With an account limit for refining AD, it wouldn't matter where the rAD would come from, they could just threw in rAD with any daily quest. Even the daily quests from the druid in PE could reward you with rAD, or the quests in the Elemental Evil areas. People have to grind through them to level anyway, so the Devs could at least make it worth it.
There is already an account limit. 25k AD per day per character. Limiting it any more is yet another anti-inducement to creating alts, which means less need for buying/creating enchantments, artifacts, and buying items from the ZEN market once you have everything you need.
An account wide AD cap that is NOT based no the number of alts you have is quite silly. And, by the way, the easiest way around it would be to just create new accounts. Each such account has 2 free character slots. This means no need to buy addition characters slots with Zen.
In addition, bots have an easier time with multiple accounts than players do since they are automated.
Please peeps; think about your proposals before posting them.
You might want to tell that to the one "proposing" to remove AD from Leadership completly.
And the last patches and modules allready made it pretty clear, that they don't want you to have more then one character. They want you to put a lot of money into one character, and do that over and over again with every new module.
Besides, this account wide limit for AD is for those, that are running Leadership farms with 15+ characters on the same account, that should slow those down a bit, and give some breathing room to come up with some reasonable changes to Leadership.
And i'm not talking about removing the character AD limit, but putting an account wide limit for AD into place too.
what difference does it make when you can only refine 24k a day?
So, here's the problem... to make 24k on one character would take numerous dungeon runs, skirmishes, and PvP. It would take a pretty good chunk of time. Now, we have already shown the calculations of how 24k a day takes about 6.33 years of play to BiS a character. So we have multiple characters to compensate, effectively working around the refinement cap. With the new system, we would have to run "numerous dungeon runs, etc. " on multiple characters in order to accumulate enough income to afford upgrades in a reasonable amount of time i.e. - less than 5 years.
This feat of gaming is not possible. No one could run enough dungeons and skirmishes with even 10 characters in one day to get each to 24k cap.
The reality is that people would be forced to seek income through running dungeons/skirmishes/domination back to back all day long, for months... just to upgrade a dozen enchantments. Clearly this eliminates the possibility of having more than one character that can survive endgame content.
We will NOT be able to afford gearing our characters. Not even if we spent a couple thousand dollars. Which I might add, some of us actually have done (I have spent over $4k for sure) in the process of setting up our professions income. (granted most of that money I spent went into upgrading enchants and artifacts... with a few mounts and companions and lock box keys).
The income that we are earning through Leadership is legitimate and accomplished only with some type of investment. Character slots and endless man-at-arms, adventurers and Heroes. Assets which will be rendered worthless with this change (as mentioned earlier in this thread) Adventurers are already being sold for under 100k AD on the AH... people are unloading and planning on leaving... not looking good.
I have been playing for a little over a year. Looking at the game the logical thing to do was focus on leadership and get some extra characters to generate AD so that I can afford enchantments to make my one character competitive. You need lots of AD to get rank 10s (now 12s) to do the content. In a year, I built a leadership army. I have a pile of characters all working to make it possible for my one main character to do the hardest content. I spent money, I spent a year of my free time. All my friends quit after mod 6. I stayed.
I am a level 12 VIP. You make it so I couldn't use the gateway (which I can use on my phone, on my tablet on work breaks,) to do leadership. That cut my AD generation in half but I didn't leave. It takes 3 times as long to do leadership in the game because the game is slow, because updating the character when you first log in is slow. This gives me less time to play because I can't start leadership unless I am at home on my RAM heavy PC at night. But I stayed. Now you have killed AD generation. I have spent millions (maybe 50 million) of AD on leadership assets because that was how to get ahead in the game you designed.
You have stolen from me.
I generated a lot of AD with leadership but I spent real money too. You took my time and changed the rules after I invested. What are the 300 or so blue leadership assets going to be worth now? That's what I built up in a year of playing and you have made it worthless. I never cheated, I never used a bot. But you suckered me in, you introduced the VIP thing, and now made what I have build up worthless. Why would I spend time or money in the game now? If whatever I do will become worthless yet again.
It is for reasons like this that so many players are leaving this game. In todays market there are tons of F2P MMO's out there and to make a move like this will drive players to abandon this game and move on to another. The one thing that will stick in those players mind is, don't EVER bother wasting time playing a game from PWE or Cryptic as they just don't care if they push players away. I've seen over half of my guild (70+ players) leave to go play Guild Wars 2 now that it went F2P and all of them are touting how there isn't any bott issues there. Why? Because they actively go after the bots not what the botts are doing to exploit their game, knowing that to do otherwise would be to hurt their player base. That is what a good MMO is and it should be what the dev's here strive to be like. I've enjoyed playing this game now for the better part of 2 years but i think this is the final straw in a long string of horrid proceidures what i am willing to except.
