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Ideas for incentivizing KDF play

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  • orondisorondis Member Posts: 1,446 Arc User
    Make everything account bound rather than character bound.
    Turn back time and remove the lvl 60 cap increase.
    Get rid of captain specializations.
    Balance the game, remove the the power creep from the last 4-5 years and incentivize PvP (and as such make a cloaking device more worthwhile).
    Previously Alendiak
    Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
    Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    orondis wrote: »
    Make everything account bound rather than character bound.
    Turn back time and remove the lvl 60 cap increase.
    Get rid of captain specializations.
    Balance the game, remove the the power creep from the last 4-5 years and incentivize PvP (and as such make a cloaking device more worthwhile).

    I agree with the idea of account bound items rather than character bound, and balance is always something that is needed - especially with the creep - even though I think that might cause a massive loss of players across the board, because people hate big changes like that, no matter how needed they are.

    But I don't see the issue with the level cap increase to 60, or Captain Specializations. Care to elaborate on what your issues are with those features?

    I also agree that PvP should be incentivized, but that there would need to be a massive balancing specific to Player Vs. Player - and PvP-centric gear - before that would really make a difference. Out of curiousity, how would you incentivize PvP?

  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    As a new PS4 player, I'd like to add my thoughts to the discussion. MMOs are grinding games. I'd consider myself at average player who doesn't have lots of time to play games. So when I looked into STO and what was involved, I figured I had the time to play two characters to keep my incentive to play the game.

    My main is Federation as I wanted to use science vessels "to go where no one has gone before". Since the other side of the coin was Klingons, my 2nd character I made a Klingon. Thought it might be fun.

    Played the Klingon through the first mission and visited the home world. First mission was to kill my captain. Unappealing to me. Visited the home world and meet Worf. I thought it was great until I learned he choose the Klingon empire over the Federation. I had thought he evolved beyond the basic "Blood and Honor" stuff. Every spot I went in the city was all about being warrior and dying with honor. I didn't see much in the way of gameplay beyond that idea. A very one dimensional faction in my option compared to the Federation which has so many ships besides warships, lots of different species to play in a variety of way, all with different takes on life. Yea I know the game ends up being mostly space combat but if you don't have a character that appeals to you, you certainly don't have the incentive to play the game.

    I have since created a third character on the Federation side whose heritage is tied into Scotty's family tree and might do some role playing with the character and is focused strictly on flagship type ships where my main is open to anything.

    I might pick up the Klingon character again some day but even giving me a free T6 ship likely won't give me the incentive to play up to rank 50 to use it. I just don't have the time to play something which doesn't have a lot of appeal to me.

    You want the Klingons to be more appealing to the masses? You have to offer more variety in the faction besides warrior, blood and honor. If I decide to play my Klingon character again, I would have the thought in my head to play him outside those basic parameters, likely an outcast but I expect most missions will keep me inside those parameters.

    Honor and Glory, and the ascension through the ranks via murdering incompetent commanders are all concepts that are sort of key to Klingon lore in the Star Trek universe.

    However, I can always agree that some alternate paths should be available - though it require far more effort (read: time and money) to introduce multiple pathing to the games storylines, and that's a rare thing for most MMO's on the market.

    But yeah, what if your Klingon didn't necessarily want to "path of the warrior"? What if they didn't agree with the Empire's point of view? What if they wanted to live a life of peace? What if they wanted to defect and join the Federation? (of course, all of those things would get you murdered really quick in the Klingon Empire...so it wouldn't be an easy path to take).

    All things that would be great to see in the game, but those are things that would require a more open world design to the game, rather than the strict script that we have now. In other words, it's not likely to ever happen.

    Regardless, welcome to the game! I hope you enjoy yourself, and stick around for a long time.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    morguerage wrote: »
    > @markhawkman said:
    > Open PvP? *points at Kerrat*

    It's like locking 2 boxers in a closet and calling it a ring.
    2? You don't visit Ker'rat often do you?

    Kerrat is okay, but honestly there's little point to it and it gets a bit repetitive after a few runs (of course, I'm not a fan of PVP, so my experience there is limited).

