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We need an overall cost reduction to Z store Ships

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    drakan87fdrakan87f Member Posts: 18 Arc User
    we got three free T-6 ships every year, not counting giveaways
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    trennantrennan Member Posts: 2,839 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    Food for thought on this.

    The servers are still running, so were' in the good here. However there is something you have to stop to consider.

    As other have mentioned, there are bills to pay at Cryptic. Which is figured into the overall cost of what they sell.

    However, when considering a cost reduction. Then one also has to consider what that means. While other are mentioning pay cuts and such to cover the reduced cost. There is another thing that can happen. Sure, they could do and overall price reduction, but to compensate for that, they'd have to switch all the account unlocks in the c-store over to character unlocks.

    Then instead of just having to buy that ship or costume once, you'd have to buy it multiple times for your different characters.
    Mm5NeXy.gif
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    Well, in just about all recent sales of T5 ships, they have been throwing in a free Upgrade Token per ship to sweeten the deal.
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    littlesarbonnlittlesarbonn Member Posts: 486 Arc User
    Cryptic is a business. If ships would sell enough at lower prices to make them more profit then prices would already be lowered.

    If you want lower prices, 20% off sales happen several times a year and there have been flash sales with steeper discounts.

    Just because they're a business doesn't mean they have always done exactly what is necessary to make the best profit. Maybe the OP has a better idea than they have because they're complacent in their approach and too scared to make a change. It's like when established authors said that it would completely not profitable to lower ebook prices to 99 cents. Some unknowns did that and became millionaires almost overnight. Some of those established authors still haven't broken $100,000 in profit to this day.

    The point: It's way too easy to discount the ideas of others as "the guys in suits must know better because they're wearing suits".
    Fleet Admiral Duane Gundrum, U.S.S. Merrimack
    Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
    Blog: http://www.sarbonn.com/?page_id=1990
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    leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 5,369 Arc User
    Cryptic is a business. If ships would sell enough at lower prices to make them more profit then prices would already be lowered.

    If you want lower prices, 20% off sales happen several times a year and there have been flash sales with steeper discounts.

    Just because they're a business doesn't mean they have always done exactly what is necessary to make the best profit. Maybe the OP has a better idea than they have because they're complacent in their approach and too scared to make a change. It's like when established authors said that it would completely not profitable to lower ebook prices to 99 cents. Some unknowns did that and became millionaires almost overnight. Some of those established authors still haven't broken $100,000 in profit to this day.

    The point: It's way too easy to discount the ideas of others as "the guys in suits must know better because they're wearing suits".

    If they were complacent then Cryptic wouldn't be doing 30% off sales and Zen charge bonuses, which as I previously said, fulfill the OP's idea.
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
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    raventomoeraventomoe Member Posts: 723 Arc User
    While I disagree with an across the board cutting of C-store ship prices; what I do think is something to address is the T5 C-store ships and their pricing/Level requirements. I've talked to a few others and we do agree that the the T5 VA ships feel redundant sitting at Level 50 when one can get a T6 for the same level with all those bonuses. At that point, the only thing they end up good for is grabbing a console for a set bonus.

    Now sure what Cryptic's metrics say on the matter but I can tell you personally, I'd be willing to throw down money for T5 Intrepid, Galaxy, Defiant, or others if I could use it at Level 40 than wait for Level 50. It would also allow me to seamlessly go from T4-5-6 for a few ships that do have a line of design going from 2360s to 2409/10.
    "The Multiverse, the ultimate frontier..."
    Thus begins...Lyrical Trek
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    davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,542 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    raventomoe wrote: »
    While I disagree with an across the board cutting of C-store ship prices; what I do think is something to address is the T5 C-store ships and their pricing/Level requirements. I've talked to a few others and we do agree that the the T5 VA ships feel redundant sitting at Level 50 when one can get a T6 for the same level with all those bonuses. At that point, the only thing they end up good for is grabbing a console for a set bonus.

