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Old BOffs Need Love Too

Way back when you were a Lieutenant Commander and you were desperate for any BOff to fill a seat, you Commissioned a Green BOff, whom you loved and cherished and trained and promoted. You've been through hard times together. But along the way you've run into a few Purple BOffs with the exact set of traits you want, and Greenie Lameo was sidelined. Now, with all the mission reward BOffs and the Recruiting BOffs you've earned along the way your roster is pretty full.

Then along comes this sweet BOff you can really use, but you have no space on your roster. Someone has to go...

You could give Greenie to another player, but you can't sell her or turn her into a manual or donate her to a project. Of course you can 'trade' the BOff, or give it away using the trade interface, but who wants Greenie Lameo? Some newguy on ESD?

So, you are stuck, like the boy in Old Yeller, taking your BOff for that last walk to the airlock. It's been real, yo. Swoosh!

Is that the best we can do?

Here are some ideas for alternate uses for BOffs:

* Assign as Captain of a ship in the Admiralty system. This would give a +1, +2, or +3 point bonus, depending on quality, to the department of the BOff, so a Tac vessel with a Sci BOff assigned as Captain would get a bonus to its Sci rating. I would limit shuttles to not having a BOff slot, ships below T3 would only have a Green BOff slot, and ships below T5 could only have Green or Blue BOffs assigned as their captains. T5+ ships could, of course, have any BOff assigned as Captain.

* Assign as Fleet Starbase Personnel. Essentially useless but cosmetic NPCs walk around the base now. Depending on the level of the base, a number of BOff slots could be made available to your Fleet. These characters could then be available for reassignment to other fleet personnel at need, or traded/dismissed by the Fleet leadership. I would number the slots and have them correspond to stations on the Starbase, so you know the Engineering BOff slot 23 will be found in the Fabrication section and your character can go there to see the BOff performing her new duties.

* Deactivated and put up for sale on the exchange. Who wouldn't want to buy a BOff with every Power available to her class? Or buy her for that one Power the purchaser can't train? Trained BOffs should be a different category from Candidate BOffs, and should not be able to be converted nto manuals.

*Assigned as Captain of Active vessels in the Player's Hangar, which are then called when the player uses Fleet Support. The Fleet Support vessels will be generic models of the ship types, but may then use the Abilities and Traits of the Captain(s) assigned to the ship(s).


So, present your better ideas on what to do with your old BOffs, or refine the ideas I've presented. I know the Roleplayer guys will love some long-term solutions to the 'disposal' issue.
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Comments

  • bejaymacbejaymac Member Posts: 448 Arc User
    brian334 wrote: »
    You could give Greenie to another player, but you can't sell her or turn her into a manual or donate her to a project. Of course you can 'trade' the BOff, or give it away using the trade interface, but who wants Greenie Lameo? Some newguy on ESD?

    Have Cryptic brought back that ability ?

    I used to trade commissioned Boffs back and forward between both of my accounts (dual logged), that way I could train them without needing someone else. But after we got the training manuals in R&D that ability was removed, spent hours trying to pass Boffs back and forward with no luck, that's when I found a post confirming that commissioned Boffs were now bound.

  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    bejaymac wrote: »
    Have Cryptic brought back that ability ?

    To be honest, it's been so long since anyone was interested in trading BOffs I haven't tried it. Before Manuals were a thing we did do trading for abilities a particular captain couldn't train, but since Manuals there isn't even that.

    It's sad that the things that make players eager to interact are being shoved into the corners of the game.

    Does STO stand for Solo Trek Online?
  • wideningxgyrewideningxgyre Member Posts: 629 Arc User
    I have to admit, after playing many missions with certain boffs, I can't quite bring myself to throw them away.

    I still use Skavrin because he's been around for so long, and it feels disloyal to toss him in the garbage. It would be nice to be able to send him somewhere.
  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 7,036 Community Moderator
    I'd rather upgrade my BOFFs than get rid of them.

    I think it's time to give us the ability to change our BOFF's Traits, that way we don't have to give up our "old favorites" and increase their value to us.

    They wouldn't get a pool of Traits to switch out the way Captains do, it would be a one-for-one trade out any time you wanted to change a Trait, similar to the way changing BOFF powers used to be.

    We could choose to turn a BOFF into a Trait to be given to another BOFF, instead of turning it into a Training Manual.

    Perhaps make some Traits available through Crafting. Allow some Lockbox Traits to be used on BOFFs as well.