I just logged on preview, to see the changes. Really? They just removed the ADs from leadership. No shorter tasks bc of the deleted rewards, no extra rewards for the missing ADs. Not just stupid, but disregarding their own announcment. LAZY plain and simple. They delete the main AD influx fom the game while generating AD sinks like stronghold (2.500.000 AD for boon structure rank 1). They promise 'compensations' or 'better ways to earn AD ingame' and 'forget' the compensations and bc math does not seem to be their stong suit, nerf the other ways to earn AD, instead of boosting them.
Slow clap. I am sure, that we will be 'compensated' with another double AD WE or something else insignificant.
I JUST spent $100 REAL MONEY to buy Heroes on the AH not knowing this change was coming. Guess what you just STOLE MY $100. Guess that explains why Heroes are less than 1/2 the going rate.
Last Cryptic/Perfect World game I ever play.
You smack every REAL customer with every change you make.
EXACTLY! This is what ticks me off... I spent lots of MONEY on this and you say you are taking it away to stop bots?? Then give me my money back! No? Then don't change it!!!!
Yep. I was just telling my wife earlier I want my last 9 months of my life back since this was a total waste of my time/money (almost a grand spent since Xmas 2014.) Levelling a alt, unlocking 9 slots, and then getting leadership to 20 on them was a lesson in extreme patience/dedication.... then when they expanded it to 25 omg.... yet I persevered and now this.
I decided to put my time/money towards what I thought made the most sense instead of just buying x item outright. The company provided the slots for $5/2, the assets, the methodology, the choice was provided by THEM for me to make and I thought I picked sensibly.
I do find it interesting that players that DIDNT use leadership have a bad attitude generally towards players that chose to spend $$$ supporting a game they play for free.
This is like the Blizzard removing flying mounts from the game epic fail... that they ended up reversing fairly quickly.
It's really sad because from a "gameplay" perspective I love this game.... this is a sad day. Going to work on my golf swing and hit the weights harder and probably log more ice time playing hockey. Taking LS away pretty much is the nail in the coffin for this game for me.... real life awaits WOOT. Thanks Cryptic.
Most of the names on that list are most likely exploiters anyway. I never did leadership because I made more playing the game then any other way. Case in point I had two toons and made 1.5Mil over weekend with CTA. I now have five. I go as far as seven but no more. My question is this "At what point did playing a Game for fun and excitement IE saving Dorothea, helping the Heroes of Scar company or putting a Dragon down." become about making money? When did you all loose you heart for thrill of putting the evil un-dead to the torch or wiping the floor with a bandits face? Yes I the the wonders bazaar needs a price cut. And that the devs should look at. But Shame on all of you who have turned R.A Salvatore's Masterpiece into what sound like a bunch whiny 10 yr olds who are mad that life stopped for a little chat about your conduct of late. And how SO meany people saw a flaw and TOOK ADVANTAGE OF IT. And now that it has been taken away you make a fuss? Why? You weren't playing the game to begin with? So what gives? What is you all want that needs so much AD?
My 6 alts turned into a Leadership army for 1 reason. I couldn't afford to gear them up. Plain and simple. They can't do high level content. So they turned into Leadership workers to support my one main character. And even then, I only have her up to 2.3k. I can't afford to get anything other than Rank 7s, I can't afford to upgrade my companion, I can't afford orange gear. Everything is blue or purple artifact because GMOPs and Wards are too rare and too expensive.
My alts are pretty useless now and they'll be beyond hopelessly useless after this change. The key to fun in an MMO is variety and being able to move around alts to enjoy a different playing experience. This is especially important in a game like that that has 3 dungeons and 2 skirmishes that we have to play over and over and over and over again.
Dude LVL65 and up gear that the game GIVES you is a huge jump 60-64. And some of the best gear in the game crafted as well. Give it some time. I can hold my own in ISD at lvl68 with the last EE quest gearset. And black ice? well that does not cost AD it cost's black ice. SO you grab your pick and weapon of choice and go get it! Give it time.
Even if he gives it time, he won't EVER see BIS. If you've been reading this forum you've obviously seen the post on the "numbers" needed. I've never met a gamer that is happy waiting 6 years to max a toon out. Oh, and that doesn't even take in to account new additions to the game.
