Romulans have already been eliminated as a viable group in the game. You won't see Romulan Fleets.
Romulan's are allied some with FED some with KDF and it is the catalyst that is used to explain how in the 29th century we are all part of the Federation.
I never understood why the conversion rate of dil: fleet credits is just 1:1. And to be honest, after the Phoenix box event I regret I didn't hoard my surplus dil instead of dumping it on fleet projects. People manage to drop their fleet marks seconds after a new project goes active. But donating dil ? Heck no !
Well I don't know what your expecting because 1:1 is a very high payout rate and very fast way to earn 50k Fleet Credit or 100k Fleet Credit or more. Especially if you refine your 8000 DIL a day... in a week you can acquire 50,000 credit. That should not be something you easily earn in a day... some players have taken weeks or months to develop their characters.
400,000 EC gives only 4000 FK and that's 100:1 not 1:1. Take your time and realize character development takes time & effort, and the fact you're able to buy DIL (often rewarded nicely for small zen purchase) is very fast way to speed this process up. Without the exchange however the whole F2P market would not exist so be more thankful as there are many options available you're just not choosing some of them.
Even if you didn't have a lot of DIL on my toons when Phoenix came you could have saved possibly 80k had you even 5000 DIL left in your reserve over the week and that would have gotten you 20 phoenix packs. I actually thought they awarded far too many Tech Point for an uncommon reward, they should have given blue reward's with 51,200 and green reward's with 25,600... Not to mention every blue reward option could be converted into 2x Ultra Phoenix upgrades...
Don't forget they changed the Ferengi at the Dilithium mine to take immediate trade of preferred dilithium claims for 2,500 fleet or reputation spendable dilithium. It cost me 3 Kelvin constitutions, a Nakhul Acheros and two Lobi ships that I sold for lockbox keys but including a Zen stipend I managed to get enough preferred dilithium claims to clear 1.3 mil dilithium from an upgrade project on my own over 3 days from one of the fleets I run rather than wait what could be weeks for members and my own 8k dailies to dailies to do it.
The tactic for K-13 i have employed is to put up at least 2 Tier 6 ships in a competition for members contributions getting it to Tier 3 with the first Tier 3 upgrade due to start tomorrow and so I think it is working as an incentive. Obviously I continue to contribute myself because I need to make 200k fleet credits a week to keep the 10% dilithium bonus going for members to help them make the dilithium to contribute.
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
True, been working on that too, but I tend to load and clear it straight away before anyone else has a chance unless they catch it when I'm changing character to grab a few more resources.
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
That... trade of ships for Dil you made, @Wisecasper? It makes me wince in pain. Would be real hard for me to do the same. The value of the ships would seem to be worth a lot more than that, but I could be off as I've not checked.
I never understood why the conversion rate of dil: fleet credits is just 1:1. And to be honest, after the Phoenix box event I regret I didn't hoard my surplus dil instead of dumping it on fleet projects. People manage to drop their fleet marks seconds after a new project goes active. But donating dil ? Heck no !
you did exactly like I did. And wishing the same thing. After I blew all my spendable Dil, I wished I'd held on to a mil or so - just in case.
you did exactly like I did. And wishing the same thing. After I blew all my spendable Dil, I wished I'd held on to a mil or so - just in case.
Oh wait, that's what you just said. :P Same, though. Phoenix event, after a fashion, really punished the Dilithium donators.
Dilithium is simply too valuable. It is used in practically everything and you only get so much of it refined a day.
Getting a 1:1 dilithium to fleet credit return makes donating dilithium to a fleet BARELY more efficient than simply throwing it into a fire.
Take people like me that haven't played in ages, I come back and I need dilithium just to take a TRIBBLE at a Starbase and am forced to play the eternal game of 'catch up'. I ain't sitting on 700,000,000,000,000 dilithium like some players... I have to play every day for a week and refine everything I get just to afford a single new item for my ship -.-
Let me donate unrefined dilithium? Then we're golden. Actually make it worth fleet credits? I am down.
Of every single possible activity in STO, farming dilithium to refine solely for fleet, ranks on par with AFKing at ESD for time-in-for-reward efficiency.