    Changing BOFF Traits would obviously increase the BOFF's rarity since rarity is linked to Traits. This could also open up the idea of Ultra Rare (3x Superior, 1x Standard) and Epic (4x Superior) BOFFs.
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  • kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,248 Arc User
    brian334 wrote: »
    bejaymac wrote: »
    Have Cryptic brought back that ability ?

    To be honest, it's been so long since anyone was interested in trading BOffs I haven't tried it. Before Manuals were a thing we did do trading for abilities a particular captain couldn't train, but since Manuals there isn't even that.

    It's sad that the things that make players eager to interact are being shoved into the corners of the game.

    Does STO stand for Solo Trek Online?

    Commissioned BOFFs are like BoE equipment - once you use it, it's bound. That's been pretty normal for MMOs since long ago, so it's not a "forcing us to play solo" thing.
  • stormcrow#8086 stormcrow Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    I would like to be able to turn a character into a Boff. I mean, the "system" already works with a character, seems reasonable to me that the same system could be applied to Boffs. I'm sure the AI would not get the boff to handle like a "player", but it could handle all the traits and skills. Of course there would still be a "melee" issue unless they change all "melee" to harry targets like the Furiadon Fangs do,

    The downside would be that once you have made your character into an "Epic Boff" they're a boff from now on.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,026 Arc User
    I'd rather upgrade my BOFFs than get rid of them.

    I think it's time to give us the ability to change our BOFF's Traits, that way we don't have to give up our "old favorites" and increase their value to us.

    They wouldn't get a pool of Traits to switch out the way Captains do, it would be a one-for-one trade out any time you wanted to change a Trait, similar to the way changing BOFF powers used to be.

    We could choose to turn a BOFF into a Trait to be given to another BOFF, instead of turning it into a Training Manual.

    Perhaps make some Traits available through Crafting. Allow some Lockbox Traits to be used on BOFFs as well.

    Changing BOFF Traits would obviously increase the BOFF's rarity since rarity is linked to Traits. This could also open up the idea of Ultra Rare (3x Superior, 1x Standard) and Epic (4x Superior) BOFFs.
    I like that idea. I still have boffs I acquired in 2010. Some of them are commons that I've been using for their skills and don't want to get rid of because I've spent so long using them. Fun fact: for space combat a common Human is just as good as a VR Human. The Human space trait doesn't have basic or superior forms, thus all Human Boffs are equally useful for space builds. Like this lot:
    eridiancollection_by_marhawkman-dch07n8.png
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
    Costume_marhawkman_Tsin%27xing_CC_Comic_Page_Blue_488916968.jpg
  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    edited November 2018
    I'd rather upgrade my BOFFs than get rid of them.

    I think it's time to give us the ability to change our BOFF's Traits, that way we don't have to give up our "old favorites" and increase their value to us.

    They wouldn't get a pool of Traits to switch out the way Captains do, it would be a one-for-one trade out any time you wanted to change a Trait, similar to the way changing BOFF powers used to be.

    We could choose to turn a BOFF into a Trait to be given to another BOFF, instead of turning it into a Training Manual.

    Perhaps make some Traits available through Crafting. Allow some Lockbox Traits to be used on BOFFs as well.

    Changing BOFF Traits would obviously increase the BOFF's rarity since rarity is linked to Traits. This could also open up the idea of Ultra Rare (3x Superior, 1x Standard) and Epic (4x Superior) BOFFs.

    I had considered upgrade as an option, but then I thought Cryptic might want to sell BOffs and us being able to upgrade might interfere with the Dil market. But I guess upgrading could become a Dil sink too.

    Some traits have always been race-locked, and I'd hate to see that go away, but an upgrade which opens a new trait slot should allow the trait-swapping thing to happen even if Greenie Lameo already has the Andorian Cold and Acute Senses traits that are currently required. Actually, this might make those BOffs with four empty trait slots preferable to those with several racial traits.
  • pooched#6581 pooched Member Posts: 204 Arc User
    It's time for re-engineering for BOffs! Take a BOff, slap him in the "Strange Change Machine" (remember those?), see what comes out. If it has too many tentacles or tries to eat you, herd it back in and try again!
  • darkbladejkdarkbladejk Member Posts: 2,312 Community Moderator
    Still have my original boffs from my original toon way back when I first started playing and would love to see some type of boff upgrading feature. Some of them are greens and some are white quality even. Sure they may not be the best in terms of overall stats but those same boffs are the one's that have gotten me through many an engagement. Would love to see something extra for the older boffs.
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  • bendalekbendalek Member Posts: 1,781 Arc User
    Well, some of the Wailin White's and Greenie Lameo's have traits that don't have "superior" versions, so those I will usually slap a Specialization onto, to make them useful (at least in T6 ships or in a ground combat role) But the option to upgrade BoFF's that do have "superior-able" (such a word? ) traits would be nice ...

