Why do you even want Astral Diamonds?

angrysprite

PLEASE VOTE in the Poll.

PLEASE: No flaming or complaints to anything like that. Let's help the Cryptic help us, etc: please give real consideration to your answers and hopefully the Devs and Staff of Cryptic can get a little clearer insight into how we the players use the economy to our own entertainment and advantage. Then maybe they'll see things from a different perspective from the one they have now.

It's always a major concern for developers of MMOs to maintain a balanced economy and the reason is pretty simple: there are those who will grind for rewards and others willing to spend real money for shortcuts to those same rewards. Cryptic is a for-profit company and this is capitalism at work; "profit" is not a bad word. The company has to make a profit to pay the bills so we can all enjoy their product. Fair enough.

MY THEORY: The current problem with the overabundance of Astral Diamonds in game is the utter lack of "wanted" rewards for playing the game, whether loot drops, chest loot or even 'bonus' rewards. And here's what I mean:

Before Mod 6: Epic Gear was a great reward, and was sellable in the Auction House. People could grind for it and sell it and make some Astral Diamonds. Other people not able or willing to grind for it would pay cash to buy Zen Points (Cryptic's primary goal to remain profitable) - then spend those Zen Points by trading it for Astral Diamonds - for the purpose of buying those wanted rewards, such as Epic Gear, in the Auction House.

It was a three-way win: Grinders got Zen Points without spending cash, Shortcutters got Epic Gear without grinding, Cryptic got cash money toward their bottom-line.

I was one of those shortcutters - I spent a LOT of money because for me it was about the convenience (not bragging and I don't expect anyone to care - I am only expressing why and how I reached my own theory and why I've no interest in buying AD through ZAX, which is something I did a LOT OF previously).

However now almost all really decent (wanted) rewards are bind-on-pickup; cannot be traded or sold in the Auction House. All other rewards are "junk" throwaway stuff, meaning I am forced to grind for the good stuff myself, as I cannot buy it. As a shortcutter willing to spend cash money - I have no incentive to want all that Astral Diamonds because there's not much interesting in the Auction House anymore. If I don't want or need those Astral Diamonds the way I did before and I'm not going to change any Zen Points for them; Zen Exchange gets backlogged, lags, AD start flooding the economy. If I do buy Zen I'll just spend it directly in the market.

So my theory is that the lack of sellable/tradable rewards that are popularly wanted is one of the root causes of the "unbalanced" economy. For the "sinks" (like ranking up mounts, refinement points, etc.) - I can earn enough to sustain that need in-game. Perhaps making loot rewards a lot better than they are now and sellable in the Auction House might be more effective in helping balancing the in-game economy than restricting the in-flow of Astral Diamonds? I don't know. It's just theory. In short: bots may be a necessary evil, it's a question of priorities for those managing the economy.

So, after voting perhaps you might explain what your current reasons are for wanting Astral Diamonds and why you're holding on to them, how you;re spending them and why, or why you're not interested in larger sums of them than before.

[Edit: Typos]

litaaers

I have always been a 'vendor' player, from Ultima Online through NWO. I get things, and hoard them, only playing the game periodically, and usually solo. So I desire AD for the potential it has... not for any one thing, but so that, if its available, I *can*, if I want.

Oddly, that doesn't work with Zen for me, as I am a lottery junkie, and will buy keys just to see if I can 'luck out' on a chest (and have, on several occasions).

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killzoneex

I take it you don't upgrade any of your artifacts, gear and enchants?

