It's not so much an argument. I find the "only 1-2 more story arc ideas left for STO" statement rather hard to believe as well. It's just my personal belief so I wouldn't read anything into it. No idea what four channel is, I just play STO
I don't really see whats so hard to believe about it. Look at Enterprise for example. Enterprise's 97 episodes make up 12% of the total Star Trek episodes that have aired. Of those 97 episodes...
A good 30 are about the Temporal Cold War/Xindi Conflict, a story STO has covered extensively.
Another 18 are either part of the storyline involving Humanity dealing with early contact with the Vulcans, Andorians, and Tellarites, which led to the founding of the Federation, or the augment crisis storyline which led to Soong switching to robotics work, and some of the Klingons losing their ridges. Both of those stories are resolved within the Trek universe as is, via the later shows.
The remaining episodes are almost all really basic things like "here is some early Nausicaan pirate interactions", "here is the ENT crew meeting the Axanar", "here is the ENT crew finding Risa", "here is the ENT crew seeing holograms for the first time", "here is an Orion slave girls try to manipulate people" episode, "here is them meeting the inventor of Earth's transporter", "here is Trip accidentally getting pregnant by an alien", "here is first non visual contact with the Romulans". Things that are all completely resolved within the episodes in question. And in many cases like Axanar, Tera Nova, Risa, etc we know those planets outright join the Federation by TOS's time. And the other races like the Xyrillians, and the Kantare, have almost certainly done so themselves. The rare, truly mysterious, alien episodes ENT had, like the Elachi, have been done in STO as well.
Moving chronologically forward into DSC S1/2, another 29 episodes(3.6%)
S1 was about the Klingon War, and the Mirror Universe. Both of which STO has covered.
S2 was about the Control crisis. While Control is dead, Cryptic managed to squeeze an artificial recreation in during the Measure of Morality missions. Other scenarios from DSC S2 like jumping into the Mycelial Realm, the capture of the Red Angel, going to Boreth to get time crystals, and a big final battle alongside L'rell, were all integrated into the modern era DSC content in STO via the Klingon Civil War stuff.
Even looking at TOS/TAS, another 102 episodes(12.7%) From TNG, DS9, and VOY we know the fact of a lot of the TOS species/planets/episodes.
The Kelvans(By Any Other Name) and Fabrini(For the World is Hollow) started new colonies/cities which are now destinations on the Federation transport network, and Worf mentions getting into a fight with a Kelvan in DS9. The same is true of places like Eminiar and Vendikar(A Taste of Armageddon), M-113(The Man Trap), Beta III(Return of the Archons), Organia(Errand of Mercy), Pollux IV(Who Mourns for Adonais?), Triskelion(Gamesters of Triskelion), Elas and Troyius(Elaan of Troyius), Platonius(Plato's Stepchildren), among others.
Worlds like Earth-2(Miri), Neural(A Private Little War) , and Capella(Friday's Child), were made into Federation protectorates
The technologies from many of the places visited, but that don't necessarily have a narrative to build off of, like the Android duplicator(What Are Little Girls Made Of?), Nomad(The Changeling), Methuselan drones(Requiem for Methuselah), have become items we can use in-game.
Not to mention the episodes STO has done direct narrative sequels to like The Galileo Seven, Arena, The City on the Edge of Forever, The Devil in the Dark, Operation -- Annihilate!, The Doomsday Machine, Journey to Babel, The Paradise Syndrome, The Tholian Web, The Savage Curtain.
Out of the nearly 30% of all Trek episodes those shows cover there is like... maybe 4-5 things that are honestly unresolved plot threads, or big enough moments I could see Cryptic do for a STO mission.
What happened to the Automated Repair Station from the ENT episode "Dead Stop"
Ba'ul/Kelpian reunification/admission into the Federation, that we know happens around STO's era for some DSC content
And from TOS maybe episodes involving the Talosians, and the Iotans from the Gangster planet.
But all of those are one off/two-parter ala Measure of Morality type things, not a full arc. The only thing I could see being a full arc level deal from these shows is if the bulk of the Kelvan armada arrives from Andromeda to try to take over the Milky way.
VOY and TNG aren't any better in this regard either. DS9 is the worst of them all in regards to this due to how narrative based the whole show was. The post Dominion War galaxy, the Ferengi changing their ways, the Mirror Universe rebelling and reforming the Terran Empire, the Prophets and Pah-Wraiths interfering in mortal affairs. All the big story arcs DS9 had STO has done pretty extensively. Only things left to wrap up there is the Leeta/Pah-Wraith plot... which was what the original post ViL story arc was originally going to be according to what Al Rivera has said a few times. And that's most of DS9's episodes covered right there. Besides some holodeck adventures with Vic Fontane or something.
please stop with your OFF TOPIC comments.
this thread is about 1 thing and only 1 thing: a civilian faction in this game.
it is NOT about the TV shows and all of the stuff you just said.
@rattler2 already asked you to stop your OFF TOPIC commenting in the other thread.
why do you have no respect for the forum mods?
OFF TOPIC comment is against the FORUM RULES.
please stop BREAKING the forum rules with your OFF TOPIC commenting.