    If there was a series of open PVP contested zones - both in space and on planets - that could change hands and offer up benefits for whichever side holds the territories, there would be far more reason to engage in PVP and it would be far more exciting in my opinion.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    elcid#6687 wrote: »
    Klingon players have represented about 10-15% of the entire playerbase in STO. This was true in the beginning and true now, I believe. This may seem like a small number, but here's some data from the game, EVE, which is highly PvP, or at least thought to be. In EVE, 75% of the player base play in non-PvP areas. That leaves only 25% of the players who actively play in PvP space. Now, look back at STO and note the percentage of KDF players. In a scenario that saw more wide use of PvP on the open map, the KDF might actually be a force to be reckoned with. I really don't care how extensive PvP would be on the open map, so long as there is something to conquer. If it ends up being 2-3 sectors along the borders, fine. Make the Romulans their own factions and have area of PvP that sort of ends up looking like the Klingon triad symbol. Perfect.

    That may be true.

    Unfortunately, PvPers being even a smaller subsect of the community (not all KDF players are PvPers after all) means that there's even less incentive to develop content for them than there is to do so for the KDF.
  • orondisorondis Member Posts: 1,446 Arc User
    edited October 2016
    orondis wrote: »
    Make everything account bound rather than character bound.
    Turn back time and remove the lvl 60 cap increase.
    Get rid of captain specializations.
    Balance the game, remove the the power creep from the last 4-5 years and incentivize PvP (and as such make a cloaking device more worthwhile).

    I agree with the idea of account bound items rather than character bound, and balance is always something that is needed - especially with the creep - even though I think that might cause a massive loss of players across the board, because people hate big changes like that, no matter how needed they are.

    But I don't see the issue with the level cap increase to 60, or Captain Specializations. Care to elaborate on what your issues are with those features?

    The massive grind and the fact it dissuades you from making an alt. Especially if you're interested in anything remotely like competitive play.
    I also agree that PvP should be incentivized, but that there would need to be a massive balancing specific to Player Vs. Player - and PvP-centric gear - before that would really make a difference. Out of curiousity, how would you incentivize PvP?

    A large increase in skill point rewards and choice of mark rewards (as well as an elite mark reward).
    Previously Alendiak
    Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
    Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
  • daviesdaviesdaviesdavies Member Posts: 277 Arc User
    "Good day to die!" and then delete your klingon toon lol
    Mzd8i1c.gif
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    warpangel wrote: »
    asuran14 wrote: »
    One thing I think would help to make the Kdf, as well as Romulan factions more appealing an profitable, would be to flesh them out more ship an race wise. I mean looking at the two factions compared to the fed is the lack of diversity both in their ship line ups, as well as their choices in races they can play as. It would be nice to see both the number of ships you can play as class-wise increased, which can be done by adding ships from the races that you can also play as alongside the the Klingons/Romulans. Why play the KDF/Romulan faction as a non-klingon/Romulan character if you can't also use your chosen race's ships that are a member of your faction, or playing as a science or engineering character an having either no non c-store option or no race-related ship of your chosen career prefered type, when you could go play as any of the Federation races with a huge variety of ships. Even if you kept the race-specific ships as c-store purchases, which I can see as even in the federation most of the race-specific vessels are c-store vessels, than at least create a few more ships to bulk out the rooster choices a bit.

    I would love to see some Remen ship designs, a ferasan vessel to sit in contrast to the Catain Atrox, more ships from the non-klingon races of the Kdf. THough also more than just two/three race choices in the Romulan faction would be an amazing change too (like allying them with the Cardassians.). I think the fact that the factions are so partially developed that it turns off the players that might actually play, and then enjoy an keep to the faction.
    As would I. The more the merrier. But so long as only 10-15% of players would be even allowed to buy them, they could never sell as much as the majority Fed ships or cross-faction ships.

    I don't suppose that it's occurred to anyone that the only reason that the cross faction ships have been limited to temporal and non-Fed/KDF is because that is all Cryptic has been allowed to use per their agreement with CBS?

    Sure, I'm speculating, but it makes sense in my opinion. CBS has placed restrictions in the past to ensure the rarity of certain ships, so why wouldn't the restrict Feds from flying KDF ships and vice versa?

    It's possible, if not entirely likely. There are other CBS-licenced Star Trek games with no factions.

