I am so glad I do not spend money on this game any more, but I am really curious to see what Cryptic will do next to beat this cluster. Have they peaked? Or do they have more left to to anger the playerbase with? Damn, all this excitement!
Stay tuned for the next episode, as Cryptic attempts to alienate the remaining players! Will they win? Or will there be anyone left to p*ss off?
You should just have made the price higher for the wards in termalune store instead of completely removing it. I too buy vip for the keys and sometimes buy keys from zen store to try my luck. I opened 50 boxes once and yet nothing good...
The only thing that made me atleast not regret buying the keys are the coal wards. Please don't remove it. Maybe just make it bound to Account or Character. Or make the price of it in the zen store to 500, or make the success rate of the weapon enchantments higher than 1%. There's too many options to choose and yet you just decided to remove it.
Please give us something good in return for this bad news.
viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
Next thing that might happen - AD poof from exchange. If you think this change is bad think again It could be a lot worse I really don't want the old system again when you needed months to buy 100 ZEN
I think there are a few underlying matters that this action might be addressing, not all of them bad, but certainly a kick in the pants for your devouted players, and certainly something that could have been handled somewhat more diplomatically:
1) perhaps the coal's and pres's had become too cheaply available, and character progression was happening faster than you had desired: - this could speak to excessively geared players, potentially unbalancing the end game, and perhaps speaking to the desired level of difficulty that you want Castle Never to provide; - the complete removal of these wards from the tarm bar, as opposed to some balancing act on pricing, or removal from the Zen store, will now result in (and has already been seen) increased ward prices, limiting the ability for your loyal players, with limited budgets, from progressing themselves and ultimately not enjoying their experience. This goes hand in hand with AD earn-rates, and what you expect the ward-earn-rate should be. What is it anyway? How long do you expect a player to wait until they can afford wards? - will you introduce these as dungeons rewards? another way for dedicated players to be rewarded for the time?
2) you have suggested that resources are tight, and hence your difficulty in focusing on bugs, or new content, or returning previously removed content: - if you wanted income to improve the game, just ask, or suggest the implementation of a monthly subscription. However: - (i) be warned that this may result in the loss of many players, who might have been happy to part with a few hard earned coins on an adhoc basis to begin with; - (ii) if this proposal does not result in an expeditious remedy of bugs, and the release of clean, new content, you will suffer even further player-migration; - I would have thought that the VIP offering has already provided you with somewhat more income than before. Are you now increasing your profit budget?
At the end of the day, your loyal players that were happy to pay for VIP, essentially ensuring wards in the tarm bar, are not likely to continue on this basis. Why else would I want the tarm bar? A new mount, with crazy powers? I would prefer the wards, please.
In short, my spending will cease for the foreseeable future, and back are the days of praying to the RNG-powers for wards from my Celestial boxes, or from a successful dungeons or resource node, and slowly grinding away trying to enjoy the content.
0
ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
Any logical MMO has it's money store full of cosmetic items. Not faster mounts, and things you absolutely need or want to make a difference. Not NW, removing fashion from the store, such logic.
Popped over from Xbox when I found out they shafted you as they did with us, I genuinely feel this is due to what has happened on XBOX, I think its an attempt to justify their actions to MS and stem the flood of folk demanding refunds from Live. At least some of you had some warning and could convert your bars to coalwards to stock up before the change.
This is a very shortsighted thing to do and will likely kill the game off over the long haul, lockboxes are pointless now as they were the only guaranteed payback you got from buying keys. My wallet has been locked since the change on XBOX and will remain so for the foreseeable future lets see how long they survive on massively reduced revenue shall we?
0
viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
You should just have made the price higher for the wards in termalune store instead of completely removing it. I too buy vip for the keys and sometimes buy keys from zen store to try my luck. I opened 50 boxes once and yet nothing good...
The only thing that made me atleast not regret buying the keys are the coal wards. Please don't remove it. Maybe just make it bound to Account or Character. Or make the price of it in the zen store to 500, or make the success rate of the weapon enchantments higher than 1%. There's too many options to choose and yet you just decided to remove it.
Please give us something good in return for this bad news.
