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XMPP Sunset

ambassadorkael#6946 ambassadorkael
ambassadorkael#6946
 Member, Administrator Posts: 2,674 Community Manager
in Galactic News Network [PC]
Greetings Captains,

As of September 19th, 2019, Star Trek Online will no longer be supporting connection to our internal chat system via an XMPP client. While this feature was interesting and often convenient, it also unfortunately makes it easier for gold spammers and others to reach our chat system. Allowing access via an XMPP client also creates several technical challenges that make it difficult to keep our in-game chat safe and smooth. At this time, we don’t have any plans to replace this with a different service.

Please feel free to discuss this change in this thread, and let us know any further questions. We will be updating this thread with any additional notices or clarifications as needed.
«134567

Comments

  • pmsattlerpmsattler Member Posts: 31 Arc User
    Most people use Discord or Teamspeak anyway, but thanks for trying to give us a chat space!
    Fleet Admiral of The Lost boys

    "Dreams are born in the deepest of minds, and destroyed in the shallowest of ones."
  • garaks31garaks31 Member Posts: 2,845 Arc User
    gold spammers ,have lifetime acc.?! well the arc app. could be usefull for this. xmpp was nice to catch up the missed msgs
    tmprl.jpg?width=998&height=499

    https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1249570/axanar-locks-in-start-date-for-filming
  • callen151callen151 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    This completely destroys a feature the Reddit Fleet Officers have relied on for years now, using XMPP(assuming the officer had LTS) to setup notifications to ping us so we could get invites without being in game 24/7. I don't see this stopping gold spammers in the slightest, they aren't buying LTS accounts so they can spam via XMPP and the notion that they would drop 300 USD on one just to spam gold selling messages frankly seems absurd when they're just going to get banned anyways.
  • akfenderakfender Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    I use xmpp, despite also more heavily using Discord.

    The use of gold spammers as the reason to drop it seems pretty weak, to be honest. I've barely ever seen a gold spammer in even the wreck that is Zone Chat.

    More to the point: This is just the removal of one more valuable LTS perk, for a package that already has greatly diminished in value. One more reason to not suggest people buy it, I suppose.
    Find me as @ZeroMGA
  • sftricksftrick Member Posts: 52 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    This bums me out. Being able to externally buffer chat has been really valuable for fleet issues, spotting missed messages, and a whole lot of other things. Has any consideration been made into keeping some sort of external output from chat, if not input?

    And I admit I have a hard time believing gold spammers spend hundreds of dollars on accounts for spamming -- and if they do, why aren't those accounts being banned instead?
  • phoenix841phoenix841 Member Posts: 486 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    This isn't cool.
    I have an LTS, and do use XMPP from time to time to keep tabs on various channels when I'm not in game.
    It was already a gold subscriber requirement, which is more or less LTS now.

    So that excuse doesn't make sense.

    Maybe change how it's accessed, so you need an account of XX days to use it, and/or require a purchase of some sort on the C-store?

    First we lost the gateway, now this.

    What does make sense is the need to shut down more services to reduce load on servers.
    LTS Since Beta (Jan 2010).
  • chipg7chipg7 Member Posts: 1,577 Arc User
    If it limits spam, that's a good thing! There are plenty of other voicechat systems out there.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan
    legendarylycan#5411
         Member Posts: 37,280 Arc User
    it isn't limiting spam at all...the only way to access the chat server via XMPP was by being a lifetime subscriber...NO goldspammer in their right mind would spend that kind of money for an account that's getting banned in less than two minutes​​
    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"

    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
    "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • altran3301altran3301 Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    ambassadorkael#6946 wrote: »
    Greetings Captains,

    As of September 19th, 2019, Star Trek Online will no longer be supporting connection to our internal chat system via an XMPP client. While this feature was interesting and often convenient, it also unfortunately makes it easier for gold spammers and others to reach our chat system. Allowing access via an XMPP client also creates several technical challenges that make it difficult to keep our in-game chat safe and smooth. At this time, we don’t have any plans to replace this with a different service.

    Yeah right, because the spammers have LTS...

    "Technical challenges" = "We've lost the people who bother/know how, to maintain things like this and the foundry, but we're scared to admit it".

    People do use Discord, but not "most". You absolutely do not have any metrics to back that up. Also, those that do use Discord are using Discord bots to link in-game fleet chat. You're going to annoy yet more of the playerbase with this.

    I'm not angry; just disappointed.
    tnl3Zwx.png
  • callen151callen151 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    chipg7 wrote: »
    If it limits spam, that's a good thing! There are plenty of other voicechat systems out there.