    Even better might be a 're-roll" option like we have with most gear, so you could maybe get lucky and roll a Human with SRO - Perhaps use bottles of Chateau Picard and Tribble Carcasses as the "fuel" for the "BoFF Randomizer"?? :wink:
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  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 11,417 Arc User
    Reengineering for Boffs. Send them to the Reeducation Camps and they'll come out better than before. This is not to be confused with the Soylent Green Tanks where we reprocess Boffs for their knowledge.

    Funny though, the Boff that has been with you through thick and thin won't impart any of their knowledge to you when they are dismissed. Unlike the Boffs you never really knew that have been down in the Cargo Holds or in the Officer's Ward Room that are quite willing to spill the beans before you send them to the Tanks.

    What a world, what a world.
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  • jamieblanchardjamieblanchard Member Posts: 465 Arc User
    I too would rather upgrade the greens and blues one gets early on. In a sense, I do do that as far as find the purples down the line, dress them up in the outfit, give the same name. Green "goes to the academy", and "come back" as a purple version of her/himself.
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  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    edited November 2018
    Okay, here's an idea: We know Stafleet has an Advanced Tactical Training, Command College, and other advanced officer training programs. So, invest your Expertise and then wait for a number of in game hours appropriate to the school for the officer to complete her training. (The time away would only count during play, so your captain cannot assigned the officer to school, go to bed, and wake up with the upgrade completed. This is supposed to represent time spent away from the ship, not just another commendation or admiralty grind.)

    Example:

    Ensigns undergo Starship Operations Qualification, which requires 6 in game hours. The cost in Expertise is based on the current Quality of the BOff as follows:
    Common = 1100, Uncommon = 2300, Rare = 3600, Very Rare = 5000, and Ultra Rare = 6500

    Lieutenants participate in Advanced Tactical Training which requires 9 in game hours. Expertise costs are:
    Common = 2300, Uncommon = 3600, Rare = 5000, Very Rare = 6500, and Ultra Rare = 8100

    Lieutenant Commanders must complete their Starship Command Qualification, spending 12 hours to do so, which costs:
    Common = 3600, Uncommon = 5000, Rare = 6500, Very Rare = 8100, and Ultra Rare = 9800

    Commanders attend Command College, that takes 15 hours o complete at an Expertise cost of:
    Common = 5000, Uncommon = 6500, Rare = 8100, Very Rare = 9800, and Ultra Rare = 11500

    In addition, a Dill Cost might be added to this, but I'm thinking the Dill would come in on the Trait Manuals.

    When the course is completed, there are results, but perhaps not the ones you want!

    Fail = the BOff did not measure up and gets nothing
    Pass = The BOff gets a quality improvement, and if that BOff's race has an assigned trait associated with the quality that trait is granted at the lowest level possible. I the BOff's race does not have an assigned trait for that quality he gets an empty trait slot which can be used for training.
    Pass with Honors = The BOff gets a quality improvement and the associated trait slot, plus a Promotion if possible.

    Using the traits by quality scale, some improvements will also mandate an upgrade of existing traits. For example, a Common BOff being upgraded to Uncommon goes from 2 Basic and 2 Standard Traits to 1 Basic and 3 Standard Traits. Thus one of the existing Basic level Traits must upgrade to Standard. I'd number them Slot 1, Slot 2, Slot 3, and Slot 4, and then have them scale from lowest to highest, so in a Common Character Slots 1 and 2 will only accept Basic traits, and an upgrade to Uncommon would leave Slot 1 at Basic but force Slot 2 to become a Standard slot. When that character upgrades to Rare it would be Slot 4 which upgrades to Superior.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,026 Arc User
    I too would rather upgrade the greens and blues one gets early on. In a sense, I do do that as far as find the purples down the line, dress them up in the outfit, give the same name. Green "goes to the academy", and "come back" as a purple version of her/himself.
    That's not how it works.

