Unbalanced PvP

skywakler

I would like to start by saying how much I enjoy this game overall, this isn't just a rant. That said, your PvP is the most unbalanced, unfair, uncompetitive garbage I have ever played, and I've been a gamer since I got my Intellivison in 1981. Rogues in particular. It should not matter what class I am or what class my opponent is, a one shot kill is <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I cannot count the number of times I've been rolling along, going to a capture point when all of a sudden my screen flashes and it asks if I want to respawn. No warning, no glimpse of my opponent, nothing. Just dead. Then when I finally get a chance to actually fight back, I unload every power I've got (I'm a CW btw) and do almost no damage, maybe enough to let him/her know I was there, and then I die again. Its to the point where I have simply stopped playing PvP altogether, rough astral diamonds be damned. Please do something to balance your PvP. Its a VERY black spot on an otherwise fun game.

opalsuns

I am a CW too, and I am just gonna put this out there, it must a combination of your build, gear, and a few other areas.

Last mod I would have agreed with you, but this mod that's not the case, even with a rouge using the double dunk they shouldn't be able to one shot you, unless you're built very squishy, and have extremely low to zero tenacity, so lets start there with your current set up.

Are lvl 70?
What PvP set are you wearing?
What's your hp?
SS or MoF?
How much tenacity?
What's slotted on tab?

Fyi, I am not going divulge my personal build or entire set up, but at least with this sample snap shot of yours I can try to aide you possibly in not getting one shotted by a rouge if you're at full health.

armadeonx

I agree, my CW is still only 2k IL and won't get one shotted like that even if jumped from behind.

You need to aim for 2k tenacity (full burning set) as it seriously reduces the amount of damage you take - if you don't have many seals of triumph, go for the cheaper set for now then work your way toward burning.

In the meantime keep shield on the right button as it absorbs more damage and work on your armor penetration (that's why your skills are having little effect).

The ultra-squishy phase is something everyone goes through as they work on their first set of pvp armor but hang in there as it improves significantly as your gear gets better.

deathbringer

Wait, is someone seriously still crying about the TR? TR's are no longer the issue, its the HR's lol

anagramofevil

TRs can't one-shot you anymore if you have tenacity and run Shield on the mastery slot (RB). However, they can still perma-stealth and at-will you to death while remaining invisible the entire time. They can also still perma-daze if they focus their gear and build on it.

And all of that said, HRs are way worse. They can perma-daze/root a CW with the cookie-cutter Trapper build and mediocre gear. You will just sit there unable to do anything until your character is dead.

Perma-CC and perma-invisibility should not be a thing in PvP, ever.

Edit: spelling

azuosed89

One thing about neverwinter, and probably most MMORPGs. Class balancewise The pvp will never be completely balanced.
Simply because it is hard to do and also, a lot of the times Devs make changes based on the PvE aspect of the game. Which doesn't always reflect well on PvP...
Also there is the gear unbalance, like, if you running ranks 7, and getting geared, you will suffer against people who way overgeared.
But one thing for sure, this mod, from my experience playing this game years on PC and on here since the launching, is that it has never been so balanced before.

anagramofevil

azuosed89 said:

One thing about neverwinter, and probably most MMORPGs. Class balancewise The pvp will never be completely balanced.

Other mmorpgs have balanced stuns in PvP by not allowing anyone to chain them forever (not any class). There are a few ways to accomplish that:

• Put severe diminishing returns on chain-CC against a player (the effectiveness of each follow-up CC within a time-window is diminished relative to the previous stun).
  
• If a CC is reapplied before the previous CC has expired, cause it to actually break the CC. This forces players to at least perfectly time their attacks to keep a stun going.
  
• Put additional limits on CC capability against players, relative to PvE (NW does some of this one).
  

Also, giving a class the capability to stay invisible while attacking is just clearly broken.

On top of that, at least one class should have some kind of a stealth counter (a "see invisible" spell or feat - the Lantern cooldown is too long to be considered a good enough counter).

