the episode does note that those assimilated as children have a lot of borg tech left in them because it becomes unsafe to remove it if they grow up with the hardware. which BTW neatly explains why Seven has the borg implants on her but Picard doesn't
Any former Borg can't survive without all their implants taken out, a balance has to be struck between the biological and technological components. Picard was once assimilated as a Borg and had those visible elements removed from his body after being severed from the collective, but internally he would still have some Borg technology within him.
It was alluded to in First Contact that Picard still had some kind of connection to the collective still:
at 3:18 a voice is heard that Picard understood before ordering the fleet to a specific coordinate on the cube to destroy it.
It suggests at the very least that he still has Borg devices within him and the queen was attempting to communicate in some fashion.
i doubt any person assimilated would be free of the technology after being freed from the collective irrespective of their age.
Can't help but wonder if the tech that Picard already had within him, namely his artifical heart, had any influence on matters. I mean, entirely possible that they replaced the new one that he received in 'Samaritan Snare' when they 'reversed' his assimilation, but it wasn't stated one way or the other.
'Tapestry' indicated that the artifical heart was a pretty sensitive piece of tech.
I always wondered why they couldn't just give him a pill to grow a new one.
^^^
What do you think it is - a Kidney?
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
the episode does note that those assimilated as children have a lot of borg tech left in them because it becomes unsafe to remove it if they grow up with the hardware. which BTW neatly explains why Seven has the borg implants on her but Picard doesn't
Any former Borg can't survive without all their implants taken out, a balance has to be struck between the biological and technological components. Picard was once assimilated as a Borg and had those visible elements removed from his body after being severed from the collective, but internally he would still have some Borg technology within him.
It was alluded to in First Contact that Picard still had some kind of connection to the collective still:
at 3:18 a voice is heard that Picard understood before ordering the fleet to a specific coordinate on the cube to destroy it.
It suggests at the very least that he still has Borg devices within him and the queen was attempting to communicate in some fashion.
i doubt any person assimilated would be free of the technology after being freed from the collective irrespective of their age.
Can't help but wonder if the tech that Picard already had within him, namely his artifical heart, had any influence on matters. I mean, entirely possible that they replaced the new one that he received in 'Samaritan Snare' when they 'reversed' his assimilation, but it wasn't stated one way or the other.
'Tapestry' indicated that the artifical heart was a pretty sensitive piece of tech.
I always wondered why they couldn't just give him a pill to grow a new one.
^^^
What do you think it is - a Kidney?
That scene always bugged me. It makes more sense if the pill makes the kidney heal instead of literally growing a new one.
why? kidneys can regenerate by themselves if they've been injured and the damage isn't too extensive - the pill obviously just aids that process
dialysis is an artificial aid to help kidneys perform functions they can no longer do, but there was nothing in that scene that suggested the woman's kidney was COMPLETELY gone
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
the episode does note that those assimilated as children have a lot of borg tech left in them because it becomes unsafe to remove it if they grow up with the hardware. which BTW neatly explains why Seven has the borg implants on her but Picard doesn't
Any former Borg can't survive without all their implants taken out, a balance has to be struck between the biological and technological components. Picard was once assimilated as a Borg and had those visible elements removed from his body after being severed from the collective, but internally he would still have some Borg technology within him.
It was alluded to in First Contact that Picard still had some kind of connection to the collective still:
at 3:18 a voice is heard that Picard understood before ordering the fleet to a specific coordinate on the cube to destroy it.
It suggests at the very least that he still has Borg devices within him and the queen was attempting to communicate in some fashion.
i doubt any person assimilated would be free of the technology after being freed from the collective irrespective of their age.
Can't help but wonder if the tech that Picard already had within him, namely his artifical heart, had any influence on matters. I mean, entirely possible that they replaced the new one that he received in 'Samaritan Snare' when they 'reversed' his assimilation, but it wasn't stated one way or the other.
'Tapestry' indicated that the artifical heart was a pretty sensitive piece of tech.
I always wondered why they couldn't just give him a pill to grow a new one.
^^^
What do you think it is - a Kidney?