I opened 125 boxes on the Boxing Day last year and I got nothing too good eighter. But I got from those boxes enough bars to buy 15 col wards which I sold for the price then of about 125000 AD each I now wish I kept those 15 wards but as everyone else I believed you cryptic when you said that wards never get wiped of trade bar store. I could of sold the wards for more now then I did then Oh well Life goes on I will get my dungeon keys
0
ghoulz66Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,748Arc User
This situation didn't have to become red hot, ready to explode. Management could have had a solution to the problem THE DAY they planned to have these changes. But as usual management goes forward with their guns cocked without using the organ in their skulls. They had... what, THREE years to take the hint that coal wards on the zen market cost way too much for what they give you in the end. Making a trans enchant from scratch costs 12 coal wards. That's just one item. WHO is managing the game's store!? WHO set those prices? Seriously, I'd love to know who came up with such an unreasonable number and feels the costs are still fine.
It's very telling to note that you've got 10 pages of comments about this dumb move and only 20 comments about castle never... It's like you guys don't even care. You're baffling us with BS because you can't impress us with substance.
Relmyna - AC/DC Righteous + Haste| Nadine - CW MoF (working on it)|Buffy - GF SM Tact| Hrist - Justice Tankadin|Healadin (Wannabe Tank)| Lena -MI Sabo TR (Farmer) | Jeska - GWF SM Destroyer (Farmer) | Maggie - HR PF Trapper (Wannabe DPS)
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
I had an earlier post, and this is certainly tough news to digest, and will certainly slow an character progression i was hoping for, and this in itself results in some [potentially] hasty comments (as can be seen from 10+ pages over a very short time... this might be one of the records). However, it is important to note that:
1) the VIP benefit, at worst 500 AD per Zen, with no coupon, will cost 500k AD for 30 days. You can acheive this in some 20 days of dungeons, skirmishes and salvage (fairly easy); the benefit provides a daily lockbox key, which amounts at least to some 75 Zen discounted, at some 355 AD per Zen (on the low side), for 30 days = 800k (i.e. a minimum net benefit of 300k AD), plus any benefit from the lockbox (albeit disastrously low chance for a marvellous item), plus the balance of AD earned during the last 10 days of dungeons, skirmish and salvage (enough to by a coal ward?). Consequently, the VIP benefit should still be worthwhile.
2) Cryptic has suggested levels of AD earn-rates that they are monitoring and are happy with, but what do they expect for Ward earn rates? Will these be modified to include chest rewards, resource nodes and quest rewards?
0
viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
I had an earlier post, and this is certainly tough news to digest, and will certainly slow an character progression i was hoping for, and this in itself results in some [potentially] hasty comments (as can be seen from 10+ pages over a very short time... this might be one of the records). However, it is important to note that:
1) the VIP benefit, at worst 500 AD per Zen, with no coupon, will cost 500k AD for 30 days. You can acheive this in some 20 days of dungeons, skirmishes and salvage (fairly easy); the benefit provides a daily lockbox key, which amounts at least to some 75 Zen discounted, at some 355 AD per Zen (on the low side), for 30 days = 800k (i.e. a minimum net benefit of 300k AD), plus any benefit from the lockbox (albeit disastrously low chance for a marvellous item), plus the balance of AD earned during the last 10 days of dungeons, skirmish and salvage (enough to by a coal ward?). Consequently, the VIP benefit should still be worthwhile.
2) Cryptic has suggested levels of AD earn-rates that they are monitoring and are happy with, but what do they expect for Ward earn rates? Will these be modified to include chest rewards, resource nodes and quest rewards?
It is only a profit if you got more then 1 character that can do dungeons. I had 3 to start with so I made some calculations and it is worth for me just in daily keys. But as most people look at P2W and want same stuff - power hungry and aggressive they don't like I don't like it much myself. But by slandering and swearing we won't get them to change their minds
0
viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
IF AD supply will dry out this will hit everyone way more then this change
Well, players continued to play NWO even after the "AD changes" and the outcry around it... Probably the same will happen after these "Trade Bars changes", players will still keep on paying and playing.