A Civilian / Independent faction could be used flesh out some of the little story elements of STO that can not be done from a Star Fleet, Klingon, or Romulan perspective. During the Ionian War & the Hurq invasion the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans where to busy protecting them selves that the Ferengi and other smaller space faring races had to protect them self’s. The Ferengi more the likely hired anyone with a phaser, and teamed up with other smaller factions (independent ship’s could have helped them). The missions that involved finding Taris could be done from a bounty hunter perspective too. They could even do a few missions where as a civilian / independent you answer a distress call from a planet or ship of a small faction or have you stumble into and get caught in between any of the larger conflicts of the larger factions. The possibility’s are only limited by the imagination.
A Civilian / Independent faction could be used flesh out some of the little story elements of STO that can not be done from a Star Fleet, Klingon, or Romulan perspective. During the Ionian War & the Hurq invasion the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans where to busy protecting them selves that the Ferengi and other smaller space faring races had to protect them self’s. The Ferengi more the likely hired anyone with a phaser, and teamed up with other smaller factions (independent ship’s could have helped them). The missions that involved finding Taris could be done from a bounty hunter perspective too. They could even do a few missions where as a civilian / independent you answer a distress call from a planet or ship of a small faction or have you stumble into and get caught in between any of the larger conflicts of the larger factions. The possibility’s are only limited by the imagination.
most of the hired mercenaries are already on Qo'noS, however non fed aligned Ferengi working with the Orion Syndicate could be an interesting faction, just don't tell the Nausicaans about this deal, they might want a cut.
As mentioned by others, one's own head canon view of their character is entirely optional. However within the narrative frame of STO an additional faction seems problematic as hell to me?
Now, I would very much enjoy seeing the devs flesh out each of the factions that they do have by adding new featured story content in events that they can fit into the games meta. Frankly pushing the story content that was seems to have been eclipsed by the grand opportunity to entwine anything and everything that is part of CBS All Access (or I suppose now Paramount+) Trek series.
But Discovery is now set further than our own 2411 time frame and that leaves an awful lot of wiggle room for following up on story threads that had served this game for its decade plus existence. Let's do try and get back to some of that too, shall we?
Pushing the story content that was wasn't eclipsed by the new shows.
Cryptic themselves have stated that, before the new shows started coming out to give them more to work with, they only had like 1-2 more story arc ideas left for STO. There just wasn't much left for them to do. We had gone to all four quadrants, interacted with pretty much every major power in Trek canon, and picked up plot threads/tech from countless one off episodes.
I recently went through the list of species in Trek over on Memory Alpha, and there was like one I thought would actually make for a good story arc antagonist. That being the Kelvans from Andromeda. There's a few more aliens I would like ot see in STO like the Sheliak, Ba'ul, Kelpians, Devore, Swarm, Viidians, but all of those would be one off stories, or like how the Malon/Kazon were in Delta Rising, and not the main focus of the story.
We can never know whether the devs might have found their muse again while working on the few ideas they claimed at that time?
As for other suggestions, just pick almost anyone from this forum that is a Trek fan and you will never run out of potential story ideas. Now, for me I would be interested in experiencing a crisis involving Balok's First Federation needing some multi-faction help over in their corner of the Alpha Quadrant?
Just a question; Who exactly are you to judge other people's ideas with such arrogance?
A person who, like any other person, has the right to judge the value, and quality, of anything put before me. And who has likewise been involved in numerous discussions on plots, across multiple franchises, and seen how nearly every fan idea gets shot down, even by other fans of the series, for not making sense/violating some aspect of the canon.
Fandom is, by its very nature, inherently illogical, and irrational. It involves putting undue importance on something that fundamentally not important, like a fictional universe from a TV/Movie/Book/Game series. In the process of doing so you end up warping the actual substance of the universe into something it isn't, and becoming attached to that made up version rather then the one that actually exists. We can see this happen in Star Trek very easy
The Connie is 947 feet long! Despite how often this was touted, and used in many third party works, this figure never actually appeared in any piece of canon up until S2 of DSC.
The Klingons and Romulans had an alliance in the TOS era, that's how they got each other's tech! Actually Spock only mentions in TOS that Starfleet intelligence reports Romulans using Klingon ships. No mention of an alliance, or how they got the ships, was ever made in canon
Klingons are an honorable race of warriors who don't do bad things! Actually, the entire concept of Klingon honor was invented to serve as a juxtaposition for how completely dishonorable their actions actually were, and served as a major plot point not only in TNG, but also in DS9.
This in turn warps any potential narrative ideas these people come up with.
In regards to the new shows, there was a certain segment of the fanbase pushing for Soji to be the Borg Queen
Looking at the Star Trek novelverse on the other hand, they did a story about a Borg invasion(Destiny) that had the Borg going around blowing up planets, not assimilating the species they came across, changing their motto to show clear pleasure in killing. This story also involved a convoluted time travel plot that had humanity become the first Borg 1,000 years ago(due to the actions of another species) and had that species in the present essentially snap their fingers to undo the entirety of the Borg hive mind, use their super tech to restore all the Borg drone's appearances, then they, and the former Borg drones, just vanished off into the night never to be seen again.
And in both instances large amounts of people pointed out how neither of these things makes any sense in Trek lore.
