"Tranporter rooms are sized as they are to transport things in larger than people". That should be almost verbatim. They are sized as they are to transports groups of people. Not cargo. Not big items. Diplomats and their entourage. Potentially hostile parties and bodyguards. Away teams, Prisoners and their guards. All people. The space was a transport point but had sufficient space to muster the party prior to transport, to accommodate additional security as required, Have delegates stand around waiting for an escort to arrive without the next person transporting running up their skirt. Form follows function. That's why it's big.
"Personally I chalk it up to 32nd Century Technological Advancement Shenanigans. After all... its far more advanced than even the 29th Century Wells class. There's no telling what kind of advancements they've made since the 29th Century."
I've always wondered about that. The Wells and the Temporal Integrity Commission are responsible for policing time and tidying up after temporal incursions. I assume they live outside of space-time, like the Annorax crew did. In STO, they're established as being around later too. So, I wonder if the Wells might use technology from all over everywhere and have a relationship with the 32nd Century. It could be that the Wells is just as advanced, if not more so than the 32nd Century ships. The Wells is a tastier ship than anything we've seen in Disco. I really wish they'd used it in Enterprise, but the TIC started in the 29th Century...the 32nd would know all about it and would it ever have been discontinued? If time was still being messed with and even more so later, then it would have made even more sense for them to stay around.
Except the Warp Core doesn't just provide power to the nacelles. Its the primary reactor for the whole ship. Yea they do have alternate power sources, but the bulk does come from the Warp Core. In TMP they made a big deal about routing the Phaser Banks through the Warp Core for extra power, but makes them useless at Warp.
Let us also not forget that there is already a ship capable of breaking into 3 (warp capable) parts. Not only are those segmants warp capable, they are also capable of attack/defence independently from the rest of the ships power reseves.
Except the Warp Core doesn't just provide power to the nacelles. Its the primary reactor for the whole ship. Yea they do have alternate power sources, but the bulk does come from the Warp Core. In TMP they made a big deal about routing the Phaser Banks through the Warp Core for extra power, but makes them useless at Warp.
Let us also not forget that there is already a ship capable of breaking into 3 (warp capable) parts. Not only are those segmants warp capable, they are also capable of attack/defence independently from the rest of the ships power reseves.
This would indicate that independent nacelles is not such a big problem.
The question would be, then, how are those sections powered?
The Galaxy saucer separation (since that was in the actual shows) for instance. Is the Saucer warp-capable, or does it have to join back up to the engineering section? And if it is, does it have it's own, smaller warp-core in it?
(The 'current era' split-up ships like the Multi-vector thing, still have to have power sources in each part. They're not beaming energy from the sole warp core.)
----
The main issue is that you can come up with "well, it makes sense because..." technobabble to excuse anything. But just because you can come up with an excuse for it, doesn't somehow make it less stupid for the people who have issues with it - the excuse sounds stupid, too.
Except the Warp Core doesn't just provide power to the nacelles. Its the primary reactor for the whole ship. Yea they do have alternate power sources, but the bulk does come from the Warp Core. In TMP they made a big deal about routing the Phaser Banks through the Warp Core for extra power, but makes them useless at Warp.
Let us also not forget that there is already a ship capable of breaking into 3 (warp capable) parts. Not only are those segmants warp capable, they are also capable of attack/defence independently from the rest of the ships power reseves.
This would indicate that independent nacelles is not such a big problem.
The question would be, then, how are those sections powered?
The Galaxy saucer separation (since that was in the actual shows) for instance. Is the Saucer warp-capable, or does it have to join back up to the engineering section? And if it is, does it have it's own, smaller warp-core in it?
(The 'current era' split-up ships like the Multi-vector thing, still have to have power sources in each part. They're not beaming energy from the sole warp core.)
----
The main issue is that you can come up with "well, it makes sense because..." technobabble to excuse anything. But just because you can come up with an excuse for it, doesn't somehow make it less stupid for the people who have issues with it - the excuse sounds stupid, too.
Well, A LOT of Star Trek cannon could be described as 'stupid'.
For instance:
Lucifer is real and he lives on Megas-Tu.
Apollo and the other Greek gods are also real, they're just aliens.
Jack the Ripper is still alive and he's actually a centuries old non-corporeal being that feeds on pain.
There's a giant clone of Spock, named Spock Two, who lives on the planet Phylos.