And everyone complaining about lockbox keys from ViP, may i remind you, that money had to be paid one way or the other to become ViP in the first place? In other words, even if someone is only exchanging AD for ZEN and buying ViP (or other items from the store) with it, Cryptic/PWE is still getting their money.
As with most other changes happening over the last several months, this will only hurt the casual/regular players.
Clearly - this 'Love' is more like an unhealthy relationship.
I feel like someone in charge is not understanding that the love we as players have for this game is not infinite. Saying "We want it to thrive" in response to this is like carefully planting a delicate flower garden and purposely running it over with a lawnmower.. completely non sequitur utter nonsense and overly harsh... Instead of making your game more difficult or interesting you're playing with our wallets like we're a credit card that won't max out. People payed VIP in advance to get insured tarmalune bars for basic character progression. It's a blatant insult to everyone's intelligence to continue with this without explanation.
How is this making your game any more fun??
Nothing this company is doing seems to have any plan or make any sense. All these knee jerk fixes.. all the negative feedback seems to be completely irrelevant. I don't know why you all even have a 'Player Feedback' forum. I guess it's just for show.
Relmyna - AC/DC Righteous + Haste| Nadine - CW MoF (working on it)|Buffy - GF SM Tact| Hrist - Justice Tankadin|Healadin (Wannabe Tank)| Lena -MI Sabo TR (Farmer) | Jeska - GWF SM Destroyer (Farmer) | Maggie - HR PF Trapper (Wannabe DPS)
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
I'm still playing for...basically, the visuals, the combat system and the fact that i already enjoy what i have and have friends in game i like to spend time with. This move is the usual greedy move, just don't buy stuff...play with friends.
But man...such a bad move. Wards in the tarmalune shop was the one good thing you added so far...the only thing that made in-game progress more doable. Agree with Lancer. Saying it's a "policy" you make yourself ridiculous. It's been there since ages. Just say "we want money".
Honestly, the coalescent wards was the ONLY thing I would've spent trade bars on at all. Of that I was thinking while grinding ad to to use in the zen/ad exchange, and now, Strumslinger, devs made trade bars worthless piece of HAMSTER, you can only buy fashion, fashion and MORE fashion, that by the way LOOKS AWFUL mostly. As in one of the comments it was said, that every time you make a step forward, you also make two steps back. Well since you ruined the system that was in NW since module 0, this means that you are making a step forwards, and FALLING down by 9 steps. And I can promise, falling down 9 steps is going to HURT you even though you expect your wallets to get bigger. It would be really nice though if players would finally strike against the devs, and the devs would finally realize, that this game isn't for making big wallets HUGE wallets, but for giving people something fun to play ALONG getting enough money themselves, because people are going to DONATE to a game that they like, not like now, all f****d up and so on. From the current situation I see in Cryptic, perfect world, you're not planing on doing anything at all about it.
But time is more powerful than a huge wallet, so be careful, Cuz if you get into a hole too deep, you might not get out.
I just bought out all wards from few dozens of bars left. I knew it will happen. Now price of Coalescent Wards and popular wep/armor enh will skyrocket.
Been playing online games since Telnet MUDs and I can tell you the writing is on the wall
This game has already suffered 3 massive player losses. This one will rival if not succeed the AD leadership nerf.
Cryptic is making the exact same mistake I have seen so many neophyte gaming companies do. This one may finally result in Game Sunset for cryptic. Alas this is what happens when you recycle content with new mob placement (Drowned Shore). Overhype a deployment and not even offer a missioning/adventure area (Underdark) and countless other examples.
Cryptic this wont solve your Zen buying problem. It will simply lead to more Dungeoning Snobbery for FAST loot runs to salvage for AD to then convert to ZEN to buy CW and PW. Pull your finger out boys and back pedal before you are on the job sites looking for another game to work on is my advice... But heck I know you don't read this stuff so I guess I'm wasting my time.
The unbound coalwards destroyed prices of a lot of enchants etc. (which caused some other items to decrease in price also) it's a good thing they remove it. Or they should make the coalwards bound again for 200 bars.
