I think the biggest issues with 2.0 are some of the ability effects. There are some combinations of buffs/debuffs that make enemies in space and ground literally light up in blinding bright lighting to a degree it is severly interfering with a scene's visibility.
I don't have any ground examples, but something like this (note that in the center of the screenshot, you are supposed to see my/the player's ship)
happened on some ground maps as well, making characters just a blinding, bright light walking around. Some of us remarked that all the flashy buff/debuffs effects were already way over the top in 1.0 - there's so much visual "noise" that does not transport any recognizable information and severly influences the game's aesthetic, but with 2.0 you can reach ability combinations that literally white- or green-out the scene in front of you.
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You mentioned that the 2.0 made some of the maps look worse, but that it's not necessarily broken. I agree with that somewhat, so far I'm about 50%-50% on the new lighting. Starfleet Academy is much better with 2.0 for ex.
My question is - are there any plans to fix/improve the issues on the maps that currently look worse with 2.0? And a bonus question - as mainly a KDF player, I think that the 2.0 didn't go down well with some, even most of the Klingon unique environments. Is there something that can be done about it other than reverting back to 1.0 ourselves? For example, the red displays on KDF interaction panels, or the red and yellow glows are just blinding while using 2.0 and cause headaches. This is very noticeable in the Fleet Embassy, especially in the 'Ops' section - it's just a shower of red and yellow blinding lights, one can't even see what's on the panels.
I think the biggest issues with 2.0 are some of the ability effects. There are some combinations of buffs/debuffs that make enemies in space and ground literally light up in blinding bright lighting to a degree it is severly interfering with a scene's visibility.
I don't have any ground examples, but something like this (note that in the center of the screenshot, you are supposed to see my/the player's ship)
happened on some ground maps as well, making characters just a blinding, bright light walking around. Some of us remarked that all the flashy buff/debuffs effects were already way over the top in 1.0 - there's so much visual "noise" that does not transport any recognizable information and severly influences the game's aesthetic, but with 2.0 you can reach ability combinations that literally white- or green-out the scene in front of you.
That reminds me of the Seraph "Ship of Lights" from the original Battlestar Galactica...
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 1.0.
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 2.0.
As you can see the lighting is VERY different. I intentionally trapped my boffs outside the main room there to make sure there was nothing else in the shot BUT my character. It is NOT the flashlights causing this, it is the map lighting itself. Some rooms in there work fine but others are vastly different and lead to it being totally different in terms of how it looks.
As an extra I'm also going to include this,
With lighting 1.0 the "carrier" cylinder that the beam travels down is actually partially transparent with no glow present allowing you to see the inside actual "beam" graphics. In 2.0 the "carrier" cylinder is less transparent with more of a glow added blurring out the graphics. This is more prevalent on beams like the Herald AP weapons, but it's visible on all beams and should be corrected.
Hopefully these screenshots will be enough to show @tacofangs that it's not me going, "but it's slightly different!" but actually issues with how the lighting is placed on the maps compared to the original lighting positions. In the cases of "What Lies Beneath" it's actually being lit differently in what looks like "default" lighting linked to locations of "light" assets like a bulb instead of intentionally placed lighting assets. Different isn't always bad, completely off the walls default lighting placements is.
I hate how overuse of the word "rushed" had made it basically meaningless.
Rushed used to mean it was put out so quickly that it had major systemic problems.
Rushed now mean
>There is a problem on a small number of maps so it was rushed!
You make the latter sound unreasonable; but, to me, indeed, releasing something when you know it's not actually production-ready, is precisely what 'rushed' means. It has become an extremely common thing, these days, though. Microsoft does it all the time: "Bring out something now, because Ferengi, and who cares whether it's actually ready or not." Were it me, I would indeed have waited to release until all known bugs were fixed (mind you, not all bugs, but all bugs you knew of at the time). Guess I'm old-school that way, but it's now being mocked. O, the times, they are a-changing!