That... trade of ships for Dil you made, @Wisecasper? It makes me wince in pain. Would be real hard for me to do the same. The value of the ships would seem to be worth a lot more than that, but I could be off as I've not checked.
Sure, they weren't all sitting in my inventory, it's one ship for keys and then recycling everything I get from opening the boxes including the Lobi and grinding a bit more ec for more keys. I was just very lucky. All I have really lost is the one original ship I sold as part of the first trade for keys, a month's dilithium stipend and the Lobi I had saved up to that point. But I have passed the 8k dilithium daily limit with the help of the ec exchange.
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
Actually, I made the case in the past that getting the Fleet Mine to Level 3, could provide a benefit of allowing Unrefined Dilithium be donated to Fleet Projects. Those Remans should be able to take care of the rest.
For K-13, my Characters have been doing the vast bulk of Dilithium donations. My characters are sitting on 4,000 Zen that was bought when it was 275 awaiting it going back into the 400s.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
So, basically some fleet leaders are incapable of being happy for their folks that they had something better to spend dilithium on for a while?
The phoenix boxes drained MASSIVE quantities of refined dilithium out of the system because THEY WERE A GREAT DEAL.
Rejoice, you idiots! Because seemingly we can have nice things ...despite the inevitable sniveling. People will be back to kicking in dilithium as opportunity and slowly recovering reserves permit.
Actually, I made the case in the past that getting the Fleet Mine to Level 3, could provide a benefit of allowing Unrefined Dilithium be donated to Fleet Projects. Those Remans should be able to take care of the rest.
For K-13, my Characters have been doing the vast bulk of Dilithium donations. My characters are sitting on 4,000 Zen that was bought when it was 275 awaiting it going back into the 400s.
I'm missing a point of referrence here. Or else I've just not seen that to which you refer. Is there something in the Lvl 3 Fleet Mine that will let you donate Unrefined to Fleet? If so, please, tell us more.
Unlimited direct use? Why I do believe someone said the Fleets are all done, so how could that be?
Well it looks to me like Cryptic can tank any 500 Market very quickly if it wanted to.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Dilithium is simply too valuable. It is used in practically everything and you only get so much of it refined a day.
Dilithium is actually pretty worthless. Even at the current exchange rate. It's crazy easy to get. So easy that I max out all 8 characters every day with no problem. And believe me there are much bigger fish who are maxing out 10+ or 15+ characters and like me they aren't using bots.
Getting a 1:1 dilithium to fleet credit return makes donating dilithium to a fleet BARELY more efficient than simply throwing it into a fire.
It may not seem like it but the 1:1 reward is balanced from a macro perspective. Meaning that how many fleet credits are earned is planned from Cryptic. If dilithium were to give out more fleet credits than it currently does, then fleet credits would have to be nerfed somewhere else to compensate. Mostly likely the nerf would come from fleet marks. Otherwise, it would just be too easy to build up your starbase and holdings.
Take people like me that haven't played in ages, I come back and I need dilithium just to take a **** at a Starbase and am forced to play the eternal game of 'catch up'. I ain't sitting on 700,000,000,000,000 dilithium like some players... I have to play every day for a week and refine everything I get just to afford a single new item for my ship -.-
Of every single possible activity in STO, farming dilithium to refine solely for fleet, ranks on par with AFKing at ESD for time-in-for-reward efficiency.
Dilithium is just too easy to get. See my above response to your post. The phoneix promotion was a fantastic way to drain dilithium out of the game. Fast forward now what? A few weeks and I'm already back up near 500,000 refined. In 8 days I'll be at a million refined. Nothing has changed in terms of generating dilithium. It's crazy easy. If you ever want to go on some dilithium runs, just hit me up in game.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Meh gotta come out with stuff people want to spend dilithium on to get people to spend it via those pheonix packs were great but you look at this TRIBBLE they did in the last year and this K13. As an individual I really have no motivation whatsoever to even bother with it.