That scene always bugged me. It makes more sense if the pill makes the kidney heal instead of literally growing a new one.
Picard needing an artificial heart seems more unrealistic than growing a new kidney with a drug. Needing an artificial heart is 20th and 21st Century technology not 24th Century technology. An artificial heart that is part of a system that allows its user in any environment seems more like 24th Century technology.
We currently are trying to grow human organs in pigs. I imagine the pill process would be fairly similar, because those aren't replacing the pig's organs, they are kinda extra, vestigial organs, as far as I understand it. So the new kidney could well have grown next to the old bad one, and the body or pill decides to use the new kidney and let the old one atrophy away, or simply have a surgeon remove the old one.
If that doesn't seem plausible to you, there are plenty of cases of massive tumors growing inside people for years, yet never completely inhibited the function of the organs it was displacing.
> @valoreah said: > (Quote) > > In Star Trek? Yes, it does seem out of place. In other sci fi? Not so much. > > Did she have to vaporize her? Nope. Easily could have taken her in and, you know, let the courts decide. Is that not the Federation way?
I haven’t seen the bridge freak out episode yet but I watched this one today. The slaughtered Romulan senator bothered me but at least Picard awklowledged that that was messed up...
But beyond even just whether Seven would kill that lady—I didn’t even get how they knew each other. She was a federation science officer who sold seven’s friends for parts. If seven was hellbent on killing her—I’m sure she would have done it a long time ago.
And if seven was using the bop—why did she shoot at Picard? Lot of plot holes in there I think. Johnathan Frakes direction was really good though. Especially Episode 4–it was really beautifuly shot. Too bad the script wasn’t tighter.
And does anyone else find the Romulan Ronin archetype a little too Orientalists? Star Trek especially TOS had a bad habit of using Asiatic stereotypes for villains. And they seem to go to Samurai culture when they want valent alien hero’s...feels rather rehashed without thinking to me.
On the other hand I hope we get some Romulan swords in STO
Really agree about the DISCO design. I think we forget though about the fact that Viacom and CBS were separate still when Discovery hit...that combined with the Abrams influence almost necessities a new designs. And if we want back to TOS design (And I hope someday we can) —there are fewer new toys that need to be sold. JJ made C-3po’s arm red not only because 3PO gets disassembled a lot—but because it requires new models. Do you prefer repaired mask Kylie or original...etc...
Also if we get Pike I am sure they will just redress the DISCO set to save money...because Star Trek gets cheaper per Episode the longer you can keep it going
> @qultuq said: > > @valoreah said: > > (Quote) > > > > In Star Trek? Yes, it does seem out of place. In other sci fi? Not so much. > > > > Did she have to vaporize her? Nope. Easily could have taken her in and, you know, let the courts decide. Is that not the Federation way? > > I haven’t seen the bridge freak out episode yet but I watched this one today. The slaughtered Romulan senator bothered me but at least Picard awklowledged that that was messed up... > > But beyond even just whether Seven would kill that lady—I didn’t even get how they knew each other. She was a federation science officer who sold seven’s friends for parts. If seven was hellbent on killing her—I’m sure she would have done it a long time ago. > > And if seven was using the bop—why did she shoot at Picard? Lot of plot holes in there I think. Johnathan Frakes direction was really good though. Especially Episode 4–it was really beautifuly shot. Too bad the script wasn’t tighter. > > And does anyone else find the Romulan Ronin archetype a little too Orientalists? Star Trek especially TOS had a bad habit of using Asiatic stereotypes for villains. And they seem to go to Samurai culture when they want valent alien hero’s...feels rather rehashed without thinking to me. > > On the other hand I hope we get some Romulan swords in STO > >
I hope they are streight blades and not just katanas. Besides sword experts often point out katanas(and any curved sword for that matter) are horrible against actual armor. Even users of the katana. They are made for unarmored targets.
Thinking of ideas from lots of games for, dunno how long now.
> > I hope they are streight blades and not just katanas. Besides sword experts often point out katanas(and any curved sword for that matter) are horrible against actual armor. Even users of the katana. They are made for unarmored targets.