    Commissioned Boffs don't actually have quality in the same sense that gear does(although uncommissioned ones do). Displayed quality is actually a function of how many Superior and Basic traits they have.
    eridianbofftraits_by_marhawkman-dcs6dz3.png
    Honestly, it'd be better if you had some sort of upgrade token that let you either change a basic trait to a superior one or a genetic resequencer that lets you change a trait entirely. Of course, for option B, the catch is that you need a resequencer with the right trait. *shakes lock box* I wonder what's inside? :p
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
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  • velquavelqua Member Posts: 1,207 Arc User
    I would love to have the ability to change my BOFFs' rarity. Of course, it would be nice to be able to change their traits as well like we do with the mods on our weapons.
    18662390068_f716cd60e3.jpg
  • snowwolf#0563 snowwolf Member Posts: 877 Arc User
    All my BOFF's are white.. I had them since my char was a Lieutenant, they mean a lot to me.. lol.
  • wraithshadow13wraithshadow13 Member Posts: 1,550 Arc User
    I would love to see some of these ideas implemented. There are a LOT of ways that boffs could be and SHOULD be improved upon. More customizations and powers would be great. Alternate weapons modes would be nice, like getting them to use the healing mode on the Lukari ground weapon. Being able to upgrade their rarity or pick out their traits would be amazing. Personally, i would love to see them be able to use player kit abilities like the universal modules or even be able to save their appearance and load it onto their replacement Boffs of a higher rarity. There is just so many ways to improve them, and they just... don't...


    In terms of getting rid of or replacing, I think it would be awesome to see some of the ideas above. Training and trading boffs was amazing. I don't know why they would get rid of that, as doing so was a terrible idea. I would love to see my old boffs roaming around fleet installations, more so, if there is a boost for having them there. Replacing generic Officers would be insanely cool, for so many reasons. I would love to see this extended to ground as well though, so security teams would be other bridge officers if you wanted. Those guys, could also use the ability to be customized to our crew. Being able to place them as "captains" on fleet support ships or admiralty ships would be a great touch as well. It seems like Cryptic is really trying to push them as just being commodities, not people (like how PWE treats us, lol) but Cryptic is really not sure just how many people get attached to these guys or hand craft them to fit their own personal stories.
  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    All my BOFF's are white.. I had them since my char was a Lieutenant, they mean a lot to me.. lol.

    You are exactly the kind of player this idea was made for!

    Way back in the dark ages my first captain got his first ship after a nasty Borg attack and I was given a choice of one of three BOffs: An Andorian Tactical Officer, a Tellarite Engineer, and a Vulcan Science Officer. I picked the Andorian because she had Beam Overload. My very next officer was an Andorian Engineer. Both are Green quality, and both are still on my ship. I have a ton of better BOffs. Like, a whole bank full of them. But those are the guys I like.
  • jrdobbsjr#3264 jrdobbsjr Member Posts: 419 Arc User
    I tend to keep the BOFFs the story gives me around, it just seems right. Though with my Roms, the ones without SRO tend to go to the landing party.....except Tovan who stays on the bridge.
  • pwstolemynamepwstolemyname Member Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    Another vote for Boff Re-Traiting hear. My preferred method being to reduce a boff down to a boff specific genetic resequencer then inject it into another Boff.

    To justify cryptics development time it will need a dilithium cost. Maybe have it cost expertise to create a genetic resequencer and dilithium to power the gene implantation device. So that like tech upgrades people can make and sell them without spending dill. Put the burden on the user.

    I am thinking we need an RNG component too as cryptic love to make us spend more dill through gambling. Maybe have the trait it replaces be random. So if we want more than one super trait on a boff we have to deal with it replacing the wrong ones.

    Actually that sounds too frustrating, wouldn't put it past cryptic, but maybe they should just limit boffs to two ground trait slots and two universal trait slots. that would accommodate all existing boffs and limit the power creep a smidgen.
  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,440 Arc User
    I like the idea of being able to upgrade BOFFs.
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  • crypticarmsmancrypticarmsman Member Posts: 3,496 Arc User
    IDK - for me it's easier just to decide who I'm going to replace; get the purple Boff (same race/gender but with the traits I want) - and then just recreate the deleted Boffs look and rename the new Boff the same as the replaced Boff and voilla - he/she/it is upgraded. :)

    in the end - they're all digital pixels anyway.

    Given no matter what system Cryptic might come up with, said system is still going to take certain resources; and by the time you're character is 65 and you're looking to upgrade Boffs, you probably have more Expertise banked than you'll ever use; so re-promoting/re-skilling isn't that that big a cost via the above method if you can't stand to let an 'original' Boff go. YMMV :)
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  • vetteguy904vetteguy904 Member Posts: 2,815 Arc User
    upgrading would be interesting.especially if you had a chance to "Crit" and not only get the upgrade, but instead of just his/her race's trait pool he/she would get a random trait from another race. the downside might be that one of your superior natural traits might be replaced by a not so great alien trait. it would mitigate stacking the boff deck. though it would be VERY cool to have a Vulcan boff with Efficient Operative and Pirate....
    Spock.jpg

  • brian334brian334 Member Posts: 2,186 Arc User
    Upgrading is fine, and I can see lot of ways to do it, but one thing I want to do is make BOffs more generally useful.

