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Well, there goes George Takei

donnydoo818#3004 donnydoo818 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
Sadly, George Takei is the latest celebrity to be accused of assault. And what makes this especially sad is that regardless of whether that *specific* claim is true or not, he actually ADMITS to assault in this interview with Howard Stern. He tries to excuse it by saying he didn't threaten anyone's job, but what he describes was still non-consenaul. This is very sad news for the Trek community who respected Mr. Takei :(
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  • kitsunesnoutkitsunesnout Member Posts: 1,210 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    (redacted, probably not a subject appropriate for this forum anyway)
    Post edited by kitsunesnout on
  • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
    A saying often comes up: one rule for the rich and another rule for the poor. There are injustices everywhere and for George Takei, he is at the end of his long successful life and he admits he did wrong, so long as what he said is true and it can be backed up, then ultimately it's a good thing for George to come out and admit it.

    It's better than hiding it behind a court room gag order like certain people in the UK are doing with injunctions to keep their sordid details secret, even from their other half especially when all it does is damage their profiles and lives irrepairably by not disclosing it.

    After that whole Weinstein debacle, a man who couldn't keep his hands to himself and using his position of power to such extremes to cage women until he got what he wanted. George Takei doesn't even come close to the level a serial monster like that man.
    T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
    Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
  • jexsamxjexsamx Member Posts: 2,802 Arc User
    Nothing about or in that interview sounded like an admission to outright sexual assault. He even says at the end that at least one oral review he was given by a subordinate officer was consensual.

    Y'all need to chill.
  • crimeonadime#2645 crimeonadime Member Posts: 24 Arc User
    jexsamx wrote: »
    Nothing about or in that interview sounded like an admission to outright sexual assault.

    You know, as someone who has always admired Mr. Takei, I really WISH that were true. Unfortunately it is not.

    In that interview Mr. Takei said that he groped people who were skittish or afraid to try to "persuade" them.

    Here is a newsflash for you: if someone is afraid, they are not consenting. And if someone is not consenting, then it is assault.

    What's more, if a man said he groped a WOMAN who was afraid to try to persuade her, that man would rightly be called a predator. Just because Takei groped men he can't be held to a different standard than if he groped women.

    Groping anyone who is AFRAID is not consensual, and that means assault. There is no way to excuse that.

    It sucks that a Trek icon has been revealed as a predator, but he admitted to this behavior himself. When you admit something you lose any presumption of innocence.


  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
    As far as actual victims go, they should report the crime as soon as they are able to try to prevent future victims instead of waiting decades. If the police do nothing, then the victim is not partially responsible for the monster still being on the street and hurting more people in the process.

    Mild sexual harassment is extremely subjective. There are some people that are just too hands on and are acting innocently without realizing the stress they are putting on the other person. Therefore, they should speak up and admit they are becoming uncomfortable with the person being too hands on. Then there is certain cultural practices like the Italian cheek kiss which is used as a form of greeting.

    With the way things are going, this will be our society.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvLHliGCcGU

    Demolition Man and Idiocracy are becoming more and more documentaries instead of science fiction. I am not sure which is worse.

  • crimeonadime#2645 crimeonadime Member Posts: 24 Arc User
    starkaos wrote: »
    As far as actual victims go, they should report the crime as soon as they are able to try to prevent future victims instead of waiting decades. If the police do nothing, then the victim is not partially responsible for the monster still being on the street and hurting more people in the process.

    I absolutely agree that would be the best thing. Unfortunately many people who are assaulted are psychologically damaged or cannot handle what happened emotionally, and it takes them time to get the "resolve" to actually speak out. Like I said I agree it would be best if everything was reported immediately simply so the predator can't assault others, but we also can't blame someone who is going through a form of PTSD for not thinking clearly.
    Mild sexual harassment is extremely subjective.