I think his sword might be straight, yes? The sheath looked more like a bow than a katana—maybe the producers were thinking of him more like an elf.
They also have the tarot and rune stuff going on with these Picard Romulans too.
I was reading about Bat’leths the other day and many people argue they are very inefficient weapons too. In STO they don’t have great reach either...
But beyond even just whether Seven would kill that lady—I didn’t even get how they knew each other. She was a federation science officer who sold seven’s friends for parts. If seven was hellbent on killing her—I’m sure she would have done it a long time ago.
Nowhere is it said Jay was a Fed Sci Officer, all points to her being a criminal overlord who owns a good chunk of Freecloud and tricked the Fenris Rangers into thinking she wanted to help them. And Seven wanted to kill her AFTER she got intimate enough with her, because she found out she only used that to get to Icheb and other other xBs' implants.
As for why she didn't get to kill her earlier, it's probably due to the fact the Fenris Rangers kept their money on Freecloud, where Jay had her criminal empire. They could have launched a full-scale assault to kill her (and I'm sure they'd have LOVED to do so), but that would have caused them a lot of issues they really didn't need since they already didn't have enough manpower to maintain order as best as they would have liked, and lose all their money.
That's like in The Mandalorian where the Mandos don't just attack the Empire directly and even work with them. They HATE that, especially since the Empire instigated a purge on them, but they have to do whatever they can to survive because they're few and lacking resources.
With Picard, Seven finally had a big opportunity to get close to Jay without directly implicating the Rangers.
And if seven was using the bop—why did she shoot at Picard? Lot of plot holes in there I think.
Where could one even get this idea?
She wasn't flying the BOP, she was flying the fighter assisting Picard in taking down the BOP and that crashed on the planetary shield.
given it's supposed to be a sword.. the Bet'leth really isn't a very effective weapon, lacking eaither the single point of a good thrusting blade, nor the ideal shape for a good cutting blade. and it looks just awkward,
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
> @saurializard said: > (Quote) > Nowhere is it said Jay was a Fed Sci Officer, all points to her being a criminal overlord who owns a good chunk of Freecloud and tricked the Fenris Rangers into thinking she wanted to help them. And Seven wanted to kill her AFTER she got intimate enough with her, because she found out she only used that to get to Icheb and other other xBs' implants.
Thanks I will try to watch it again.
> @shadowfang240 said: > which makes a klingon bat'leth master all the more deadly, because they had to train their way through all that awkwardness and disadvantage
I tend to agree. Having a weapon that is better designed for defense makes sense for its ceremonial nature especially.
Someone on Trek BBS cited the episode where Worf finds the Romulan prison camp. The kids use Klingon weapons as farm tools.
Although Worf reprimands the boy. The guys argument was that perhaps it did originate as a farm tool.
I tend to think when we as fans need to rationalize Star Trek it points to bad writing. Bat’leths are cool though.
I was reading about Bat’leths the other day and many people argue they are very inefficient weapons too. In STO they don’t have great reach either...
There have been real weapons kinda similar to a batleth, but they're rather defensive weapons.
I always thought bat'leths were made like "arm-wrestling weapons" where the main interest is to keep them locked with each opponent trying to knock the other down either by pushing them hard or by hitting their head, where they can finish them off with the pointy ends.
That said...
There is zero excuse for this kind of bat'leths in Discovery... or any sane scenario for that matter.
Those abominations only exist to accidentally injure and impale their owners without much help. In fact that's how the Torchbearer gets killed if you look closely at his brief scene with Burnham
Enjoying the show, it is taking a while to get going...... but maybe thats a good thing.
It is already halfway though the season, if it is not "going" by now it probably never will (or at least not in this season anyway).
Since a modern TV serial is pretty much a single story per season in eight to thirteen parts, if PIC is using a linear plot structure they would have moved out of the exposition stage and into the rising action stage by the third installment at most (usually metaplot exposition is mostly covered in the series pilot episode(s) in a normal series). Depending on exactly where they put the climax it could be coming up as soon as the next segment (it should fall somewhere in the third quarter of the season more or less), since the falling action and resolution stages would together cover two or three segments if you put a normal novel plot grid over ten episodes.
