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Enterprise-J The Death Of Reason
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Member, NoReporting Posts: 178,019 Arc User
Edit: Since the Enterprise J has been scraped this thread is no longer useful.
So I was a little late on reading the newest engineering report. Tonight when I got to it I saw a lot of things upcoming to be excited about. Also a bit bummed to see they are a bit far off because the current focus is on bug fixes. Yes I know we need the bug fixes there's just some cool additions in the works I wish were here now. Anyway I'm reading along thinking to myself how neat all this stuff is, and then I'm almost floored. No it can't be. They wouldn't, it's gotta be a typo. A bunch of new ships in the works, all sound great, then I see it, Enterprise J.
Come on, really? I think every ship we've ever seen in Star Trek should make it into this game at some point, with the Universe class being the only exception. Aside from it being ugly as sin, the ship is two miles long, so big it has site to site transport instead of turbo lifts. There is no way this think could work as a player ship. It's just a bad idea all around.
I know a lot of people take issue with the time line. Saying things like we shouldn't have connies cause they are to old, and it's not right to be mixing designs from all the shows. I could rattle off a bunch of plausible reasons why the older ships could still be in use. Not the Enterprise J though, even in the show it was a bad idea, in the game this thing would be a disaster. If they make it the right size how many weapon slots do you think the thing would have? 50? 100? Maybe more. There is no danger for a ship that size in this game. Balance would be gone. The only option would be to make it around the size of a T5 cruiser. So that leaves us with a model that is both very very wrong, and is just a train wreck to look at.
There is no place in this game for the enterprise J, and I urge you all to let cryptic know how you feel about this
So I was a little late on reading the newest engineering report. Tonight when I got to it I saw a lot of things upcoming to be excited about. Also a bit bummed to see they are a bit far off because the current focus is on bug fixes. Yes I know we need the bug fixes there's just some cool additions in the works I wish were here now. Anyway I'm reading along thinking to myself how neat all this stuff is, and then I'm almost floored. No it can't be. They wouldn't, it's gotta be a typo. A bunch of new ships in the works, all sound great, then I see it, Enterprise J.
Come on, really? I think every ship we've ever seen in Star Trek should make it into this game at some point, with the Universe class being the only exception. Aside from it being ugly as sin, the ship is two miles long, so big it has site to site transport instead of turbo lifts. There is no way this think could work as a player ship. It's just a bad idea all around.
I know a lot of people take issue with the time line. Saying things like we shouldn't have connies cause they are to old, and it's not right to be mixing designs from all the shows. I could rattle off a bunch of plausible reasons why the older ships could still be in use. Not the Enterprise J though, even in the show it was a bad idea, in the game this thing would be a disaster. If they make it the right size how many weapon slots do you think the thing would have? 50? 100? Maybe more. There is no danger for a ship that size in this game. Balance would be gone. The only option would be to make it around the size of a T5 cruiser. So that leaves us with a model that is both very very wrong, and is just a train wreck to look at.
There is no place in this game for the enterprise J, and I urge you all to let cryptic know how you feel about this
Post edited by Unknown User on
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Now it's not just me who doesn't like the way this thing looks, if you look at the results of the ship poll cryptic took out a few months back, the J is at the bottom.
If they don't make it the right size there is no reason to make it. I wouldn't be to upset at if they took that ugly model and made it the size of a star cruiser, it would just be one more silly looking design that I won't buy from the C-Store.
My fear is that when they say they are working on the Enterprise-J that they mean they are working on the Enterprise-J, not some knock off shrunk down version. You may disagree with every thing I have to say on the matter, but Cryptic states over and over that they want to hear what we think about what they are doing. That makes this a valid thread and feed back could stop them from moving on with this bad idea. It has happened before. And I believe there are enough people who do not want to see this monstrosity in the game that it can happen again. Plus they are going to try and sell this thing in the C-Store that alone means they are going to listen close on feedback before so they don't waste time on something no body wants to pay for.
I feel VA's 'should' get a bigger better ship. I have 'toyed' with what has been released since I got my Star Cruiser in March and well I am back to my Nomad Star Cruiser and yes I know VA's are T-5
If the J takes a half a sector to get up to speed and/or to turn around so be it.
The J is almost two (2) miles long and when it is released it should be to scale for what it is. :cool:
VA's need a new ship - new rank (RA to VA) new bigger better ship.
Look at the D' deridex-class or better yet look at the Kazon-Ogla warship :eek:
Could be the dev's are going to make the J one of the T-6 ships for FA's ?? who knows, I sure see a lot of folks reading 'in to' what little info we get from the dev's and well - truth is
'We Don't Know'
You could park your star cruiser inside like it was a shuttle craft.
Also there is nothing to "read into" here, it's a simple post, with a list of new ships, and the J is one of them.
I do disagree. The people who complain about the J don't represent enough of the userbase to prevent it. They're certainly the most vocal, but keep in mind that not even the whole userbase uses the forums, so even if a large percent of forum-users didn't want it it still wouldn't be enough. Also simply because it didn't do well in the poll doesn't mean everyone hates it, it just means people wanted the Excelsior and Nebula more. Scaling it down doesn't mean there's 'no reason to make it', it just means it'll fit in better among the other ships and won't be massively overpowered. It was never actually stated to be two miles long in canon either, only in the designers blogs, so there's room for creative freedom on Cryptic's part.