You currently can't earn enough in game (with the 24K daily limit) to buy enough GMOPS and Coalescent wards to upgrade. We are talking over 8M per enchant just in wards alone.

fantasycharacter

Astral diamonds are needed for character progression. I like to progress my characters. I M not willing to spend the literal thousands of dollars on one character to upgrade it via cash

zacazu

that is my whole (not hole : D) playgame:

since m5 i stoped to do dungeons by some reasons that dont come in the case (maybe i back, maybe not). what i do is, a lot of heroic encounters alone and my daily things when , paralel to that, work my leadership (+/- 80kday thanks to 5 charaters).

what i do using that ad? everthing that i need in the moment. even dye.

over the top, i lost the interest in my others charaters since some reworks in classes and/or game.

if i continue have that amount of ad or some paralel coin just, in general, killing monsters w/o major changes in my purchasing power, iam fine.

angrysprite

killzoneex said:

I take it you don't upgrade any of your artifacts, gear and enchants?

You currently can't earn enough in game (with the 24K daily limit) to buy enough GMOPS and Coalescent wards to upgrade. We are talking over 8M per enchant just in wards alone.

I do upgrade them - and I've been buying GMOPs (or grinding for them in DR since Mod 6) and have about a dozen Coalescent Wards and truckloads of other stuff sitting in account bank, all of which were either loot or Invoke/Professions drops. (Edit: I've never ever once purchased a GMOP in game, but have purchased rank 8 enchantments - to be clear about that). The rank-up process is slow enough that the 24k Refine limit is not an issue. Just don't burn it the moment you get it and it piles up.

And sure, I've purchased some enchantments - but once you're decked out with those, what else is there to buy? The AD keeps growing, especially if you don't spend it as you get it. This is my point. Cryptic is going for attrition - the newest players still leveling up their first characters - this is where the eventual balancing will come from. But even they (the shortcutters) will need to have a strong "want" of AD before they'll spend cash to get it.

Edit to add (in hindsight of submitting this post firstly): Many "legitimate" 'Professons Armies" are alt characters played (not bots and not new characters created for the purpose of leadership-farming). Among the reasons for creating many alts, beyond experiencing other races and classes is the eventual "Invoke/Leadership" farmer you end-up with. Now you can farm Astral Diamonds to use the AH to gear-up those alts with enchantments, gear, etc.

Nevermind the removal of AD from leadership; because all decent gear is BoP you cannot buy it in AH, so that AD just piles up; nothing to spend it on. As for the usual sinks (refining costs, etc) you can earn that AD exactly as the Devs suggest it: by playing the game and grinding for it). Otherwise: If there's nothing to spend it on what should I do with it? Convert it to Zen Points? There's the problem: more backlog. This is also part of my point.

The issue is there is a lot more AD wanting to be sold for Zen than Zen wanting to be made into AD; Zen is where Cryptic makes their money. If AD value is so low (not in terms of buying power, but rather in terms of WANT) - then those with Zen aren;t as interested in buying. Hence, backlog of Zen. Backlog of Zen = no new purchasing of Zen.

This is why they need the economy balanced: They badly need LESS AD in game so that more people will trade Zen for the AD, which creates demand to spend cash to buy Zen to buy AD. get it? But if there's nothing really good to buy with AD, why would the Zen-holders buy the AD?

ashnvf

I do upgrade them - and I've been buying GMOPs (or grinding for them in DR since Mod 6) and have about a dozen Coalescent Wards and truckloads of other stuff sitting in account bank, all of which were either loot or Invoke/Professions drops. (Edit: I've never ever once purchased a GMOP in game, but have purchased rank 8 enchantments - to be clear about that). The rank-up process is slow enough that the 24k Refine limit is not an issue. Just don't burn it the moment you get it and it piles up.

I think you are mistaken. You don't get GMOPs (Greater Marks of Potency) in DR, only a small chance at the other Greater Marks (Union, Power, Stability).

I think I got 1 Coalescent Ward from invocation.

zacazu

marks of potency sometimes drop, yes.

onegaki101

There are plenty of things you can buy on AH. Normal artifacts, artifact gear(neck and belt), refinement points, enchantments, pets, companion gear. Heck, you can also pay for artifact main hand.

So yes, there are already a TON of items which will prompt zen holders to buy AD. So your shortcutters have plenty of reason to convert zen to AD.

