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Mudd's Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack!

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    sarah2774sarah2774 Member Posts: 238 Arc User
    westmetals wrote: »
    sarah2774 wrote: »
    Last year, they reran the whole year's Mudd Bundles all at once. Whether or not they'll do it again, and whether or not it'll include all Mudd bundles or just the most recent year's bundles, or whatever, that's purely speculative. Mudd was brand new last year, which is a generally useless sample size of one. No trends can be inferred by it.

    https://sto.fandom.com/wiki/Zen_Store#Mudd.27s_Market
    When did they reran? If you scroll to bundles i don't see any rerun. Yes, it is still new and no trends can be inferred but so far no rerun as far as i notice.

    It was over the weekend of either Thanksgiving or Christmas, I forget which.

    Ok found it thanks. https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11482243
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    thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,165 Arc User
    edited June 2021


    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11489213

    In addition, everything else in Mudd's Market (except the other three bundles) will be on sale for 75% off from 6/10 at 8am PT (17:00 CEST) - 6/14 at 10am PT (19:00 CEST)!

    We're adding a special version of the pack on PC! The Mudd's MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle is a one stop purchase to obtain all eight items in the pack at once! The pack contains all eight items, no choices needed. It will also launch on 6/10, for 60000 Zen, but will be 50% off until 6/24 at 10am PT. Here's how it works:


    *The MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will appear in Midd's Market at the same time as the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack

    *This is a once per account purchase. When purchased, it will disappear from the store. If you'd like, you can still purchase the Into Darkness and Beyond Pack for more of the non-ship items.

    *Purchasing the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will drop an item in your inventory, that you can unpack to receive the items.

    *If you wish to buy both the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle and the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack, you must purchase the bundle first. Any purchase of the Choice Pack will cause the Bundle to disappear from the store.

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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    evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,950 Arc User


    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11489213

    In addition, everything else in Mudd's Market (except the other three bundles) will be on sale for 75% off from 6/10 at 8am PT (17:00 CEST) - 6/14 at 10am PT (19:00 CEST)!

    We're adding a special version of the pack on PC! The Mudd's MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle is a one stop purchase to obtain all eight items in the pack at once! The pack contains all eight items, no choices needed. It will also launch on 6/10, for 60000 Zen, but will be 50% off until 6/24 at 10am PT. Here's how it works:


    *The MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will appear in Midd's Market at the same time as the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack

    *This is a once per account purchase. When purchased, it will disappear from the store. If you'd like, you can still purchase the Into Darkness and Beyond Pack for more of the non-ship items.

    *Purchasing the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will drop an item in your inventory, that you can unpack to receive the items.

    *If you wish to buy both the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle and the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack, you must purchase the bundle first. Any purchase of the Choice Pack will cause the Bundle to disappear from the store.

    That's a hard pass, the only items I want are ships and the mega bundle price is MORE expensive than buying the regular bundle twice. If the mega bundle was a pick 4 or pick 6 deal with a regular price around 40-45k (20-22.5k on sale) then I might have something to think about, but all 8 for $300 isn't worth it when half of it is junk.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
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    jivedutchjivedutch Member Posts: 357 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    Methinks this is either a typo, or a MUDDo ...
    Double buying of the pack enables 2x (2x ship + keys) as option ... for less cost than the whole shebang .. and getting tokens i wouldnt be using coz i alreayd have all cstore ships, and the 8 tokens i already have i can never use on the new ships anyways

    50 keys is 5625
    9 T6X is 6000
    If you done all your events .. the bound epic token is mostly worthless, unless you have a hard time farming 81 zen worth of dili for a phoenix 40pack
    If you still have a shopping list .. the 100% tokens might be worth something if bound.
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    garaffegaraffe Member Posts: 1,353 Arc User
    $$$
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    thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,165 Arc User
    edited June 2021


    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11489213

    In addition, everything else in Mudd's Market (except the other three bundles) will be on sale for 75% off from 6/10 at 8am PT (17:00 CEST) - 6/14 at 10am PT (19:00 CEST)!

    We're adding a special version of the pack on PC! The Mudd's MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle is a one stop purchase to obtain all eight items in the pack at once! The pack contains all eight items, no choices needed. It will also launch on 6/10, for 60000 Zen, but will be 50% off until 6/24 at 10am PT. Here's how it works:


    *The MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will appear in Midd's Market at the same time as the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack

    *This is a once per account purchase. When purchased, it will disappear from the store. If you'd like, you can still purchase the Into Darkness and Beyond Pack for more of the non-ship items.

    *Purchasing the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will drop an item in your inventory, that you can unpack to receive the items.

    *If you wish to buy both the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle and the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack, you must purchase the bundle first. Any purchase of the Choice Pack will cause the Bundle to disappear from the store.