The Kzinthi are mentioned in the current Episode. I guess not verboten anymore.
The closing of the Jarleth System Patrol months ago makes sense given this Episode.
Post edited by ltminns on
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Someone on Trek BBS cited the episode where Worf finds the Romulan prison camp. The kids use Klingon weapons as farm tools.
Although Worf reprimands the boy. The guys argument was that perhaps it did originate as a farm tool.
Well the how/when/why of the creation of the Batleth was barely even talked about. Maybe Kahless really did adapt a farming tool?
I tend to think when we as fans need to rationalize Star Trek it points to bad writing. Bat’leths are cool though.
I'd phrase that as "incomplete world building". Most things in Star Trek AREN'T explained because there is little plot relevance. That's apparently part of why the encyclopedias exist. they give background details for things you see in episodes.
I was reading about Bat’leths the other day and many people argue they are very inefficient weapons too. In STO they don’t have great reach either...
There have been real weapons kinda similar to a batleth, but they're rather defensive weapons.
I always thought bat'leths were made like "arm-wrestling weapons" where the main interest is to keep them locked with each opponent trying to knock the other down either by pushing them hard or by hitting their head, where they can finish them off with the pointy ends.
Yeah, like I said, defensive. They seem to be quite good at parrying blows, but not great offensively.
That said...
[o][/o]
There is zero excuse for this kind of bat'leths in Discovery... or any sane scenario for that matter.
Those abominations only exist to accidentally injure and impale their owners without much help. In fact that's how the Torchbearer gets killed if you look closely at his brief scene with Burnham
Yeah, that part is weird, but... isn't that particular weapon literally the only one ever seen?
That said...
[o][/o]
There is zero excuse for this kind of bat'leths in Discovery... or any sane scenario for that matter.
Those abominations only exist to accidentally injure and impale their owners without much help. In fact that's how the Torchbearer gets killed if you look closely at his brief scene with Burnham
Yeah, that part is weird, but... isn't that particular weapon literally the only one ever seen?
It's been awhile since I watched season 1, but I thought it showed up later as well. Infact, didn't Tyler have a bat'leth fight in the mirror universe before realizing who he really was?
That said...
[o][/o]
There is zero excuse for this kind of bat'leths in Discovery... or any sane scenario for that matter.
Those abominations only exist to accidentally injure and impale their owners without much help. In fact that's how the Torchbearer gets killed if you look closely at his brief scene with Burnham
Yeah, that part is weird, but... isn't that particular weapon literally the only one ever seen?
It's been awhile since I watched season 1, but I thought it showed up later as well. Infact, didn't Tyler have a bat'leth fight in the mirror universe before realizing who he really was?
Yes, he did. But I can't remember if this weapon was used or not.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I don't understand where you see the darkness in this tv show, at the contrary. Humanity is shown with its imperfections, emotions, hope. And, Death is life. The future is shown realistically, not a like in a fairytale.
And the lesson to keep in mind is that obscurantism (political, religious) and fear can have some serious repercussions (interdiction of the researches on the positronic tech)
Will and Picard seat on the bench was a really nice sequence.
Elnor is a main character (i hope), Hugh's death is a kind of lesson, he spent most of his live in a kind of monastery. Hugh's death is not useless at all.
Agnes' act is "bright" moment, she makes a sacrifice for her friends, what do you need more?
In fact the characters in this show are more human, and alive than the same characters in TNG.
I don't understand where you see the darkness in this tv show, at the contrary. Humanity is shown with its imperfections, emotions, hope. And, Death is life. The future is shown realistically, not a like in a fairytale.
And the lesson to keep in mind is that obscurantism (political, religious) and fear can have some serious repercussions (interdiction of the researches on the positronic tech)
Will and Picard seat on the bench was a really nice sequence.
Elnor is a main character (i hope), Hugh's death is a kind of lesson, he spent most of his live in a kind of monastery. Hugh's death is not useless at all.
Agnes' act is "bright" moment, she makes a sacrifice for her friends, what do you need more?