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therealairhead

In game sinks. And they just added a crazy big one with Strongholds. Need gmops and coals to 'improve' my character (fixed cost set by Cryptic). OR just buy the rank 10+ stones on AH, which have those gmops and ward costs built into their price. The price of those things are in no way related to the amount of AD in circulation. If it costs 1mill to CREATE a rank-N stone, only an insane person would sell it for less than 1-mill !! It's like hamburgers at the fast-food joint and minimum wage. If labor+materials for creating the burger is X, the CHEAPEST it will ever be is a little more than X. Inflation (devalued currency due to circulation amount) is irrelevant.

And I also challenge (nicely) your idea that you can be competitive by just 'playing the game' and getting your 24k AD per day in a reasonable amount of time. Just do the math on the enchants; you will be 'grinding' repeatable content for a greater amount of time than the item will be desireable (i.e. replaced by a new 'thing' in some future mod). There are tons of posts on this topic, not going to repeat here...

rickcase276

For the multitude of enchants and artifacts that need to be leveled to get anywhere in the game.

suicidalgodot

...actually I don't "want" them - I'm force-fed the need for them. By all three mechanisms you outlined.

Actually, I'd rather have a variety of quests to accomplish to get my gear, ZEN and/or ZEN-Store stuff, and upgrade ingredients.

Being force-fed playing party-/queued-content to get my AD will neither make playing this content more interesting - especially with the very very narrow bandwidth thereof - nor the game more satisfying, not the prices less astronomic, nor will it entice more people to spend $$$ on ZEN. It will IMHO probably only lead to more depopulation.

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angrysprite

ashnvf said:

I do upgrade them - and I've been buying GMOPs (or grinding for them in DR since Mod 6) and have about a dozen Coalescent Wards and truckloads of other stuff sitting in account bank, all of which were either loot or Invoke/Professions drops. (Edit: I've never ever once purchased a GMOP in game, but have purchased rank 8 enchantments - to be clear about that). The rank-up process is slow enough that the 24k Refine limit is not an issue. Just don't burn it the moment you get it and it piles up.

I think you are mistaken. You don't get GMOPs (Greater Marks of Potency) in DR, only a small chance at the other Greater Marks (Union, Power, Stability).

I think I got 1 Coalescent Ward from invocation.

Okay, then it must have been from Invoking bonus or a Leadership bag - I know I never purchased any. Edit to add: and to clarify: I am not a "zerger" - I don;t have BiS gear and could;t care any less. I'm rocking all blues and what not and the first artifact other than the initial free from Blackdagger is the freebie level 70 stuff you get - and I'm only barely refining at leisure. if I could do it faster I would, but not gonna go insane RP-Farming and refuse to pay some of those AH prices.

I know there are zergers, I get it (and probably why the "Sinks" category is highest rated in the poll.

Which brings me back to my theory: Rewards and drops need to be better; rank 8 every now and then or something, more wards, GMOPs more often - even if it's only dungeon chests. I understand some are just giving a Peridot? Are you faking kidding? I know the bonus chest in DR only give that HAMSTER so I never ever bother forging a glove or gauntlet or whatever the hell. Ever. It's a complete waste of effort.

And this is the crux of my primary argument above.

drkbodhi

I spent over 300k AD to get my GWF on a solid footing as soon as hit hit 70... which all came from my main. I know my main will get paid back. I work on them as they are a group of adventurers... the run stuff together. They help each other out when needed.

That AD was burning a hole in the pockets of my main so I used it.

- I have donated some to the SH.
- I do buy stuff on the AH.
- I do use it for collecting the last of my boons.

Until I can put enough ad, or Zen together for some GMOPs and Coals, I will collect AD for putting gear on my CW. My TR main and my GWF will be getting upgrades when I start feeling like spending money again. I lost faith that what they were advertising is what I would be given... so there has been a RL spending freeze on the game.

The only reason I have r7s and 8s is from buying keys for the lockboxes... and occasionally like buying few for my GWF.