    As it is now, you need four or five BOffs for your ship and if you don't use one of them in ground too, then another four for that. Nobody needs more than nine on their roster. With other uses for BOffs players will begin to purchase extra active slots on their rosters so they can include them in the extra stuff.

    I tried to focus in my first post on their being used in features already in game: Admiralty, Starbase personnel, and Feet Reinforcements, for example. How about some new features for BOffs?

    Away Teams: Your fleet is due to attack and you need to get those shield generators down. Beam over a DOff team headed by an appropriate BOff. Tactical: Blow up the generator: (Needs an Explosives Expert and some Assault Squad DOffs.) Engineering: Disable the shield generator: (Needs a Deflector Officer and some Security DOffs.) Science: Override the shield generator: (Needs Shield Distribution Officer and Development Lab Scientist.)

    The Away Team is a special category of DOff assignment lead by a BOff which affects the difficulty of the mission. In the example above, the target is shielded, as are the active defenses, and there is a choice to either brute-force the shield, all while under attack from the defenses, or to make the attack after the shield is removed.Of course, if the Away Team fails, youmight have to brute-force it anyway.

    I'm sure you can see hundreds of uses, so I won't list them all, but the idea is to have something going on while you're involved in the mission which might help you to succeed. They need not be combat related. For example, you could put away teams down on six different worlds to survey potential colony sites, or you could send a medical team to a plague-ridden ship or planet. The idea is that you are a captain, have a crew at your disposal, and you don't need to be the guy holding the hypospray, especially with an enemy dreadnaught staring you in the face.

    DOff Training: How about upgrading a DOff? White DOffs became a rare commodity when Starbases started needing donations. I spent hours at the various DOff recruiters hoping for Whitey LeBlanc back when fleets were upgrading their bases. But what do you do with that green Entertainer, (no, not the Orion hologram!) A BOff could have a special assignment which allows her to upgrade DOffs. Of course, a Green BOff can never train a Blue DOff.

    Some possible effects: Sometimes a DOff is an overlooked BOff and can be upgraded to BOff status! This will create a new BOff Candidate and cost you your old DOff. Sometimes a DOff will get a change in her ability, such as a Conn Officer changing from Reduced Evasive Recharge Rate to Reduced Attack Pattern Recharge Rate. Sometimes a DOff will gain an R&D school. Some of these effects can be the intended goal of the training, while others can be random. But Ranking up should be the main purpose of DOff training, and it should require days to complete.

    Long Term Assignments: Diplomatic, Fleet, and Command organizations require expertise, whether in maintaining security during a hostile negotiation, designing the next prototype starship component or creating an historical record of the latest conflict. Long term assignments should take weeks to complete, but should also offer some sweet benefits. Imagine an Officer Exchange Program which results in your Federation Captain getting the use of a Klingon Vessel, or a Starship Systems Design mission ending up with your captain getting a copy of the latest pototype console or engine.

    The general idea is to make BOffs into valuable, and tradeable, commodities. Make them worth something more than a walk to the airlock when you've acquired their replacement.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,026 Arc User
    Another vote for Boff Re-Traiting hear. My preferred method being to reduce a boff down to a boff specific genetic resequencer then inject it into another Boff.

    To justify cryptics development time it will need a dilithium cost. Maybe have it cost expertise to create a genetic resequencer and dilithium to power the gene implantation device. So that like tech upgrades people can make and sell them without spending dill. Put the burden on the user.

    I am thinking we need an RNG component too as cryptic love to make us spend more dill through gambling. Maybe have the trait it replaces be random. So if we want more than one super trait on a boff we have to deal with it replacing the wrong ones.

    Actually that sounds too frustrating, wouldn't put it past cryptic, but maybe they should just limit boffs to two ground trait slots and two universal trait slots. that would accommodate all existing boffs and limit the power creep a smidgen.
    Or maybe re-implement genetic resequencers and make them only usable on Boffs? :p Needless to say getting specific traits requires specific resequencers that aren't necessarily easy to get. Oh and a special trait upgrade sequencer that take non-superior traits and makes them Superior.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
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  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 11,417 Arc User
    Are we talking about making Augments? :)
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!
    Judge Dan Haywood
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