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Discovery 1x05: Choose Your Pain

donnydoo818#3004 donnydoo818 Member Posts: 17 Arc User
edited October 2017 in Ten Forward
For the discussion of tomorrow night's episode: Choose Your Pain

Official summary: While on a mission, Lorca unexpectedly finds himself in the company of prisoner of war Starfleet Lieutenant Ash Tyler and notorious intergalactic criminal Harry Mudd.

Preview:



General topics for discussion:

A: What was your overall impression of the episode?

B: What did you like or not like about the episode?

C: What do you think will happen next?

Discovery 1x05: Choose Your Pain 19 votes

I enjoyed it
47%
timv94irm1963mustrumridcully0mhall85seaofsorrowsvaloreahmarkhawkmanevilmark444starswordc 9 votes
I did not enjoy it
26%
toivadarakossalexhurlbutsmokebaileytaylor1701d 5 votes
Other (please post to explain)
26%
trygvar13jcswwkodachikunothelordofshadeskabutotokugawa 5 votes
«1

Comments

  • tunicate515#4416 tunicate515 Member Posts: 30 Arc User
    Bumping this to the top since it was the first thread posted for this episode and someone else was too lazy to even bother looking at the first page before posting a duplicate.
  • mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    edited October 2017
    I enjoyed it
    This one was better than last week's episode. I'll post more tomorrow, once more have watched!
    Post edited by mhall85 on
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  • darakossdarakoss Member Posts: 850 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    Well they officially retconned the D-7.
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  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,556 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    The episode itself was good, and presented an interesting potential issue for later episodes. Discovery's transporter room was awesome, the first thing set wise in this entire show to aesthetically resemble the franchise in any way. Loved the character development between Burnham and Saru, Burnham is still unlikable in my opinion but is gradually becoming a decent Starfleet officer.

    Oh and one other thing, that "D7" designation was a load of horse manure.
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  • jcswwjcsww Member Posts: 6,458 Arc User
    edited October 2017
    Other (please post to explain)
    Harry Mudd was played very well. The actor did the role justice in my opinion. Saru continues to prove that he is one of a few respectable characters on the entire show and stepped up in the Captain's role when needed. Lorca proves that he doesn't deserve to be a Captain when he mentions that he literally blew up his previous crew instead of allowing them to be imprisoned by the Klingon's while he escaped. The couple of F-bombs were not needed in this episode. Burnham is still nonredeemable in my opinion. Clearly CBS forgot what a Klingon D7 looked like!
  • kodachikunokodachikuno Member Posts: 6,020 Arc User1
    Other (please post to explain)
    I thought it was awesome how the "Klingon Bird of Prey" so strongly resemble STO's Romulan "Miracle Worker" ships! /sarcasm
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    quick n dirty screen grabs I know
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    I was also overjoyed at the next level TRIBBLE of established canon with their "D7"
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    I mean how could you think these were anything but clones?! /sarcasm

    I was somewhat surprised we finally did some character development for others besides chocolate 'save us boy genius weslet!'
    and the last couple minutes of the episode were almost optimistic.

    one of the better TRIBBLE episodes so far but gods.. I really wish JJTrek #4 would hurry up, its closer to star trek than this
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    Personally I don't care about the D7 thing. Why? Well... d7 isn't really the Klingon name for that vessel class now is it?
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it



    Another disappointment.....when I heard of D7's, I was YAY......until I saw it, and was like.......





    .....~slams face into wall~
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    darakoss wrote: »
    Well they officially retconned the D-7.

    More like Mongolian Cluster TRIBBLE it, I think is a better term.


    ST Discovery is our name, bait 'n switch is our game!
    dvZq2Aj.jpg
  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,929 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    More like Mongolian Cluster **** it, I think is a better term.


    ST Discovery is our name, bait 'n switch is our game!

    I didn't/don't care for much of the Klingon re-design stuff myself. The Klingon ships I'm really disappointed in.

    For anyone watching the After Trek podcast, I think Glen Hetrick and Neville Page will be on there next week, so if you don'tlike the Klingon makeup designs and such, please be sure to hit them and After Trek on Twitter during the show.

    I plan to tag them all with #BringBackMichaelWestmore.

    Dear Devs: I enjoyed the Legacy of Romulus expansion much more than the Delta Rising expansion. .
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    valoreah wrote: »
    More like Mongolian Cluster **** it, I think is a better term.


    ST Discovery is our name, bait 'n switch is our game!

    I didn't/don't care for much of the Klingon re-design stuff myself. The Klingon ships I'm really disappointed in.