    ...well, they heard the suggestion about a deluxe version. The price is a bit out of touch with reality though.

    I mean...it is and it isn't. If you look at it from the perspective of getting 5 lockbox ships, 1 lobi ship, and 1 promo ship...all as account unlocks...for $300 (on sale) (when it normally costs $100-200 just to get a single lockbox/promo ship on a single character), it's not.

    But having said that, if you are ONLY using the original pack as a measurement of price breakdown per ship ($25 per ship if you get 6 ships) then if someone ONLY wants the 1 extra ship they couldn't fit into their original pack coice, the price increase is way too much for a single ship IMO.

    So there are different ways to look at it.

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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    davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,544 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    Yep, That's "technically" better than buying the regular pack twice because besides the 4 ships you get 4 x fluff instead of 2 x fluff. Of course what people really wanted was a "choose 4" for maybe $200.

    For me, I have all the event ships so the Phoenix token is useless since I can't sell it on the exchange. I have plenty of X-ship tokens already.
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    sovereign010sovereign010 Member Posts: 636 Arc User
    The 100% T6 ship coupons are of as little use as the epic phoenix tokens, I've had a handful of those drop but nothing to spend them on, and previous events have given me various 50% and 100% off coupons, the only one of those I spent was to get the Titan. I have a few experimental upgrades but they're too awesome to use so I haven't touched them. The keys as always are a lottery, have gotten all manner of random items out of them and need to make use of those.

    Until the option of taking 4 instead of 3 comes along I have to make the choice- because Kelvin 1 and Vengeance between them have the Alternate Timeline Set they go together. This leaves the final ship, the Kelvin heavy destroyer or the Spockmobile? The latter's console is useful for phaser-armed science captains. I have 2 of the former and 4 of the latter, but they're all separate characters.
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    husanakxhusanakx Member Posts: 1,601 Arc User
    Wait wait wait... hold on... let me see if I can work this cryptic math. That MEGA deal is a massive rip off. lol
    Ok you get 8 instead of 6 items buying twice. But I mean seriously CRYPTIC stop with the fluff. If people want to buy master keys they are in the store... and often on sale for under 2k for 20, WITH very nice instant gear upgrades. If people want ship upgrade tokens they are also in the store... as are T6 ships if people want to buy them. I guess the epic phoneix can't be purchased... but I mean what do those even unlock anymore, a couple old and dated event ships no one really cares about.

    The proper thing to do here and we all know it... would have been to simply bundle the Vengence in with one of the Kelvin packs so people could complete the set and not have to double buy to get a Promo pack ship.

    This is one of the greediest cash grabs I have seen them pull. If I buy this (and I admit I might those Kelvin ship unlocks are nice) I will skip the vengeance and be forever reminded just how greedy Cryptic is. Perhaps its just time to park the wallet on this game. I don't claim to be a whale but I though Cryptic the equivalent of a full priced AAA title at them every year.... making this my most expensive game anyway. I mean Epics sale is on for another few weeks... I could buy 6 or 7 AAA titles... or account unlock 3 STO ships. I don't know its starting to be a pretty hard sell ST license or no. lol
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    evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,950 Arc User
    The 100% T6 ship coupons are of as little use as the epic phoenix tokens

    Yeah I have two sitting in the bank right now with no idea what to use them on, the few ships that I'd be interested in getting with them are prime candidates for a future Legendary bundle and I don't want to get burned again like I did earlier this year when I bought the Ambassador a week before the Legendary was revealed.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
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    sentinel64sentinel64 Member Posts: 900 Arc User
    With the latest update, when do we get the punchline to this joke? Not a punch to my gut... to take all the money out of my wallet.
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    jozen#9312 jozen Member Posts: 102 Arc User
    These guys have deluded themselves with greed at this point.

    This whole Mudds Market operation is great marketing. Please refer to Bill Hicks on marketing.

    You give away 3+ ships a year, you've sold ships in the C-Store for $5. The tier cost system is total artificial inflation.

    You technically sell lotto ships for $1.25, though you'll rarely have to suffer it.

    Microsoft Visio right now costs $309. You want $600 for a pack of digital scratch and wins, a token for a previously free ship, and the lost revenues from however lotto tickets you may or may not have sold. oh and two coupons for T6 (or T5 with a trait) ships from the C-store...which has gotten few updates lately and is now FULL of redundant skins.