If you are to have a discussion it would be within the bounds of that 'stupid' universe. Otherwise you're just being a kill joy
The point of detached Warp Nacelles is less work for the ship artists and special effects staff. Also, they avoid the backlash on things like how the Cerritos Nacelles were connected to the main ship. They can use technical gobbledygook to make it sound like a futuristic wonders.
Path of least resistance.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The point of detached Warp Nacelles is less work for the ship artists and special effects staff. Also, they avoid the backlash on things like how the Cerritos Nacelles were connected to the main ship. They can use technical gobbledygook to make it sound like a futuristic wonders.
Path of least resistance.
Is it really less work? When you had Voy raise/lower 'fixed' nacelles. We was told it was a pain in the TRIBBLE to perfect (in game).
Could you explain to me how detached warp nacelles make less work?
The question would be, then, how are those sections powered?
The Galaxy saucer separation (since that was in the actual shows) for instance. Is the Saucer warp-capable, or does it have to join back up to the engineering section? And if it is, does it have it's own, smaller warp-core in it?
(The 'current era' split-up ships like the Multi-vector thing, still have to have power sources in each part. They're not beaming energy from the sole warp core.)
If I remember correctly, the Galaxy saucer was not warp capable, but did have the ability to generate a field to sustain it if separated at warp. Kinda like how a Photon Torpedo can sustain warp speeds when launched at warp, but only for a short time.
Though highly inadvisable, it was possible to separate the saucer from the stardrive section at high-warp velocities. Used by Jean-Luc Picard during the first encounter with Q, the saucer was separated at a warp speed of 9.6. According to Data, it was highly impractical but possible, with no margin for error. The slightest mishap would have made this attempt deadly. It was also required to clear the saucer section from the stardrive section to ensure safety, because as soon as separation was over, the saucer section would start to lose speed, posing a danger to the stardrive section. However, Picard was able to successfully separate the saucer in order to protect the families of the Enterprise from the immense power of Q. (TNG: "Encounter at Farpoint")
As for the Prometheus, I'd have to agree that that ship probably had two secondary cores in order for all three parts to be warp capable, as evidenced by the fact that yes all three parts do have warp nacelles. With the Prometheus being a more combat oriented ship these secondary cores probably supliment the primary when combined, or are inactive until needed. Kinda like backup generators.
It was just a rhetorical joke about how the people who make that show have their brain cells detached from their brain so then they made a ship to illustrate it.
The question would be, then, how are those sections powered?
The Galaxy saucer separation (since that was in the actual shows) for instance. Is the Saucer warp-capable, or does it have to join back up to the engineering section? And if it is, does it have it's own, smaller warp-core in it?
(The 'current era' split-up ships like the Multi-vector thing, still have to have power sources in each part. They're not beaming energy from the sole warp core.)
If I remember correctly, the Galaxy saucer was not warp capable, but did have the ability to generate a field to sustain it if separated at warp. Kinda like how a Photon Torpedo can sustain warp speeds when launched at warp, but only for a short time.
Though highly inadvisable, it was possible to separate the saucer from the stardrive section at high-warp velocities. Used by Jean-Luc Picard during the first encounter with Q, the saucer was separated at a warp speed of 9.6. According to Data, it was highly impractical but possible, with no margin for error. The slightest mishap would have made this attempt deadly. It was also required to clear the saucer section from the stardrive section to ensure safety, because as soon as separation was over, the saucer section would start to lose speed, posing a danger to the stardrive section. However, Picard was able to successfully separate the saucer in order to protect the families of the Enterprise from the immense power of Q. (TNG: "Encounter at Farpoint")
As for the Prometheus, I'd have to agree that that ship probably had two secondary cores in order for all three parts to be warp capable, as evidenced by the fact that yes all three parts do have warp nacelles. With the Prometheus being a more combat oriented ship these secondary cores probably supliment the primary when combined, or are inactive until needed. Kinda like backup generators.
Prometheus had three warp cores, one for each section and six nacelles in total, with two on each. In the saucer section, one raises out of the top and the bottom (we've saw that in "Message In A Bottle" and also in STO.
And of course, on it's schematics, Voyager had two warp cores...but like the aeroshuttle and secondary deflector, they were never explored in the series.