The Universe Class imho, would make a fantastic reward ship for those in the diplomatic Corps. For example those who hit Ambassador could acquire this ship - that way it will, for the most part, stay out of PvP or Episode maps as its purpose would be to mainly explore the Universe.
A ship from a series despite its place in canon timeline, not so much. It's still duranium, not silicon.
How did you know all my BOs had fake knockers?
See I'm not upset by people who want this thing in the game. I just don't want them breaking the game over some ship we only saw a blur shot of for a second on screen. If they were to put this thing in the game scaled down to the size of a star cruiser I don't have a problem with it I just think it's ugly and I won't be buying it.
Also I think it's far more out of place then an Excelsior, there is no reason to believe they would give up on a working hull design just because it is old, and no reason to think originals wouldn't still be in service. The T5 Excelsior is the refit from DS9. That's already pretty old there. The US airforce has 60 year old bombers still running missions, I would think in 400 years we could get a really long life span out of a star ship.
The Enterprise J on the other hand would be skipping over 4 flag ships for no reason. And the only excuse to put it in the game is because there is a quick screen shot of the thing. By that logic they should add the millenium falcon since ILM snuck one into the battle scene at the begining of First Contact.
Well I think that remains to be seen.
Also considering where the enterprise J is from and how poorly ENT did, I would think there are more people playing the game who don't even know what the enterprise J is in the first place.
It looks better than the Jupiter. I am all for replacing the Jupiter with the Universe class.
Adding the Enterprise J is not the death of reason. I would like to argue the death of reason would be to ignore player wishes, but of course, that's impossible in STO. Player unfortunately have opposing wishes.
LOL- I actually thing the big TRIBBLE on a shelf for all to see is canon - at least all the shows and movies seemed fit on displaying them so, which is backed up by at least one actress from the show I talked to at a convention years ago.
I have to say Cryptic seem to have a habit for adding "X of the week" TRIBBLE to the game, I'd rather take one of their ugly designs that will atleast be of a decent size then the Enterprise J, In fact I'd rather stick forks in my eyes then see that outside ESD in every angle I rotate my camera
I cringe every time a Galaxy X passes by so just because you hate this ship means that you are too late to be arguing about it. If you want to stop the Enterprise-J from being created, then go back in time and stop the Galaxy-X. After alll, most argues that work for or against the Galaxy-X also work for the Enterprise-J
I don't really care.
There is a lot here in this game which I find unreasonable which die-hard trekkers will -not- part with.
I myself will not use the J, think its ugly
But, do I really care about it being 'immersion' ruining for a minority that seem to be ignoring half of what they wear/do/etc which breaks it moreso?
No, not really. Let those who wanna use it, use it. Like maximum sized TRIBBLE, liberated borg by the million, Mirror Universe bridge officer uniforms, Starfleet personnel running around with alien weaponry, the fact that any of -you- take the rank of yours 'Admiral' seriously, Undine, Borg, Klingon and Romulan war (not just invasions) all at once, Risa that doesn't look like Risa, alien weaponry on federation starships, and the list goes on...and on...and on.
Borg Tribble.
Infact, drop all your tribbles, the fact officers are breeding them at all is more of a break from trekality than even if an Imperial Star Destroyer was added as a c-store option.
Drop one, or all the above, + others...Then one can complain about one ship addition that breaks logic.
It's the fact that a ship that big and advanced will either be inaccurately portrayed in game (a Tier 5 cruiser skin with regular interiors) and be a waste of time, or will do everything it's supposed to (including the city-like interior with site-to-site transporters instead of turbolifts), and completely unbalance the game, especially for anyone wishing to use any other ship in PvP.
Seriously - on the scale front, the interior would have to be a map to rival DS9, at the very least, to even begin to represent the nature of the ship. How much content would we be missing out on if the level designers spent their time on it instead of regular location maps and the like?!? Seems like a waste of manpower and resources on Cryptic's part, IMO.
Let's not start on how the Klingon players will lose out (again!), seeing as there's no alternative for them.
Well aside from being overpriced and under powered I see nothing wrong with the GalaxyX. In the alt time line it was a refit. Just because the enterprise d didn't survive that long doesn't mean they wouldn't still make that refit of the galaxy class
Say what? The J came in third.
Poll results here
The J has 1875 votes. Third behind the Excelsior and the Nebula. And ahead of The Oberth, NX and Ambassador.
Size was only a suggestion from the artist. It's never been shown what its actual size is.
I don't think it's so much about breaking logic as it is breaking the game. This ship will either be over powered game changer. Or just a useless skin. If its a skin great I won't buy it.
As I said in my previous post, there is no canon to state how big the Enterprise-J really is. ST: Enterprise never stated how big the ship was and that is the only info about the ship that counts. The designer of the ship mentioning various info about the abilities of the ship doesn't count. If you have a problem with the ship besides it being overpowered or too big, then you have a valid point, but don't use faulty info to justify your dislike for it. Just laugh at people that waste money on a bunch of ugly pixels or shake your head.
Thats a big difference from when I placed my vote. I could sworn that thing was at the bottom. I don't understand what people see in the thing. Following that link just gave me a sinking feeling, if that many people voted for the J then there's enough people out there that want it. So be it if thats the case.
I just don't understand why people go by what the designers said for every other ship in the shows, but are willing to ignore this one.
That's a good point too, no one is going to be happy with the end result because of the murky history.
So it's just set up for another crying session.