It's all about supply and demand you can put in millions of sinks but theres usually no one to fill them if they aren't providing something useful. Another thing is the pricing when you look at time spent to gather and refine this dilithium. Like that new sovy requiring you to buy the other pack to get the full set when the pack is only useful to the admiralty system since they were only useful to romulan and kdf players due to being a new ship to their ship line.
Dilithium is just too easy to get. See my above response to your post. The phoneix promotion was a fantastic way to drain dilithium out of the game. Fast forward now what? A few weeks and I'm already back up near 500,000 refined. In 8 days I'll be at a million refined. Nothing has changed in terms of generating dilithium. It's crazy easy. If you ever want to go on some dilithium runs, just hit me up in game.
It's great you have so many alts, multiplying all your daily gains by 8; but, as an 'argument' to disqualify the assessments of others, it's really not that valid. Most people probaly have just 1 main, and maybe an alt somewhere they rarely use (thank the insane Upgrade System for that). For all purposes and intent, 8k is simply the daily refining limit for most. And, at 8k, Dilithium is simply a prized commodity. And it doesn' matter whether Dilithium is easy to get: we all know that; it's only the refining end of things that counts. So, when I spend 240k on Phoenix boxes, or on our Fleet, it takes 30 days to replenish.
If you want to talk 'crazy easy' to get, then it's Fleet Marks. And yet they pay out 50x as much as Dilithium. Yeah, that's crazy alright. Therefore, Dilithium should pay out 50:1 as well. If not more. Especially since Dilithium, indirectly, has a 'money' value attached to it, in that you can convert it to Zen (for which you would otherwise have to open your wallet). So, if you want to know why ppl are so reluctant to contribute Dilithium, it's because it pays out like cr*p. Simple as that.
Dilithium is just too easy to get. See my above response to your post. The phoneix promotion was a fantastic way to drain dilithium out of the game. Fast forward now what? A few weeks and I'm already back up near 500,000 refined. In 8 days I'll be at a million refined. Nothing has changed in terms of generating dilithium. It's crazy easy. If you ever want to go on some dilithium runs, just hit me up in game.
It's great you have so many alt, multiplying all your daily gains by 8; but, as an 'argument' to disqualify the assessments of others, it's really not that valid. Most people probaly have just 1 main, and maybe an alt somewhere they rarely use (thank the insane Upgrade System for that). For all purposes and intent, 8k is simply the daily refining limit for most. And, at 8k, Dilithium is simply a prized commodity. And it doesn' matter whether Dilithium is easy to get: we all know that; it's only the refining end of things that counts. So, when I spend 240k on Phoenix boxes, or on our Fleet, it takes 30 days to replenish.
If you want to talk 'crazy easy' to get, then it's Fleet Marks. And yet they pay out 50x as much as Dilithium. Yeah, that's crazy alright. Therefore, Dilithium should pay out 50:1 as well. If not more. Especially since Dilithium, indirectly, has a 'money' value attached to it, in that you can convert it to Zen (for which you would otherwise have to open your wallet). So, if you want to know why ppl are so reluctant to contribute Dilithium, it's because it pays out like cr*p. Simple as that.
I play one main and one alt most of the time. I have others I play here and there...but that is all. Since the pheonix box and me converting all my dil into zen, I have more than a couple hundred dil piled up already. So...yeah, not that hard.
Phoenix was like, what, 2 weeks ago?! So, that's 112k per toon then. So, yeah, with one or two extra alts, a couple of hundred K since then makes sense. But with just 1 toon, 112k is soon spent on a few Fleet Projects.
I feel the OP's pain, but this is nothing new: I own a T4 fleet, and I've put so much into its construction (I'm #1 on all the holdings' leaderboards, by a millions-to-thousands ratio) and have complained about not having ANY help, so many times. I finally just got fed up one day and swung the axe at my roster, getting rid of inactive players and those who had been in the fleet for a while and donated 0; my roster went from 153 to 37. Finding fleet mates who play at least weekly and/or those who actually donate is one of the most frustrating things in this game, to me.
Also, having a stable leadership is a problem. I've promoted several to jobs they said they wanted, and then didn't do. Recruiting, training, events coordination -- everybody I tried in those spots never did ****. If I'd known it would be about me building 90% of the starbase I wouldn't have joined/created a fleet!