Class balance in rpg-based PvP is difficult to achieve, but there is no excuse for some very broken mechanics that other games have already solved. Not to mention all of the bugs - e.g. Trans Elven Battle causing DoTs to tick 4x longer than normal.

deathbringer

You can see a TR even when they are stealth. You just need to open your eyes.

dontbeupset

You can only see them when close. The weapon will give their location away to some extent but only after attacking and that will wear off well before their stealth does if they're set up correctly. So no..... Opening your eyes won't solve everything.

snoborder101

You guys do realize that Shocking Execution takes no tenacity penalty right? It's certainly possible to get one shot, or nearly one shot in full burning if you don't manage your stamina wisely. That being said, I think rogues are better balanced this mod. I think most classes are better balanced. There's only one class that comes into question and I think we all know who that is.

azuosed89

anagramofevil said:

azuosed89 said:

One thing about neverwinter, and probably most MMORPGs. Class balancewise The pvp will never be completely balanced.

Other mmorpgs have balanced stuns in PvP by not allowing anyone to chain them forever (not any class). There are a few ways to accomplish that:

• Put severe diminishing returns on chain-CC against a player (the effectiveness of each follow-up CC within a time-window is diminished relative to the previous stun).
  
• If a CC is reapplied before the previous CC has expired, cause it to actually break the CC. This forces players to at least perfectly time their attacks to keep a stun going.
  
• Put additional limits on CC capability against players, relative to PvE (NW does some of this one).
  

Also, giving a class the capability to stay invisible while attacking is just clearly broken.

On top of that, at least one class should have some kind of a stealth counter (a "see invisible" spell or feat - the Lantern cooldown is too long to be considered a good enough counter).

Class balance in rpg-based PvP is difficult to achieve, but there is no excuse for some very broken mechanics that other games have already solved. Not to mention all of the bugs - e.g. Trans Elven Battle causing DoTs to tick 4x longer than normal.

honestly what makes the pvp on neverwinter boring is not even the CC. it is the healers. I think the healers from both DCs and Pallys make the game boring. two equal teams running a comp with 1 dc and 1 pally won't have anyone die if they both play properly. the game becomes a bunch of people running from one point to the other desperate to cap the point before the enemy does it first or arrive to defend.
I wish healing was not so strong, usually the most fun matches are the ones that are not crowded with healers.

armadeonx

I agree with that - mind you my healing was pathetic so I switched - lol

drexci

I've tried pvp the last few day's and lol it is horrible. haste healers, bubble paladins, hunters wtf! invisible rouges throwing knives at you lol. I'm used to the player being over powered not the character.

Hunters I think are the biggest joke, imagine playing a shooting game with a auto aim machine gun that made the other player stand still, not be able to fight back and killed them at the same time!...that's basically what they are.

If you're playing against a bubble and haste all you can do is run away lol hope the healer can't build up divinity fast enough to haste the pally. You could probably just sit on nodes 1 and 2 with a haste and pally on each and have a hunter or rouge rotate between the two and win.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

azuosed89

poopoomcmuffns said:

I agree. Games with 2 clerics and a pally or two pallys and a cleric are just utterly unsatisfying even if we win. Its 10 mins of mindless button smashing with no real effect, and zerging around trying to cap points because neither team is really killing anyone. I ran this team comp a few times when ee first launched and it was fun at first, but became stale real fast.

yeah, healing should be nerfed for PvP even more IMO.

s4v10rx

skywakler#7773 said:

I would like to start by saying how much I enjoy this game overall, this isn't just a rant. That said, your PvP is the most unbalanced, unfair, uncompetitive garbage I have ever played, and I've been a gamer since I got my Intellivison in 1981. Rogues in particular. It should not matter what class I am or what class my opponent is, a one shot kill is HAMSTER. I cannot count the number of times I've been rolling along, going to a capture point when all of a sudden my screen flashes and it asks if I want to respawn. No warning, no glimpse of my opponent, nothing. Just dead. Then when I finally get a chance to actually fight back, I unload every power I've got (I'm a CW btw) and do almost no damage, maybe enough to let him/her know I was there, and then I die again. Its to the point where I have simply stopped playing PvP altogether, rough astral diamonds be damned. Please do something to balance your PvP. Its a VERY black spot on an otherwise fun game.

lol...guess u have not gone against over geared HR with rank 12, transcendent enchantment with a mythic on their artifact and weapon. try against any class with 3k gs score and above and i can guarantee u they will whoop ur a** in any class they r playing, this game is about ur how much $$ u r willing to spend on ur gear and teamwork, if you want a tanky char go with OP, GF, GWF and DC

cummins12v

You can't balance a pay 2 win game. You just can't.

armadeonx

I just went against a TR with what appeared to be a trans plaguefire - three sets of 3 daggers and I was dead (on CW) I saw him about 1 second in every 10. Yes it took him a couple of mins but each set of 3 took about 40% of my health.