BTW... the "gear" I am eluding to... is not armor and jewelry more enchants.​​

rversant

I use my AD for all the sinks. Which there is a HUGE amount of.

icyphish

yes GMOP does drop from DR's chest, I jave gotten 1 in the past 1.5yr gameplay...

darkstarcrash

I have multiple alts that I like to play, and I try to keep most of them "dungeon-ready" -- which to me means at least greater weapon enchantment, lesser Soulforged, epic artifact gear, 4 epic artifacts and rank 8 enchantments, including on their augment companions. Stripping enchantments off characters and mailing them around is a pain, so everybody has at least rank 7s, and my goal is to have everyone in rank 8s by the end of this weekend.

Add in the Cubes of Augmentation for weapons and offhands, and that's a lot of AD. I've gotten a few GMoPs from dungeons, but not nearly enough for one character, much less the 6 I have geared up.

arabatur

My thoughts on this are irrelevant, Cryptic will make this change regardless of any concerns made. We are left with two choices however; either to accept it or move on.

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lirithiel

I recently stockpiled GMoP to upgrade my artifacts during this RP event. I have been saving up my ADs, currently I have about 2 million, but there is nothing I want to spend it on. I'm waiting for Cryptic to adjust their AD sinks before I spend any of my ADs, whether it be on GMoP, Cubes, companions or whatever. As was pointed out, with just about everything being either BoP or BoA there is nothing worthwhile to buy on AH anymore. And I don't even see the point up upgrading enchantments past Rank 8 or Perfect. The cost far outweighs the value to me.

lirithiel

angrysprite said:

Which brings me back to my theory: Rewards and drops need to be better; rank 8 every now and then or something, more wards, GMOPs more often - even if it's only dungeon chests. I understand some are just giving a Peridot? Are you faking kidding? I know the bonus chest in DR only give that HAMSTER so I never ever bother forging a glove or gauntlet or whatever the hell. Ever. It's a complete waste of effort.

I don't even think the Arcane Coffers give Peridots anymore. I get mostly R5's and the odd R6, along with Power, Stability, Union stones. I have gotten 3 GMoP and a few MoP from there since Mod 6 launched. Getting the Adamantite (purple) gauntlet does pay off in the long run though.

cambo1682

To cover the sinks, I spend cash as well, green and blue wards if I need them and don't have enough trade bars, companions if I have my eye on one and a coupon drops, primarily impulse purchases or gambling on lockboxes for something cool and interesting or that may sell for AD to, again cover the sinks. Spending RL cash is my way of supporting the game and also getting what I want. I agree, eliminating BoE drops for sought after gear was a mistake on their part. They basically had free workers farming gear that new people may want. When I first started playing I outfitted my HR with gear purchased through AD bought with zen bought with cash. No opportunity, or very few of those now.

Personally, I'd actually prefer they eliminate the ability to convert AD to Zen but leave the ability to purchase AD with Zen, than totally annihilate Leadership like this. I know that would be hugely unpopular as well, but for me personally, I've never actually converted AD to Zen, the wait time was always too long, or I couldn't be arsed. If I wanted a companion and the price point seemed fair in the cash shop then that was part of supporting the game. All of my AD has gone towards buying stuff to progress my characters...one of each class. I'm probably an anal completist, but I like to get them all to a level that I would be proud to take any of them into a T2. *shrug*

silverkelt

I would agree, I would rather have leadership and remove the ability to purchase zen and get rid of it. Frankly you can still call this game f2p and not have it, they allow you to play all content and techinically advance without spending a dime, without the need of the exchange.

This would be a better solution for many of us, who just buy things and dont use the stupid ad to zen thing to start with.

rickcase276

I only use the ad/zen exchange to transfer ad from one character to the other. So it would be a good idea to just get rid of it.

neveragain

2nd and 3rd option are basically the same

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ogarious

I would have to say for reasons 2 and 3 of the above poll

rollingonit

I use it for all 3. All 3 are primary reasons for me.