    For anyone watching the After Trek podcast, I think Glen Hetrick and Neville Page will be on there next week, so if you don'tlike the Klingon makeup designs and such, please be sure to hit them and After Trek on Twitter during the show.

    I plan to tag them all with #BringBackMichaelWestmore.

    Oh, I'm sure those guys will get quite a mouthful from the viewers even if I am not there.

    Put in #PutSomeActualTOSinThis!

    As I said, if they say we're gonna get Constitutions in the future.....I'm gonna need to brace myself with a few stiff whiskeys for that, for it's probably gonna look nothing like the TOS Constitution. :/
    dvZq2Aj.jpg
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    valoreah wrote: »
    More like Mongolian Cluster **** it, I think is a better term.


    ST Discovery is our name, bait 'n switch is our game!

    I didn't/don't care for much of the Klingon re-design stuff myself. The Klingon ships I'm really disappointed in.

    For anyone watching the After Trek podcast, I think Glen Hetrick and Neville Page will be on there next week, so if you don'tlike the Klingon makeup designs and such, please be sure to hit them and After Trek on Twitter during the show.

    I plan to tag them all with #BringBackMichaelWestmore.
    Oh please... Mr. Westmore retired. He's OLD.....
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  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,929 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    Oh please... Mr. Westmore retired. He's OLD.....

    He's still better than Hetrick or Page can ever hope to be IMO. He wouldn't have to do the work himself, just mentor the makeup artists on how to do it right.

    Dear Devs: I enjoyed the Legacy of Romulus expansion much more than the Delta Rising expansion. .
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  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,929 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    Oh, I'm sure those guys will get quite a mouthful from the viewers even if I am not there.

    Put in #PutSomeActualTOSinThis!

    As I said, if they say we're gonna get Constitutions in the future.....I'm gonna need to brace myself with a few stiff whiskeys for that, for it's probably gonna look nothing like the TOS Constitution. :/

    Oh I'm with you on the Connie. I've no doubt if they do show one, it will be different. I'm kind of torn though because I think that ship in particular is iconic and should be left as it was, however I also don't think I'd go insane if they tweaked it a bit.

    Dear Devs: I enjoyed the Legacy of Romulus expansion much more than the Delta Rising expansion. .
    thecosmic1 wrote:
    Anyone calling Valoreah a "Cryptic fanboy" must be new to the forum.

    Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    valoreah wrote: »
    Oh, I'm sure those guys will get quite a mouthful from the viewers even if I am not there.

    Put in #PutSomeActualTOSinThis!

    As I said, if they say we're gonna get Constitutions in the future.....I'm gonna need to brace myself with a few stiff whiskeys for that, for it's probably gonna look nothing like the TOS Constitution. :/

    Oh I'm with you on the Connie. I've no doubt if they do show one, it will be different. I'm kind of torn though because I think that ship in particular is iconic and should be left as it was, however I also don't think I'd go insane if they tweaked it a bit.

    I mean, Rogue One was literally days before A New Hope, and a lot of the "DISCO!" elements were kept, and looked fine. Trek can do it, too. One does not need to pull a "Bait and Switch!" game to make something.

    That thing we saw the other day was NOT a D7, folks....not even CLOSE.
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  • mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    I enjoyed it
    valoreah wrote: »
    Oh, I'm sure those guys will get quite a mouthful from the viewers even if I am not there.

    Put in #PutSomeActualTOSinThis!

    As I said, if they say we're gonna get Constitutions in the future.....I'm gonna need to brace myself with a few stiff whiskeys for that, for it's probably gonna look nothing like the TOS Constitution. :/

    Oh I'm with you on the Connie. I've no doubt if they do show one, it will be different. I'm kind of torn though because I think that ship in particular is iconic and should be left as it was, however I also don't think I'd go insane if they tweaked it a bit.

    If we're asking which side of the spectrum, the Discovery Phaser or the Discovery D7, a Connie will be on... it's got to be the Phaser side.

    It may be tweaked, or at least would have a more intricate hull pattern/design... but it would have to be the Jefferies design, for the most part. I don't think it would get out of the design room if it were anything else, let alone the deafening backlash from fans if they ape the design.

    It's a line you don't cross, and I don't think the producers are THAT stupid.