Wireless power transfer is a real thing and through vacuum is far more efficient than power transfer through a physical medium (conduction, plasma, etc) so getting power to detached nacelles is cheaper and less wasteful. It could be done with microwaves, lasers, basically any EM field.
You can buy a unit for wirelessly charging smartphones at a distance now too. So power is just not an issue for detached nacelles.
Also there’s a cannon explanation for how they stay in place. Sub space filaments.
However there’s also real world tech that achieves this effect. Google quantum levitation or the Meissner Effect where static/frozen magnetic field lines can lock a superconductor into place against another object, forcing it to move with and stay in alignment with that object with no physical attachment.
We need supercool temperatures to do this but room temperature superconductors are a theoretical possibility and not a stretch for sci-fi set 1000 years in the future.
But the explanation given is subspace, which is the same explanation used for transporters, warp speed, and basically everything fiction in this science fiction show. It doesn’t need to be more plausible than that.
Detached ship parts are plausible with real world, contemporary physics. In the 32nd century the only way to have an issue with them is by being very specifically selective with your own willingness to suspend disbelief.
Detached nacelles make more sense in real physics than transporters do.
Detached nacelles make more sense in real physics than transporters do.
Or warp drive, for that matter, which is not an Alcubierre-White warp (A-W warp would behave very differently, with the ship causally separated from reality while underway rather than being able to alter course and send/receive messages).
If I normally had to do A (Hull), B (Pylon), and C (Nacelle) and now I only had to do A and C, that would seem like less work.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Wireless power transfer is a real thing and through vacuum is far more efficient than power transfer through a physical medium (conduction, plasma, etc) so getting power to detached nacelles is cheaper and less wasteful. It could be done with microwaves, lasers, basically any EM field.
You can buy a unit for wirelessly charging smartphones at a distance now too. So power is just not an issue for detached nacelles.
Also there’s a cannon explanation for how they stay in place. Sub space filaments.
However there’s also real world tech that achieves this effect. Google quantum levitation or the Meissner Effect where static/frozen magnetic field lines can lock a superconductor into place against another object, forcing it to move with and stay in alignment with that object with no physical attachment.
We need supercool temperatures to do this but room temperature superconductors are a theoretical possibility and not a stretch for sci-fi set 1000 years in the future.
But the explanation given is subspace, which is the same explanation used for transporters, warp speed, and basically everything fiction in this science fiction show. It doesn’t need to be more plausible than that.
Detached ship parts are plausible with real world, contemporary physics. In the 32nd century the only way to have an issue with them is by being very specifically selective with your own willingness to suspend disbelief.
Detached nacelles make more sense in real physics than transporters do.
What if you were flying through a Mutara class nebula? What if you were flying between two binary pulsars? What if there was a power failure? What backup and emergency contingencies do you have? If you've got a single piece of hull, then you know where you stand, but pieces floating free...even if you've got some sort of super duper turbolift, what about when there down? Are the Jeffries Tubes made of wanky matter too?
Why are you flying between binary pulsars? Do you have the least idea of how rare such a phenomenon is? The two stars, if close enough to be considered binary, would exert sufficient tidal drag on one another that in less than a million years, both would have ceased to spin at anything near pulsar speeds. (Of course, nonrotating neutron stars are their own class of interstellar hazard, but nothing a ship with a good Forward mass detector can't avoid easily.) Meanwhile, the radiation flux of two neutron stars isn't something you want to be next to, even for scientific reasons. That's what Class-IV probes are for.
As for a Mutara-class nebula, nebulae are mostly vacuum, just like the rest of space. The EM fields can wreak havoc on the shields of a 23rd-century ship, but I see no reason to assume that a craft constructed seven hundred years later would have had no improvements to shielding technology.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Why are you flying between binary pulsars? Do you have the least idea of how rare such a phenomenon is? The two stars, if close enough to be considered binary, would exert sufficient tidal drag on one another that in less than a million years, both would have ceased to spin at anything near pulsar speeds. (Of course, nonrotating neutron stars are their own class of interstellar hazard, but nothing a ship with a good Forward mass detector can't avoid easily.) Meanwhile, the radiation flux of two neutron stars isn't something you want to be next to, even for scientific reasons. That's what Class-IV probes are for.
