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So the Genesis system

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Remember that? Haven't heard too much about it. Remember how, when the game was in development, the devs would always talk about it, saying how revolutionary it was? Remember how it was suppose to allow the devs to create a virtually infinite variety of planets, species and missions? Supplying us with content for years. What ever happened to that? I am just playing the same maps with the same species doing the same missions from one corner of the galaxy to another, over and over again.

Seeing how lame the Genesis system turned out I have very low expectations on how well the Foundry will be, despite how much more creative Star Trek fans supposedly are than Cryptic employees.
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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I assume that u've not been on tribble, or played the missions on holodeck that were transfered over from tribble.

    Also the genesis system has never worked at its full potential. Also all the exploration mission your see, thats genesis. Genesis only makes the environments, then an environmental artist goes in an fixes it up a little.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    It was lip service sir I think whatever dev talked about it went to the Peter molyneux school of hyping
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    First, you need to understand what the Genesis system actually is. It is NOT anything that is part of the player-side of the game. It is an internal Dev tool that basically lets them hit "random" and auto-generate a planet for use in a mission(like the way you can hit "random" in the character creator and create a fairly unique looking character or alien). However, that only allows them to create a MAP. To then create an actual MISSION they would still have to write all the dialog, place all the NPCs and buildings, and hook up all the working parts of the mission.

    So the Genesis system does exactly what it is supposed to. The problem is, the Devs did not CONTINUE to update the exploration content after the game was launched. If they had continued to add new scenerios into the mix every update, it wouldnt seem as stale. However, exploration is getting a major revamp soon, so that is pretty much a moot point.

    As far as the Foundry goes, it is simply amazing. I have never used a UGC tool that has as much power and ability. People are building missions that are as good or better than episodes already in game made by the Devs.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Genesis is there and working as intended. It was you guys who put the lofty expectations of it.

    They are revisiting it in the exploration update to actually remove the Genesis system and replace it with something else.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Barihawk wrote: »
    Genesis is there and working as intended. It was you guys who put the lofty expectations of it.

    They are revisiting it in the exploration update to actually remove the Genesis system and replace it with something else.

    Though I've already discussed the differences between "the genesis system" and "exploration" in my previous post, the Devs really did over-sell exploration before launch. Go back and read the pre-launch interviews and you'll see it isnt what they said it would be. Some of us tried to bring this up in beta, but it didnt accomplish anything at the time:

    http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=39071

    You'll see that in my post I did not correctly understand what "the genesis system" was at the time, but you can still see the point I was making about lackluster exploration.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Though I've already discussed the differences between "the genesis system" and "exploration" in my previous post, the Devs really did over-sell exploration before launch. Go back and read the pre-launch interviews and you'll see it isnt what they said it would be. Some of us tried to bring this up in beta, but it didnt accomplish anything at the time:

    http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=39071

    Yeah, I remember reading the Game Informer article making the Genesis system sound like the bomb. There was just going to be miles and miles of content created by this beast and you could explore to your heart's content. Yeah right. You can explore to your heart's content, but that contentness goes away very quickly after a few repeats. They made the genesis system sound like it was just going to automatically create new missions after we had done a certain amount of them.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Ooh! And they also said other things that hinted at you being able to just go on and explore, explore, explore if you charted the right course and of course you had to wonder "if I explored a planet, would it be registered in the system?'

    - ah the days of pre-launch when I was sitting there thinking "wow, this sounds awesome" and "where the hell are they going to find the space to cram all of this in properly!?"
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Summit wrote: »
    I assume that u've not been on tribble, or played the missions on holodeck that were transfered over from tribble.

    Also the genesis system has never worked at its full potential. Also all the exploration mission your see, thats genesis. Genesis only makes the environments, then an environmental artist goes in an fixes it up a little.

    Well, Genesis does make planets, so I'd have to assume that it'd make the environments to go with those planets. To bad the planet self destructed though.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Yeah, they caught me out with the Genesis oversell.

    I honestly believed each of these Exploration maps were being generated from scratch at the point where you zone into the mission. Took me many Borg Third Dynasties to realise how limited the system actually was.

    There's a great discussion on Dynamically Generated Content over on Massively at the moment. Worth a read if this kinda thing appeals.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I for one was massively disappointed. I expected this.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Though I've already discussed the differences between "the genesis system" and "exploration" in my previous post, the Devs really did over-sell exploration before launch. Go back and read the pre-launch interviews and you'll see it isnt what they said it would be. Some of us tried to bring this up in beta, but it didnt accomplish anything at the time:

    http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=39071

    You'll see that in my post I did not correctly understand what "the genesis system" was at the time, but you can still see the point I was making about lackluster exploration.