    Now sure what Cryptic's metrics say on the matter but I can tell you personally, I'd be willing to throw down money for T5 Intrepid, Galaxy, Defiant, or others if I could use it at Level 40 than wait for Level 50. It would also allow me to seamlessly go from T4-5-6 for a few ships that do have a line of design going from 2360s to 2409/10.

    They might be considering making some of the T5 into leveling ships you can use from 10-50. That would increase the value. Or they might be thinking of doing that with the T6 variants and getting rid of the lower-level ships.

    "The Cryptic are wise in all things" -- some Vorta

    Post edited by davefenestrator on
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    majorprankstermajorprankster Member Posts: 25 Arc User
    Cryptic is a business. If ships would sell enough at lower prices to make them more profit then prices would already be lowered.

    If you want lower prices, 20% off sales happen several times a year and there have been flash sales with steeper discounts.

    Just because they're a business doesn't mean they have always done exactly what is necessary to make the best profit. Maybe the OP has a better idea than they have because they're complacent in their approach and too scared to make a change. It's like when established authors said that it would completely not profitable to lower ebook prices to 99 cents. Some unknowns did that and became millionaires almost overnight. Some of those established authors still haven't broken $100,000 in profit to this day.

    The point: It's way too easy to discount the ideas of others as "the guys in suits must know better because they're wearing suits".

    It's also pretty easy to be an armchair CFO and just post TRIBBLE on forums...

    It is not a zero-sum thing - the ideas may well be awesome.

    If the people with the ideas actually want to change things, then this forum is not the place, IMO/IME.

    Going around in circles about financial data and company metrics we do not have, IMO, is just idle speculation in a blatant effort to, once again, make the company 'look bad' and a few forum posters feel better about themsleves and thier 'amazing fiscal insights'.

    :)
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    mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    Going by how many Shepard Clas ships I saw at ESD not too long after the patch, I'd say things are still selling at the current prices. Of course ,that's anecdotical and just a brief moment in time, but...

    Ultimately, there way of "reducing" prices is the one that works best psychologically - sales and bonus zen. When people hear they can get something cheaper than the usual price, they often overlook whether the sales price nor the usual price are actually reasonable.

    And in the end, for a complete luxury good like a virtual space ship in a computer game, there is no real objective criterion to go for.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
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    mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,963 Arc User
    valoreah wrote: »
    westx211 wrote: »
    Most ships don't sell at all now with the higher prices.

    I'm curious where you get your sales information from? Do you work for Cryptic/PWE? If the answer is no, then we know where you pulled this from...

    The statement could be true, and it might still not yield the same conclusion. If people only buy at the sales price, they might actually be buying more than they would otherwise, because they know they have to buy during a sale, not when it is at full price. So they hurry up instead of deferring to a later time when they might actually have more time to play with the ship, because there is no guarantee there will be a sale when they actually want the ship.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
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    darkbladejkdarkbladejk Member Posts: 3,733 Community Moderator
    No one in here has access to the behind the scenes stuff and actual sale numbers. Statements as to how well certain cstore ships have sold or otherwise are speculation without those numbers. provided the debate stays civil I will leave this open for a bit.
    "Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations

    Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    Bortasqu' anyone?
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    raventomoeraventomoe Member Posts: 723 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    No one in here has access to the behind the scenes stuff and actual sale numbers. Statements as to how well certain cstore ships have sold or otherwise are speculation without those numbers. provided the debate stays civil I will leave this open for a bit.

    Oh I know and I agree that an across the board cut would be overkill; but I still think personally that I would get more use out of all the T5 C-store ships I have gotten over 6 years of playing if I could play even some of them at Level 40. I mean the recently given out Atrox doesn't have a console yet it's locked to Level 50 (I can see this being a thing for the Fleet version though.). :( And I only got the T5 Defiant on Console for the Set really (same with the T5 Light Warbird...wanted the complete sets for those two lines of ships) so that I could have a cloaking Defiant like in DS9.