As for a Mutara-class nebula, nebulae are mostly vacuum, just like the rest of space. The EM fields can wreak havoc on the shields of a 23rd-century ship, but I see no reason to assume that a craft constructed seven hundred years later would have had no improvements to shielding technology.
That was in an episode of Voyager, you Trek Virgin. Season Four, Episode Seven, "Scientific Method"...and that's why I said it.
What if you were flying through a Mutara class nebula? What if you were flying between two binary pulsars? What if there was a power failure? What backup and emergency contingencies do you have? If you've got a single piece of hull, then you know where you stand, but pieces floating free...even if you've got some sort of super duper turbolift, what about when there down? Are the Jeffries Tubes made of wanky matter too?
Why would any of those be an issue? None of the pieces are floating free. They’re all permanently attached. Just like with real-world demonstrable quantum effects. They are not loose, they are not disconnected. Action on one body affects the linked body as if they were a single object because physically they are a single object. Why on earth would a nebula be an issue? Matter density in a nebula is still so sparse that it will still be more efficient than transfer through a medium. Subspace filaments for all you know are indestructible. The worst we see is disruption of the connection which is at worst directly comparable to a direct hit to a nacelle which takes out warp drive every five minutes already. Power failure is just a none issue. There’s no reason to believe that power is required to maintain the connection, not in real physics nor subspace (which is literally magic and therefore immune to basically any criticism).
Also these ships have shields 1000 years more advanced. In DS9 there are shields that withstand the corona of a sun (the hottest part of the star with the most intense radiation). If there remain celestial hazards that are dangerous to ship systems, then they’ll do what they do in the prior shows. That is to say avoid the hazard or come up with a technobabble solution by reconfiguring a something-ator or realigning the phase of something. Again, solutions already well examples in existing trek.
Who needs turbolifts? Personal teleporters are superior in every way. They don’t even need the ship to have power online. They don’t pose the risk of travelling through hazardous environments. They can be inhibited, but so can walking. There are such things as force fields. Personal transporters are tactically superior to ship transporters, turbolifts, and ambulation.
You literally have no meaningful argument here. Space magic. A solution to your suggestions isn’t even required, and if it was subspace can be invoked by the writers just like in basically every episode of TNG ever recorded.
That was in an episode of Voyager, you Trek Virgin. Season Four, Episode Seven, "Scientific Method"...and that's why I said it.
Once you’re resorting to ad hominem attacks it’s clear you no longer have a valid argument to make.
Not liking aspects of DSC is not the same as having valid criticisms. But don’t come arguing against things in DSC that you’re selectively ignoring from the prior shows. Don’t come arguing physics without a good understanding of physics and the acknowledgement that prior shows are often demonstrably worse in their plausibility.
We get that you don’t like it, but the best arguments you’ve presented are “I don’t like it” and “this thing is wanky”.
That’s absolute weaksauce. I get that it’s de rigeur to hate on new trek, but these reasons are spurious and internally inconsistent. It’s bashing for the sake of bashing. You don’t prove your love of something by shitting on it. It’s not clever to hate something, especially with such poor justification. You aren’t more of a fan if you can pull dubious criticisms and bile out of your TRIBBLE. The prior shows don’t need defending, not from DSC fans and certainly not by you. You’re just pissing on things other people love for no other reason than to present your preferences as superior. They aren’t: an opinion backed up only by personal distaste and enmity despite being something you’re wholly entitled to hold is not something you’re entitled to have respected.
The Voyager was able to use diving between binary pulsars as a threat precisely because such things are vanishingly rare - even the highly-advanced species threatening them hadn't bothered to create defenses against them, any more than farmers worry about being trampled by cattle (as an aside, did you know that over 100 people per year are killed by cows? Makes sharks look downright docile!).
That's also why Tuvok was uncertain the ship would survive the maneuver. It's pretty much suicidal, and they survived only through the power of plot armor (which, presumably, would also defend any other Hero Ship encountering such a rare thing).
Perhaps your time would be better spent rewatching the episode, rather than resorting to what I'm sure you consider a devastating insult. (I'm an old-school Trekkie, kid - I've been called a lot worse over the decades.)
One of my issues with the detached nacelles is how it could have been a good opportunity to "fix" the whole "space is 2D" thing and allow ships to have more vertical and strafing movement thanks to the new nacelles.
In the shows/movies that did bother to show this kind of movement, it was done with weak repulsors/thrusters making a ship fly upwards/downwards/left/right very slowly. Detached nacelles could have been used to improve that.