There is a reason why the term "fan fiction" is almost always used as a negative. Because fan ideas, and fan stories, aren't good, and typically just involve people splerging about their favorite things in ways that don't make sense. Hell, Star Trek fan fiction literally created Mary Sue, a character now synonymous with bad writing tropes.
This is also why I tend not to give out many narrative suggestions myself. Since I am aware I am just as likely to fall into this trap as anyone else. Those I do tend to be smaller things, and are based directly on what we know from canon, and don't involve any "mysterious threats kept hidden by X" or anything of that nature.
please stop with your OFF TOPIC comments.
this thread is about 1 thing and only 1 thing: a civilian faction in this game.
it is NOT about the TV shows and all of the stuff you just said.
@rattler2 already asked you to stop your OFF TOPIC commenting in the other thread.
why do you have no respect for the forum mods?
OFF TOPIC comment is against the FORUM RULES.
please stop BREAKING the forum rules with your OFF TOPIC commenting.
Even when I go OFF TOPIC, I make sure to steer it back to the original topic, like for a civilian faction why not go Lukari, every thing pre future proof can be done in the form of time travel, you accidentally get sent back in time in the tutorial set after the Klingon civil war or after the gamma arc and and do the mission as form of predestination paradox or in other words the boot strap paradox, everything you do doesn't affect the timeline because you already affected it.
Just a question; Who exactly are you to judge other people's ideas with such arrogance?
blabla
.
I wanted to respond to your your blabla, but like i don't want to be unpolite or rude, i wouldn't do it. Because being silent is also a proof of intelligence
back to topic: I would like a mini-faction of smugglers, bounty hunters (kdf and romulan sides). Already asked a long time ago, though. the drozana station or one of the old stations removed from the game could be their base.
A couple of things: 1) It's highly unlikely there will ever be a full new faction with it's own story and introduction in the game. With the size of the team and the time it takes to make things, taking on extra missions would just mean less time to continue the main story. 2) Please do not tag mods relentlessly because you don't like how a discussion is going. If you feel you must tag a moderator for action, or me, tag us once. Repeatedly doing it won't get us to do what you want any faster. Or at all. 3) The comment that we were going to be "out of ideas" post Discovery was Geko's way of emphasizing how awesome it's been for us to get an injection of new story hooks and ideas in this amazing new era of tons of new Trek. We've never really been close to being out of ideas: Geko tends to speak in hyperbole that then gets taken as fact and is blown out of proportion. We just did a whole year of original, STO story and we have a few more ready to go.
A really unhappy person whose only pleasure is tearing other people down.
I'm very happy thank you.
Being upset with how poorly the gaming community acts is not the sole determination of my mood. And pointing out the flaws in people's suggestions isn't tearing people down. Its having honest, constrictive, debate. If I was trying to tear people down I would be making a lot more attacks against their person, their families, their emotional states, or something like that. Rather then attacking their argument.
Though I do find it somewhat sad that some people seem to think that anything other then total, unflinching, agreement is tearing people down.
I wanted to respond to your your blabla, but like i don't want to be unpolite or rude, i wouldn't do it. Because being silent is also a proof of intelligence
What is impolite and rude is responding to a person's comment by going blabla, and then saying you don't want to respond to it. If you actually didn't want to respond to it you simply wouldn't have, instead of doing so, but then actually avoiding debating their points by hand waving it away. As is you are just being dishonest, which is as impolite and rude as you can get.
please stop breaking the forum rules by posting off topic.
nothing you just said is about the topic of the thread.
you are breaking the forum rules by posting off topic.
I'm not necessarily a big fan of a civilian faction. But it could have some added value, although I also see other ways how it could add that value.
First why I'm not a big fan:
As mentioned on the first page, most of the stuff we do in the game aren't really things done by civilians - although participation in the Iconian war could help to make that conflict seem even more dramatic.
Moreover, a civilian faction would need to have its ship access restricted to event ships like the Risa ones and maybe some freighter stuff and possibly new designs. Otherwise you'd just end up being like a Federation captain, if you're flying a shiny legendary Galaxy class cruiser.
So, to really keep it a civilian faction, you'd either have to severly limit its attractiveness by limiting the options - or heavily invest in making new ones.
Secondly, the added value:
We never saw much of civilian life in the Federation. Sure, Sisko's dad had his restaurant, Picard's family had their vineyard and we saw some colonies. But we never really got to explore or follow a civilian community, with all its economic, political and social events. Usually it was either more of a case study (with the planet of hats trope) or some simple statement, like Picard discussing money in First Contact. In-depth exploration of social dynamics, of what it means for ordinary people to be a spacefaring civilisation or a part thereof, never played much of a role. This is, btw, one of the reasons why I think The Expanse is so great: there's much more attention for civil society in that series.
Which brings me to my third point: ways to add that value of having more attention for civil society:
Instead of adding a civilian faction, allow players of the existing factions to perform other roles by adding more content, uniforms, biography options, locations and maps and so on.
Instead of every Federation character being a Starfleet officer and every Klingon being a warrior in the KDF, we could have factions within factions. You could be a trader in a city on Regulus, a researcher on a newly added Academy affiliate on Bolarus or a technician at Jupiter Station. All with NPC's with background stories - perhaps they could even be written in some sort of contest by players, as has been done before with some post-Iconian war lore.