But delaying putting it out would also have meant halting any development at all on new maps. Is that what you'd rather see? Them take 2 years to go fix all the old content and not get any new content in that time? That's all tacofangs was saying is that now that they have these new toys to play with they can make a lot more fun new and exciting maps that look really great, instead of spending time fixing old stuff that really, who does anymore?
Personally, I'm pretty new to the game myself, and I guess I never experienced lighting 1.0, but I have to say I have not seen anything in the game that looked horribly bad or broken yet. Watching videos of people playing in the same areas as me, then with lightin 1.0 and I can say hands down that if the game still had lightin 1.0, I probably would not have subbed and just stopped playing. Areas so dark you have to guess where you are going is a good reason to just never touch a game again, and there appear to be quite a few of those with the old system.
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 1.0.
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 2.0.
I'm very curious to know how you managed to get those screens with lighting 2.0. That's not what I get when I switch from 1.0 and 2.0 without changing anything else and I have brightness at 100 and bloom at 85.
For the beams, I agree, though, especially the plasma ones. It looked horrible when the infested Vaadwaur got shot by everyone on the Lleiset.
While I was here, I also took the liberty to take some screens of K-13:
Before/After:
I'm very curious to know how you managed to get those screens with lighting 2.0. That's not what I get when I switch from 1.0 and 2.0 without changing anything else and I have brightness at 100 and bloom at 85.
For the beams, I agree, though, especially the plasma ones. It looked horrible when the infested Vaadwaur got shot by everyone on the Lleiset.
I literally loaded the mission in 1.0, took the screenshot and then opened the options menu and swapped to 2.0, then took a second screenshot. My Brightness and Bloom are both set as low as possible for both screen shots. It looked the exact same when I left the mission and went back in with 2.0 on first so it's not a case of "well it's loaded in 1.0 and then swapping to 2.0 causes issues" because even when loaded as 2.0 baseline it looks like this. THIS is why I'm saying missions looked messed up because they quite literally DO when I'm running them. Other people are seeing much better results somehow and I'm sitting here getting weird lighting and funky overly bright and blurred out maps. I have no doubt that map is SUPPOSED to look like your screen shots, but it doesn't as shown by mine. Is there some issue based on graphics cards that might be causing this? (I'm running a Nvidia if that makes any difference)
Beams should be an easy enough fix though because they all seem to be operating under the exact same set of rules. Tweak the rules to allow for more transparency and less bloom and they should look just like 1.0.
I think the biggest issues with 2.0 are some of the ability effects. There are some combinations of buffs/debuffs that make enemies in space and ground literally light up in blinding bright lighting to a degree it is severly interfering with a scene's visibility.
I don't have any ground examples, but something like this (note that in the center of the screenshot, you are supposed to see my/the player's ship)
happened on some ground maps as well, making characters just a blinding, bright light walking around. Some of us remarked that all the flashy buff/debuffs effects were already way over the top in 1.0 - there's so much visual "noise" that does not transport any recognizable information and severly influences the game's aesthetic, but with 2.0 you can reach ability combinations that literally white- or green-out the scene in front of you.
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I don't have any ground examples, but something like this (note that in the center of the screenshot, you are supposed to see my/the player's ship)
happened on some ground maps as well, making characters just a blinding, bright light walking around. Some of us remarked that all the flashy buff/debuffs effects were already way over the top in 1.0 - there's so much visual "noise" that does not transport any recognizable information and severly influences the game's aesthetic, but with 2.0 you can reach ability combinations that literally white- or green-out the scene in front of you.
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You mentioned that the 2.0 made some of the maps look worse, but that it's not necessarily broken. I agree with that somewhat, so far I'm about 50%-50% on the new lighting. Starfleet Academy is much better with 2.0 for ex.
