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Forums > Home› Star Trek Online General Discussion

Tzengethi got nerfed vs. exotic ?

doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,188 Arc User
edited August 2023 in Star Trek Online General Discussion
I know Tzengethi used to have a high resistance vs. epg damage but this seems not to be the case no more anybody else noticed this?
C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
Post edited by baddmoonrizin on

Comments

  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 10,918 Arc User
    Yeah, I don't remember them ever being more resistant to exotic, they simply benefit when you pull then together due to the fact that TZ ships can buff one another.

    As said above, EPG is not a damage type, it would be exotic damage. Maybe they once did resist exotic damage, but I don't remember that.
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  • jennycolvinjennycolvin Member Posts: 1,100 Arc User
    It's pretty clear they meant exotic damage, so let's not nitpick for the sake of nitpicking, uhm?

    As for your question, OP, I can't say I've noticed anything particularly out of the ordinary, tho sometimes there's so much going around you that's it's difficult to say for sure.
    Do you have some example to give, so we can maybe go and test for ourselves?
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  • doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,188 Arc User
    So yeah i noticed on advanced they pop way faster then they used to since the last patch. Since i play random tfo's quiet frequently I think something changed and I'm not the only one who noticed in my fleet. They just pop quiet a bit faster and they didn't used too they have had the highest exotic damage resistance from all the species out there. There was a reason for people calling in tzengethi front not to use gravity well ect...
    C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
  • jennycolvinjennycolvin Member Posts: 1,100 Arc User
    Tbf, as @seaofsorrows said, they do buff each other quite a lot, so pulling them all together is not the best strategy you can use and it can explain why they seem(ed) more resistant to exotic damage - or any kind of damge, really.

    That said, I will keep an eye out and see if they're truly more vulnerable to it now. It will be interesting, at least: something "new" to look out for.
    kv1Ohsx.png
    Not agreeing with someone doesn't give you the right to be an TRIBBLE.

    Ci sono tre tipi di giocatori:
    - quelli a cui non va mai bene niente... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
    - quelli che sono talmente imbesuiti da credere a qualunque cosa i dev dicano, perfino che la luna è fatta di formaggio... e vanno sul forum a trollare;
    - quelli che credono a quello a cui è giusto credere, sono d'accordo con quello con cui è giusto essere d'accordo e sono critici con quello che non va;

    Ai giocatori dei primi due tipi, gratis in omaggio un bello specchio lucente su cui arrampicarsi. E una mazzata in testa per la loro poca intelligenza e compassione verso gli altri giocatori che non la pensano come loro.
    Agli appartenenti al terzo tipo, invece, dico grazie. Anche se non sempre si riesce a mantenere la calma, siete quelli per cui vale la pena incazzarsi.
  • doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,188 Arc User
    I know the Cruisers make the Battle Cruisers immune its not that i m not familiar with them, i just seem to kill them way faster then what i m used too on my science toons.
    C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
  • vetteguy904vetteguy904 Member Posts: 3,857 Arc User
    I think what it was is that GWs pulled them together and the shields re-enforced making evergy weapons less effective, but there have been some additions to Exotic that is doing more damage, and that damage either ignores or at least penetrates 50% and now have 100% up time. would an old fashioned GW kill them? yes but slowly, but now, all you have to do is kill one and let the warp breach get the job done for you
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  • foxrockssocksfoxrockssocks Member Posts: 2,482 Arc User
    I haven't noticed anything specific here. What needs to be understood, though, is that the cruisers are what gives the protection to the other ships. So even if you are using a GW, as long as you're burning the cruisers fast enough, it can still be a viable strategy in spite of the temporary immunity. Once the cruisers go down, the rest fall like dominoes.