Star Trek has always been "semi-Neutonian" in portraying space flight physics, treating it like submarine warfare. Babylon 5 was probably one of the better examples of full Neutonian physics, as shown by the Starfury. Also on that list is reboot Battlestar Galactica and The Expanse.
I don't see Star Trek changing how ships fly in space anytime soon.
Star Trek has always been "semi-Neutonian" in portraying space flight physics, treating it like submarine warfare. Babylon 5 was probably one of the better examples of full Neutonian physics, as shown by the Starfury. Also on that list is reboot Battlestar Galactica and The Expanse.
I don't see Star Trek changing how ships fly in space anytime soon.
...uh, because this is Star Trek, and running your ship into/through/between all sorts of Negative Space Wedgies is part of daily life?
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Meanwhile, all the series are full of many examples of needing to do things the backup/secondary/tertiary/manual way because Something Went Wrong. Having your engines (or anything else) floating out there by Space Magic, without any way to send repairmen/damage control/security via their feet, does not "make sense" in any kind of physics, or tactics, or anything else. Ditto with not having backup physical structure to keep your ship together in the event of catastrophic <whatever> disrupting your Ship Integrity Field™.
And no amount of "but, really, it's totally rational!" arguments will change that. It's solely because the showrunners thought it would be Cool & Future-y, not for any sane reasons. We're not drinking the kool-aid, you're not going to convince us that it's anything other than dumb.
...uh, because this is Star Trek, and running your ship into/through/between all sorts of Negative Space Wedgies is part of daily life?
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Meanwhile, all the series are full of many examples of needing to do things the backup/secondary/tertiary/manual way because Something Went Wrong. Having your engines (or anything else) floating out there by Space Magic, without any way to send repairmen/damage control/security via their feet, does not "make sense" in any kind of physics, or tactics, or anything else. Ditto with not having backup physical structure to keep your ship together in the event of catastrophic <whatever> disrupting your Ship Integrity Field™.
And no amount of "but, really, it's totally rational!" arguments will change that. It's solely because the showrunners thought it would be Cool & Future-y, not for any sane reasons. We're not drinking the kool-aid, you're not going to convince us that it's anything other than dumb.
Your entire argument is undermined by the ability to physically sever a pylon and cause a nacelle to float away.
The ship integrity field is irrelevant.
Floating nacelles or detached nacelles, the appropriate damage could separate the nacelle from the hull. Floaties have the advantage in that their tether is not directly targetable. Even when disrupted by an internal explosion (a fatal injury to a pylon) the nacelle recovers.
So actually floaties are more resilient than attached nacelles with vulnerable pylons.
Also you can send repair crews the same way they always do: transporters. Even better, personal transporters don’t require ship power to be online.
FYI disrupting ship power does not cause the nacelles to just float away.
I’ve already provided examples in real world physics that make this plausible to the standard of existing trek tech from older shows. So your decision to single DSC tech out is on you. Just screaming “it’s nonsense” into the void doesn’t change that the issue is with your choice and not the show and though you’re entitled to your choice your assertion that somehow detached nacelles are less plausible than other aspects of trek that you do accept is demonstrably wrong.
Comments
I've always wondered about that. The Wells and the Temporal Integrity Commission are responsible for policing time and tidying up after temporal incursions. I assume they live outside of space-time, like the Annorax crew did. In STO, they're established as being around later too. So, I wonder if the Wells might use technology from all over everywhere and have a relationship with the 32nd Century. It could be that the Wells is just as advanced, if not more so than the 32nd Century ships. The Wells is a tastier ship than anything we've seen in Disco. I really wish they'd used it in Enterprise, but the TIC started in the 29th Century...the 32nd would know all about it and would it ever have been discontinued? If time was still being messed with and even more so later, then it would have made even more sense for them to stay around.
Let us also not forget that there is already a ship capable of breaking into 3 (warp capable) parts. Not only are those segmants warp capable, they are also capable of attack/defence independently from the rest of the ships power reseves.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Multi-vector_assault_mode
This would indicate that independent nacelles is not such a big problem.
The question would be, then, how are those sections powered?
The Galaxy saucer separation (since that was in the actual shows) for instance. Is the Saucer warp-capable, or does it have to join back up to the engineering section? And if it is, does it have it's own, smaller warp-core in it?