    Now, some purists will demand nothing short of the "Cage" model from 1965, and anything short of that will be met with apocalyptic fury. I think it's silly to expect that, especially at this point... but, those fans are already predisposed to not like anything this show does, IMO. There's wiggle room available to the producers, but even I have my limits. :tongue:
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  • trygvar13trygvar13 Member Posts: 689 Arc User
    Other (please post to explain)
    It was a copy paste of last week's episode. People need to be rescued and ship but "jump" at all costs. Introduction of an obvious Klingon spy (Tyler) who even looks like a TOS Klingon. Mudd was only there ton confuse us so it would not be too obvious that Tyler is a spy. Offering food to the Captain so it gets stolen by Mudd's pet. Mudd is a spy. Right? No he is a survivor. Tyler is a spy and I would not even be surprised if he were Voq. In the previous episode it was mentioned that would have to sacrifice everything. He had nothing so what did he have to sacrifice? The only thing he had: his Klingonness (well what passes for Klingonness in Discovery). Someone in Starfleet is obviously a spy because how could the Klingons know where Lorca would be and how could they enter Federation space so easily? It was all a set up to plant a spy inside Discovery.
    Dahar Master Qor'aS
  • trygvar13trygvar13 Member Posts: 689 Arc User
    Other (please post to explain)
    valoreah wrote: »
    Oh, I'm sure those guys will get quite a mouthful from the viewers even if I am not there.

    Put in #PutSomeActualTOSinThis!

    As I said, if they say we're gonna get Constitutions in the future.....I'm gonna need to brace myself with a few stiff whiskeys for that, for it's probably gonna look nothing like the TOS Constitution. :/

    Oh I'm with you on the Connie. I've no doubt if they do show one, it will be different. I'm kind of torn though because I think that ship in particular is iconic and should be left as it was, however I also don't think I'd go insane if they tweaked it a bit.

    Actually in the tie-in Discovery novel Desperate Hours the way the Enterprise is described it is a very standard Connie. And not only that but the crew wears the TOS uniform. It is mentioned that this is the new Starfleet uniform but that only the crews of the Constitution-class starships have been issued them yet. It is slowly going to replace the blue uniforms.
    Dahar Master Qor'aS
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    valoreah wrote: »
    Oh please... Mr. Westmore retired. He's OLD.....
    He's still better than Hetrick or Page can ever hope to be IMO. He wouldn't have to do the work himself, just mentor the makeup artists on how to do it right.
    what makes you think he dislikes their work?
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  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,929 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    what makes you think he dislikes their work?

    I neither said he would like nor dislike their work. I'm simply saying his makeups are better in my opinion.
    Dear Devs: I enjoyed the Legacy of Romulus expansion much more than the Delta Rising expansion. .
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  • toivatoiva Member Posts: 3,276 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    Well it had some good elements, some far and between Trek elements (the doctor mainly, and Mudd was fine), but other than that...

    I cringe whenever I see these "Klingons" and their weird ships. I cringe whenever Michael or Saru are in a scene (and I usually love all Star Trek aliens, particularly those part of Starfleet). Saru is just not consistent in his behaviour at all. Sometimes at the smallest amount of risk he argues against an action, other times he'll wave away any objections.
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    I'd prefer this over the so-called D7 seen in the story.


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  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,929 Arc User
    I enjoyed it
    ^ I'm with you on that one. I don't like the Klingon ships in Discovery. They are too far divergent.

    @baddmoonrizin can this thread be merged with the other?
    Dear Devs: I enjoyed the Legacy of Romulus expansion much more than the Delta Rising expansion. .
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  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,533 Arc User
    Maybe it is time to consider Discovery as a sequel to Enterprise and not a prequel to TOS. A TOS prequel should have the ships
    and uniforms visually upgraded to match what is possible in 2017, but also have any fan recognize the ship or costume. The Kelvin Universe Constitution could have been used in a TOS prequel instead of in Star Trek 2009 and everyone would recognize it as an updated version of the Enterprise. However, there is no similarity between the TOS D7 and Discovery D7. If Discovery named their Klingons as some other alien race, then it would have worked much better.

    With the way things currently are they could introduce the Enterprise as a Borg Cube and wearing Stormtrooper armor and I wouldn't be surprised.
  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    starkaos wrote: »
    Maybe it is time to consider Discovery as a sequel to Enterprise and not a prequel to TOS. A TOS prequel should have the ships
    and uniforms visually upgraded to match what is possible in 2017, but also have any fan recognize the ship or costume. The Kelvin Universe Constitution could have been used in a TOS prequel instead of in Star Trek 2009 and everyone would recognize it as an updated version of the Enterprise. However, there is no similarity between the TOS D7 and Discovery D7. If Discovery named their Klingons as some other alien race, then it would have worked much better.

    With the way things currently are they could introduce the Enterprise as a Borg Cube and wearing Stormtrooper armor and I wouldn't be surprised.