It wouldn't be a new faction, but expanding the game like that could allow for doing more civilian stuff, expanding the Trek universe, adding new assets for all other players and so on.
[4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother
I'm not necessarily a big fan of a civilian faction. But it could have some added value, although I also see other ways how it could add that value.
First why I'm not a big fan:
As mentioned on the first page, most of the stuff we do in the game aren't really things done by civilians - although participation in the Iconian war could help to make that conflict seem even more dramatic.
Moreover, a civilian faction would need to have its ship access restricted to event ships like the Risa ones and maybe some freighter stuff and possibly new designs. Otherwise you'd just end up being like a Federation captain, if you're flying a shiny legendary Galaxy class cruiser.
So, to really keep it a civilian faction, you'd either have to severly limit its attractiveness by limiting the options - or heavily invest in making new ones.
Secondly, the added value:
We never saw much of civilian life in the Federation. Sure, Sisko's dad had his restaurant, Picard's family had their vineyard and we saw some colonies. But we never really got to explore or follow a civilian community, with all its economic, political and social events. Usually it was either more of a case study (with the planet of hats trope) or some simple statement, like Picard discussing money in First Contact. In-depth exploration of social dynamics, of what it means for ordinary people to be a spacefaring civilisation or a part thereof, never played much of a role. This is, btw, one of the reasons why I think The Expanse is so great: there's much more attention for civil society in that series.
Which brings me to my third point: ways to add that value of having more attention for civil society:
Instead of adding a civilian faction, allow players of the existing factions to perform other roles by adding more content, uniforms, biography options, locations and maps and so on.
Instead of every Federation character being a Starfleet officer and every Klingon being a warrior in the KDF, we could have factions within factions. You could be a trader in a city on Regulus, a researcher on a newly added Academy affiliate on Bolarus or a technician at Jupiter Station. All with NPC's with background stories - perhaps they could even be written in some sort of contest by players, as has been done before with some post-Iconian war lore.
It wouldn't be a new faction, but expanding the game like that could allow for doing more civilian stuff, expanding the Trek universe, adding new assets for all other players and so on.
wasn't the Maquis a bunch of Federation Civilians who became Terrorists due to how unhappy they were with the UFP?
I'm not necessarily a big fan of a civilian faction. But it could have some added value, although I also see other ways how it could add that value.
First why I'm not a big fan:
As mentioned on the first page, most of the stuff we do in the game aren't really things done by civilians - although participation in the Iconian war could help to make that conflict seem even more dramatic.
Moreover, a civilian faction would need to have its ship access restricted to event ships like the Risa ones and maybe some freighter stuff and possibly new designs. Otherwise you'd just end up being like a Federation captain, if you're flying a shiny legendary Galaxy class cruiser.
So, to really keep it a civilian faction, you'd either have to severly limit its attractiveness by limiting the options - or heavily invest in making new ones.
Secondly, the added value:
We never saw much of civilian life in the Federation. Sure, Sisko's dad had his restaurant, Picard's family had their vineyard and we saw some colonies. But we never really got to explore or follow a civilian community, with all its economic, political and social events. Usually it was either more of a case study (with the planet of hats trope) or some simple statement, like Picard discussing money in First Contact. In-depth exploration of social dynamics, of what it means for ordinary people to be a spacefaring civilisation or a part thereof, never played much of a role. This is, btw, one of the reasons why I think The Expanse is so great: there's much more attention for civil society in that series.
Which brings me to my third point: ways to add that value of having more attention for civil society:
Instead of adding a civilian faction, allow players of the existing factions to perform other roles by adding more content, uniforms, biography options, locations and maps and so on.
Instead of every Federation character being a Starfleet officer and every Klingon being a warrior in the KDF, we could have factions within factions. You could be a trader in a city on Regulus, a researcher on a newly added Academy affiliate on Bolarus or a technician at Jupiter Station. All with NPC's with background stories - perhaps they could even be written in some sort of contest by players, as has been done before with some post-Iconian war lore.
It wouldn't be a new faction, but expanding the game like that could allow for doing more civilian stuff, expanding the Trek universe, adding new assets for all other players and so on.
wasn't the Maquis a bunch of Federation Civilians who became Terrorists due to how unhappy they were with the UFP?
Yes, but like most other examples of civilians in Trek, they weren't really a society with all its dynamics. They were just a rebel group and therefore we only really saw their political and military actions towards outsiders.
And although they were one of the better examples of a well written villain, a military conflict alone isn't really sufficient for making a well-defined society. At least not in the limited time they were in existence - it worked with the Klingons for example, because they existed much longer.
Not to mention that we mostly got to know the Maquis through some notable individuals - again while they were interacting with Starfleet.
And quite a number of those individual Maquis didn't really seem to fight for a cause or believe in any coherent ideology - many of them were just outcasts, having either failed at life (or at least life until then) or suffering from severe psycho-social problems. Torres and Paris were examples of the former, Lon Suder was an example of the latter.
[4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother
While you could have privateers or frontier resistance fighters that get caught up in the events in the game threads easily enough (I have a number of them as character backgrounds already for instance, being an altaholic), they would inevitably end up as de facto recruits and if they are successful and honorable enough would probably be offered an official commission the way it sometimes happened in the Victorian sailing ship times that Star Trek was inspired by.