I have a GWF as my main character and that is all I really want to play. I don't bot and I now have 11 characters that do leadership. It is the only way to gear up my main character. Once I hit 2k iLvl on my main, I hit a brick wall. I had all but 2 boons and no gear left to get out of a dungeon or PvP. I was left with upgrading my enchantment to create a better character. Realizing I needed millions of AD to upgrade my enchantments I started the leadership army. So far in my months of running my alts, I have gotten my main from a 2k ilvl to a 2.5k ilvl. Not fast, but I am a grinder as long as I am making progress I am good. Once I can't progress I will be done. Removal of the AD from leadership will look very much to me like all my progress will end so I may be done if this goes into effect.
I am in the same boat with you jchariais01, the EXACT same boat. I used 9 toons at 25 leadership to outfit my GWF ALONE, because it took ALL of that for my GWF, nothing left over for any other toon really. I'm also interested to see how they handle VIP. I bought 12 months because I saw the benefit in it....ie keys, extra ad from chests, extra keys for chests, etc. Under this new AD structure did I just waste that purchase? The keys no longer matter and with the AD cap per day then the extra ad doesn't mean anything either. I really hope someone is looking at this and realizing what they are doing.
Playing Dungeons Old: If you picked up the daily quest, you got 3,000 AD for one dungeon. If you had your chest key, you got an additional 3,000 AD. New: 1. Automatically get 3,000 AD for each of the first two dungeons. 2. In addition, get 150 to 750 AD for each dungeon played (up to a maximum 7,200 AD per day from dungeons). Amount varies by time.
So instead of being able to earn 6000 AD with one dungeon run we'll have to do two. How is this in any way better? Please tell us.
Playing Dungeons Old: If you picked up the daily quest, you got 3,000 AD for one dungeon. If you had your chest key, you got an additional 3,000 AD. New: 1. Automatically get 3,000 AD for each of the first two dungeons. 2. In addition, get 150 to 750 AD for each dungeon played (up to a maximum 7,200 AD per day from dungeons). Amount varies by time.
So instead of being able to earn 6000 AD with one dungeon run we'll have to do two. How is this in any way better? Please tell us.
My favorite thing to do to earn extra AD while via playing is to do the daily dungeon runs. My main can do one run in 8 minutes. My alts are much slower but I can get 5 character done in the 1 hour time limit if I start my first character a few minutes early. So I used to make 30k AD per hour, now that will be cut to 15k. Great, thanks a bunch. Whats left a punch to the junk?
I have half the BI and I have only been playing since july. And if maxing is "I can do now more with this toon" and I need it done now or I cant have fun in the game. Is why they are making changes. My main is at 68 I have half of my BI gear waiting my bank. How you ask? There always a merry mob of adventurers doing HE and raking BI witch in turn will help you fund your way into most of the BI gear from there its epic runs and the drops from them will lead to lots of AD. It takes far less time then you think. And if this is about PVP gear? Then the issue here is how many outfits do I have? The stats on them are almost all same. Pick one that works and go with it. I have another a 65 one at 55, 23 and 5. The 23 was 5 three days ago it's not going to take 6 years. 6 months maybe if you keep up with the special events you can do thats how I got to where I am.
Well I know one group of people that are wild about this change to the game. Game widows the world over are rejoicing this decision as they see their significant others swearing off the game should the powers at be not change their minds and go back to the drawing boards to come up with a better solution to their financial woes that doesn't alienate a large portion of their paying customers.
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vinceent1Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,264Arc User
as mention above. astral diamond represent time. GMOP at wondrous bazarre 100 000 AD represent time in characters developement too. So now when astral diamond are hugely nerfed (gain over time) its necessary lower the cost of things that represent characters development with fixed AD costs. So why any dev dont say " yes, prices of GMOPs will go surely down" already?
Well I know one group of people that are wild about this change to the game. Game widows the world over are rejoicing this decision as they see their significant others swearing off the game should the powers at be not change their minds and go back to the drawing boards to come up with a better solution to their financial woes that doesn't alienate a large portion of their paying customers.
Dude most of the players out there these days are female bro. And they will have a replacement in place soon as well. Just you watch.
I knew spending almost $200 on this game this month was going to be a bad idea I would severely regret and here it is. 12 months of VIP and a load of character slots to work with for leadership and other HAMSTER while jobs are going and now that is going to be useless. I probably won't be around anymore when my vip ends because I won't do the same 3 dungeons 20 times a day for weeks just to buy something small I'll just install and move on.
Well I know one group of people that are wild about this change to the game. Game widows the world over are rejoicing this decision as they see their significant others swearing off the game should the powers at be not change their minds and go back to the drawing boards to come up with a better solution to their financial woes that doesn't alienate a large portion of their paying customers.
Dude most of the players out there these days are female bro. And they will have a replacement in place soon as well. Just you watch.