    "The Multiverse, the ultimate frontier..."
    Thus begins...Lyrical Trek
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    ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,571 Arc User
    I know of the C-Store but is the Z Store where you can buy Z Cars?
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
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    ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 986 Arc User
    No one in here has access to the behind the scenes stuff and actual sale numbers. Statements as to how well certain cstore ships have sold or otherwise are speculation without those numbers. provided the debate stays civil I will leave this open for a bit.

    So the Bortasqu' flop and the KDF content/ship embargo for a time were just pure speculation and fear-mongering, or just imagined? That the ship line itself wasn't a lemon when it was released?
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    xyquarzexyquarze Member Posts: 2,116 Arc User
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    So the Bortasqu' flop and the KDF content/ship embargo for a time were just pure speculation and fear-mongering, or just imagined? That the ship line itself wasn't a lemon when it was released?

    Not fear-mongering, not imagined, but speculation for sure. Or do you have any idea how well (or unwell) the Bortasqu' did compared to other ships, say the Dyson Destroyers (pre and post "allow for faction materials), the Arbiter, ... We can gather from all the anecdotal data we have (forum posts, sightings in game) that it probably was not as well received as many an other ship but we have no clue as to how this turned out in numbers - 10% less sales, 50% less, 90% less? Maybe it wasn't even a lemon sales wise but disappointed after having bought it? Do you know any numbers? Because lemons come in different shapes, colours and grades of sourness and that would mean different conclusions to draw.
    My mother was an epohh and my father smelled of tulaberries
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    luminaire#0745 luminaire Member Posts: 77 Arc User
    valoreah wrote: »
    jagdtier44 wrote: »
    Relax man, he made a good point in that a lot of the mediocre ships might sell better at a lower price point as $30 is a lot to ask for a subpar ship to fly just for fun.

    "subpar" according to what measure? DPS? Not everyone is a DPS chaser.



    Yeah...but practically speaking, unless you really happen to love a particular design, are you really going to go with the mechanically inferior/outdated ship over the current meta/up to date one for the same price?
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    casualstocasualsto Member Posts: 672 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    So you want them to reduce the cost of items in the C-Store. I presume that you want a COST reduction so that the PRICE you pay can also be reduced. So, how would you propose that Cryptic cut costs? Should the developers all take a pay cut? Perhaps not invest in regular technology upgrades? Reduce or stop entirely all voice acting work? Maybe pack up the entire office and move somewhere with a lower rent? Where in their operating budget do you think they should cut COSTS just to save you a few bucks on PRICE?

    This has to be the most defensive line I've ever seen. There's no need to bash the poor guy for trying to propose the lowering of the prices.

    1. There will be no price drop out of reasons that will be explained below (from a logic standpoint).
    2. Regardless of how silly or misguided is a dude posting a topic, unless he's breaking a certain rule, mods should provide support from a tutor's standpoint. You're basically watching over this kindergarten called a forum where adults act like children.
    3. Cryptic does give away ships and stuff every year. Without mentioning the event ships.
    4. You should throw some money at your hobby from time to time. That's a long term investment for both parts.

    Price reduction would result in quality plummeting, content rate dropping and that doesn't benefit you, the user, both short term or long term. I got plenty of posts where I explain why bashing the money element is stupid. If it's out of your price range, you don't buy it.

    I agree that some rewards would be most welcome, especially for the players who've stayed loyal to the game, even if it's counter-productive from a financial standpoint. 3-years or more players who have purchased zen multiple times could be a certain thing.

    Wouldn't it be nice to login one morning and find a message in Arc/Steam:
    "As a token of your support towards our universe and franchise, we offer you a ship of your choice from the C-store. This is a one-time reward to show you that we care and appreciate. Enjoy your new ship, proud captain!"

    (And this thing is a 30$ freebie that almost seals the deal for further purchases. Someone who purchases systematically for a long time is basically there. You're just ensuring that the client matters. And that the client stays.)
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    darkbladejkdarkbladejk Member Posts: 3,733 Community Moderator
    edited February 2019
    [
    Yeah...but practically speaking, unless you really happen to love a particular design, are you really going to go with the mechanically inferior/outdated ship over the current meta/up to date one for the same price?