The only frustrating part for him was I kept coming straight off the campfire and back at him preventing him from capping the node.

They were a premade of 2 x HR and 2 x TR plus a GF against my pug team - I lolled in zone just before they lost 850 to 1000.

yourenext2die

armadeonx said:

I just went against a TR with what appeared to be a trans plaguefire - three sets of 3 daggers and I was dead (on CW) I saw him about 1 second in every 10. Yes it took him a couple of mins but each set of 3 took about 40% of my health.

The only frustrating part for him was I kept coming straight off the campfire and back at him preventing him from capping the node.

They were a premade of 2 x HR and 2 x TR plus a GF against my pug team - I lolled in zone just before they lost 850 to 1000.

Trans Plaguefire, hmmm. I saw one for sale recently. I personally would rather have a Trans Feytouched, especially with the coming change to active companion bonuses in Domination.

armadeonx

I think it worked well with the fighting style he was going for in that it kept up the damage for a few seconds after he had thrown the knives - it did a lot of damage too.

With the 3 knives in quick succession he'd get 15% of his weapon damage per second plus an aoe hit on the 3rd second - plus ofc the huge defence reduction.

sharpcams

PVP Is a joke,it's so imbalanced it's stupid,going on there and getting killed with one hit,how is that fun,how you ever meant to improve when you never win,take weeks of playing to buy upgrades,or do what they want and spend 100s of bucks to pay to win,they'll never fix it because people with more money than brain cells will always pay to win.

respectpays

buying immunity to stuns for a time period...

armadeonx

sharpcams#9128 said:

PVP Is a joke,it's so imbalanced it's stupid,going on there and getting killed with one hit,how is that fun,how you ever meant to improve when you never win,take weeks of playing to buy upgrades,or do what they want and spend 100s of bucks to pay to win,they'll never fix it because people with more money than brain cells will always pay to win.

Buy a set of tenacity rated blues for 10-20k AD from the AH. This'll give you 1k tenacity. Run GG instead of Dom as you have a greater chance of winning due to team randomness & you get more glory when you include seals - 3 for a loss & 7 for a win (each is worth 50 glory). You need 1 win per day for 10 days to buy your main Burning armor which will give you a big boost on stats, including tenacity. At this point your life becomes a lot easier - another 17 days will get you the rest of your gear.

Make sure you put glory boosting enchantments in all utility slots - preferably rank 7's. This'll reduce the number of matches you need to play daily.

I have not spent any money on this and all of my characters have the full burning set and hold their own. (DC, CW & OP)
Yes if I spent real money I'd have top level enchantments giving a serious boost to my abilities but going from meh to uber in one wallet drop takes the sense of achievement out of getting better.

shanedogg

skywakler#7773 said:

I would like to start by saying how much I enjoy this game overall, this isn't just a rant. That said, your PvP is the most unbalanced, unfair, uncompetitive garbage :snip:
<snip>

In Ultima Online (grandfather of ALL MMOs) you could be one shotted if your character was not fully developed and a PK with full stats and Vanquishing gear showed up while you were farming in a dungeon. At least on here for the most part PvP is optional and when you die people can't loot your corpse of all your gear and stuff in your inventory. Imagine having to always look over your back with your recall scroll hot key at the ready hoping your spell doesn't fizzle and fail when a red shows up.