In fact the characters in this show are more human, and alive than the same characters in TNG.
Maybe not so realistic though when you consider the odds.
If everyone who was killed or close to the people killed were a loosely organized group looking into the conspiracy and were murdered when they got close or whatever then yes, it is realistic. OR if on the other hand, if they were totally random people who are drawn in to the situation in different, chance ways it also realistic. In fact, that second situation is a technique writers very often use to get a team of heroes together in the first place, out of a random selection of people who would otherwise have never met and wouldn't have banded together any other way.
The problem is that neither situation actually applies (especially the second since they are not just random new characters) which makes justifying it happening to those particular people out of hundreds of trillions of possible random victims far less realistic, a sort of metagaming of the plot like the villains somehow saw the various TV series the good guys came from and tried to eliminate or scare off any main cast characters who might interfere with their plans (that is a surprisingly easy trap to fall into btw, especially when writing more complex plots).
While I have not seen the series so far it certainly does sound like they are deliberately doing "dark" to some degree, possibly to fit in better with the DSC stuff (to be fair, it really would be awkward and possibly damaging for CBS to seem to start ignoring their own previous take on Trek with the way Hollywood gossips and works behind the glamour). The tone might even be appropriate considering the show happens far from the ivory towers of Starfleet.
They may even be going for a deconstruction, though from what I have seen of DSC I am not sure the CBS writers could pull that off successfully (they can be wickedly tricky to do without tainting the original or turning the deconstruction into an unintentional lampoon), especially with the contempt some key production people show for anything resembling TOS ideals (and TNG pushed those more than TOS did in many ways, especially Picard himself).
It's pretty clear to me that what last episode did was "Stakes build" will and deanna's personal tragedy shows us that there are stakes at play here beyond just "ohh well no new data's will be built"now we see the cost, with people we care about, it has an emotional impact beyond a pure "ohh random person says X" likewise Hugh's death makes Elnor's new mission more personal. AND (more importantly) eistablishes Nerak's sister has his personal foil. chances are they'll fight again and he'll defeat her.
Look I get some people hate that the heros have personal costs, and that things don't go well all the time etc. and frankly if that's your view, well.. you're looking for fairy tales and kids tv. real life doesn't have happily ever afters
I don't understand where you see the darkness in this tv show, at the contrary. Humanity is shown with its imperfections, emotions, hope. And, Death is life. The future is shown realistically, not a like in a fairytale.
And the lesson to keep in mind is that obscurantism (political, religious) and fear can have some serious repercussions (interdiction of the researches on the positronic tech)
Will and Picard seat on the bench was a really nice sequence.
Elnor is a main character (i hope), Hugh's death is a kind of lesson, he spent most of his live in a kind of monastery. Hugh's death is not useless at all.
Agnes' act is "bright" moment, she makes a sacrifice for her friends, what do you need more?
In fact the characters in this show are more human, and alive than the same characters in TNG.
Maybe not so realistic though when you consider the odds.
If everyone who was killed or close to the people killed were a loosely organized group looking into the conspiracy and were murdered when they got close or whatever then yes, it is realistic. OR if on the other hand, if they were totally random people who are drawn in to the situation in different, chance ways it also realistic. In fact, that second situation is a technique writers very often use to get a team of heroes together in the first place, out of a random selection of people who would otherwise have never met and wouldn't have banded together any other way.
The problem is that neither situation actually applies (especially the second since they are not just random new characters) which makes justifying it happening to those particular people out of hundreds of trillions of possible random victims far less realistic, a sort of metagaming of the plot like the villains somehow saw the various TV series the good guys came from and tried to eliminate or scare off any main cast characters who might interfere with their plans (that is a surprisingly easy trap to fall into btw, especially when writing more complex plots).
While I have not seen the series so far it certainly does sound like they are deliberately doing "dark" to some degree, possibly to fit in better with the DSC stuff (to be fair, it really would be awkward and possibly damaging for CBS to seem to start ignoring their own previous take on Trek with the way Hollywood gossips and works behind the glamour). The tone might even be appropriate considering the show happens far from the ivory towers of Starfleet.