A game widow can be male or female and significant others can be anyone who is sick of the time we spend in this game. Players can be replaced yes, but the revolving door eventually leads to a thinning of the pool of players who will dedicate themselves enough to the game to actually put money into it. Even for the players rejoicing this as a good decision will likely themselves see things more clearly in time.
I would love for the game to be all about playing and not about the Gateway. Professions are a huge waste of time when I would rather play. BUT, at the same time, I am earning about 23,000 RAD per day via Leadership and I have invested a ton of time to get it there. I don't play PvP and I find Dungeons to be long and boring. Where is my RAD supposed to come from??? I can deal with 2 skirmishes, but that gets me only 3,000 RAD. Unless you bring down the daily RAD to AD rate and bring down the AD cost of most things, I won't be able to afford anything.
I want to do things like HEs around the Stronghold, daily quests in zones, and the like. Why are these not considered to be part of playing the game?
Yes! this is EXACTLY how I play! They said theyd look into solo players as all they did now is look into group play (dungeons, skirmishes, pvp) and I'm still hoping they will look into it soon...
I would love for the game to be all about playing and not about the Gateway. Professions are a huge waste of time when I would rather play. BUT, at the same time, I am earning about 23,000 RAD per day via Leadership and I have invested a ton of time to get it there. I don't play PvP and I find Dungeons to be long and boring. Where is my RAD supposed to come from??? I can deal with 2 skirmishes, but that gets me only 3,000 RAD. Unless you bring down the daily RAD to AD rate and bring down the AD cost of most things, I won't be able to afford anything.
I want to do things like HEs around the Stronghold, daily quests in zones, and the like. Why are these not considered to be part of playing the game?
Yes! this is EXACTLY how I play! They said theyd look into solo players as all they did now is look into group play (dungeons, skirmishes, pvp) and I'm still hoping they will look into it soon...
It might be cynicism talking, but I'm expecting them to look into it in the same way that they looked into DH drop rates. I.e. not at all. If they're releasing this, they should have planned for all types of players out there, be they groups/solos/pvps etc. It's not like this issue with AD production hasn't been there for a long time. They should release their "fix" when it's fit for purpose. Not when it's half finished.
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And the last patches and modules allready made it pretty clear, that they don't want you to have more then one character. They want you to put a lot of money into one character, and do that over and over again with every new module.
Besides, this account wide limit for AD is for those, that are running Leadership farms with 15+ characters on the same account, that should slow those down a bit, and give some breathing room to come up with some reasonable changes to Leadership.
And i'm not talking about removing the character AD limit, but putting an account wide limit for AD into place too.
This feat of gaming is not possible. No one could run enough dungeons and skirmishes with even 10 characters in one day to get each to 24k cap.
The reality is that people would be forced to seek income through running dungeons/skirmishes/domination back to back all day long, for months... just to upgrade a dozen enchantments. Clearly this eliminates the possibility of having more than one character that can survive endgame content.
We will NOT be able to afford gearing our characters. Not even if we spent a couple thousand dollars. Which I might add, some of us actually have done (I have spent over $4k for sure) in the process of setting up our professions income. (granted most of that money I spent went into upgrading enchants and artifacts... with a few mounts and companions and lock box keys).
The income that we are earning through Leadership is legitimate and accomplished only with some type of investment. Character slots and endless man-at-arms, adventurers and Heroes. Assets which will be rendered worthless with this change (as mentioned earlier in this thread) Adventurers are already being sold for under 100k AD on the AH... people are unloading and planning on leaving... not looking good.
I've enjoyed playing this game now for the better part of 2 years but i think this is the final straw in a long string of horrid proceidures what i am willing to except.
Slow clap. I am sure, that we will be 'compensated' with another double AD WE or something else insignificant.
I decided to put my time/money towards what I thought made the most sense instead of just buying x item outright. The company provided the slots for $5/2, the assets, the methodology, the choice was provided by THEM for me to make and I thought I picked sensibly.
I do find it interesting that players that DIDNT use leadership have a bad attitude generally towards players that chose to spend $$$ supporting a game they play for free.
This is like the Blizzard removing flying mounts from the game epic fail... that they ended up reversing fairly quickly.
that needs so much AD?
My alts are pretty useless now and they'll be beyond hopelessly useless after this change. The key to fun in an MMO is variety and being able to move around alts to enjoy a different playing experience. This is especially important in a game like that that has 3 dungeons and 2 skirmishes that we have to play over and over and over and over again.
I.e. not at all.
If they're releasing this, they should have planned for all types of players out there, be they groups/solos/pvps etc.
It's not like this issue with AD production hasn't been there for a long time.
They should release their "fix" when it's fit for purpose. Not when it's half finished.