    Yep. Watch Bill Hicks on marketing.
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    husanakxhusanakx Member Posts: 1,601 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    husanakx wrote: »
    Wait wait wait... hold on... let me see if I can work this cryptic math. That MEGA deal is a massive rip off. lol
    Not really.
    • Lockbox ships cost anywhere from 200-250 dollars worth of keys, on average, to pull. They are also single character unlocks that you can't reclaim if you discard them.
    • In total these 7 ships would cost anywhere from 1400, to 1750, dollars worth of keys, if you pulled them from the lockboxes normally, for unreclaimable, single character, ships.
    • This "mega pack" costs 600 dollars at full price, anywhere from 57%-65% off the cost of buying the keys for these ships the normal way.
    • At the 50% off price of 300 dollars that makes it a 78%-82% discount compared to the cost of these ships normally.
    • Mudd's ships are also account unlocks, allowing you to claim them on every character on your account. Which further increases the saving compared to getting these ships normally on multiple characters
    Still very expensive yes, but a massive discount compared to before.

    I was comparing the mega price to the standard mudd price.

    So I can pay $150 for 3 ships.... or $300 for 4.

    NO one cares about the other junk in the pack. If I want to buy keys I would buy keys if I want to buy a T6 ship they are always on the store. (and I own basically all of them anyway... and I don't need phoenix tokens I own the ships)

    A proper mega pack would have been them saying Mega pack... Pick 4 for 40,000 zen or 20,000 with the 50% off sale.

    That is the value.... the extra junk you can buy on the exchange is not the point of the mudd packs. The only issue most people have with this pack... is the prospect of having to buy it twice to unlock all the previously gamble only ships.

    And thinking about it... why don't they just experiment a bit and go the other way.... offer the mudd lite pack choice... for 10k zen with the sale for a pick 2 box. People might buy 2 pick 2 boxes for 20k zen and grab the ships. Heck they might even find they sell a ton more as more casual players may spend on a lite pack.
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    The true comparison is between the Standard and Mega Bundles, not the slight of hand comparison with the the base components, for which the math would have been even truer with the Standard Pack and the Ship (only) selections there.

    The Mega is the same sort of crazy deal like the Premium Tenth Anniversary Bundle was in comparison with the Standard Tenth th Anniversary Bundle.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,165 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    The problem with this argument is that its the same argument people have made for the other Mudd packs, and the DSC/KDF/ROM starer packs. Yet, despite the claim no one cares, from what Cryptic has said people keep buying them and using these fluff items... so obviously they do care, or at least enough to buy it at the rate Cryptic considers successful enough to keep making more.

    As you read the following, bear in mind I'm not actually disagreeing with anything you said, just adding some extra details:

    Regarding the "fluff" items, we all know the ships are the main selling points. However Cryptic wants to be able to charge a certain amount for these packs(I'm not saying that's right or wrong, just a fact) and these "fluff" items allow them to justify a specific price point. They exist so when people complain about the price, the response (whether you think it's valid or not) is to point to these additional items and then explain how each of their supposed value corresponds to the price of the pack.

    Regarding people using these "fluff" items: well, of course people are going to use something that was part of what they paid for. Using myself as an example, I bought the legendary T'liss pack and the Legendary D7 only because I wanted the ships. The "fluff" that came with the ships had literally no impact on my purchase. However, because it was included in my purchase, of course I used some of them. The point is that my using that stuff in no way indicates I actually wanted it, so Cryptic saying 'people use the fluff' does not actually mean anything.

    The most important point, however, is this: regardless of what any of us think, money talks. So the fact that they keep doing these huge packs is proof that the previous ones sold well. That's all that actually matters to Cryptic, not anybody's 10 cents on the forums.

    PS: nothing I said above is meant to sound like a dig at Cryptic. It's only intended to be realistic.

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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    westx211westx211 Member Posts: 42,246 Arc User
    edited June 2021
    300 dollars for 4 ships and a bunch of random garbage that I don't care about. I'd rather just buy the normal bundle and miss out on one of the ships
    Post edited by westx211 on
    Men are not punished for their sins, but by them.
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    thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,165 Arc User
    Regarding the "fluff" items, we all know the ships are the main selling points. However Cryptic wants to be able to charge a certain amount for these packs(I'm not saying that's right or wrong, just a fact) and these "fluff" items allow them to justify a specific price point.
    Not necessarily disagreeing with you, but with the cost of these ships normally they could easily not include any of these fluff items, and still charge the same amounts since, as I showed with my previous post, its still a very very high discount even not taking them into the equation.

    Yeah, they could definitely sell just the ships for $1-300 each (depending on whether it's lockbox or promo). And in a way I wish they would, because then nobody could complain about the fluff, and people could easily point out "it's the same price you're paying for a single character bound ship, but now it's account unlocked".

    But I think they must have some kind of information...market research...whatever...that tells them that just selling the ships for those prices would look bad. Also, in explaining "it's the same price you're paying for a single character bound ship" it might also hurt their lockbox income if they actually come out and admit the rates are so low that that is what it costs on average to get those ships from the boxes.