    Also there is WAY more to exotic damage than gravity well, and you don't need GW to have a strong exotic damage build. That is often forgotten.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5
    fleetcaptain5#1134
         Member Posts: 4,786 Arc User
    corinthalas wrote: »
    EPG is not a damage type. It may have been that they had unusually high resistance (or an ability that gave them such) to non-standard damage types (physical, radiation, proton, etc), and that got nerfed, but it might also be that you've been fighting them around a cruiser which is providing other ships nearby a massive damage reduction effect. Without the cruiser, Tzenkethi ships aren't much more durable than any other ships...usually. There are the odd occasions where a lone ship mysteriously becomes nearly immune to all damage, until somebody else flies in and obliterates it in a blink of the eye, so I don't know.

    There's nothing mysterious about it though.

    Those are simply shield repair drones. When you have a 'kill x Tzenkethi ships' endeavour, sometimes you can kill 3 ships by destroying 1 battlecruiser. The other 2 ships that are counted are those drones.

    If you check the combat log (manually I mean, in the chat box) you'll see references to those drones.

    If someone's suddenly obliterating those ships, it's likely because they know how to target them with, for example, torpedo spreads.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5
    fleetcaptain5#1134
         Member Posts: 4,786 Arc User
    doctorstegi wrote: »
    I know Tzengethi used to have a high resistance vs. epg damage but this seems not to be the case no more anybody else noticed this?

    Maybe, slowly, players are starting to pay attention.

    As has been noticed here, there are still people who throw out gravity wells without thinking about it and then continue hitting spacebar without paying attention to what they're targeting (usually from the wrong angle as well).

    At some point someone will destroy the cruisers, a battleship will just happen to turn with its front facing towards a player and that player will, hopefully, realise what just happened. It takes time though as situational awareness isn't that great amongst STO players.

    What you are seeing may simply be the result of fewer players using dumb tactics and more players thinking about what they're doing.


    Also, there are more effective counters to GW such as Delayed Overload Cascade. So that may also partially explain why ships are killed faster, because dumb actions of other players can be countered more effectively.


    (Note: there are of course players who use GW and who do know what they're doing. They're rare though.)
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5
    fleetcaptain5#1134
         Member Posts: 4,786 Arc User
    corinthalas wrote: »
    fleetcaptain5#1134 wrote: »
    corinthalas wrote: »
    EPG is not a damage type. It may have been that they had unusually high resistance (or an ability that gave them such) to non-standard damage types (physical, radiation, proton, etc), and that got nerfed, but it might also be that you've been fighting them around a cruiser which is providing other ships nearby a massive damage reduction effect. Without the cruiser, Tzenkethi ships aren't much more durable than any other ships...usually. There are the odd occasions where a lone ship mysteriously becomes nearly immune to all damage, until somebody else flies in and obliterates it in a blink of the eye, so I don't know.

    There's nothing mysterious about it though.

    Those are simply shield repair drones. When you have a 'kill x Tzenkethi ships' endeavour, sometimes you can kill 3 ships by destroying 1 battlecruiser. The other 2 ships that are counted are those drones.

    If you check the combat log (manually I mean, in the chat box) you'll see references to those drones.

    If someone's suddenly obliterating those ships, it's likely because they know how to target them with, for example, torpedo spreads.

    Unless those shield repair drones are literally invisible, that does not apply. It's a ship, all by itself, nothing and no one else around, shrugging off multiple barrages, including repeated regular torpedo spreads.

    Well they do exist. It's the most likely explanation. It could be that the immunity lingers for a while after they've been destroyed.

    I've never seen a ship get immune for much longer without those drones and no cruisers nearby.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,188 Arc User
    I don't know people in my fleet saying the same thing they pop faster on advanced then what they used too. I can't put my finger on it.
    C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
  • kyle223catkyle223cat Member Posts: 584 Arc User
    I don’t know about exotic damage specifically, but this might have something to do with the October 6, 2020 patch notes:

    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11479363

    “Tzenkethi innate resistances that scale up with loss of shields, now scale less aggressively.”
    da84303d8bc4080b9860968f634f98682215bbe5.gifv
  • eladonwarps#6040 eladonwarps
    eladonwarps#6040
         Member Posts: 231 Arc User
    kyle223cat wrote: »
    I don’t know about exotic damage specifically, but this might have something to do with the October 6, 2020 patch notes:

    https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/11479363

    “Tzenkethi innate resistances that scale up with loss of shields, now scale less aggressively.”