The bottom line is, it's almost impossible to find players who aren't selfish. I suppose it's a reflection of the world entire, but it's true, nobody cares about anybody else. I've spent a lot on this game (understatement) and have been VERY generous with those around me because of it, yet I know most players aren't like me, and that's fine. Variety is the spice of life and all that.
I gave up long ago trying to get others to help me build the fleet. It's just a waste of time. I'm gonna keep doing what I'm doing, get the fleet up to T5, and then probably sell it. And not get a fraction back of everything I put into it.
I'm a console player [Xbox One] and freely admit that I created far too many STO characters for my own good over two separate gamertags. I've finally been doing the hard part of pairing them down to four on each over the course of this holiday week, and may have to cut those numbers down as well; simply to focus my STO gameplay and hopefully become a better overall fleet contributor to those remaining. I've yet to see any of the fleets that I've joined get beyond tier one and I do my part as much as I'm able donating EC, dilithium, resources and items into the bank. Thus far no matter what I've coughed up, the return all seems one-sided to me. Often anything in the bank, for instance that may interest me, is restricted to me due to my seldom to never changing level. In one instance, I was given a recruitment role and still left unable to actually claim anything from the bank; apparently at that level mining the bank was not an option and nobody ever thought to mention it? The fleet that I've donated the most energy credits to [literally millions] that did promote me, later demoted me following a reconfiguration intended for some esoteric purpose that still escapes me? I don't take daily EC and fail to understand why a fleet would make that stuff available anyway. Right now, I'm just trying to stick it out until a level 3 fleet unlock actually occurs, just to access additional costume options to benefit my game roleplaying. A long slog if you ask me!
Also, would it really matter if Dilithium paid out 50:1?! I mean, what does Cryptic care?! There's no RL money involved, so who cares if you buy like 500 Locators!? It's all for personal use. You can't sell Fleet gear, so there's no market (hence no alleged inflation, as suggested). If anything, those 500 Locators present a highly increased likelihood of you upgrading a few (also good for Cryptic).
Cryptic reasons the other way around though. Like, "If you only need to donate a tiny bit of Dilithium to get your Fleet gear, then those Projects are not a large enough Dilithium sink." That sounds rather reasonable, at first glance; until you realize cr*ppy paying out Dilithium causes ppl to donate to Fleet hardly at all. And that's the situation a lot of Fleets are in now.
It's great you have so many alts, multiplying all your daily gains by 8; but, as an 'argument' to disqualify the assessments of others, it's really not that valid. Most people probaly have just 1 main, and maybe an alt somewhere they rarely use (thank the insane Upgrade System for that). For all purposes and intent, 8k is simply the daily refining limit for most. And, at 8k, Dilithium is simply a prized commodity. And it doesn' matter whether Dilithium is easy to get: we all know that; it's only the refining end of things that counts. So, when I spend 240k on Phoenix boxes, or on our Fleet, it takes 30 days to replenish.
It's my choice to run 8 characters just like it's other people's choice to run 1 character, or 4, or 12. The system is in place. It's up to YOU to use it the way it was designed. My above advice is sound and it's absolutely is valid.
If you want to talk 'crazy easy' to get, then it's Fleet Marks. And yet they pay out 50x as much as Dilithium. Yeah, that's crazy alright. Therefore, Dilithium should pay out 50:1 as well. If not more. Especially since Dilithium, indirectly, has a 'money' value attached to it, in that you can convert it to Zen (for which you would otherwise have to open your wallet). So, if you want to know why ppl are so reluctant to contribute Dilithium, it's because it pays out like cr*p. Simple as that.
I've been thinking about this for a while since it's often suggested. I agree that fleet marks are also crazy easy to get. However, the overall fleet credit payout cannot be buffed since it would be too easy to get doffs from the starbase vendor. As we all know the doff grind is the REAL grind when it comes to starbases. Therfore, if you want to change dilithium to 50 to 1 payout, you would need to reduce the fleet mark payout to near zero. Actually if you reduced the fleet mark payout to 1:1, you wouldn't even be able to buff the dil payout up to 50:1. It would still need to be lower so that players wouldn't get their hands on too many fleet credits. Here's an example of a starbase project.