(The 'current era' split-up ships like the Multi-vector thing, still have to have power sources in each part. They're not beaming energy from the sole warp core.)
----
The main issue is that you can come up with "well, it makes sense because..." technobabble to excuse anything. But just because you can come up with an excuse for it, doesn't somehow make it less stupid for the people who have issues with it - the excuse sounds stupid, too.
Well, A LOT of Star Trek cannon could be described as 'stupid'.
For instance:
Lucifer is real and he lives on Megas-Tu.
Apollo and the other Greek gods are also real, they're just aliens.
Jack the Ripper is still alive and he's actually a centuries old non-corporeal being that feeds on pain.
There's a giant clone of Spock, named Spock Two, who lives on the planet Phylos.
If you are to have a discussion it would be within the bounds of that 'stupid' universe. Otherwise you're just being a kill joy
Path of least resistance.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Is it really less work? When you had Voy raise/lower 'fixed' nacelles. We was told it was a pain in the TRIBBLE to perfect (in game).
Could you explain to me how detached warp nacelles make less work?
If I remember correctly, the Galaxy saucer was not warp capable, but did have the ability to generate a field to sustain it if separated at warp. Kinda like how a Photon Torpedo can sustain warp speeds when launched at warp, but only for a short time.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Saucer_separation
As for the Prometheus, I'd have to agree that that ship probably had two secondary cores in order for all three parts to be warp capable, as evidenced by the fact that yes all three parts do have warp nacelles. With the Prometheus being a more combat oriented ship these secondary cores probably supliment the primary when combined, or are inactive until needed. Kinda like backup generators.
Prometheus had three warp cores, one for each section and six nacelles in total, with two on each. In the saucer section, one raises out of the top and the bottom (we've saw that in "Message In A Bottle" and also in STO.
And of course, on it's schematics, Voyager had two warp cores...but like the aeroshuttle and secondary deflector, they were never explored in the series.
You can buy a unit for wirelessly charging smartphones at a distance now too. So power is just not an issue for detached nacelles.
Also there’s a cannon explanation for how they stay in place. Sub space filaments.
However there’s also real world tech that achieves this effect. Google quantum levitation or the Meissner Effect where static/frozen magnetic field lines can lock a superconductor into place against another object, forcing it to move with and stay in alignment with that object with no physical attachment.
We need supercool temperatures to do this but room temperature superconductors are a theoretical possibility and not a stretch for sci-fi set 1000 years in the future.
But the explanation given is subspace, which is the same explanation used for transporters, warp speed, and basically everything fiction in this science fiction show. It doesn’t need to be more plausible than that.
Detached ship parts are plausible with real world, contemporary physics. In the 32nd century the only way to have an issue with them is by being very specifically selective with your own willingness to suspend disbelief.
Detached nacelles make more sense in real physics than transporters do.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
What if you were flying through a Mutara class nebula? What if you were flying between two binary pulsars? What if there was a power failure? What backup and emergency contingencies do you have? If you've got a single piece of hull, then you know where you stand, but pieces floating free...even if you've got some sort of super duper turbolift, what about when there down? Are the Jeffries Tubes made of wanky matter too?
As for a Mutara-class nebula, nebulae are mostly vacuum, just like the rest of space. The EM fields can wreak havoc on the shields of a 23rd-century ship, but I see no reason to assume that a craft constructed seven hundred years later would have had no improvements to shielding technology.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
That was in an episode of Voyager, you Trek Virgin. Season Four, Episode Seven, "Scientific Method"...and that's why I said it.
Why would any of those be an issue? None of the pieces are floating free. They’re all permanently attached. Just like with real-world demonstrable quantum effects. They are not loose, they are not disconnected. Action on one body affects the linked body as if they were a single object because physically they are a single object. Why on earth would a nebula be an issue? Matter density in a nebula is still so sparse that it will still be more efficient than transfer through a medium. Subspace filaments for all you know are indestructible. The worst we see is disruption of the connection which is at worst directly comparable to a direct hit to a nacelle which takes out warp drive every five minutes already. Power failure is just a none issue. There’s no reason to believe that power is required to maintain the connection, not in real physics nor subspace (which is literally magic and therefore immune to basically any criticism).