    See, I thought that was referring to Tzenkethi on the ground. Usually if they meant ships, they'd say ships. But we know that communication clarity has not been the strongest lately, so maybe it's ships, or both ships and ground enemies.

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  • chastity1337chastity1337 Member Posts: 1,606 Arc User
    fleetcaptain5#1134 wrote: »
    doctorstegi wrote: »
    I know Tzengethi used to have a high resistance vs. epg damage but this seems not to be the case no more anybody else noticed this?

    Maybe, slowly, players are starting to pay attention.

    As has been noticed here, there are still people who throw out gravity wells without thinking about it and then continue hitting spacebar without paying attention to what they're targeting (usually from the wrong angle as well).

    At some point someone will destroy the cruisers, a battleship will just happen to turn with its front facing towards a player and that player will, hopefully, realise what just happened. It takes time though as situational awareness isn't that great amongst STO players.

    What you are seeing may simply be the result of fewer players using dumb tactics and more players thinking about what they're doing.


    Also, there are more effective counters to GW such as Delayed Overload Cascade. So that may also partially explain why ships are killed faster, because dumb actions of other players can be countered more effectively.


    (Note: there are of course players who use GW and who do know what they're doing. They're rare though.)

    This kind of hate needs to stop. Categorically slandering all of us who use GW is neither reasonable nor helpful.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5
    fleetcaptain5#1134
         Member Posts: 4,786 Arc User
    chastity1337 wrote: »
    fleetcaptain5#1134 wrote: »
    doctorstegi wrote: »
    I know Tzengethi used to have a high resistance vs. epg damage but this seems not to be the case no more anybody else noticed this?

    Maybe, slowly, players are starting to pay attention.

    As has been noticed here, there are still people who throw out gravity wells without thinking about it and then continue hitting spacebar without paying attention to what they're targeting (usually from the wrong angle as well).

    At some point someone will destroy the cruisers, a battleship will just happen to turn with its front facing towards a player and that player will, hopefully, realise what just happened. It takes time though as situational awareness isn't that great amongst STO players.

    What you are seeing may simply be the result of fewer players using dumb tactics and more players thinking about what they're doing.


    Also, there are more effective counters to GW such as Delayed Overload Cascade. So that may also partially explain why ships are killed faster, because dumb actions of other players can be countered more effectively.


    (Note: there are of course players who use GW and who do know what they're doing. They're rare though.)

    This kind of hate needs to stop. Categorically slandering all of us who use GW is neither reasonable nor helpful.

    Yeah, that's not what anyone is doing.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • doctorstegidoctorstegi Member Posts: 1,188 Arc User
    chastity1337 wrote: »
    fleetcaptain5#1134 wrote: »
    doctorstegi wrote: »
    I know Tzengethi used to have a high resistance vs. epg damage but this seems not to be the case no more anybody else noticed this?

    Maybe, slowly, players are starting to pay attention.

    As has been noticed here, there are still people who throw out gravity wells without thinking about it and then continue hitting spacebar without paying attention to what they're targeting (usually from the wrong angle as well).

    At some point someone will destroy the cruisers, a battleship will just happen to turn with its front facing towards a player and that player will, hopefully, realise what just happened. It takes time though as situational awareness isn't that great amongst STO players.

    What you are seeing may simply be the result of fewer players using dumb tactics and more players thinking about what they're doing.


    Also, there are more effective counters to GW such as Delayed Overload Cascade. So that may also partially explain why ships are killed faster, because dumb actions of other players can be countered more effectively.


    (Note: there are of course players who use GW and who do know what they're doing. They're rare though.)