My question is - are there any plans to fix/improve the issues on the maps that currently look worse with 2.0? And a bonus question - as mainly a KDF player, I think that the 2.0 didn't go down well with some, even most of the Klingon unique environments. Is there something that can be done about it other than reverting back to 1.0 ourselves? For example, the red displays on KDF interaction panels, or the red and yellow glows are just blinding while using 2.0 and cause headaches.
That reminds me of the Seraph "Ship of Lights" from the original Battlestar Galactica...
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
http://imgur.com/LIEz9oA
http://imgur.com/ctMYyw8
http://imgur.com/s8BIAmz
Edit: Trying to get these images to show in the thread for easier viewing. See if this helps:
Yes it is the map that is the problem.
With Lighting 1.0 in the mission start room.
With Lighting 2.0 in the mission start room.
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 1.0.
In the "center" room where you face the malfunctioning Hologram with Lighting 2.0.
As you can see the lighting is VERY different. I intentionally trapped my boffs outside the main room there to make sure there was nothing else in the shot BUT my character. It is NOT the flashlights causing this, it is the map lighting itself. Some rooms in there work fine but others are vastly different and lead to it being totally different in terms of how it looks.
As an extra I'm also going to include this,
With lighting 1.0 the "carrier" cylinder that the beam travels down is actually partially transparent with no glow present allowing you to see the inside actual "beam" graphics. In 2.0 the "carrier" cylinder is less transparent with more of a glow added blurring out the graphics. This is more prevalent on beams like the Herald AP weapons, but it's visible on all beams and should be corrected.
Hopefully these screenshots will be enough to show @tacofangs that it's not me going, "but it's slightly different!" but actually issues with how the lighting is placed on the maps compared to the original lighting positions. In the cases of "What Lies Beneath" it's actually being lit differently in what looks like "default" lighting linked to locations of "light" assets like a bulb instead of intentionally placed lighting assets. Different isn't always bad, completely off the walls default lighting placements is.
But delaying putting it out would also have meant halting any development at all on new maps. Is that what you'd rather see? Them take 2 years to go fix all the old content and not get any new content in that time? That's all tacofangs was saying is that now that they have these new toys to play with they can make a lot more fun new and exciting maps that look really great, instead of spending time fixing old stuff that really, who does anymore?
Personally, I'm pretty new to the game myself, and I guess I never experienced lighting 1.0, but I have to say I have not seen anything in the game that looked horribly bad or broken yet. Watching videos of people playing in the same areas as me, then with lightin 1.0 and I can say hands down that if the game still had lightin 1.0, I probably would not have subbed and just stopped playing. Areas so dark you have to guess where you are going is a good reason to just never touch a game again, and there appear to be quite a few of those with the old system.
For the beams, I agree, though, especially the plasma ones. It looked horrible when the infested Vaadwaur got shot by everyone on the Lleiset.
While I was here, I also took the liberty to take some screens of K-13:
Before/After:
I literally loaded the mission in 1.0, took the screenshot and then opened the options menu and swapped to 2.0, then took a second screenshot. My Brightness and Bloom are both set as low as possible for both screen shots. It looked the exact same when I left the mission and went back in with 2.0 on first so it's not a case of "well it's loaded in 1.0 and then swapping to 2.0 causes issues" because even when loaded as 2.0 baseline it looks like this. THIS is why I'm saying missions looked messed up because they quite literally DO when I'm running them. Other people are seeing much better results somehow and I'm sitting here getting weird lighting and funky overly bright and blurred out maps. I have no doubt that map is SUPPOSED to look like your screen shots, but it doesn't as shown by mine. Is there some issue based on graphics cards that might be causing this? (I'm running a Nvidia if that makes any difference)
Beams should be an easy enough fix though because they all seem to be operating under the exact same set of rules. Tweak the rules to allow for more transparency and less bloom and they should look just like 1.0.
that is a pretty green, though ;#)
gameover?
cool, thanks for the pic (right click, search on tineye ;#) , darn, not much there)