    XMPP Chat Protocol is text, not voice. IIRC STO's voice chat is based off Ventrillo.
  • futurepastnowfuturepastnow Member Posts: 3,660 Arc User
    This is a feature that enhances many peoples' gameplay, a feature that larger fleets and chat channels are absolutely dependent on, and terminating it demonstrates that Cryptic is shockingly out of touch with the way the players who spend money on their game play it.

    Don't remove XMPP. Take it out of beta and monetize it instead. Charge $10 or $25 for access if you have to.
  • akfenderakfender Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    altran3301 wrote: »
    "Technical challenges" = "We've lost the people who bother/know how, to maintain things like this and the foundry, but we're scared to admit it".

    Honestly this sounds like the actual reason.

    Find me as @ZeroMGA
  • sirboulevardsirboulevard Member Posts: 722 Arc User
    Yeah... not super fond of this decision guys.

    I have to agree with alot of people, I seriously doubt goldspammers are buying LTS to use XMPP. If there's some sort of security exploit that's letting them use it without LTS, maybe try patching that instead?

    I don't get this decision. A lot of large fleets and player groups use this functionality.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    TRIBBLE Hydra! Hail Janeway!
  • callen151callen151 Member Posts: 28 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    azrael605 wrote: »
    > @futurepastnow said:
    > This is a feature that enhances many peoples' gameplay, a feature that larger fleets and chat channels are absolutely dependent on, and terminating it demonstrates that Cryptic is shockingly out of touch with the way the players who spend money on their game play it.
    >
    > Don't remove XMPP. Take it out of beta and monetize it instead. Charge $10 or $25 for access if you have to.

    First off, can the hyperbole. Secondly, the descision has been made. Thirdly, I don't know 1 single person, fleet, or channel that has ever even mentioned xmpp.

    RedditChat(a channel with anywhere between 200-500 online or more depending on releases and a total channel pop above 10k), and the associated Reddit Fleets(REDdit Alert, Reddit Star Empire, House of Snoo, etc) all use it. Several XMPP Clients allow the user to setup keyword notifications to notify us, extremely useful for grabbing fleet invites without being in game 24/7, something that is essential for us. I'm sure there are several other fleets that also use it similarly.

    Edit: another amazing feature is logging, it allows us to log our channel, so if an incident occurs when no officers are actually in game, w/e officers are connected via XMPP will have a log so we can go back and view the incident. All in all XMPP access has been an invaluable tool for us running our fleets, and it's removal and the extremely weak excuse of Gold Sellers, is honestly just pathetic.
  • futurepastnowfuturepastnow Member Posts: 3,660 Arc User
    azrael605 wrote: »
    > @futurepastnow said:
    > This is a feature that enhances many peoples' gameplay, a feature that larger fleets and chat channels are absolutely dependent on, and terminating it demonstrates that Cryptic is shockingly out of touch with the way the players who spend money on their game play it.
    >
    > Don't remove XMPP. Take it out of beta and monetize it instead. Charge $10 or $25 for access if you have to.

    First off, can the hyperbole. Secondly, the descision has been made. Thirdly, I don't know 1 single person, fleet, or channel that has ever even mentioned xmpp.

    Then you don't know any fleets. There's no hyperbole in what I typed.
  • altran3301altran3301 Member Posts: 167 Arc User
    callen151 wrote: »

    RedditChat(a channel with anywhere between 200-500 online or more depending on releases and a total channel pop above 10k), and the associated Reddit Fleets(REDdit Alert, Reddit Star Empire, House of Snoo, etc) all use it. Several XMPP Clients allow the user to setup keyword notifications to notify us, extremely useful for grabbing fleet invites without being in game 24/7, something that is essential for us. I'm sure there are several other fleets that also use it similarly.

    Edit: another amazing feature is logging, it allows us to log our channel, so if an incident occurs when no officers are actually in game, w/e officers are connected via XMPP will have a log so we can go back and view the incident. All in all XMPP access has been an invaluable tool for us running our fleets, and it's removal and the extremely weak excuse of Gold Sellers, is honestly just pathetic.

    Spot on.
    tnl3Zwx.png
  • akfenderakfender Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    azrael605 wrote: »
    Thirdly, I don't know 1 single person, fleet, or channel that has ever even mentioned xmpp.