    This kind of hate needs to stop. Categorically slandering all of us who use GW is neither reasonable nor helpful.

    What has anything he said to do with hate? It's a fact that there is a lot of people out there who throw gravity wells left and right without thinking about it. Sometimes even killing optionals because of that.

    C-Store Inc. is still looking for active members on the fed side. If you don't have a fleet feel free to contact me in game @stegi.
  • spiritbornspiritborn Member Posts: 4,263 Arc User
    Yeah not all players who use Grav Wells are like that same way as not all players who use "Beam fire at will" are lazy a-holes who just spam space bar because anything else would be too much effort, that doesn't however change the fact that both of these player types exist and unlike mindless BAW spam mindless GW spam can hurt your team.

    Good players know when to use Gravity well and other abilities correctly and also when not to use them.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan
    legendarylycan#5411
         Member Posts: 37,280 Arc User
    edited November 2020
    people who 'are lazy a-holes who just spam spacebar because anything else would be too much effort' aren't using FAW anymore - they're using carrier spam, because that's even more low effort, and carriers are actually powerful enough that you can actually get halfway decent performance even with the barest minimum of effort or expenditure​​
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  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,569 Arc User
    edited November 2020
    Sorry, but when I go into Gron'cha with my Legendary Intrepid for an Endeavor, I beeline for the large Red Spheres. As soon as it lights up, Mega Grav Well III is fired off. I follow that with a TS II of Gravimetric, Neutronic, or Particle Emission. Some KCB and Black Ops Mines and finish off with Feedback Pulse II. Delayed Overload Cascade II, after that if necessary.

    Never a problem. Like the Roach Motel, "Roaches check in, but they don't check out!".

    Different than Advanced TFOs, so one size does not fit all.
    Post edited by ltminns on
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  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5
    fleetcaptain5#1134
         Member Posts: 4,786 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    Sorry, but when I go into Gron'cha with my Legendary Intrepid for an Endeavor, I beeline for the large Red Spheres. As soon as it lights up, Mega Grav Well III is fired off. I follow that with a TS III of Gravimetric, Neutronic, or Particle Emission. Some KCB and Black Ops Mines and finish off with Feedback Pulse II. Delayed Overload Cascade II, after that if necessary.

    Never a problem. Like the Roach Motel, "Roaches check in, but they don't check out!".

    Different than Advanced TFOs, so one size does not fit all.

    Which is perfectly fine because you clearly know what you're doing and you're following a thought through tactic.

    (In case anyone needed additional evidence that I'm not slandering GW-users in general.)
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • nixie50nixie50 Member Posts: 1,268 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    Sorry, but when I go into Gron'cha with my Legendary Intrepid for an Endeavor, I beeline for the large Red Spheres. As soon as it lights up, Mega Grav Well III is fired off. I follow that with a TS III of Gravimetric, Neutronic, or Particle Emission. Some KCB and Black Ops Mines and finish off with Feedback Pulse II. Delayed Overload Cascade II, after that if necessary.

    Never a problem. Like the Roach Motel, "Roaches check in, but they don't check out!".

    Different than Advanced TFOs, so one size does not fit all.
    ltminns wrote: »
    Sorry, but when I go into Gron'cha with my Legendary Intrepid for an Endeavor, I beeline for the large Red Spheres. As soon as it lights up, Mega Grav Well III is fired off. I follow that with a TS III of Gravimetric, Neutronic, or Particle Emission. Some KCB and Black Ops Mines and finish off with Feedback Pulse II. Delayed Overload Cascade II, after that if necessary.

    Never a problem. Like the Roach Motel, "Roaches check in, but they don't check out!".

    Different than Advanced TFOs, so one size does not fit all.

    yup. MegaGW III, subspace Vortex, TSII grav or particle emissions, Iso cannon. by the time I turn around TS II in the other seat is coming off CD and a spread of Neutronic. if anything is alive at that point it's crippled by the multiple warp breaches
    u7acy6aymfw7.gif
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