They may even be going for a deconstruction, though from what I have seen of DSC I am not sure the CBS writers could pull that off successfully (they can be wickedly tricky to do without tainting the original or turning the deconstruction into an unintentional lampoon), especially with the contempt some key production people show for anything resembling TOS ideals (and TNG pushed those more than TOS did in many ways, especially Picard himself).
first of all, if you don't have seen the show, how you can comment objectively its content; it is not a reproach but take a look at the show
DSC in my opinion is the worst trek show and not dark at all, even TNG is better. Most of the characters are totally forgotten or ridiculous. I cannot take this show seriously. Burham the super hero of the universe, mega extra lol. In fact, cbs writers ignore totally DSC. DSC is a fail, of course not in the point of view of the profesisonnal critics. it is just my point of view.
STP explores the fact of being just a person: Picard's doubts and weakness, soji's quest, etc, Elnor's evolution etc.
It is hard for me to like TNG or Discovery because my fav trek show is DS9, a tv show where the characters were all complicated, and the tragedy at each street corner (Jadzia's death for example). The best trek tv show ever, and I like it
i personally like dark stories, because after the death, the sadness,etc, there is always a hope. Take a look at Altered Carbon
I agree, there seem to be some people who don't like the heros being challanged, facing loss and troubles. but thats what a good story SHOULD do, put the heros through the wringer so that when they emerge on the other side, it's more sastifying. yeah you don't wanna do it (I know a lot of people who gave up on GOT because it took so long to get to the pay off, but that was 6 or 7 seasons of "LOL STARKS GET SCREWED!" yeah if Picard season 1 ends with nothing happening and, I dunno. the tal shiar cutting off Picard's head I'll be a bit annoyed) I mean, I said kids TV earlier, but even transformers killed Optimus.
Comments
What do you think it is - a Kidney?
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
My character Tsin'xing
dialysis is an artificial aid to help kidneys perform functions they can no longer do, but there was nothing in that scene that suggested the woman's kidney was COMPLETELY gone
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Picard needing an artificial heart seems more unrealistic than growing a new kidney with a drug. Needing an artificial heart is 20th and 21st Century technology not 24th Century technology. An artificial heart that is part of a system that allows its user in any environment seems more like 24th Century technology.
If that doesn't seem plausible to you, there are plenty of cases of massive tumors growing inside people for years, yet never completely inhibited the function of the organs it was displacing.
> (Quote)
>
> In Star Trek? Yes, it does seem out of place. In other sci fi? Not so much.
>
> Did she have to vaporize her? Nope. Easily could have taken her in and, you know, let the courts decide. Is that not the Federation way?
I haven’t seen the bridge freak out episode yet but I watched this one today. The slaughtered Romulan senator bothered me but at least Picard awklowledged that that was messed up...
But beyond even just whether Seven would kill that lady—I didn’t even get how they knew each other. She was a federation science officer who sold seven’s friends for parts. If seven was hellbent on killing her—I’m sure she would have done it a long time ago.
And if seven was using the bop—why did she shoot at Picard? Lot of plot holes in there I think. Johnathan Frakes direction was really good though. Especially Episode 4–it was really beautifuly shot. Too bad the script wasn’t tighter.
And does anyone else find the Romulan Ronin archetype a little too Orientalists? Star Trek especially TOS had a bad habit of using Asiatic stereotypes for villains. And they seem to go to Samurai culture when they want valent alien hero’s...feels rather rehashed without thinking to me.
On the other hand I hope we get some Romulan swords in STO
> (Quote)
>
Really agree about the DISCO design. I think we forget though about the fact that Viacom and CBS were separate still when Discovery hit...that combined with the Abrams influence almost necessities a new designs. And if we want back to TOS design (And I hope someday we can) —there are fewer new toys that need to be sold. JJ made C-3po’s arm red not only because 3PO gets disassembled a lot—but because it requires new models. Do you prefer repaired mask Kylie or original...etc...