    I'm not trying to be a jerk, but your single anecdotal experience has already been shown as a universal non-truth considering several people have already mentioned using it in this thread. Yes, the decision has been made. Since there was no attempt to converse with the community about this before they decided, all that we can do now is give them the feedback on their decision. Logically I understand them not checking first, but quit acting as if people don't have the right to state their displeasure about it.
    Find me as @ZeroMGA
  • captainrebel78#5049 captainrebel78
    captainrebel78#5049
         Member Posts: 61 Arc User
    First of all... It is insulting to ask the opinions of players on something that a decision has already been made on and been stated "we don’t have any plans to replace this with a different service." In all the channels I am in regarding STO: I have never seen the "spam" that is being referred to as most of what I get comes through in-game mail and not a chat channel.

    Secondly and worst of all: you are willing to "punish" the hundreds of users that are not violating anything by keeping in touch with their players. To me, the is a huge step backwards. Cryptic is almost treating its players like little kids saying "Ooo… We will give you this new shiny toy; but, take away three that you already enjoy using." Cryptic seriously needs to be in better communication with what the players want and not what they think is best on paper. I know 5 of the fleets I am in are furious over this decision with one saying " this is just another nail in STO's coffin."

    This is a sad day for STO players and one I am not pleased with at all. For the records, I am a LTS and have NEVER bothered setting up a STO relay. Therefore, Cryptic's reasoning for doing this is completely illogical to say the least.
  • phoenix841phoenix841 Member Posts: 486 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    altran3301 wrote: »
    "Technical challenges" = "We've lost the people who bother/know how, to maintain things like this and the foundry, but we're scared to admit it".

    This.
    I'm a developer and I would love to work there to keep these old systems running, but I feel I would not be allowed to work on it.
    LTS Since Beta (Jan 2010).
  • iconiansiconians Member Posts: 6,987 Arc User
    Another sad day. Thanks for demoralizing us some more.​​
    ExtxpTp.jpg
  • foppotee#4552 foppotee
    foppotee#4552
         Member Posts: 1,704 Arc User
    Begone spammers. I know of a few in-game players that used such tech to communicate while not actually in-game, but I never did so I won't miss it. It can seem like despite all of Cryptic's positive outlooks of were going to do this, that, & the other in the future they're doing more shrinking, re-shuffling, closing-down, & streamlining a lot more lately. I'm trying to think of that as having to do so for those, hopeful, future developments & not just all marketing lingo. Some days being tougher to believe than others of course lol.
  • warzoon007warzoon007 Member Posts: 22 Arc User
    edited August 2019
    This is highly disappointing as a leader of a big fleet having this service kept me in contact with my members whilst I was offline at work etc, stopping this service and don't have an replacement continue to show the lack of respect you have for your gaming community. I will only ask that your team reconsider as I have had no issues with having this service on two chats my fleet is exposed too.
    Chancellor Seven Leader House of Beautiful Orions
  • phoenix841phoenix841 Member Posts: 486 Arc User
    Is gold spamming even an issue?

    I never see it in chat (including ESD zone), and only receive a spam email once every several months.

    I remember when it was really bad during the early F2P days, but it was cleaned up very well over the years IMO.
    LTS Since Beta (Jan 2010).
  • bosn1abosn1a Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    this realy suck's using xmpp for very long time very good external chat tool while i am on work
    sigpic4178_3.png
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan
    legendarylycan#5411
         Member Posts: 37,280 Arc User
    it wasn't cleaned up, it cleaned itself up - goldspam is a good indication of MMO health; when the game is healthy, activity is high and when a game is dying, activity is low, because goldspammers won't waste time with a dying game​​
    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

    #LegalizeAwoo

    A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
    An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
    A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
    A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"

    "It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
    "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
    Passion and Serenity are one.
    I gain power by understanding both.
    In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
    I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
    The Force is united within me.
  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,056 Media Corps

    futurepastnow wrote: »
    This is a feature that enhances many peoples' gameplay, a feature that larger fleets and chat channels are absolutely dependent on, and terminating it demonstrates that Cryptic is shockingly out of touch with the way the players who spend money on their game play it.

    Don't remove XMPP. Take it out of beta and monetize it instead. Charge $10 or $25 for access if you have to.

    I agree with this sentiment. I would support monetizing (if necessary).
  • foppotee#4552 foppotee
    foppotee#4552
         Member Posts: 1,704 Arc User
    shadowfang240 wrote: »
    it wasn't cleaned up, it cleaned itself up - goldspam is a good indication of MMO health; when the game is healthy, activity is high and when a game is dying, activity is low, because goldspammers won't waste time with a dying game​​

    I might get 1 in-game mail from some spammer a week. I just delete it nowadays. I do remember a lot more spamming used to happen so your equation about the spamming & STO's health doesn't give me good vibes for STO's future :-(
This discussion has been closed.