Also these ships have shields 1000 years more advanced. In DS9 there are shields that withstand the corona of a sun (the hottest part of the star with the most intense radiation). If there remain celestial hazards that are dangerous to ship systems, then they’ll do what they do in the prior shows. That is to say avoid the hazard or come up with a technobabble solution by reconfiguring a something-ator or realigning the phase of something. Again, solutions already well examples in existing trek.
Who needs turbolifts? Personal teleporters are superior in every way. They don’t even need the ship to have power online. They don’t pose the risk of travelling through hazardous environments. They can be inhibited, but so can walking. There are such things as force fields. Personal transporters are tactically superior to ship transporters, turbolifts, and ambulation.
You literally have no meaningful argument here. Space magic. A solution to your suggestions isn’t even required, and if it was subspace can be invoked by the writers just like in basically every episode of TNG ever recorded.
Once you’re resorting to ad hominem attacks it’s clear you no longer have a valid argument to make.
Not liking aspects of DSC is not the same as having valid criticisms. But don’t come arguing against things in DSC that you’re selectively ignoring from the prior shows. Don’t come arguing physics without a good understanding of physics and the acknowledgement that prior shows are often demonstrably worse in their plausibility.
We get that you don’t like it, but the best arguments you’ve presented are “I don’t like it” and “this thing is wanky”.
That’s absolute weaksauce. I get that it’s de rigeur to hate on new trek, but these reasons are spurious and internally inconsistent. It’s bashing for the sake of bashing. You don’t prove your love of something by shitting on it. It’s not clever to hate something, especially with such poor justification. You aren’t more of a fan if you can pull dubious criticisms and bile out of your TRIBBLE. The prior shows don’t need defending, not from DSC fans and certainly not by you. You’re just pissing on things other people love for no other reason than to present your preferences as superior. They aren’t: an opinion backed up only by personal distaste and enmity despite being something you’re wholly entitled to hold is not something you’re entitled to have respected.
That's also why Tuvok was uncertain the ship would survive the maneuver. It's pretty much suicidal, and they survived only through the power of plot armor (which, presumably, would also defend any other Hero Ship encountering such a rare thing).
Perhaps your time would be better spent rewatching the episode, rather than resorting to what I'm sure you consider a devastating insult. (I'm an old-school Trekkie, kid - I've been called a lot worse over the decades.)
In the shows/movies that did bother to show this kind of movement, it was done with weak repulsors/thrusters making a ship fly upwards/downwards/left/right very slowly. Detached nacelles could have been used to improve that.
I don't see Star Trek changing how ships fly in space anytime soon.
You mean 'Newtonian'?!
"Why would you be flying there?"
...uh, because this is Star Trek, and running your ship into/through/between all sorts of Negative Space Wedgies is part of daily life?
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Meanwhile, all the series are full of many examples of needing to do things the backup/secondary/tertiary/manual way because Something Went Wrong. Having your engines (or anything else) floating out there by Space Magic, without any way to send repairmen/damage control/security via their feet, does not "make sense" in any kind of physics, or tactics, or anything else. Ditto with not having backup physical structure to keep your ship together in the event of catastrophic <whatever> disrupting your Ship Integrity Field™.
And no amount of "but, really, it's totally rational!" arguments will change that. It's solely because the showrunners thought it would be Cool & Future-y, not for any sane reasons. We're not drinking the kool-aid, you're not going to convince us that it's anything other than dumb.
Your entire argument is undermined by the ability to physically sever a pylon and cause a nacelle to float away.
The ship integrity field is irrelevant.
Floating nacelles or detached nacelles, the appropriate damage could separate the nacelle from the hull. Floaties have the advantage in that their tether is not directly targetable. Even when disrupted by an internal explosion (a fatal injury to a pylon) the nacelle recovers.
So actually floaties are more resilient than attached nacelles with vulnerable pylons.
Also you can send repair crews the same way they always do: transporters. Even better, personal transporters don’t require ship power to be online.
FYI disrupting ship power does not cause the nacelles to just float away.
I’ve already provided examples in real world physics that make this plausible to the standard of existing trek tech from older shows. So your decision to single DSC tech out is on you. Just screaming “it’s nonsense” into the void doesn’t change that the issue is with your choice and not the show and though you’re entitled to your choice your assertion that somehow detached nacelles are less plausible than other aspects of trek that you do accept is demonstrably wrong.