- Reinforce Local Systems III -
900 fleet marks at 50:1 = 45,000 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 1:1 = 54,000 fleet credits
Total = 99,000 fleet credits
Let's see what happens if you flip the scale
900 fleet marks at 1:1 = 900 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 50:1 = 2,700,000 fleet credits
Total = 2,700,900 fleet credits
Just look at that. That is not going to happen. Duty officers from the starbase will be free and starbase upgrading will be too easy. Therefore the dil payout must be lower than 50:1. Low enough that the total payout will be only around 99,000 fleet credits for donating both dilithium and fleet marks. So...
900 fleet marks at 1:1 = 900 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 2:1 = 108,000 fleet credits
Total = 108,900 fleet credits
Look at this. Even at 2:1 for dilithium, you would still need to virtually eliminate the payout for fleet marks from 50:1 down to 1:1. Let's say you wanted a payout even higher than 2:1 for dilithium, you would need to eliminate all fleet credits rewards down to 0 for fleet marks, EC and duty officers and you still might only be able to get up to 3:1 payout for dil. After considering all this, I think the current system was designed to be balanced. Suggestions to buff dilithium fleet credit rewards throw off that balance which is quite elegantly designed IMO.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Also, would it really matter if Dilithium paid out 50:1?! I mean, what does Cryptic care?! There's no RL money involved, so who cares if you buy like 500 Locators!? It's all for personal use. You can't sell Fleet gear, so there's no market (hence no alleged inflation, as suggested).
(a) Fleet gear usage is easily connected to other gear usage. If you got the best fleet gear just for turning up, the need for other stuff would diminish.
(b) Also, you would need to work less hard to get fleet gear which means you don't need to play content as much to get it.
Both would lessen the (needed) play time to achieve your goals, thus cutting into Cryptic's business model (or that of any other MMO). Players would feel like they have even less to do.
I'm not saying that 1:1 or 50:1 is somewhat of a "perfect" balance, but as a company, Cryptic does indeed care how easily achievable items are.
My mother was an epohh and my father smelled of tulaberries
There is no taking of Unrefined Dilithium if you have a Tier 3 Mine. That was a suggestion only, since the fully upgraded Mine should be able to provide those types of services. It's what they do.
Another suggestion would be to do what they did to those Reputation Projects that required Doffs (Elite Scorpions or Widows) converting them to Dilithium at 100:1. Doffs are no longer required only some more Dilithium. You could then raise the Fleet Credit cost for Common Doffs at the Fleet Store since they are no longer required for Fleet Projects, if you were worried about some sort of exploitation.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
LoL. I cannot help but chuckle at some of the arguments people have with my 'simple fact' statements.
Yes, if I had the time and energy to run 8, 10, or 12 characters a day, max dilithium farming, and had terrific enough gear that I didn't need any of the refined dilithium for myself... then we'd be having a different argument.
Problem: Many players are unable to dedicate the time to farm dilithium for fleets.
Solution: Quit work, divorce wives/husbands, stop eating, quit life, only play STO and make tons of alts to farm dilithium!
Really? That is the solution some people are pushing? It may come as a SHOCK to some people, but I, and many others, have more important and worthwhile things in our lives than farm dilithium across dozens of alts. And even then, this implies we simply have no use at all for it for ourselves.
Being casual, spending just a couple hours a day on STO max, if I get to sign in, I still make enough unrefined dilithium. More than I can refine. But, I need that refined dilithium. I need a lot of it. I'd gladly dump my left over unrefined dilithium in a heart beat.
I am terribly happy for people that are just so in love with STO and have the time to manage 8 characters farming every day for dilithium... I greatly enjoy the game too. However, that is not my style and it is also not in the realm of possibility with my daily play time.
LoL. I cannot help but chuckle at some of the arguments people have with my 'simple fact' statements.
Yes, if I had the time and energy to run 8, 10, or 12 characters a day, max dilithium farming, and had terrific enough gear that I didn't need any of the refined dilithium for myself... then we'd be having a different argument.