    But from a player's point of view, speculating on the origin of the arbitrary restrictions is useless, unless Cryptic wants to give some factual statement on the subject.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    elcid#6687 wrote: »
    Klingon players have represented about 10-15% of the entire playerbase in STO. This was true in the beginning and true now, I believe. This may seem like a small number, but here's some data from the game, EVE, which is highly PvP, or at least thought to be. In EVE, 75% of the player base play in non-PvP areas. That leaves only 25% of the players who actively play in PvP space. Now, look back at STO and note the percentage of KDF players. In a scenario that saw more wide use of PvP on the open map, the KDF might actually be a force to be reckoned with. I really don't care how extensive PvP would be on the open map, so long as there is something to conquer. If it ends up being 2-3 sectors along the borders, fine. Make the Romulans their own factions and have area of PvP that sort of ends up looking like the Klingon triad symbol. Perfect.
    That may be true.

    Unfortunately, PvPers being even a smaller subsect of the community (not all KDF players are PvPers after all) means that there's even less incentive to develop content for them than there is to do so for the KDF.
    Actually some of the deadliest pvpers in the game are Feds. So incentives for PvP will not necessarily be incentives for KDF play.

    And yeah.... there are peeps who go to Ker'rat just for the fun of blowing up other players. I remember one of them boasting about how his torpedo build could blast multiple players out of the sky simultaneously. I haven't seen it in action, but that's because I usually stay away from Ker'rat.

    At any rate, back to KDF... I think the best thing would be more non-Klingon ships. It'd be nice if the story missions actually cared if you were Klingon or not. At present the only difference is a few bits of text. But that's probably not gonna happen as it would compete for resources with actual new stuff. Hmm maybe some shared story missions that showcase Klingon stuff in a manner less dumb than house of Pegh?
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  • valoreahvaloreah Member Posts: 10,930 Arc User
    I kind of like the idea of a "For the Empire!" KDF recruiting event.
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  • nikephorusnikephorus Member Posts: 2,734 Arc User
    There is still an intensive to make kdf characters to farm contraband, but other then that I can't really name anything that the kdf have that you can't get on the fedside.
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  • trennantrennan Member Posts: 2,839 Arc User
    orondis wrote: »
    Make everything account bound rather than character bound.
    Turn back time and remove the lvl 60 cap increase.
    Get rid of captain specializations.
    Balance the game, remove the the power creep from the last 4-5 years and incentivize PvP (and as such make a cloaking device more worthwhile).

    The level 60 is fine. There is nothing wrong with it. The only other option to balance this out would be to do it by rank. This is were I'd add the second skill tree. That way all characters have a PvE setup and a PvP setup.

    The Specializations are there for PvE. No need to get rid of them. Just a need to make them deactivate during PvP. Then add in a PvP specialization. This way, it would be Skill Tree and PvP Specialization.

    The power creep comes from the game itself. This is a design problem. The game is balanced around the level 40 promotion ships. This is why the T5 and T6 are overpowered for the game. The game isn't designed to balance out for the Specialization's either. As I said, it's designed around the Level 40 ships and the Skill Tree.

    As I stated in my post about it. The rewards would need to be either account or character bound. This would also have to be a daily reward for the Crafting/Upgrade tokens. The marks would work the same as Pve queues. And no rewards for private PvP matches, this would be sparring and testing. This way nobody could abuse the system.
    valoreah wrote: »
    I kind of like the idea of a "For the Empire!" KDF recruiting event.

    While I do like this idea. You'd run in to the same problem they did with Delta Recruit and AoY. People play the char, get the rewards and go back to what they were doing before. Because let's face it here, if it doesn't come with account wide rewards, only those that main KDF would bother with it.
    Mm5NeXy.gif
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    trennan wrote: »
    valoreah wrote: »
    I kind of like the idea of a "For the Empire!" KDF recruiting event.

    While I do like this idea. You'd run in to the same problem they did with Delta Recruit and AoY. People play the char, get the rewards and go back to what they were doing before. Because let's face it here, if it doesn't come with account wide rewards, only those that main KDF would bother with it.

    But AoY and Delta Recruits did come with account-wide unlocks. The problem is that they weren't set up with any continuous bonuses that stuck after the initial event was over to keep players actively playing those characters, or once you'd completed all of the content for the bonus content. Some additional bonus would be nice.

    Still, I don't really think that there are as many players that abandon all of that hard work as people think there are, and I believe that there might be enough player retention from such an event that it would be worth it to boost KDF play.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    nikephorus wrote: »
    There is still an intensive to make kdf characters to farm contraband, but other then that I can't really name anything that the kdf have that you can't get on the fedside.