Really, the only factions where that induction of civilians as semi-independent units is not already commonplace are the Federation because of their preferred self image as rational, peaceful, and self-sufficient, and the Dominion because the Founders don't trust all the people they tricked or conquered with any serious weapons and prefer to manufacture meat droids as rank-and-file combat units overseen by their brainwashed Vorta officer corps.
The Klingons are feudal and their military was always a collection of house forces (at least the ones who were not fighting each other anyway), and the new Romulan Republic just gives "civillians" with the right skills a commission and a welcome package and sends them out on missions, usually in the same ships they rode in on.
Some more (probably one off) missions tailored to those kind of characters would be an interesting change of pace, like getting a shipment of emergency supplies through fiercely contested enemy lines or rescuing people in a similar situation (there are a few of those already but there are variations available the game has not explored yet). So would some decent T6 utility ships, heavily armed converted freighters (like WWII Q-ships), Orion/Ferengi/Nausican/Dosi/whatever commerce raiders that are not necessarily freighters but make sense in an anti-commerce role (like the Orion Intruder/Scout from Journey to Babel for instance).
But a full faction dedicated to "civillians"? As Kael mentions it is probably too much effort for the results since all it really takes is a good background writeup (which most people don't seem to bother with anyway), some imagination while playing, and maybe a few good props like the civilian clothing that is already there (and maybe a converted civilian or pirate ship like the Risa ones and others).
. . . Fandom is, by its very nature, inherently illogical, and irrational. It involves putting undue importance on something that fundamentally not important, like a fictional universe from a TV/Movie/Book/Game series. In the process of doing so you end up warping the actual substance of the universe into something it isn't, and becoming attached to that made up version rather then the one that actually exists. We can see this happen in Star Trek very easy
The Connie is 947 feet long! Despite how often this was touted, and used in many third party works, this figure never actually appeared in any piece of canon up until S2 of DSC.
The Klingons and Romulans had an alliance in the TOS era, that's how they got each other's tech! Actually Spock only mentions in TOS that Starfleet intelligence reports Romulans using Klingon ships. No mention of an alliance, or how they got the ships, was ever made in canon
Klingons are an honorable race of warriors who don't do bad things! Actually, the entire concept of Klingon honor was invented to serve as a juxtaposition for how completely dishonorable their actions actually were, and served as a major plot point not only in TNG, but also in DS9.
This in turn warps any potential narrative ideas these people come up with. . . .
. . . There is a reason why the term "fan fiction" is almost always used as a negative. Because fan ideas, and fan stories, aren't good, and typically just involve people splerging about their favorite things in ways that don't make sense. Hell, Star Trek fan fiction literally created Mary Sue, a character now synonymous with bad writing tropes. . . .
That is a very odd point of view. Following that logic then the majority of Star Trek from TNG onwards would have to be warped, utter nonsensical garbage because until the end of ENT (and also including Lower Decks of the new stuff) many of the writers and producers were Trek fans themselves. And while I know a few ultrapurists who would say that everything after TOS IS nonsensical garbage I personally do not agree with that assessment.
Also your examples have no relation to the point you were trying to make.
The 947 foot length of the TOS Enterprise was not "made up by fans" it was the official length noted in production documents, including the blueprints Jefferies drew up for the construction of the main shooting model. And yes, if you want to be pedantic it does not have the 947 foot length written DIRECTLY, it has the scale listed and when you use that scale the with the measurements that are explicitly written for the model it comes out to 947 feet. That is how engineering drawings like that work. As for canon, there was a graphic displayed in the show itself that compared the sizes of the Enterprise and a D7 which had a scale, and guess what, that graphic has the Enterprise at somewhere close to 947 feet too, and it is even canon by the "only what is onscreen" canon oversimplification of the actual (and somewhat ambiguous) canon rules, though canon really does not come into this.
The Klingon/Romulan tech exchange was something they were telling writers and the slush readers about, it was in the official internal documentation according to D.C. Fontana (and she should know since part of her job was keeping that documentation up to date and accurate). Spock's line was written as it was because it was done from the Federation point of view and they just had rumors Starfleet Intelligence did not have the opportunity to confirm or disprove conclusively at that point. So, no, it is not "made up by fans" either.
You might be partially right about the Klingons. Early on it was just noted that they were the stand-ins for the Soviet Union in the cold war analogy thread of TOS and that ranged all the way from Mongol analogs to a quasi "Stalinist thugs" interpretation (which is actually more realistic than if it had been totally homogenized, especially in hindsight with the house structure first mentioned in TNG). On one end there was the honor-obsessed types like Kang and his crew, in the middle the affable but ruthless Orwellian pragmatists like Kor and the almost Kirk-like loose cannon Koloth, with the pure treacherous thugs like the (aptly named) Kras from Friday's Child and a few others at the other end. It is true though that John M. Ford's The Final Reflection did have an inordinately large influence on the later Klingon depictions.
1) It's highly unlikely there will ever be a full new faction with it's own story and introduction in the game. With the size of the team and the time it takes to make things, taking on extra missions would just mean less time to continue the main story.
Supposedly, the game has had the second best year, economically wise, last year.