0
lirithielMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,482Arc User
Respectful? Un-be-HAMSTER-lievable! This is the devs being transparent with us? Just a week after the outcry on XBox over the exact same BS move? And it was pointed out that the move was made on XBox because the economies are so different, then you pull the same HAMSTER on PC version. Disgusting. The guy making all these HAMSTER decisions needs be kicked out on his HAMSTER - he obviously has no clue about this game and MMO's in general. I'm done with VIP, thank the gods mine runs out in a few days. New WoW expansion is looking better by the day...
Our pain is self chosen.
The most important thing in life is to be yourself. Unless you can be Batman. Always be Batman.
0
viperwitch23Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 205Arc User
The unbound coalwards destroyed prices of a lot of enchants etc. (which caused some other items to decrease in price also) it's a good thing they remove it. Or they should make the coalwards bound again for 200 bars.
MAY BE But you don't even bothered to think about casual players who work 5-6 days a week and don't have the time to run 10-20 dungeons a day I remember when I was getting kicked from a dungeon when they inspected me and saw I had no weapon or armor enchantment. Back then lesser vorpal was 400k And they didn't give a HAMSTER some people can't afford
Comments
Stay tuned for the next episode, as Cryptic attempts to alienate the remaining players! Will they win? Or will there be anyone left to p*ss off?
The only thing that made me atleast not regret buying the keys are the coal wards. Please don't remove it. Maybe just make it bound to Account or Character. Or make the price of it in the zen store to 500, or make the success rate of the weapon enchantments higher than 1%. There's too many options to choose and yet you just decided to remove it.
Please give us something good in return for this bad news.
And now what?
Illitilich
Demons getting into everything
Please put it back the way it was
If you think this change is bad think again
It could be a lot worse
I really don't want the old system again when you needed months to buy 100 ZEN
1) perhaps the coal's and pres's had become too cheaply available, and character progression was happening faster than you had desired:
- this could speak to excessively geared players, potentially unbalancing the end game, and perhaps speaking to the desired level of difficulty that you want Castle Never to provide;
- the complete removal of these wards from the tarm bar, as opposed to some balancing act on pricing, or removal from the Zen store, will now result in (and has already been seen) increased ward prices, limiting the ability for your loyal players, with limited budgets, from progressing themselves and ultimately not enjoying their experience. This goes hand in hand with AD earn-rates, and what you expect the ward-earn-rate should be. What is it anyway? How long do you expect a player to wait until they can afford wards?
- will you introduce these as dungeons rewards? another way for dedicated players to be rewarded for the time?
2) you have suggested that resources are tight, and hence your difficulty in focusing on bugs, or new content, or returning previously removed content:
- if you wanted income to improve the game, just ask, or suggest the implementation of a monthly subscription. However:
- (i) be warned that this may result in the loss of many players, who might have been happy to part with a few hard earned coins on an adhoc basis to begin with;
- (ii) if this proposal does not result in an expeditious remedy of bugs, and the release of clean, new content, you will suffer even further player-migration;
- I would have thought that the VIP offering has already provided you with somewhat more income than before. Are you now increasing your profit budget?
At the end of the day, your loyal players that were happy to pay for VIP, essentially ensuring wards in the tarm bar, are not likely to continue on this basis. Why else would I want the tarm bar? A new mount, with crazy powers? I would prefer the wards, please.
In short, my spending will cease for the foreseeable future, and back are the days of praying to the RNG-powers for wards from my Celestial boxes, or from a successful dungeons or resource node, and slowly grinding away trying to enjoy the content.
At least some of you had some warning and could convert your bars to coalwards to stock up before the change.
This is a very shortsighted thing to do and will likely kill the game off over the long haul, lockboxes are pointless now as they were the only guaranteed payback you got from buying keys.
My wallet has been locked since the change on XBOX and will remain so for the foreseeable future lets see how long they survive on massively reduced revenue shall we?
But I got from those boxes enough bars to buy 15 col wards which I sold for the price then of about 125000 AD each
I now wish I kept those 15 wards but as everyone else I believed you cryptic when you said that wards never get wiped of trade bar store. I could of sold the wards for more now then I did then
Oh well
Life goes on
I will get my dungeon keys
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
Some of my best friends are Imaginary.
just a joke or?