    I've never used my KDF characters to farm contraband. I might be in the minority, but I doubt I'm alone in that. Of course, I hate repetitive content.
  • stobg2015stobg2015 Member Posts: 800 Arc User
    I really wish that the KDF starting experience really addressed the differences between the major races instead of treating them all like Klingons. That kind of a revamp would justify a KDF recruitment event.

    From the KDF side of things, the biggest enemies are the Tal Shiar in collusion with the House of Torg and the Fek'Ihri (Possibly engineered by their ancient enemy the Hur'q). These could be woven into a narrative that would involve the KDF and even the other two members of the Alliance. The reappearance of the Fek'Ihri was never really explained in connection with the rest of the STO timeline, so it is a good opportunity to expand on that.
    (The Guy Formerly And Still Known As Bluegeek)
  • kjfettkjfett Member Posts: 370 Arc User
    Let's be honest. There is one thing that would increase the KDF player base.

    Open the Risa summer swimwear to Orions of the KDF to wear everywhen.

    There...increase those playing KDY will increase 10 fold if not more.
    kjfett_14091.jpg
  • ichaerus1ichaerus1 Member Posts: 986 Arc User
    elcid#6687 wrote: »
    Klingon players have represented about 10-15% of the entire playerbase in STO. This was true in the beginning and true now, I believe. This may seem like a small number, but here's some data from the game, EVE, which is highly PvP, or at least thought to be. In EVE, 75% of the player base play in non-PvP areas. That leaves only 25% of the players who actively play in PvP space. Now, look back at STO and note the percentage of KDF players. In a scenario that saw more wide use of PvP on the open map, the KDF might actually be a force to be reckoned with. I really don't care how extensive PvP would be on the open map, so long as there is something to conquer. If it ends up being 2-3 sectors along the borders, fine. Make the Romulans their own factions and have area of PvP that sort of ends up looking like the Klingon triad symbol. Perfect.
    That may be true.

    Unfortunately, PvPers being even a smaller subsect of the community (not all KDF players are PvPers after all) means that there's even less incentive to develop content for them than there is to do so for the KDF.
    Actually some of the deadliest pvpers in the game are Feds. So incentives for PvP will not necessarily be incentives for KDF play.

    And yeah.... there are peeps who go to Ker'rat just for the fun of blowing up other players. I remember one of them boasting about how his torpedo build could blast multiple players out of the sky simultaneously. I haven't seen it in action, but that's because I usually stay away from Ker'rat.

    At any rate, back to KDF... I think the best thing would be more non-Klingon ships. It'd be nice if the story missions actually cared if you were Klingon or not. At present the only difference is a few bits of text. But that's probably not gonna happen as it would compete for resources with actual new stuff. Hmm maybe some shared story missions that showcase Klingon stuff in a manner less dumb than house of Pegh?

    The closest thing I have found, is the Honor of Ferasans, Honor of Orions, and Honor of the Empire series found in the foundry. I won't spoil it, but recommend players give the trilogy a run through. I thought it was done really well.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    elcid#6687 wrote: »
    Klingon players have represented about 10-15% of the entire playerbase in STO. This was true in the beginning and true now, I believe. This may seem like a small number, but here's some data from the game, EVE, which is highly PvP, or at least thought to be. In EVE, 75% of the player base play in non-PvP areas. That leaves only 25% of the players who actively play in PvP space. Now, look back at STO and note the percentage of KDF players. In a scenario that saw more wide use of PvP on the open map, the KDF might actually be a force to be reckoned with. I really don't care how extensive PvP would be on the open map, so long as there is something to conquer. If it ends up being 2-3 sectors along the borders, fine. Make the Romulans their own factions and have area of PvP that sort of ends up looking like the Klingon triad symbol. Perfect.
    That may be true.

    Unfortunately, PvPers being even a smaller subsect of the community (not all KDF players are PvPers after all) means that there's even less incentive to develop content for them than there is to do so for the KDF.
    Actually some of the deadliest pvpers in the game are Feds. So incentives for PvP will not necessarily be incentives for KDF play.

    And yeah.... there are peeps who go to Ker'rat just for the fun of blowing up other players. I remember one of them boasting about how his torpedo build could blast multiple players out of the sky simultaneously. I haven't seen it in action, but that's because I usually stay away from Ker'rat.

