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I like the Cloaked Tractor Mines

SystemSystem Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Hello everyone! I'm just wondering if I'm the only one who likes the new Cloaked Tractor Mines as a reward for the mission this week?

I'm already sending e-mails to my fleet members to remind them to have these ready the next time we make a run on Kitomer Accord! :D

Take that Borg ships!

I was reading other posts from people that they hate the new mines. :eek: :rolleyes:

If cryptic could do something to help PVP WITHOUT affecting STF and other PVE missions, then I'd say go for it. However, that's not how STO works.

When Cryptic Nerf's something, everyone and everything gets hit. So I say leave the mines alone and to all PVPer's "fire at will", "p.h." and "a.p.o" are your best freinds!
Post edited by Unknown User on

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  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    redheadguy wrote:
    Hello everyone! I'm just wondering if I'm the only one who likes the new Cloaked Tractor Mines as a reward for the mission this week?

    I'm already sending e-mails to my fleet members to remind them to have these ready the next time we make a run on Kitomer Accord! :D

    Take that Borg ships!

    I was reading other posts from people that they hate the new mines. :eek: :rolleyes:

    If cryptic could do something to help PVP WITHOUT affecting STF and other PVE missions, then I'd say go for it. However, that's not how STO works.

    When Cryptic Nerf's something, everyone and everything gets hit. So I say leave the mines alone and to all PVPer's "fire at will", "p.h." and "a.p.o" are your best freinds!

    You forgot GW.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    It's not that people hate the mines, they hate the mines being used in PVP.

    Sure they are easy to destroy, but people have to keep in mind that you're usually being attacked at the same time and 1 second can literally be the difference between life and death. Secondly, inspite of counters like Polariized Hull, you have a large window of vulnerability if those abilities are in cooldown.

    BTW, Gravity well's AoE isn't large enough to destroy all the mines, unless you catch them during deployment.



    But yes, Cryptic does need to start making 2 values to seperate PvE and PvP, so changes doesn't ruin it for everyone.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Azurian wrote: »
    It's not that people hate the mines, they hate the mines being used in PVP.

    Sure they are easy to destroy, but people have to keep in mind that you're usually being attacked at the same time and 1 second can literally be the difference between life and death. Secondly, inspite of counters like Polariized Hull, you have a large window of vulnerability if those abilities are in cooldown.

    BTW, Gravity well's AoE isn't large enough to destroy all the mines, unless you catch them during deployment.



    But yes, Cryptic does need to start making 2 values to seperate PvE and PvP, so changes doesn't ruin it for everyone.

    Well yeah, but that's why you'd run Fire At Will and.or Scatter Volley so that you wouldn't have to target them. Also, keep in mind that for every tractor mine deployment, that's one weapon that won't be targeted on you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Isn't Fire At Will getting a nerf where it can only target 2 targets instead of actually FIRING AT WILL?
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Yes.

    /10 char
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I love them! I really hope they don't get nerfed either. People will realize that their DPS will get gimped using these and move on to other things soon enough. They work well with my B'rel build that's made to just add confusion to the battlefield.

    I say add all the confusion you can to the battlefield!!!!! Just as long as both factions get to dish out the same amount of craziness.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Isn't Fire At Will getting a nerf where it can only target 2 targets instead of actually FIRING AT WILL?
    snix wrote: »
    Greetings all,

    Beam: Fire at Will will now attack up to two targets with each beam weapon, the user's current target having priority if within arc while the potential second target being selected randomly within arc. This makes it possible to use FAW as a damage buff against a single target, while gaining additional AoE attacks.

    This compares to Cannon: Scatter Volley which currently attacks up to three targets with each cannon weapon, the user's current target having priority if within arc while the potential second and third targets being selected based on distance from the user within arc. Cannon: Scatter Volley can be used as a damage buff against a single target, while gaining a concentrated AoE around that primary target.

    Comparison summary:

    Beam: Fire at Will attacks up to two targets, but each attack's damage buff is greater. With beams having a wider arc and the secondary target being random, the AoE is less concentrated.

    Cannon: Scatter Volley attacks up to three targets, but each attack's damage buff is smaller. With cannons having a narrow arc and the addtional targets selected based on distance from the user, the AoE is more concentrated and controlled.



    This improvement should reach Tribble at the end of next week.

    -snix

    BFAW is actually getting a substantial buff with the new improvement. Instead of the current mechanic, where each weapon pulse targets a single object within the beam/DBB's firing arc, and each firing cycle gains an additional pulse, the new mechanics work much differently.

    Example:

    Old BFAW:

    6 Beam Weapons - Each Beam weapon, for 15 seconds, gains +1 pulse per firing cycle (5/cycle instead of 4/cycle), each pulse firing at a random target within the firing arc. Each pulse gains a damage buff, plus the inherent damage buff of an additional pulse per cycle. Total weapon pulses per augmented cycle: 5/Beam (30/total in example)

    New BFAW:

    6 Beam Weapons- Definitive mechanics, as yet, unknown... Assumption: same length of buff and cooldown, likely no longer gains the +1 pulse per cycle (if it remains, the potential for the skill being overpowered increases). Each pulse now fires 2 pulses per Beam weapon, with target priority for the first pulse being given to any enemy that you currently have targeted, and the second pulse using an identical mechanic to the current BFAW (randomly attacking any target in the weapon's firing arc). If you have no current target selected, both pulses will utilize the current BFAW mechanics, attacking a random target within the weapon's firing arc. Essentially, this allows you to maintain your current weight of fire against your current target, while gaining an equal (if random) AoE amount of firepower within all of your ship's beam weapons' firing arcs. Total weapon pulses per augmented cycle: 8-10/Beam (depending on whether the power still grants the +1 pulse per cycle) (48-60/total in example)

    Since the new version is not available for testing yet (as far as I am aware), it will remain to be seen how the finalized version of this new BFAW will operate, but based on snix's description, this is, roughly, how the new BFAW will function.

