is quite possible for a sandbox MMO to create the feel of a huge world. So IMO they could make a game that covered whole realms.
Usually the problem is in creating cities that feel like cities. Usually MMO cities feel too small and are largely just selling and quest hubs. Cryptic though created a City that felt like a city in champions.
And even though I have bemoaned the fact that the game may only be around Neverwinter. I can say that if Cryptic makes Neverwinter feel as much like a city as their city in Champions. I will feel pretty happy about it. Champions was mostly around the city and had some other areas around it. it also was big enough, with enough random mobs to make it feel like a real city. Even with super flight or speed, the city felt big. So mounts could be needed in such a setting. It also had instances spread out enough so that it didn't feel like a non world like DDO.
Frankly, I think the biggest problem for programmers making a D&D MMO is the 20 level cap in D&D. Not the size of the world. As D&D players expect a cap of 20. And MMO players expect a cap of 50. That can expands to around 100 if the game is successful.
Being that this game is not being developed by Turbine gives me more hope that they won't kill the immersion of gameplay like DDO does.
If it was the "province" or "District" or whatever of Neverwinter and the other close ones, that would be cool. But yah, just my opinion on games, since i love traveling...it just adds that extra umf for rps and character development. XD
DDO is fun in it's own right but it becames blatantly obvious that if you're not in an instance then you're wasting time. And if you're just roaming in the outside world's instances you're still wasting time. No chance of XP, no chance for loot and after you roam the map once you'll never find anything new.
DDO was quest or stand around...kind of bland when it boils down to the basics.
One of my favorite parts of NWN, especially the persistant worlds, was walking from city to city and often dealing with something new. Ogres might spawn were previously only goblins were, an occassional chest might appear in a bandit camp.
Yes over time this is learned like anything else but it still kept my interest better than DDO which had the same monsters spawn in the same spots without any chance of good loot and absolutely no xp. If you explored once you might as well never explore again.
D&D isn't all about quests. I suppose they took the easy way for game balancing but it doesn't really display the "Spirit of D&D."
If you ever read any Forgotten Realms novels it's very apparent that the journey to a place of interest should be as important as the place itself.
I agree with this so much that I couldn't agree with it any more than I do.
My frst D&D Novel was a Dragonlance one, The Knight of the Black Rose (I actually skipped school to read that book!). I couldn't get over the journeys Lord Soth went through and everything else in that novel. Then, I have since read practically everything by Ed Greenwood on Forgotten Realms, as well as other writers too. I loved the Time of the Troubles Triology, my latest series by Ed were the Elminster ones. Hopefully some resemblance of the "journey" of D&D will be a part of NWO as well. Even the short stories, like the ones in Silverfall and the Realms of Infamy, to name only a couple great examples, told of fantastical journeys.
Ultima Online, for me, when it was still new before Trammel, felt like a Journey every time I left my Tower (and later my Estate, when I moved back to Felucca before quitting in 2004ish). I have missed that feeling in every MMO I have played since. I also miss UO's spectacular and extremely customized housing system, save for the decay part (that lost me my grandfathered castle and keep).
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Quests are great fun, and D&D is by-in-large about questing. Heck, DDO has a ton of quests. You can run about the city of Stormreach in search of quest-givers and jump into quest after quest. Quest, quest, quest, everywhere is a quest. But you never get to see anything. (maybe that's changing in their new update and venture into Eveningstar, Forgotten Realms).
So, now for Neverwinter. All we know is that we'll have a city (Neverwinter) and the surrounding areas to quest in. Well we have that already in DDO... One of my biggest beefs with DDO is the lack of immersion you get when you want to feel how big the world is. You can write all the story you want about how you've just travelled on a caravan that journeyed a thousand miles across jungle and mountains, and now you are in this little zone where you'll fight a horde of monsters and kill a big baddy. But if your journey is just a loading screen, you lose the sense of it; and most players won't even read the story anyways.
Now I know some smart person here will tell me, this is D&D, or it's Neverwinter, and how it's not EQ or WoW. But a game hardly has to be as massive as WoW in order to give players a feeling of a grand world. **** did it well. It was nowhere's near the size of either EQ or WoW. And I would argue that **** was much larger than it needed to be, were it D&D.
I'm just really hoping we won't be locked into a city, and only given day passes to quest zones in the areas outside the city. We've done that already, and it didn't get rave reviews.
If memory serves, nobody has really told us anything more than there is a city, and surrounding area to adventure in. So can I explore that area? Or can I just pick quests that take me to instanced dungeons in that area?
/end negative rant
There doesn't always have to be loading screen. There can be random encounters (more than one per journey unlike pnp
Though in general I agree it will be great to have open world. But as ss already pointed out, to have a world as large as faerun or even just sword coast, may not be possible. A good map of sword coast itself may perhaps turn out to be 40-50GB big.
Well, from what we saw in the E3 preview video, there are open areas to explore before heading into instanced quests. Whether it'll be more like DDO wilderness areas (with objectives, mini-quests and mini-bosses), or more like large WoW wilderness areas where you can go kill boars when bored remains to be seen.
I'd say either approach is OK if done well, though I do have to mention that I'm absolutely against having to go "mobbing" to train skills/grind XP. Have something random to kill on the way to quests, and a bit of exploration for those who like it, but please don't make the game dependent on it. This ain't Monster Hunter.
Considering that BW basically ripped off D&D when making DA:O just so they wouldn't have to pay for the IP, not much surprise there. Every D&D-based computer game I've played had this system as well (IWD, BG, TOEE)
Well, from the info we have, it seems like we're only getting NW City and some surrounding areas to begin with. Meaning only a small chunk of the map. It'd probably take years for them to make the entire Coast in to the game, if ever.
They did not "rip off D&D", the d20 system that d&d uses is released under open game license as open game content that allows for any person or company to take it, modify it and use it to publish their own game
Hey! Hey! Lets drop that. lol
Didn't mean to cause a debate when I said DA:O copied one-encounter-a-day meme from dnd.
Copying isn't bad. Even halflings are called so because of so and so issue with hobb... you know, those little guys from other verse. It isn't bad to copy(as long as it is legal), its a kind of flattery - as long as it is not just ripping into the creative profits made by original and adding nothing else.