1) the VIP benefit, at worst 500 AD per Zen, with no coupon, will cost 500k AD for 30 days. You can acheive this in some 20 days of dungeons, skirmishes and salvage (fairly easy); the benefit provides a daily lockbox key, which amounts at least to some 75 Zen discounted, at some 355 AD per Zen (on the low side), for 30 days = 800k (i.e. a minimum net benefit of 300k AD), plus any benefit from the lockbox (albeit disastrously low chance for a marvellous item), plus the balance of AD earned during the last 10 days of dungeons, skirmish and salvage (enough to by a coal ward?). Consequently, the VIP benefit should still be worthwhile.
2) Cryptic has suggested levels of AD earn-rates that they are monitoring and are happy with, but what do they expect for Ward earn rates? Will these be modified to include chest rewards, resource nodes and quest rewards?
I had 3 to start with so I made some calculations and it is worth for me just in daily keys.
But as most people look at P2W and want same stuff - power hungry and aggressive they don't like
I don't like it much myself. But by slandering and swearing we won't get them to change their minds
Probably the same will happen after these "Trade Bars changes", players will still keep on paying and playing.
And everyone complaining about lockbox keys from ViP, may i remind you, that money had to be paid one way or the other to become ViP in the first place?
In other words, even if someone is only exchanging AD for ZEN and buying ViP (or other items from the store) with it, Cryptic/PWE is still getting their money.
As with most other changes happening over the last several months, this will only hurt the casual/regular players.
Clearly - this 'Love' is more like an unhealthy relationship.
I feel like someone in charge is not understanding that the love we as players have for this game is not infinite. Saying "We want it to thrive" in response to this is like carefully planting a delicate flower garden and purposely running it over with a lawnmower.. completely non sequitur utter nonsense and overly harsh... Instead of making your game more difficult or interesting you're playing with our wallets like we're a credit card that won't max out. People payed VIP in advance to get insured tarmalune bars for basic character progression. It's a blatant insult to everyone's intelligence to continue with this without explanation.
How is this making your game any more fun??
Nothing this company is doing seems to have any plan or make any sense. All these knee jerk fixes.. all the negative feedback seems to be completely irrelevant. I don't know why you all even have a 'Player Feedback' forum. I guess it's just for show.
--
I'll never retrace my steps.
Some of my best friends are Imaginary.
This move is the usual greedy move, just don't buy stuff...play with friends.
But man...such a bad move. Wards in the tarmalune shop was the one good thing you added so far...the only thing that made in-game progress more doable.
Agree with Lancer. Saying it's a "policy" you make yourself ridiculous. It's been there since ages. Just say "we want money".
But time is more powerful than a huge wallet, so be careful, Cuz if you get into a hole too deep, you might not get out.
Now price of Coalescent Wards and popular wep/armor enh will skyrocket.
— (The unwritten rule)
This game has already suffered 3 massive player losses. This one will rival if not succeed the AD leadership nerf.
Cryptic is making the exact same mistake I have seen so many neophyte gaming companies do. This one may finally result in Game Sunset for cryptic. Alas this is what happens when you recycle content with new mob placement (Drowned Shore). Overhype a deployment and not even offer a missioning/adventure area (Underdark) and countless other examples.
Cryptic this wont solve your Zen buying problem. It will simply lead to more Dungeoning Snobbery for FAST loot runs to salvage for AD to then convert to ZEN to buy CW and PW. Pull your finger out boys and back pedal before you are on the job sites looking for another game to work on is my advice... But heck I know you don't read this stuff so I guess I'm wasting my time.
The unbound coalwards destroyed prices of a lot of enchants etc. (which caused some other items to decrease in price also) it's a good thing they remove it. Or they should make the coalwards bound again for 200 bars.
The most important thing in life is to be yourself. Unless you can be Batman. Always be Batman.
But you don't even bothered to think about casual players who work 5-6 days a week and don't have the time to run 10-20 dungeons a day
I remember when I was getting kicked from a dungeon when they inspected me and saw I had no weapon or armor enchantment. Back then lesser vorpal was 400k
And they didn't give a HAMSTER some people can't afford
And you might want to come up with something additional in the ViP bags too, the daily single lockbox key isn't going to be enough after this change.