    Well, to be fair, in Zinc's eyes, the system cut mission development time by a fair margin; IF you didn't mind Scan 5/Kill 5 or quickie patrol missions. The initial implememntation had too issues - each individual map had to be downloaded to the client/repatched if there was a change to it, thus the constant 4GB patched (that WERE 4GB downloads during closed eta through the early launch of the game, and also the fact that many maps had non-linked 'indiviual instance' enemy groups meaning if teh Romulan faction got re-worked; NONE of the Genesis system created content with Romulans would see the enemy group changes - which is why we still see 'one shot' MOBs in Exploration content.

    I applaud the fact they are reworking it so that new content created with it is linked so faction changes or updates will be reflected automatically, and the fact they went to the 'map only gets downloaded/patched if you get an exploration mission and don't have it/have an older version system.

    I suspect there's a lot of 'quick brutre force' code across STO as they had so little time tp develop the game from CBS (something that they agreed to; and we as players have had to live with); but again, I think it speaks well that they're going back and fixing/uypgrading this as they're able to; while still intigrating new game features as well.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    MrJ wrote:
    Remember that? Haven't heard too much about it. Remember how, when the game was in development, the devs would always talk about it, saying how revolutionary it was? Remember how it was suppose to allow the devs to create a virtually infinite variety of planets, species and missions? Supplying us with content for years. What ever happened to that? I am just playing the same maps with the same species doing the same missions from one corner of the galaxy to another, over and over again.

    Seeing how lame the Genesis system turned out I have very low expectations on how well the Foundry will be, despite how much more creative Star Trek fans supposedly are than Cryptic employees.

    Except players have actually used the Foundry and can empirically verify that it's made of awesome.

    The same cannot be said about the Genesis tools.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    HerbieZ wrote: »
    I for one was massively disappointed. I expected this.

    Clicked expecting "I Can't Dance".
    Left happy.

    10/10 will click again.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    This post has been edited to remove content which violates the [URL=" http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=70&a=2"]Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines[/URL] GMMeeko
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    HerbieZ wrote: »
    I for one was massively disappointed. I expected this.

    Oh I'm so gonna have to punch you :p

    (j/k, i lol'd) :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    This picture pretty much summed up my hopes for exploration when I first read all their comments about how it would work. Maybe one day.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    This picture pretty much summed up my hopes for exploration when I first read all their comments about how it would work. Maybe one day.

    So pretty and so hard to do without human input. :o

    I really want to see the Exploration revamp.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Summit wrote: »
    I assume that u've not been on tribble, or played the missions on holodeck that were transfered over from tribble.

    Also the genesis system has never worked at its full potential. Also all the exploration mission your see, thats genesis. Genesis only makes the environments, then an environmental artist goes in an fixes it up a little.

    No I'm not on Tribble, STO is buggy enough, I don't want to play on the even more buggy test server. And have STO take up twice the room on my hard drive than it already does.

    I have however, played the foundry missions that are on holodeck and they are pretty good, better than the average STO mission at least. I understand the devs are working on adding things like branching dialogue options and such, but until then it will just be press "f" and shoot things missions.

    I guess I'm just grumpy because the featured episode is over and I have to go back to having nothing to do in this game. Even though the Featured Episodes only provided about half an hour of content a week.

    I have created a 2nd Star Fleet character but I have pretty much stalled out at Lieutenant level 5. Because there is so little content that a second character has to do the same missions the first guy went through. Now, in a game like World of Warcraft (yeah I went there don't freak out) a different character of a different race and class but of the same faction as the original will have a completely different experience with a different starting location and different quests. Don't give me any of that "But WoW has been out for years so it has more content" BS, this is the way it always has been since their level cap was 60.

    I'm just saying that Genesis was supposed to be this awesome developing tool that was going to give the devs the ability to create an almost endless supply of missions and environments, by drastically reducing the time it took to make stuff. Because as every one knows: "According to myth, the Earth was created in six days. Now, watch out! Here comes Genesis! We'll do it for you in six minutes!"
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    MrJ wrote:
    : "According to myth, the Earth was created in six days. Now, watch out! Here comes Genesis! We'll do it for you in six minutes!"

    Leonard McCoy....Star Trek II "The Wrath of Khan"....what do I win???:D
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