    -Big Red


    Incidentally, the 'light show' from the new BFAW should be vastly more impressive, and closer to the 'canonical' instances of Fire-At-Will being employed in the shows and movies. :D
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    Isn't Fire At Will getting a nerf where it can only target 2 targets instead of actually FIRING AT WILL?

    No. It fires 2 shots - one at your primary target, and one at a random target.

    --

    Instead of nerfing the mines, Cryptic can just disable it on some maps - like PvP Maps. It seems to me they have the tech now to do it, as I could not beam down my Security Escort during Coliseum. (And they also disabled all kit powers, but there could be a difference between "disable all powers" and "disable annoying power only".
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    All I want out of BFAW is something that for 30 seconds will fire 1 shot at random targets within the firing arc. So, say, if I get tractor mined, I use BFAW, and I hit a mine ahead, mine behind, mine ahead, mine behind, mine side, and so on until I break out.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    It's the fact that they are particularly bad for the KDF faction that bothers me. These mines can see through cloaks are lock onto you, imobilsing you and decloaking you at the same time, and given the fact that they are invisible to start with so can't be avoided it constitutes a really big problem when setting up an attack run. Remember KDF ships (and those Fed ships with cloaks) sacrifice certain benefits to have cloaks, such as hull strength.

    Add to all this that the carriers have recently received a massive nerf after numerous complaints from fed PvPrs about the amount of pet spam they have to cycle through when attempting to target, it comes as a massive kick to the face that everyone now has the pet/mine spamming potential of a pre nerf carrier. The PvP map now is cluttered with Scorpion fighters. Invisible mines and numerous support craft pets and soon MVAM pets. Our beloved PvP has become PvEvP.
    Throw in scramble sensors and your imobilzed, decloak and cycling through hundreds of chaff to try and free yourself, all the while your tiny hull strength is being blasted away from under you.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    spartan844 wrote:
    All I want out of BFAW is something that for 30 seconds will fire 1 shot at random targets within the firing arc. So, say, if I get tractor mined, I use BFAW, and I hit a mine ahead, mine behind, mine ahead, mine behind, mine side, and so on until I break out.

    Would you be satisfied if snix offered you two shots (per Beam weapon) which do exactly that? :D

    Which is precisely what the re-vamped BFAW is going to do for you. ;)
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    redheadguy wrote:
    Hello everyone! I'm just wondering if I'm the only one who likes the new Cloaked Tractor Mines as a reward for the mission this week?

    I'm already sending e-mails to my fleet members to remind them to have these ready the next time we make a run on Kitomer Accord! :D

    Take that Borg ships!

    I was reading other posts from people that they hate the new mines. :eek: :rolleyes:

    If cryptic could do something to help PVP WITHOUT affecting STF and other PVE missions, then I'd say go for it. However, that's not how STO works.

    When Cryptic Nerf's something, everyone and everything gets hit. So I say leave the mines alone and to all PVPer's "fire at will", "p.h." and "a.p.o" are your best freinds!

    My girlfriend was doing hilarious things with those in Khitomer earlier tonight, actually. They would probably have made the first section go a lot more smoothly. My own aversion to mines in general kept me from trying them out, but I do have to admit they make a lot of sense for the first chunk of KA. I'd just worry about generating agro from them and getting my own teeth kicked in by an annoyed cube...
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    No. It fires 2 shots - one at your primary target, and one at a random target.

    --

    Instead of nerfing the mines, Cryptic can just disable it on some maps - like PvP Maps. It seems to me they have the tech now to do it, as I could not beam down my Security Escort during Coliseum. (And they also disabled all kit powers, but there could be a difference between "disable all powers" and "disable annoying power only".

    Interestingly Coliseum does not disable Borg Neural Blast, for those 15 players that actually use it... so there's definitely some selective blocking going on.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    No. It fires 2 shots - one at your primary target, and one at a random target.

    --

    Instead of nerfing the mines, Cryptic can just disable it on some maps - like PvP Maps. It seems to me they have the tech now to do it, as I could not beam down my Security Escort during Coliseum. (And they also disabled all kit powers, but there could be a difference between "disable all powers" and "disable annoying power only".
    Interestingly Coliseum does not disable Borg Neural Blast, for those 15 players that actually use it... so there's definitely some selective blocking going on.

    I can confirm that Leg Sweep and Lunge from the tactical kits worked as well, including during the 'dampening' area.
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    It's not a pbs in PVP.
    Don't touch mines :cool:
  • Archived PostArchived Post Member Posts: 2,264,498 Arc User
    edited March 2011
    I have used "mine" a few times and found they are quite useful in the right situation, like a fighter it makes the opponent instanly have multiple targets it HAS to take out or get snared, you can usually take a hit from standard mines and keep going but being stalled and motionless is a killer.
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