Problem: Many players are unable to dedicate the time to farm dilithium for fleets.
Solution: Quit work, divorce wives/husbands, stop eating, quit life, only play STO and make tons of alts to farm dilithium!
Really? That is the solution some people are pushing? It may come as a SHOCK to some people, but I, and many others, have more important and worthwhile things in our lives than farm dilithium across dozens of alts. And even then, this implies we simply have no use at all for it for ourselves.
Being casual, spending just a couple hours a day on STO max, if I get to sign in, I still make enough unrefined dilithium. More than I can refine. But, I need that refined dilithium. I need a lot of it. I'd gladly dump my left over unrefined dilithium in a heart beat.
I am terribly happy for people that are just so in love with STO and have the time to manage 8 characters farming every day for dilithium... I greatly enjoy the game too. However, that is not my style and it is also not in the realm of possibility with my daily play time.
I grind out all 8 characters in about 1.5 hours so you don't need to make massive changes from a time perspective. If you choose not to change your approach, that's fine. It's your choice to do 1, 2, 4, 8 or whatever characters. Choose wisely though. Spending unrefined dilithium is not something that I see happening ever.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Comments
Romulan's are allied some with FED some with KDF and it is the catalyst that is used to explain how in the 29th century we are all part of the Federation.
Well I don't know what your expecting because 1:1 is a very high payout rate and very fast way to earn 50k Fleet Credit or 100k Fleet Credit or more. Especially if you refine your 8000 DIL a day... in a week you can acquire 50,000 credit. That should not be something you easily earn in a day... some players have taken weeks or months to develop their characters.
400,000 EC gives only 4000 FK and that's 100:1 not 1:1. Take your time and realize character development takes time & effort, and the fact you're able to buy DIL (often rewarded nicely for small zen purchase) is very fast way to speed this process up. Without the exchange however the whole F2P market would not exist so be more thankful as there are many options available you're just not choosing some of them.
Even if you didn't have a lot of DIL on my toons when Phoenix came you could have saved possibly 80k had you even 5000 DIL left in your reserve over the week and that would have gotten you 20 phoenix packs. I actually thought they awarded far too many Tech Point for an uncommon reward, they should have given blue reward's with 51,200 and green reward's with 25,600... Not to mention every blue reward option could be converted into 2x Ultra Phoenix upgrades...
The tactic for K-13 i have employed is to put up at least 2 Tier 6 ships in a competition for members contributions getting it to Tier 3 with the first Tier 3 upgrade due to start tomorrow and so I think it is working as an incentive. Obviously I continue to contribute myself because I need to make 200k fleet credits a week to keep the 10% dilithium bonus going for members to help them make the dilithium to contribute.
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
I kept 1 mil refined.
Should've kept 2.
Nobody is donating Dil for K-13.
Getting a 1:1 dilithium to fleet credit return makes donating dilithium to a fleet BARELY more efficient than simply throwing it into a fire.
Take people like me that haven't played in ages, I come back and I need dilithium just to take a TRIBBLE at a Starbase and am forced to play the eternal game of 'catch up'. I ain't sitting on 700,000,000,000,000 dilithium like some players... I have to play every day for a week and refine everything I get just to afford a single new item for my ship -.-
Let me donate unrefined dilithium? Then we're golden. Actually make it worth fleet credits? I am down.
Of every single possible activity in STO, farming dilithium to refine solely for fleet, ranks on par with AFKing at ESD for time-in-for-reward efficiency.
Sure, they weren't all sitting in my inventory, it's one ship for keys and then recycling everything I get from opening the boxes including the Lobi and grinding a bit more ec for more keys. I was just very lucky. All I have really lost is the one original ship I sold as part of the first trade for keys, a month's dilithium stipend and the Lobi I had saved up to that point. But I have passed the 8k dilithium daily limit with the help of the ec exchange.