    DPS is not the final decider as to what is a great ship and what isn't. For you it may be, but for everyone else that may not be the case. I used a t5u Galor well into the AoY era, and it wasn't until the Keldon itself released that I jumped to t6. A great number of folks may prefer the t6 variant to the t5u version if one exists. That does NOT however make the t5u ship somehow less than or a bad ship. There's far far more to this game than chasing DPS metas if folks would look up from the charts from time to time.
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    So the Bortasqu' flop and the KDF content/ship embargo for a time were just pure speculation and fear-mongering, or just imagined? That the ship line itself wasn't a lemon when it was released?

    Unless you have access to data that the rest of us simply don't, then yes it's just pure speculation based on circumstantial and anecdotal evidence. Cryptic has the real numbers and unless they're willing to release those, then any conversations any of us have will be pure speculation and nothing more. What we may think sells very well and what actually sells well may be two different things.
    "Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations

    Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
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    fury#0751 fury Member Posts: 33 Arc User
    All I want as a reward is the ability to recover any bound to character items when I'm tired of that character.
    As an LTS I have 'quit' STO multiple times and when I come back a few years later, its nice to create a new Captain and start over just to get a feel of how the missions and game mechanics have changed.
    Consequently I have deleted a number of unplayed Captains only to realize later I'd unpacked a lobi ship or Character bound item.

    Unlike some others I don't have the patience or time to play alts, so when expansions come out offering a new playthrough experience, they devalue any previous character bound purchases i've made.

    I really like the game, but the thing stopping me making purchases at the moment is, all the ships Im interested in are character bound and I've promised myself to not spend any zen on items that aren't BoA or, even if Character Bound, reappear in my store as a reclaimable item if I delete the character that previously claimed it.
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    postagepaidpostagepaid Member Posts: 2,899 Arc User
    With the way T6's work often being sold with the premise that folk are going for the trait rather than ship (GW on an escort!) unless you park up outside argala and count ships for a few hours then you'll miss seeing a lot of the vessels which are bought, levelled and discarded.
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    casualstocasualsto Member Posts: 672 Arc User
    With the way T6's work often being sold with the premise that folk are going for the trait rather than ship (GW on an escort!) unless you park up outside argala and count ships for a few hours then you'll miss seeing a lot of the vessels which are bought, levelled and discarded.

    This too.

    But it has to sell, since you people need to have a place to pew pew and complain on the forums. >:)

    Yes for Romulan ships!
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    leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 5,369 Arc User
    valoreah wrote: »
    jagdtier44 wrote: »
    Relax man, he made a good point in that a lot of the mediocre ships might sell better at a lower price point as $30 is a lot to ask for a subpar ship to fly just for fun.

    "subpar" according to what measure? DPS? Not everyone is a DPS chaser.



    Yeah...but practically speaking, unless you really happen to love a particular design, are you really going to go with the mechanically inferior/outdated ship over the current meta/up to date one for the same price?

    Absolutely I do. I'll make a different build for every ship on my main, because it's more fun than chasing DPS. And my KDF run almost exclusively the Fleet T5U Kar'Fi, a comparably 'mechanically inferior/outdated ship' that I've been using for years, and you know what, it's better for me than the vast swathe of other KDF T6's!
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
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    themadprofessor#9835 themadprofessor Member Posts: 1,203 Arc User
    casualsto wrote: »
    Wouldn't it be nice to login one morning and find a message in Arc/Steam:
    "As a token of your support towards our universe and franchise, we offer you a ship of your choice from the C-store. This is a one-time reward to show you that we care and appreciate. Enjoy your new ship, proud captain!"

    Sounds good in theory. Wouldn't do me a damned bit of good as I already own all the C-store ships.
    Yeah...but practically speaking, unless you really happen to love a particular design, are you really going to go with the mechanically inferior/outdated ship over the current meta/up to date one for the same price?