judejack121

> @s4v10rx said:
> I would like to start by saying how much I enjoy this game overall, this isn't just a rant. That said, your PvP is the most unbalanced, unfair, uncompetitive garbage I have ever played, and I've been a gamer since I got my Intellivison in 1981. Rogues in particular. It should not matter what class I am or what class my opponent is, a one shot kill is <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I cannot count the number of times I've been rolling along, going to a capture point when all of a sudden my screen flashes and it asks if I want to respawn. No warning, no glimpse of my opponent, nothing. Just dead. Then when I finally get a chance to actually fight back, I unload every power I've got (I'm a CW btw) and do almost no damage, maybe enough to let him/her know I was there, and then I die again. Its to the point where I have simply stopped playing PvP altogether, rough astral diamonds be damned. Please do something to balance your PvP. Its a VERY black spot on an otherwise fun game.
>
>
>
> lol...guess u have not gone against over geared HR with rank 12, transcendent enchantment with a mythic on their artifact and weapon. try against any class with 3k gs score and above and i can guarantee u they will whoop ur a** in any class they r playing, this game is about ur how much $$ u r willing to spend on ur gear and teamwork, if you want a tanky char go with OP, GF, GWF and DC
GWF? Are you actually for real the GWF NEEDS to be buffed. This doesn't seem to apply in Neverwinter PvP but if a 10 ft half Orc is swinging around a sword bigger than most other races how does that do less damage than a TR with two tiny daggers when they both have the same gear score. I have a 1.9k and I get beaten by a TR with a 1.2k.
But for real. GWF is the worst class in the game.
If you were told that GWF were the worst in pvp it would be VERY seldom you see one.
There would probably be like 3 in the whole game and they would delete their accounts if they were below level 20. Unfortunately I didn't try pvp until lvl 40
And I wasn't willing to stop then.

indylol

I like how everyones ok with my GF killing any class in the game in 1 rotation.

Carry on with your rogue / hr is op debate LOL

armadeonx

@judejack121 at 1.9k your character isn't anywhere near spec yet but if you're getting out DPS'd by ANYONE at 1.2k your specs need looking at. Can you state your Power, Critical Chance and Resistance Ignored?

Experienced GWF's are very happy with their class now so you'd probably benefit from some advise - check out the GWF class forum.

Unknown

This content has been removed.

melodiezxx

If your getting one shotted in pvp by rouges still you need to learn how to build your char right and Atleast have all epics to stay competitive, and if you think GWF is the worst class in the game your a noob, a lot of people here don't know what your talking about

s4v10rx

judejack121 said:

> @s4v10rx said:

> I would like to start by saying how much I enjoy this game overall, this isn't just a rant. That said, your PvP is the most unbalanced, unfair, uncompetitive garbage I have ever played, and I've been a gamer since I got my Intellivison in 1981. Rogues in particular. It should not matter what class I am or what class my opponent is, a one shot kill is HAMSTER. I cannot count the number of times I've been rolling along, going to a capture point when all of a sudden my screen flashes and it asks if I want to respawn. No warning, no glimpse of my opponent, nothing. Just dead. Then when I finally get a chance to actually fight back, I unload every power I've got (I'm a CW btw) and do almost no damage, maybe enough to let him/her know I was there, and then I die again. Its to the point where I have simply stopped playing PvP altogether, rough astral diamonds be damned. Please do something to balance your PvP. Its a VERY black spot on an otherwise fun game.

>

>

>

> lol...guess u have not gone against over geared HR with rank 12, transcendent enchantment with a mythic on their artifact and weapon. try against any class with 3k gs score and above and i can guarantee u they will whoop ur a** in any class they r playing, this game is about ur how much $$ u r willing to spend on ur gear and teamwork, if you want a tanky char go with OP, GF, GWF and DC

GWF? Are you actually for real the GWF NEEDS to be buffed. This doesn't seem to apply in Neverwinter PvP but if a 10 ft half Orc is swinging around a sword bigger than most other races how does that do less damage than a TR with two tiny daggers when they both have the same gear score. I have a 1.9k and I get beaten by a TR with a 1.2k.

But for real. GWF is the worst class in the game.

If you were told that GWF were the worst in pvp it would be VERY seldom you see one.

There would probably be like 3 in the whole game and they would delete their accounts if they were below level 20. Unfortunately I didn't try pvp until lvl 40

And I wasn't willing to stop then.

GWF already got buffed in this mod, same goes for GF and HR. GF burst damage got buffed big time and GF have now have 1 of the best burst damage ever.

GWF tanky build will be sentinel/instigator with at least 3-4K life steal, once u r able to reach that threshold, you will be unkillable by ppl with 2200 GS score and below.