    They simple don't a damn about us, I feel.
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  • baddmoonrizinbaddmoonrizin Member Posts: 7,036 Community Moderator
    @valoreah Can't merge threads with polls. It messes up the polling data.
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  • mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    I enjoyed it
    starkaos wrote: »
    Maybe it is time to consider Discovery as a sequel to Enterprise and not a prequel to TOS. A TOS prequel should have the ships
    and uniforms visually upgraded to match what is possible in 2017, but also have any fan recognize the ship or costume. The Kelvin Universe Constitution could have been used in a TOS prequel instead of in Star Trek 2009 and everyone would recognize it as an updated version of the Enterprise. However, there is no similarity between the TOS D7 and Discovery D7. If Discovery named their Klingons as some other alien race, then it would have worked much better.

    With the way things currently are they could introduce the Enterprise as a Borg Cube and wearing Stormtrooper armor and I wouldn't be surprised.

    Hyperbole aside, your point is taken.

    The D7 was the most egregious and avoidable kind of mistake. I won't defend them for it, and they could have done a number of things to avoid fan consternation. Added to the struggles with the makeup and the subtitles... they probably should have picked their battles, in terms of revamping.

    All of that said, I don't think they'd treat the Connie the same way. I don't think they're THAT stupid, LOL. As I tried to explain to another poster (but that poster seemed to think I was shouting them down, instead of engaging in conversation, so whatever)... they have some wiggle room to work with the Connie, but not THAT much. The Connie is iconic. The producers know that, or at least, they lead you to believe they do. We won't see the 1965 "Cage" model, so those fans will just have to get over that. Nothing that the producers have said or done have led me to believe we would see that, anyway, and I don't think the 1965 model would fit in with the design language they've established. A refined 1966 model, though? That isn't unreasonable.

    Still, if they do decide to ape the Connie... the backlash will be deafening.
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  • smokebaileysmokebailey Member Posts: 4,334 Arc User
    I did not enjoy it
    mhall85 wrote: »
    starkaos wrote: »
    Maybe it is time to consider Discovery as a sequel to Enterprise and not a prequel to TOS. A TOS prequel should have the ships
    and uniforms visually upgraded to match what is possible in 2017, but also have any fan recognize the ship or costume. The Kelvin Universe Constitution could have been used in a TOS prequel instead of in Star Trek 2009 and everyone would recognize it as an updated version of the Enterprise. However, there is no similarity between the TOS D7 and Discovery D7. If Discovery named their Klingons as some other alien race, then it would have worked much better.

    With the way things currently are they could introduce the Enterprise as a Borg Cube and wearing Stormtrooper armor and I wouldn't be surprised.

    Hyperbole aside, your point is taken.

    The D7 was the most egregious and avoidable kind of mistake. I won't defend them for it, and they could have done a number of things to avoid fan consternation. Added to the struggles with the makeup and the subtitles... they probably should have picked their battles, in terms of revamping.

    All of that said, I don't think they'd treat the Connie the same way. I don't think they're THAT stupid, LOL. As I tried to explain to another poster (but that poster seemed to think I was shouting them down, instead of engaging in conversation, so whatever)... they have some wiggle room to work with the Connie, but not THAT much. The Connie is iconic. The producers know that, or at least, they lead you to believe they do. We won't see the 1965 "Cage" model, so those fans will just have to get over that. Nothing that the producers have said or done have led me to believe we would see that, anyway, and I don't think the 1965 model would fit in with the design language they've established. A refined 1966 model, though? That isn't unreasonable.

    Still, if they do decide to ape the Connie... the backlash will be deafening.

    I still think the TOS Connie will look good on screen

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    A sleek, smooth, hull is the prime example of advanced.

    Also....Rogue One, which happens literally days before A New Hope, retained that classic, retro look....be it the TIE fighters, the Storm Troopers, Tantive IV and its interiors, The Death Star, and the Imperial Ship interiors.....that, to me, says one can be retro.
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  • mhall85mhall85 Member Posts: 2,852 Arc User1
    I enjoyed it
    I never said that the Connie doesn't, or wouldn't, look good on screen, @smokebailey. The sleek & symmetrical design is what makes the Connie truly iconic. Part of me would argue that the purest version of the Connie would be the Probert refit from The Motion Picture, but I still dig the '66 model.

    Unfortunately, Discovery has chosen a different design language. It is not like Rogue One, in that sense. I'm not saying you have to LIKE it or not... it's just a fact: Discovery is not going for the same nostalgia as Rogue One.

    Now, with that said, I think the producers will be FAR more respectful to the Connie... because again, I don't think they're THAT stupid to do otherwise. If you look at Discovery's Phaser or Communicator, I think you'll find the spirit in which they would "refresh" the Connie.
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