    Absolutely. Every time.

    I don't chase DPS or demand the best of the best. I am Space Barbie for life. I get an idea in my head and create a toon based on that idea. Sometimes it's cosplay (such as the toons based on Dark Matter and Jurassic World), sometimes it's abit of hilarity (my Gorn that looks like a crayola factory threw up on him and who adores his kitty kat, my Roswell Gray who is a shapeshifter, or my short Romulan known as Tater Thot), and sometimes it's inspired by a new thing in the Lobi Store (my toon that wears the full Tzenkethi armor). I have pirates, Mirrorverse Refugees, gods, mythical creatures, Time Travelers, and others in my roster of toons.

    Some of them have awesome ships and loadouts, some not so awesome. It all depends on the toon.
    Space Barbie Extraordinaire. Got a question about Space Barbie? Just ask.

    Things I want in STO:

    1) More character customization options such as more clothing options, letting the toon complexion affect the entire body, not just the head. Also a true RGB color picker applied to all costume and appearance options, which would allow for true appearance customization and homogenous colors instead of "this same exact color looks vastly different on two different pieces."
    2) Bridge customization, not bridge packs. Let us pick a general layout and adjust the color palette, console appearance, and chair types, as well as more ready room layout options.
    3) Customizable ground weapons, i.e. The aesthetic look of phaser dual pistols but they shoot antiproton bolts. For obvious reasons this would only apply to standard ground weapons.
    4) For the love of Q please revamp Plasma Ground Weapons. They look like demented Supersoakers right now.
    5) True Vanity Impulse and Deflector effects similar to Vanity Shields.
    6) A greater payout for hitting T6 Reputations. Currently it takes more time and resources to get from T5 to T6 than it does to get from nothing to T5. Make that grind really pay out at the end.
    7) Mirrorverse Refugee event similar to AoY/Delta/Gamma, complete with new Mirrorverse recruits for all factions.
    8) Independent Faction, because yo ho yo ho a pirate's life for me!
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    jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 376 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    I think we all know where ships like the D'kora stand with the general populace. Not very high.

    That said, I absolutely ADORE the D'kora and ensure that every toon I play has one, even if it doesn't fit the theme of the toon.

    Why?

    Because I find the ship to be quite versatile, extremely well balanced, and, frankly, a HELL of a lot of fun to fly. It can be surprisingly tanky, a good gut puncher, or even a decent science ship, depending on how you lay it out.

    Now, some people don't like it because there's not one thing it is exceedingly good at, but there's also nothing that is sucks at either.

    Plus, I love the aesthetics.

    I feel the same with the Orb Weaver, now that it's a lot cheaper I think Im gonna grab
    [
    Yeah...but practically speaking, unless you really happen to love a particular design, are you really going to go with the mechanically inferior/outdated ship over the current meta/up to date one for the same price?

    DPS is not the final decider as to what is a great ship and what isn't. For you it may be, but for everyone else that may not be the case. I used a t5u Galor well into the AoY era, and it wasn't until the Keldon itself released that I jumped to t6. A great number of folks may prefer the t6 variant to the t5u version if one exists. That does NOT however make the t5u ship somehow less than or a bad ship. There's far far more to this game than chasing DPS metas if folks would look up from the charts from time to time.
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    So the Bortasqu' flop and the KDF content/ship embargo for a time were just pure speculation and fear-mongering, or just imagined? That the ship line itself wasn't a lemon when it was released?

    Unless you have access to data that the rest of us simply don't, then yes it's just pure speculation based on circumstantial and anecdotal evidence. Cryptic has the real numbers and unless they're willing to release those, then any conversations any of us have will be pure speculation and nothing more. What we may think sells very well and what actually sells well may be two different things.