@Wisecasper
Non-faction Ship Bridge Collector and Junk Hauler with alt-itis
Contact in-game to add your fleet to a casual, friendly Armada
For K-13, my Characters have been doing the vast bulk of Dilithium donations. My characters are sitting on 4,000 Zen that was bought when it was 275 awaiting it going back into the 400s.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Seems like that. Almost unlimited direct use for the gazillions of unrefined dil in player banks would certainly kill the exchange rate for good.
The phoenix boxes drained MASSIVE quantities of refined dilithium out of the system because THEY WERE A GREAT DEAL.
Rejoice, you idiots! Because seemingly we can have nice things ...despite the inevitable sniveling. People will be back to kicking in dilithium as opportunity and slowly recovering reserves permit.
I'm missing a point of referrence here. Or else I've just not seen that to which you refer. Is there something in the Lvl 3 Fleet Mine that will let you donate Unrefined to Fleet? If so, please, tell us more.
Not talking about the Doff missions are you?
Well it looks to me like Cryptic can tank any 500 Market very quickly if it wanted to.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
It may not seem like it but the 1:1 reward is balanced from a macro perspective. Meaning that how many fleet credits are earned is planned from Cryptic. If dilithium were to give out more fleet credits than it currently does, then fleet credits would have to be nerfed somewhere else to compensate. Mostly likely the nerf would come from fleet marks. Otherwise, it would just be too easy to build up your starbase and holdings.
Create more characters.
No this undermines a big part of the dilithium system.
Dilithium is just too easy to get. See my above response to your post. The phoneix promotion was a fantastic way to drain dilithium out of the game. Fast forward now what? A few weeks and I'm already back up near 500,000 refined. In 8 days I'll be at a million refined. Nothing has changed in terms of generating dilithium. It's crazy easy. If you ever want to go on some dilithium runs, just hit me up in game.
It's all about supply and demand you can put in millions of sinks but theres usually no one to fill them if they aren't providing something useful. Another thing is the pricing when you look at time spent to gather and refine this dilithium. Like that new sovy requiring you to buy the other pack to get the full set when the pack is only useful to the admiralty system since they were only useful to romulan and kdf players due to being a new ship to their ship line.
It's great you have so many alts, multiplying all your daily gains by 8; but, as an 'argument' to disqualify the assessments of others, it's really not that valid. Most people probaly have just 1 main, and maybe an alt somewhere they rarely use (thank the insane Upgrade System for that). For all purposes and intent, 8k is simply the daily refining limit for most. And, at 8k, Dilithium is simply a prized commodity. And it doesn' matter whether Dilithium is easy to get: we all know that; it's only the refining end of things that counts. So, when I spend 240k on Phoenix boxes, or on our Fleet, it takes 30 days to replenish.
If you want to talk 'crazy easy' to get, then it's Fleet Marks. And yet they pay out 50x as much as Dilithium. Yeah, that's crazy alright.
Phoenix was like, what, 2 weeks ago?! So, that's 112k per toon then. So, yeah, with one or two extra alts, a couple of hundred K since then makes sense. But with just 1 toon, 112k is soon spent on a few Fleet Projects.
I'm a console player [Xbox One] and freely admit that I created far too many STO characters for my own good over two separate gamertags. I've finally been doing the hard part of pairing them down to four on each over the course of this holiday week, and may have to cut those numbers down as well; simply to focus my STO gameplay and hopefully become a better overall fleet contributor to those remaining. I've yet to see any of the fleets that I've joined get beyond tier one and I do my part as much as I'm able donating EC, dilithium, resources and items into the bank. Thus far no matter what I've coughed up, the return all seems one-sided to me. Often anything in the bank, for instance that may interest me, is restricted to me due to my seldom to never changing level. In one instance, I was given a recruitment role and still left unable to actually claim anything from the bank; apparently at that level mining the bank was not an option and nobody ever thought to mention it? The fleet that I've donated the most energy credits to [literally millions] that did promote me, later demoted me following a reconfiguration intended for some esoteric purpose that still escapes me? I don't take daily EC and fail to understand why a fleet would make that stuff available anyway. Right now, I'm just trying to stick it out until a level 3 fleet unlock actually occurs, just to access additional costume options to benefit my game roleplaying. A long slog if you ask me!