    At any rate, back to KDF... I think the best thing would be more non-Klingon ships. It'd be nice if the story missions actually cared if you were Klingon or not. At present the only difference is a few bits of text. But that's probably not gonna happen as it would compete for resources with actual new stuff. Hmm maybe some shared story missions that showcase Klingon stuff in a manner less dumb than house of Pegh?
    The closest thing I have found, is the Honor of Ferasans, Honor of Orions, and Honor of the Empire series found in the foundry. I won't spoil it, but recommend players give the trilogy a run through. I thought it was done really well.
    Played them, they're great. But yeah, Foundry. I LOVE Foundry! So much so I co-host a Foundry pod-cast. But it's not the same as an official mission.
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  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    kjfett wrote: »
    Let's be honest. There is one thing that would increase the KDF player base.

    Open the Risa summer swimwear to Orions of the KDF to wear everywhen.

    There...increase those playing KDY will increase 10 fold if not more.

    Heh...it's funny 'cause it's true.

    Seriously, of any of the races, Orion's are the only one that that would make perfect sense.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    ichaerus1 wrote: »
    elcid#6687 wrote: »
    Klingon players have represented about 10-15% of the entire playerbase in STO. This was true in the beginning and true now, I believe. This may seem like a small number, but here's some data from the game, EVE, which is highly PvP, or at least thought to be. In EVE, 75% of the player base play in non-PvP areas. That leaves only 25% of the players who actively play in PvP space. Now, look back at STO and note the percentage of KDF players. In a scenario that saw more wide use of PvP on the open map, the KDF might actually be a force to be reckoned with. I really don't care how extensive PvP would be on the open map, so long as there is something to conquer. If it ends up being 2-3 sectors along the borders, fine. Make the Romulans their own factions and have area of PvP that sort of ends up looking like the Klingon triad symbol. Perfect.
    That may be true.

    Unfortunately, PvPers being even a smaller subsect of the community (not all KDF players are PvPers after all) means that there's even less incentive to develop content for them than there is to do so for the KDF.
    Actually some of the deadliest pvpers in the game are Feds. So incentives for PvP will not necessarily be incentives for KDF play.

    And yeah.... there are peeps who go to Ker'rat just for the fun of blowing up other players. I remember one of them boasting about how his torpedo build could blast multiple players out of the sky simultaneously. I haven't seen it in action, but that's because I usually stay away from Ker'rat.

    At any rate, back to KDF... I think the best thing would be more non-Klingon ships. It'd be nice if the story missions actually cared if you were Klingon or not. At present the only difference is a few bits of text. But that's probably not gonna happen as it would compete for resources with actual new stuff. Hmm maybe some shared story missions that showcase Klingon stuff in a manner less dumb than house of Pegh?
    The closest thing I have found, is the Honor of Ferasans, Honor of Orions, and Honor of the Empire series found in the foundry. I won't spoil it, but recommend players give the trilogy a run through. I thought it was done really well.
    Played them, they're great. But yeah, Foundry. I LOVE Foundry! So much so I co-host a Foundry pod-cast. But it's not the same as an official mission.

    I really REALLY wish that they would just incorporate some of the best of the best Foundry missions into the actual story content of the game. There's more than enough content to fill up a few new blocks on the side of the Episodes tab.

    I'll have to play through those "Honor" Foundry episodes. Thanks for the recommendations!
  • binebanebinebane Member Posts: 535 Arc User
    how about console version? how many people do play klingons af main? if i understand correctly knigons were not even available right from the start on PC. i guess this is one reason for long time players (before free to play) dont play that as much. and you cant change that. while recruting event is good it would be only used for new players to make thair main toon klingon.
    for me problem is first city is incredibly ugly. also interior of klingon ships. i know its that what it should look like. but stil its just ugly.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    binebane wrote: »
    how about console version? how many people do play klingons af main? if i understand correctly knigons were not even available right from the start on PC. i guess this is one reason for long time players (before free to play) dont play that as much. and you cant change that. while recruting event is good it would be only used for new players to make thair main toon klingon.
    for me problem is first city is incredibly ugly. also interior of klingon ships. i know its that what it should look like. but stil its just ugly.

    I disagree with the assessment that it would only work for new players.

    The previous recruiting events managed to draw in all types of players, even those that have been playing since beta, to create a TOS or Delta Recruit, so a purely KDF version would doubtless do the same - if it offered the right incentives.