    Except when the assaulter actually admits the person was afraid. Someone who is afraid is not consenting, so the moment you admit someone you groped was afraid you admit you sexually assaulted them. There is no way around that. See my previous post for my details on this specific case.
  • silverlobes#2676 silverlobes Member Posts: 1,953 Arc User
    When Stephen Collins was outed as a molester, people were quite prepared to decry him as scum. George Takei needs holding to that same standard.

    Someone's popularity, is no reason to not hold them accountable, to the standards which they themself demand others be held to.
    "I fight for the Users!" - Tron

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  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
    Mild sexual harassment is extremely subjective.
    Except when the assaulter actually admits the person was afraid. Someone who is afraid is not consenting, so the moment you admit someone you groped was afraid you admit you sexually assaulted them. There is no way around that. See my previous post for my details on this specific case.

    Which is where the problem comes in. If they knew that the person was afraid. I think we can all agree that intentionally grabbing someone's buttocks or TRIBBLE is sexual harassment. However, certain comforting gestures, friendly gestures, and accidentally touching due to being pushed or not realizing someone is behind you is not. They could be unwanted gestures, but if their is no sexual intent, then it is not sexual harassment.
  • crimeonadime#2645 crimeonadime Member Posts: 24 Arc User
    Which is where the problem comes in. If they knew that the person was afraid.

    Bud, I'm telling you what Takei himself said. HE said he groped people who were AFRAID to try to "persuade" them. Those were HIS words.

    And again I have to say this: if a man said the same thing about groping a woman, nobody with a brain would be trying to defend that statement. But for some reason people are trying to defend what Takei said, which was clearly assault.
  • marty123#3757 marty123 Member Posts: 670 Arc User
    If it was consensual in his own home it’s not TRIBBLE!
  • rimmarierimmarie Member Posts: 418 Arc User
    edited November 2017

    The 'story' was that the guy passed out at Takei's house after a date and woke up to George groping him.
    He got mad and left.

    Sexual assault? yep.
    But he got mad and left. End of story. They even dated again.
    George didn't make him stay or say 'you will NEVER work in this city again if you leave!'
    Does it make it ok? No.
    But it didn't seem like it was a habitual thing. Just an after-date-attempt-to-get-some-gone-wrong
    I know that is a no-no these days, but 40yrs ago? Commonplace.






    Post edited by rimmarie on
  • marty123#3757 marty123 Member Posts: 670 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    > @rimmarie said:
    > 'Afraid' wasn't used. he said 'skittish'
    > and it wasn't 'them', it was 'him'
    > THOSE were HIS words.
    >
    > The 'story' was that the guy passed out at Takei's house after a date and woke up to George groping him.
    > He got mad and left.
    >
    > Sexual assault? yep.
    > But he got mad and left. End of story. They even dated again.
    > George didn't make him stay or say 'you will NEVER work in this city again if you leave!'
    > Does it make it ok? No.
    > But it didn't seem like it was a habitual thing. Just an after-date-attempt-to-get-some-gone-wrong
    > I know that is a no-no these days, but 40yrs ago? Commonplace.

    People also forget back then it was illegal to be homosexual or for two men/women to have sexual relationships.
  • marty123#3757 marty123 Member Posts: 670 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    :(
  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,659 Arc User
    Well to Hollywood, folks.

    Hollywood, it's Mos Easily, folks.
    dvZq2Aj.jpg
  • theraven2378theraven2378 Member Posts: 5,985 Arc User
    The biggest hive of scum and villainy on the planet, that's Hollywood
    NMXb2ph.png
      "The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
      -Lord Commander Solar Macharius
    • donnydoo818#3004 donnydoo818 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
      rimmarie wrote: »
      'Afraid' wasn't used. he said 'skittish'

      Dude, you just told an outright lie. He said AFRAID right after the word skittish. Go to 45 seconds and hear for yourself:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJYb0Yom5UQ

      If you are going to start off your post with an outright lie then there is no reason to read any further =(
    • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
      Which is where the problem comes in. If they knew that the person was afraid.