If the team is too small, here's a novel idea: use the money you made and hire more people. That way, you'll have more people to concentrate on what actually matters: content. And by content, I do not mean ships, though that's all you think about.
Stories are just an afterthought, added so that you can continue to call the game "free to play". Nothing more, nothing less.
And please, we have only two "full factions". The others are just semi factions. Sure, they have their "own story and introduction", but it ends there as every character will then have to pick a side.
That's not being a full faction at all.
3) The comment that we were going to be "out of ideas" post Discovery was Geko's way of emphasizing how awesome it's been for us to get an injection of new story hooks and ideas in this amazing new era of tons of new Trek. We've never really been close to being out of ideas: Geko tends to speak in hyperbole that then gets taken as fact and is blown out of proportion. We just did a whole year of original, STO story and we have a few more ready to go.
Imagine thinking that a comment made not once, not twice but three times in three different podcasts (or rather, three different episodes of a podcast) is "hyperbole" that was then "blown out of proportion".
As for the "whole year of original, STO story"... I won't even touch that with a teen feet pole.
Not agreeing with someone doesn't give you the right to be an TRIBBLE.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
1) It's highly unlikely there will ever be a full new faction with it's own story and introduction in the game. With the size of the team and the time it takes to make things, taking on extra missions would just mean less time to continue the main story.
Supposedly, the game has had the second best year, economically wise, last year.
If the team is too small, here's a novel idea: use the money you made and hire more people. That way, you'll have more people to concentrate on what actually matters: content. And by content, I do not mean ships, though that's all you think about.
Stories are just an afterthought, added so that you can continue to call the game "free to play". Nothing more, nothing less.
And please, we have only two "full factions". The others are just semi factions. Sure, they have their "own story and introduction", but it ends there as every character will then have to pick a side.
That's not being a full faction at all.
3) The comment that we were going to be "out of ideas" post Discovery was Geko's way of emphasizing how awesome it's been for us to get an injection of new story hooks and ideas in this amazing new era of tons of new Trek. We've never really been close to being out of ideas: Geko tends to speak in hyperbole that then gets taken as fact and is blown out of proportion. We just did a whole year of original, STO story and we have a few more ready to go.
Imagine thinking that a comment made not once, not twice but three times in three different podcasts (or rather, three different episodes of a podcast) is "hyperbole" that was then "blown out of proportion".
As for the "whole year of original, STO story"... I won't even touch that with a teen feet pole.
The game itself had a good year financially, the game company probably not so much overall since Magic caved in.
1) It's highly unlikely there will ever be a full new faction with it's own story and introduction in the game. With the size of the team and the time it takes to make things, taking on extra missions would just mean less time to continue the main story.
Supposedly, the game has had the second best year, economically wise, last year.
If the team is too small, here's a novel idea: use the money you made and hire more people. That way, you'll have more people to concentrate on what actually matters: content. And by content, I do not mean ships, though that's all you think about.
Stories are just an afterthought, added so that you can continue to call the game "free to play". Nothing more, nothing less.
And please, we have only two "full factions". The others are just semi factions. Sure, they have their "own story and introduction", but it ends there as every character will then have to pick a side.
That's not being a full faction at all.
3) The comment that we were going to be "out of ideas" post Discovery was Geko's way of emphasizing how awesome it's been for us to get an injection of new story hooks and ideas in this amazing new era of tons of new Trek. We've never really been close to being out of ideas: Geko tends to speak in hyperbole that then gets taken as fact and is blown out of proportion. We just did a whole year of original, STO story and we have a few more ready to go.
Imagine thinking that a comment made not once, not twice but three times in three different podcasts (or rather, three different episodes of a podcast) is "hyperbole" that was then "blown out of proportion".
As for the "whole year of original, STO story"... I won't even touch that with a teen feet pole.
The game itself had a good year financially, the game company probably not so much overall since Magic caved in.
And of course the solution was to sack each and every dev that was moved from STO (and other games) to Magic.
I understand that they took a blow - though I'm eternally grateful that I wasn't interested in the slightes, because how much must it have sucked for them to offer refunds on a freaking beta? - but at some point they will have to rebuild the teams that they broke in order to move forward. And the more time it pass, the more difficult it will become.
Not agreeing with someone doesn't give you the right to be an TRIBBLE.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.
Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.
hey @rattler2 this guy is trolling again. pelase dont let him ruin the forums for everyone else.
He's not the troll in this particular argument. But you do you.
Meanwhile, back on topic, I agree that STO doesn't really have room for a "civilian" faction. What's the exciting storyline, trying to run a shipment of Andorian tubers to their destination in the Gamma Quadrant before a competitor manages to drive the price down? Upgrading the transtators in the mol'Rihan transporter network? The adventures of a small cruise liner carrying loads of vacationers between Risa and Earth?
"Merc" is just a backstory. I've got at least one merc operating a Denerios-class interceptor she bought on the black market, on retainer to D'Tan. She's not actually part of the Romulan Republic, but it's a steady paycheck...
your BS meter is getting old. how much are they paying you anyway?
Ahh yes the typical "I can't actually refute the argument so I'm going to call BS and accuse you of being paid" response.
Amusing to see the 4chan style of debate is still alive in late 2021.
hey @rattler2 this guy is trolling again. pelase dont let him ruin the forums for everyone else.