    I'm sure there are a lot of reasons they do it they way they do. But as discussed, I think the fluff just allows them to set a certain price point and 'justify' it by factoring the value of the fluff without focusing too closely on the high value of the ships (created by super low lock box odds).

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    If people are falling all over themselves for the so-called 'fluff', then they should take the Discovery, Romulan, and Klingon Legendary Bundles and create two Bundles for each. A Premium Bundle for 12k Zen, which is the Bundles we have today. Introduce a 'Standard' Bundle, which is just the Ship and any Consoles and Traits, for 8k Zen.

    Then we'll see if people really like all the 'fluff'.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,950 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    If people are falling all over themselves for the so-called 'fluff', then they should take the Discovery, Romulan, and Klingon Legendary Bundles and create two Bundles for each. A Premium Bundle for 12k Zen, which is the Bundles we have today. Introduce a 'Standard' Bundle, which is just the Ship and any Consoles and Traits, for 8k Zen.

    Then we'll see if people really like all the 'fluff'.

    I'd just like them to offer some additional boosts separately from bundles, I keep coming up with ideas for new characters but I hate leveling them up.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
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    nommo#5819 nommo Member Posts: 1,105 Arc User
    I don't like the MEGA bundle but since it's an option I'm not too concerned about it. I'm still deciding about the regular version of this bundle though so I got a question.

    Sorry if it's already been verified yay or nay, but is that "Jellyfish" ship's Quad Micro Photon Torpedo useable on others ships?

    I saw where the ship's console, Eject red matter, is so yippie for phaser users but the torp didn't have a link.

    Thanks in advance for any verification.
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    szerontzurszerontzur Member Posts: 2,724 Arc User
    The more I mull over it, the more I think this bundle was designed in response to the 'failure' of the 11th Anniversary Bundle.
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    jivedutchjivedutch Member Posts: 357 Arc User
    Pointing out the thinking thought on this and previously "leaked" information on this ..
    The price point is set by PWE , and cryptic dev's try to work in the confines set by PWE to make the bundles attractive to players, and PWE allows them to add " fluff" to increase the perceived value.

    The case is not that the main attractions of the pack (ships in this case) are worth the "50,-" or 5k Zen per choice item ..
    It is due to there being 4 ships, and only 3 choices for it, in the normal pack, and not having the option to get the 4 choices for 20k , or a modification to the bundle, and putting the Vengeance/Jellyfish together as an option, alongside the other 2 ship-choices.

    As i and others pointed out ... the other individual options do not appear to be of equal value.
    Epic Phoeninx pack for a account bound single char ship is problematic in enough ways .. IMHO this should not be in an account-unlock bundle ,the unlock for the ship from the Epic token should be account wide, considering the cost and droprates as they are now.
    This is a seperate problem

    And it is not even considering the restriction on maximum purchasing, many people not even being able to purchase enough Zen to get the bundle anyway....
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    saurializardsaurializard Member Posts: 4,401 Arc User
    Apparently more text was added in the blog, and oh boy...
    The MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will appear in Midd's Market at the same time as the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack
    This is a once per account purchase. When purchased, it will disappear from the store. If you'd like, you can still purchase the Into Darkness and Beyond Pack for more of the non-ship items.
    Purchasing the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle will drop an item in your inventory, that you can unpack to receive the items.
    If you wish to buy both the MEGA Into Darkness and Beyond Bundle and the Into Darkness and Beyond Choice Pack, you must purchase the bundle first. Any purchase of the Choice Pack will cause the Bundle to disappear from the store.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLN7Hxo11AI
    #TASforSTO
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    Ok, so say someone took all but one Ship in the Standard Bundle, let's figure out the theoretical cost of the remaining five items for the Premium Bundle, based upon C-Store prices and other extrapolation.

    The remaining ship - 10,000 Zen (based on 1/3 the cost of the Stanard Bundle for one slot, rounded up).

    50 Keys or 5 x 1,125 - 5,625 Zen.

    9 Experimental Upgrades or 3 x 2,000 - 6,000 Zen

    2 T6 Coupons or 2 x 3,000 - 6,000 Zen

    So far, for 4 items we have 27,625 Zen, leaving 2,875 Zen for the Epic Token giving a T6 Single Character Ship or 4 Experimental Upgrades (cost normally 3,000 Zen at 2,000 + 1,000).

    Now, if you needed or wanted all that stuff, then yes, the additional pricing is within the mark. If not, then get three slots of Ships and wait for rhe 75% Christmas Sale and get the remaining Ship and two slots of whatever.

    For me, the T6 Coupons are worthless. I still have one. The only reason I spent the other is when they scr×wed up on the Titan release.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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