      Bud, I'm telling you what Takei himself said. HE said he groped people who were AFRAID to try to "persuade" them. Those were HIS words.

      And again I have to say this: if a man said the same thing about groping a woman, nobody with a brain would be trying to defend that statement. But for some reason people are trying to defend what Takei said, which was clearly assault.

      I am talking in general, not about any particular case. I am not defending or accusing Takei since it is not my place. There is just too many times when someone is accused of sexual harassment when there was no sexual intent involved like a person bumps into another on a crowded train.

      Humans are social creatures that need a hug. When people can't get a hug unless they say "Permission to hug granted. In 3...2...1.", then we will lose a part of our essence. This is what all these accusations are causing where it is not known if sexual harassment was actually involved. Where someone can ruin another's life just by the accusation and no evidence. Something as innocent as a comforting hug is perverted until people have to rely on nonphysical gestures. This is why I fear that Demolition Man is a documentary where all the things that cause enjoyment are removed like social contact, unhealthy, but addictive food, and other activities that make us human.
    • donnydoo818#3004 donnydoo818 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
      starkaos wrote: »
      I am talking in general, not about any particular case.

      Well this thread happens to be about a particular case, and about the things Mr. Takei himself described doing. So all the general comments about hugs being misinterpreted don't really apply to this case.
    • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
      starkaos wrote: »
      I am talking in general, not about any particular case.

      Well this thread happens to be about a particular case, and about the things Mr. Takei himself described doing. So all the general comments about hugs being misinterpreted don't really apply to this case.

      Since it seems to be open season for sexual harassment accusations, general comments about hugs being misinterpreted and the resulting impact to society does apply. After all, it is all related to that Hollywood creep that started it all.
    • rimmarierimmarie Member Posts: 418 Arc User
      edited November 2017
      rimmarie wrote: »
      'Afraid' wasn't used. he said 'skittish'

      Dude, you just told an outright lie. He said AFRAID right after the word skittish. Go to 45 seconds and hear for yourself:

      If you are going to start off your post with an outright lie then there is no reason to read any further =(

      Calm down. prolly missed it when I alt-tabbed back into STO to hit button to join the MU queue. my bad man
      I removed the error and I shall leave you to your controversy. :/
      Post edited by rimmarie on
    • angrytargangrytarg Member Posts: 11,001 Arc User
      "Misinterpreted hugs". Heh. That's cute.
      lFC4bt2.gif
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    • mirrorchaosmirrorchaos Member Posts: 9,844 Arc User
      Is there any more information on this? i read up somewhere else that it was some form of sexual harrassment, along the lines of groping another man however Takei denied this is the case because it was 40 years ago.
      T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW.
      Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
    • jexsamxjexsamx Member Posts: 2,802 Arc User
      [a long and valid post that I happen to disagree with one little thing on]

      All I can say is I've been "skittish" in intimate situations too. And it absolutely wasn't from a lack of desire. You're assuming a concrete no from a party that you can't prove ever made that clear. All you have is Takei's side of the story, with all the bias one can assume from that. Without the other side of the story, though, any judgement made is only half-informed.

      All Takei's admitted to is tantamount to horseplay, nothing more.
    • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,556 Arc User
      jexsamx wrote: »
      [a long and valid post that I happen to disagree with one little thing on]

      All I can say is I've been "skittish" in intimate situations too. And it absolutely wasn't from a lack of desire. You're assuming a concrete no from a party that you can't prove ever made that clear. All you have is Takei's side of the story, with all the bias one can assume from that. Without the other side of the story, though, any judgement made is only half-informed.

      All Takei's admitted to is tantamount to horseplay, nothing more.

      And time makes people forget and/or distort the details about certain situations.
    • damienvryce2damienvryce2 Member Posts: 428 Arc User
      I lost Louis C.K. NOW George Takei?! WTF??!! Can't anyone keep their hands to themselves? The ultimate irony would be if accusations come out against Shatner. You know being Kirk and all. :|
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