He's not the troll in this particular argument. But you do you.
Meanwhile, back on topic, I agree that STO doesn't really have room for a "civilian" faction. What's the exciting storyline, trying to run a shipment of Andorian tubers to their destination in the Gamma Quadrant before a competitor manages to drive the price down? Upgrading the transtators in the mol'Rihan transporter network? The adventures of a small cruise liner carrying loads of vacationers between Risa and Earth?
"Merc" is just a backstory. I've got at least one merc operating a Denerios-class interceptor she bought on the black market, on retainer to D'Tan. She's not actually part of the Romulan Republic, but it's a steady paycheck...
counter point I'm literally logging to elite dangerous to fly my space bus for a bit. and a lot of games have pretty basic trading that people enjoy. beside cryptic loves spending alot of time making neat mini- games/mechanics/systems then updating them maybe twice then never touching them again.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Comments
please stop with your OFF TOPIC comments.
this thread is about 1 thing and only 1 thing: a civilian faction in this game.
it is NOT about the TV shows and all of the stuff you just said.
@rattler2 already asked you to stop your OFF TOPIC commenting in the other thread.
why do you have no respect for the forum mods?
OFF TOPIC comment is against the FORUM RULES.
please stop BREAKING the forum rules with your OFF TOPIC commenting.
most of the hired mercenaries are already on Qo'noS, however non fed aligned Ferengi working with the Orion Syndicate could be an interesting faction, just don't tell the Nausicaans about this deal, they might want a cut.
We can never know whether the devs might have found their muse again while working on the few ideas they claimed at that time?
As for other suggestions, just pick almost anyone from this forum that is a Trek fan and you will never run out of potential story ideas. Now, for me I would be interested in experiencing a crisis involving Balok's First Federation needing some multi-faction help over in their corner of the Alpha Quadrant?
Just a question; Who exactly are you to judge other people's ideas with such arrogance?
please stop with your OFF TOPIC comments.
this thread is about 1 thing and only 1 thing: a civilian faction in this game.
it is NOT about the TV shows and all of the stuff you just said.
@rattler2 already asked you to stop your OFF TOPIC commenting in the other thread.
why do you have no respect for the forum mods?
OFF TOPIC comment is against the FORUM RULES.
please stop BREAKING the forum rules with your OFF TOPIC commenting.
please stop making so many off topic comments.
you are breaking the forum rules with all your off topic comments.
please stop brekaing the forum rules.
everything is not off topic.
many people are actually posting on topic about the subject of the thread.
but your long posts about plots of TV shows are off topic.
it is breaking the forum rules to post off topic.
please stop breaking the forum rules.
A really unhappy person whose only pleasure is tearing other people down.
I wanted to respond to your your blabla, but like i don't want to be unpolite or rude, i wouldn't do it. Because being silent is also a proof of intelligence
back to topic: I would like a mini-faction of smugglers, bounty hunters (kdf and romulan sides). Already asked a long time ago, though. the drozana station or one of the old stations removed from the game could be their base.
A couple of things:
1) It's highly unlikely there will ever be a full new faction with it's own story and introduction in the game. With the size of the team and the time it takes to make things, taking on extra missions would just mean less time to continue the main story.
2) Please do not tag mods relentlessly because you don't like how a discussion is going. If you feel you must tag a moderator for action, or me, tag us once. Repeatedly doing it won't get us to do what you want any faster. Or at all.
3) The comment that we were going to be "out of ideas" post Discovery was Geko's way of emphasizing how awesome it's been for us to get an injection of new story hooks and ideas in this amazing new era of tons of new Trek. We've never really been close to being out of ideas: Geko tends to speak in hyperbole that then gets taken as fact and is blown out of proportion. We just did a whole year of original, STO story and we have a few more ready to go.
please stop breaking the forum rules by posting off topic.
nothing you just said is about the topic of the thread.
you are breaking the forum rules by posting off topic.
Som. Fax. Stop it. Leave each other alone. I don't care who started it or how you feel about each other. Last warning.
First why I'm not a big fan:
As mentioned on the first page, most of the stuff we do in the game aren't really things done by civilians - although participation in the Iconian war could help to make that conflict seem even more dramatic.
Moreover, a civilian faction would need to have its ship access restricted to event ships like the Risa ones and maybe some freighter stuff and possibly new designs. Otherwise you'd just end up being like a Federation captain, if you're flying a shiny legendary Galaxy class cruiser.
So, to really keep it a civilian faction, you'd either have to severly limit its attractiveness by limiting the options - or heavily invest in making new ones.
Secondly, the added value:
We never saw much of civilian life in the Federation. Sure, Sisko's dad had his restaurant, Picard's family had their vineyard and we saw some colonies. But we never really got to explore or follow a civilian community, with all its economic, political and social events. Usually it was either more of a case study (with the planet of hats trope) or some simple statement, like Picard discussing money in First Contact. In-depth exploration of social dynamics, of what it means for ordinary people to be a spacefaring civilisation or a part thereof, never played much of a role. This is, btw, one of the reasons why I think The Expanse is so great: there's much more attention for civil society in that series.