Also if we get Pike I am sure they will just redress the DISCO set to save money...because Star Trek gets cheaper per Episode the longer you can keep it going
> > @valoreah said:
> > (Quote)
> >
> > In Star Trek? Yes, it does seem out of place. In other sci fi? Not so much.
> >
> > Did she have to vaporize her? Nope. Easily could have taken her in and, you know, let the courts decide. Is that not the Federation way?
>
> I haven’t seen the bridge freak out episode yet but I watched this one today. The slaughtered Romulan senator bothered me but at least Picard awklowledged that that was messed up...
>
> But beyond even just whether Seven would kill that lady—I didn’t even get how they knew each other. She was a federation science officer who sold seven’s friends for parts. If seven was hellbent on killing her—I’m sure she would have done it a long time ago.
>
> And if seven was using the bop—why did she shoot at Picard? Lot of plot holes in there I think. Johnathan Frakes direction was really good though. Especially Episode 4–it was really beautifuly shot. Too bad the script wasn’t tighter.
>
> And does anyone else find the Romulan Ronin archetype a little too Orientalists? Star Trek especially TOS had a bad habit of using Asiatic stereotypes for villains. And they seem to go to Samurai culture when they want valent alien hero’s...feels rather rehashed without thinking to me.
>
> On the other hand I hope we get some Romulan swords in STO
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I hope they are streight blades and not just katanas. Besides sword experts often point out katanas(and any curved sword for that matter) are horrible against actual armor. Even users of the katana. They are made for unarmored targets.
Thinking of ideas from lots of games for, dunno how long now.
> I hope they are streight blades and not just katanas. Besides sword experts often point out katanas(and any curved sword for that matter) are horrible against actual armor. Even users of the katana. They are made for unarmored targets.
I think his sword might be straight, yes? The sheath looked more like a bow than a katana—maybe the producers were thinking of him more like an elf.
They also have the tarot and rune stuff going on with these Picard Romulans too.
I was reading about Bat’leths the other day and many people argue they are very inefficient weapons too. In STO they don’t have great reach either...
As for why she didn't get to kill her earlier, it's probably due to the fact the Fenris Rangers kept their money on Freecloud, where Jay had her criminal empire. They could have launched a full-scale assault to kill her (and I'm sure they'd have LOVED to do so), but that would have caused them a lot of issues they really didn't need since they already didn't have enough manpower to maintain order as best as they would have liked, and lose all their money.
That's like in The Mandalorian where the Mandos don't just attack the Empire directly and even work with them. They HATE that, especially since the Empire instigated a purge on them, but they have to do whatever they can to survive because they're few and lacking resources.
With Picard, Seven finally had a big opportunity to get close to Jay without directly implicating the Rangers.
Where could one even get this idea?
She wasn't flying the BOP, she was flying the fighter assisting Picard in taking down the BOP and that crashed on the planetary shield.
My character Tsin'xing
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
> (Quote)
> Nowhere is it said Jay was a Fed Sci Officer, all points to her being a criminal overlord who owns a good chunk of Freecloud and tricked the Fenris Rangers into thinking she wanted to help them. And Seven wanted to kill her AFTER she got intimate enough with her, because she found out she only used that to get to Icheb and other other xBs' implants.
Thanks I will try to watch it again.
> @shadowfang240 said:
> which makes a klingon bat'leth master all the more deadly, because they had to train their way through all that awkwardness and disadvantage
I tend to agree. Having a weapon that is better designed for defense makes sense for its ceremonial nature especially.
Someone on Trek BBS cited the episode where Worf finds the Romulan prison camp. The kids use Klingon weapons as farm tools.
Although Worf reprimands the boy. The guys argument was that perhaps it did originate as a farm tool.
I tend to think when we as fans need to rationalize Star Trek it points to bad writing. Bat’leths are cool though.
That said...
There is zero excuse for this kind of bat'leths in Discovery... or any sane scenario for that matter.
Those abominations only exist to accidentally injure and impale their owners without much help. In fact that's how the Torchbearer gets killed if you look closely at his brief scene with Burnham
It is already halfway though the season, if it is not "going" by now it probably never will (or at least not in this season anyway).