Cryptic reasons the other way around though. Like, "If you only need to donate a tiny bit of Dilithium to get your Fleet gear, then those Projects are not a large enough Dilithium sink." That sounds rather reasonable, at first glance; until you realize cr*ppy paying out Dilithium causes ppl to donate to Fleet hardly at all. And that's the situation a lot of Fleets are in now.
I've been thinking about this for a while since it's often suggested. I agree that fleet marks are also crazy easy to get. However, the overall fleet credit payout cannot be buffed since it would be too easy to get doffs from the starbase vendor. As we all know the doff grind is the REAL grind when it comes to starbases. Therfore, if you want to change dilithium to 50 to 1 payout, you would need to reduce the fleet mark payout to near zero. Actually if you reduced the fleet mark payout to 1:1, you wouldn't even be able to buff the dil payout up to 50:1. It would still need to be lower so that players wouldn't get their hands on too many fleet credits. Here's an example of a starbase project.
- Reinforce Local Systems III -
900 fleet marks at 50:1 = 45,000 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 1:1 = 54,000 fleet credits
Total = 99,000 fleet credits
Let's see what happens if you flip the scale
900 fleet marks at 1:1 = 900 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 50:1 = 2,700,000 fleet credits
Total = 2,700,900 fleet credits
Just look at that. That is not going to happen. Duty officers from the starbase will be free and starbase upgrading will be too easy. Therefore the dil payout must be lower than 50:1. Low enough that the total payout will be only around 99,000 fleet credits for donating both dilithium and fleet marks. So...
900 fleet marks at 1:1 = 900 fleet credits
54,000 dilithium at 2:1 = 108,000 fleet credits
Total = 108,900 fleet credits
Look at this. Even at 2:1 for dilithium, you would still need to virtually eliminate the payout for fleet marks from 50:1 down to 1:1. Let's say you wanted a payout even higher than 2:1 for dilithium, you would need to eliminate all fleet credits rewards down to 0 for fleet marks, EC and duty officers and you still might only be able to get up to 3:1 payout for dil. After considering all this, I think the current system was designed to be balanced. Suggestions to buff dilithium fleet credit rewards throw off that balance which is quite elegantly designed IMO.
(a) Fleet gear usage is easily connected to other gear usage. If you got the best fleet gear just for turning up, the need for other stuff would diminish.
(b) Also, you would need to work less hard to get fleet gear which means you don't need to play content as much to get it.
Both would lessen the (needed) play time to achieve your goals, thus cutting into Cryptic's business model (or that of any other MMO). Players would feel like they have even less to do.
I'm not saying that 1:1 or 50:1 is somewhat of a "perfect" balance, but as a company, Cryptic does indeed care how easily achievable items are.
Another suggestion would be to do what they did to those Reputation Projects that required Doffs (Elite Scorpions or Widows) converting them to Dilithium at 100:1. Doffs are no longer required only some more Dilithium. You could then raise the Fleet Credit cost for Common Doffs at the Fleet Store since they are no longer required for Fleet Projects, if you were worried about some sort of exploitation.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Yes, if I had the time and energy to run 8, 10, or 12 characters a day, max dilithium farming, and had terrific enough gear that I didn't need any of the refined dilithium for myself... then we'd be having a different argument.
Problem: Many players are unable to dedicate the time to farm dilithium for fleets.
Solution: Quit work, divorce wives/husbands, stop eating, quit life, only play STO and make tons of alts to farm dilithium!
Really? That is the solution some people are pushing? It may come as a SHOCK to some people, but I, and many others, have more important and worthwhile things in our lives than farm dilithium across dozens of alts. And even then, this implies we simply have no use at all for it for ourselves.
Being casual, spending just a couple hours a day on STO max, if I get to sign in, I still make enough unrefined dilithium. More than I can refine. But, I need that refined dilithium. I need a lot of it. I'd gladly dump my left over unrefined dilithium in a heart beat.
I am terribly happy for people that are just so in love with STO and have the time to manage 8 characters farming every day for dilithium... I greatly enjoy the game too. However, that is not my style and it is also not in the realm of possibility with my daily play time.