Which brings me to my third point: ways to add that value of having more attention for civil society:
Instead of adding a civilian faction, allow players of the existing factions to perform other roles by adding more content, uniforms, biography options, locations and maps and so on.
Instead of every Federation character being a Starfleet officer and every Klingon being a warrior in the KDF, we could have factions within factions. You could be a trader in a city on Regulus, a researcher on a newly added Academy affiliate on Bolarus or a technician at Jupiter Station. All with NPC's with background stories - perhaps they could even be written in some sort of contest by players, as has been done before with some post-Iconian war lore.
It wouldn't be a new faction, but expanding the game like that could allow for doing more civilian stuff, expanding the Trek universe, adding new assets for all other players and so on.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
wasn't the Maquis a bunch of Federation Civilians who became Terrorists due to how unhappy they were with the UFP?
Yes, but like most other examples of civilians in Trek, they weren't really a society with all its dynamics. They were just a rebel group and therefore we only really saw their political and military actions towards outsiders.
And although they were one of the better examples of a well written villain, a military conflict alone isn't really sufficient for making a well-defined society. At least not in the limited time they were in existence - it worked with the Klingons for example, because they existed much longer.
Not to mention that we mostly got to know the Maquis through some notable individuals - again while they were interacting with Starfleet.
And quite a number of those individual Maquis didn't really seem to fight for a cause or believe in any coherent ideology - many of them were just outcasts, having either failed at life (or at least life until then) or suffering from severe psycho-social problems. Torres and Paris were examples of the former, Lon Suder was an example of the latter.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
Really, the only factions where that induction of civilians as semi-independent units is not already commonplace are the Federation because of their preferred self image as rational, peaceful, and self-sufficient, and the Dominion because the Founders don't trust all the people they tricked or conquered with any serious weapons and prefer to manufacture meat droids as rank-and-file combat units overseen by their brainwashed Vorta officer corps.
The Klingons are feudal and their military was always a collection of house forces (at least the ones who were not fighting each other anyway), and the new Romulan Republic just gives "civillians" with the right skills a commission and a welcome package and sends them out on missions, usually in the same ships they rode in on.
Some more (probably one off) missions tailored to those kind of characters would be an interesting change of pace, like getting a shipment of emergency supplies through fiercely contested enemy lines or rescuing people in a similar situation (there are a few of those already but there are variations available the game has not explored yet). So would some decent T6 utility ships, heavily armed converted freighters (like WWII Q-ships), Orion/Ferengi/Nausican/Dosi/whatever commerce raiders that are not necessarily freighters but make sense in an anti-commerce role (like the Orion Intruder/Scout from Journey to Babel for instance).
But a full faction dedicated to "civillians"? As Kael mentions it is probably too much effort for the results since all it really takes is a good background writeup (which most people don't seem to bother with anyway), some imagination while playing, and maybe a few good props like the civilian clothing that is already there (and maybe a converted civilian or pirate ship like the Risa ones and others).
That is a very odd point of view. Following that logic then the majority of Star Trek from TNG onwards would have to be warped, utter nonsensical garbage because until the end of ENT (and also including Lower Decks of the new stuff) many of the writers and producers were Trek fans themselves. And while I know a few ultrapurists who would say that everything after TOS IS nonsensical garbage I personally do not agree with that assessment.
Also your examples have no relation to the point you were trying to make.
If the team is too small, here's a novel idea: use the money you made and hire more people. That way, you'll have more people to concentrate on what actually matters: content. And by content, I do not mean ships, though that's all you think about.
Stories are just an afterthought, added so that you can continue to call the game "free to play". Nothing more, nothing less.
And please, we have only two "full factions". The others are just semi factions. Sure, they have their "own story and introduction", but it ends there as every character will then have to pick a side.
That's not being a full faction at all.
Imagine thinking that a comment made not once, not twice but three times in three different podcasts (or rather, three different episodes of a podcast) is "hyperbole" that was then "blown out of proportion".
As for the "whole year of original, STO story"... I won't even touch that with a teen feet pole.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
The game itself had a good year financially, the game company probably not so much overall since Magic caved in.
And of course the solution was to sack each and every dev that was moved from STO (and other games) to Magic.
I understand that they took a blow - though I'm eternally grateful that I wasn't interested in the slightes, because how much must it have sucked for them to offer refunds on a freaking beta? - but at some point they will have to rebuild the teams that they broke in order to move forward. And the more time it pass, the more difficult it will become.
Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
- quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
- quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;
Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
Meanwhile, back on topic, I agree that STO doesn't really have room for a "civilian" faction. What's the exciting storyline, trying to run a shipment of Andorian tubers to their destination in the Gamma Quadrant before a competitor manages to drive the price down? Upgrading the transtators in the mol'Rihan transporter network? The adventures of a small cruise liner carrying loads of vacationers between Risa and Earth?
"Merc" is just a backstory. I've got at least one merc operating a Denerios-class interceptor she bought on the black market, on retainer to D'Tan. She's not actually part of the Romulan Republic, but it's a steady paycheck...
counter point I'm literally logging to elite dangerous to fly my space bus for a bit. and a lot of games have pretty basic trading that people enjoy. beside cryptic loves spending alot of time making neat mini- games/mechanics/systems then updating them maybe twice then never touching them again.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.