Since a modern TV serial is pretty much a single story per season in eight to thirteen parts, if PIC is using a linear plot structure they would have moved out of the exposition stage and into the rising action stage by the third installment at most (usually metaplot exposition is mostly covered in the series pilot episode(s) in a normal series). Depending on exactly where they put the climax it could be coming up as soon as the next segment (it should fall somewhere in the third quarter of the season more or less), since the falling action and resolution stages would together cover two or three segments if you put a normal novel plot grid over ten episodes.
The closing of the Jarleth System Patrol months ago makes sense given this Episode.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
My character Tsin'xing
It's been awhile since I watched season 1, but I thought it showed up later as well. Infact, didn't Tyler have a bat'leth fight in the mirror universe before realizing who he really was?
Yes, he did. But I can't remember if this weapon was used or not.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
well the OFFICAL story is that he made it by dipping a lock of his hair in a volcano..
So I watched the latest episode.. it's a good one. seeing Picard reunite with Riker and troi was great
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
And the lesson to keep in mind is that obscurantism (political, religious) and fear can have some serious repercussions (interdiction of the researches on the positronic tech)
Will and Picard seat on the bench was a really nice sequence.
Elnor is a main character (i hope), Hugh's death is a kind of lesson, he spent most of his live in a kind of monastery. Hugh's death is not useless at all.
Agnes' act is "bright" moment, she makes a sacrifice for her friends, what do you need more?
In fact the characters in this show are more human, and alive than the same characters in TNG.
Maybe not so realistic though when you consider the odds.
If everyone who was killed or close to the people killed were a loosely organized group looking into the conspiracy and were murdered when they got close or whatever then yes, it is realistic. OR if on the other hand, if they were totally random people who are drawn in to the situation in different, chance ways it also realistic. In fact, that second situation is a technique writers very often use to get a team of heroes together in the first place, out of a random selection of people who would otherwise have never met and wouldn't have banded together any other way.
The problem is that neither situation actually applies (especially the second since they are not just random new characters) which makes justifying it happening to those particular people out of hundreds of trillions of possible random victims far less realistic, a sort of metagaming of the plot like the villains somehow saw the various TV series the good guys came from and tried to eliminate or scare off any main cast characters who might interfere with their plans (that is a surprisingly easy trap to fall into btw, especially when writing more complex plots).
While I have not seen the series so far it certainly does sound like they are deliberately doing "dark" to some degree, possibly to fit in better with the DSC stuff (to be fair, it really would be awkward and possibly damaging for CBS to seem to start ignoring their own previous take on Trek with the way Hollywood gossips and works behind the glamour). The tone might even be appropriate considering the show happens far from the ivory towers of Starfleet.
They may even be going for a deconstruction, though from what I have seen of DSC I am not sure the CBS writers could pull that off successfully (they can be wickedly tricky to do without tainting the original or turning the deconstruction into an unintentional lampoon), especially with the contempt some key production people show for anything resembling TOS ideals (and TNG pushed those more than TOS did in many ways, especially Picard himself).
Look I get some people hate that the heros have personal costs, and that things don't go well all the time etc. and frankly if that's your view, well.. you're looking for fairy tales and kids tv. real life doesn't have happily ever afters
I agree, in fact that would have been awesome
first of all, if you don't have seen the show, how you can comment objectively its content; it is not a reproach
DSC in my opinion is the worst trek show and not dark at all, even TNG is better. Most of the characters are totally forgotten or ridiculous. I cannot take this show seriously. Burham the super hero of the universe, mega extra lol. In fact, cbs writers ignore totally DSC. DSC is a fail, of course not in the point of view of the profesisonnal critics. it is just my point of view.
STP explores the fact of being just a person: Picard's doubts and weakness, soji's quest, etc, Elnor's evolution etc.
It is hard for me to like TNG or Discovery because my fav trek show is DS9, a tv show where the characters were all complicated, and the tragedy at each street corner (Jadzia's death for example). The best trek tv show ever, and I like it
i personally like dark stories, because after the death, the sadness,etc, there is always a hope. Take a look at Altered Carbon