    Woo thanks for that example of T5U lockbox ship that was the ONLY Cardassian ship in the game for a looooooooong time for proof that T5U ships are still selling well on the C-store. (WHICH btw you still dropped for a T6)

    It's true the other day this guy was like hey I want to buy a new ship what should I get? and everyone in the fleet was like buy this t6 or that one. and I was like HEY wait. for almost the same price you could get a Regent Assault cruiser! it's the same thing man.

    Less consoles, less weapons, less stats, and no trait don't make them lesser ships at all. Your being disingenuous, sure the content in STO is doable in T5s but to not claim they are lesser ships is calling the ocean dry.

    I assure you Cryptic is selling far less T5 Hakoonas these days than they are t6 scimitars, morrigus or even Karas. I don't think anyone is clamoring to buy a T5 Multi vector escort with the T6 Hestia kicking around. How about Andromedas vs Yamatos?

    people can screech anecdotal all they want but we can all clearly see what has done well for Cryptic and what hasn't. You can see a ship coming look at it's stats, layouts, console, and trait and see if a new ship is going to be selling. (or just a canon ship in general)

    Do we know the EXTENT of how well or how poorly? No we don't because as stated Cryptic doesn't release that information but acting like the Bortasqu' wasn't a failure because we don't know to what extent makes me chuckle

    edit: final point, do we really need cryptics sales figures to know that the reason the t6 nova hasn't come out yet is because science ships don't sell as well as Tac ships?
    Post edited by jagdtier44 on
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    trennantrennan Member Posts: 2,839 Arc User
    fury#0751 wrote: »
    All I want as a reward is the ability to recover any bound to character items when I'm tired of that character.
    As an LTS I have 'quit' STO multiple times and when I come back a few years later, its nice to create a new Captain and start over just to get a feel of how the missions and game mechanics have changed.
    Consequently I have deleted a number of unplayed Captains only to realize later I'd unpacked a lobi ship or Character bound item.

    Unlike some others I don't have the patience or time to play alts, so when expansions come out offering a new playthrough experience, they devalue any previous character bound purchases i've made.

    I really like the game, but the thing stopping me making purchases at the moment is, all the ships Im interested in are character bound and I've promised myself to not spend any zen on items that aren't BoA or, even if Character Bound, reappear in my store as a reclaimable item if I delete the character that previously claimed it.

    There is this. However, while they offer new play through experiences with expansions. I don't let it detract me from my main characters. Like the Gamma Recruit. I did it's play through, and the more annoying rewards like complete 100 TFOs. Outside of that, I log in to doff and adm on it. I don't delete chars, I simply let them sit idle until I decide to toy around with them again. I mean in total you can have 56 characters for LTS and 55 for non-sub. I still play my mains after I finish the newer play through.

    This way, you can save you character bound stuff for the ones you play, and account bound for your alts. This is how I play, and the majority of ships in the C-store hold very little value to me. Outside of their traits, they don't even really interest me. Which is why I've been playing sine the game went F2P, and have not bought any ship from the c-store.

    This is where the character bound ships and equipment gain more value to me, than the c-store ones. I'm buying the character bound one for the express purpose to use them. I'm not wasting money on ships, traits, and consoles, that I'm likely never going to use to begin with.

    Now if they separated these into the following categories:

    Ship
    Ship Trait
    Consoles

    To where I could buy just the ones I wanted, with out having to acquire part of it I don't want. For instance buying a ship to get the trait. I don't actually want the ship or the console. This is where the C-store ships lose their value to me. Why would I want to waste money on buying two products I don't want, just to get the product that I do?

    Now someone mentioned hobbies. I'll use two that have a bit in common, leather working and tailoring. Sure, you have to spend money on these, that's a given. You chose tailoring as the hobby, but you need a specific needle from leather working to accomplish something. The question is, would you buy a $100 leatherworking kit, to get the 1 needle you need? Or would you buy just the needle?

    This is how the C-store ships work for me. I'm having to buy the $100 kit, to get the $5 needle I need. Which makes them a waste of money.
    Mm5NeXy.gif
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