    As for the Klingon aesthetic, that's a purely subjective thing. I happen to love the look of First City, and the interiors of the ships really make me feel like I'm playing a Klingon warrior.
  • jaguarskxjaguarskx Member Posts: 5,945 Arc User
    If Cryptic gives me 1,000 Zen, then I will gladly make a 5th KDF captain.

    :):):)


    However, I am actually looking for a reason to create a 3rd Romulan Captain. If the AoY expansion was not locked only for Fed, then I would have created a 2nd KDF Aligned Romulan... an engineer actually since I already have a Romulan science and tactical captain.
  • centaurianalphacentaurianalpha Member Posts: 1,150 Arc User
    If there was a series of open PVP contested zones - both in space and on planets - that could change hands and offer up benefits for whichever side holds the territories, there would be far more reason to engage in PVP and it would be far more exciting in my opinion.

    This is the best idea I've seen to address PvP in the game! I've not been a PvP enthusiast, mostly because it's taken me so long to grind my 'toons through the expanding content & special events. Now that I'm approaching end-game status, this would be a good draw even for me to do more PvP. Even better to engage opposite-faction fleets in fleet battles over territory & treasure!

    I have had a KDF toon nearly since Day 1, because I prefer to be immersed in as much of the Trek universe as possible. I also have Romulans in both factions for the same reason, even as I hold out hope that the Romulans might one day break free of their current faction entanglements. the AoY expansion got me to roll a 4th Fed toon, but I will absolutely not create any more unless it's KDF, and a similar event to AoY. I like balance (no, I'm not Deferi), so my next KDF captain will be Tactical, and that will fill out my fleets.

    Cryptic might be interested to know (or not), that the first ship I actually bought was the Fleet Ar'kif Warbird Carrier Refit, for my KDF/Rommie captain (5 FSM's = $25 US!). It won't be the last if Cryptic starts offering some new ships for KDF; maybe starting with a T6 Vo'quv carrier...? ;)
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  • trennantrennan Member Posts: 2,839 Arc User
    edited October 2016
    If there was a series of open PVP contested zones - both in space and on planets - that could change hands and offer up benefits for whichever side holds the territories, there would be far more reason to engage in PVP and it would be far more exciting in my opinion.

    This is the best idea I've seen to address PvP in the game! I've not been a PvP enthusiast, mostly because it's taken me so long to grind my 'toons through the expanding content & special events. Now that I'm approaching end-game status, this would be a good draw even for me to do more PvP. Even better to engage opposite-faction fleets in fleet battles over territory & treasure!

    This is what I mean by opening up the battle zones. They have to add a couple ground ones for alpha and beta quad. Well and a space one for Beta quad. But, have two instances of them. One for PvE and one for PvP. The PvE ones remain as they are. The PvP ones, well you're picking a side and fighting to claim that contested territory.

    The only way I see to keep this balanced out at first. Would be to make it random on load in. You go to the battlezone, select to enter the PvP instance and from here you randomly become a member of the Red team or Blue team

    Imagine if you will a the Voth Ground battle zone. If you go with 30 people per instance, 15 people per side, and no Boffs. It would cease to be a Battle Zone and becomes a War Zone.

    For the Quadrants themselves. You can break this down by Cluster/Nebula. Especially the colonization ones. They would still have to Doff assignments. Would just need to add a PvP Space and Ground area to them.

    This even works for the factions and the neutral zones. This way they could address something they left out of the story. Fed/Rom fighting, Klingon/Rom War, Fed/Klingon War, etc. For the Alpha Quad, this would be balanced around Bajor. It wouldn't be so much Dominion as it would be more Bajoran/Cardassian.

    Then on these maps, the current skills tree and specializations are deactivated. A second skill tree and specializations are then activated, these being for PvP. Everyone starts off with max points for the the skill tree. This one doesn't cost a "respec token" but is more free form. You can swap your points around freely at the command post. Then you have a PvP Expertise System. Expertise to be earned, through PvP only, to gain points for the PvP Specialization(s). This way, there is no using PvE to point up your PvP.

    Equipment is simple. You start with White Mk X or even Mk XII gear, including kit. White Kit Mods can be gotten from the vendor in the Command post, free of charge. The same goes for ship gear. All current gear is deactivated and you have the basic white gear for it. White consoles can be gotten for free at the vendor in the command post. All PvE consoles are now useless, including those pesky Universal ones. This put's everyone on equal footing as they start pvping.

    Now as far as rewards go. This would go back to the old Omega Store style. You start off with white gear, which doesn't cost your a thing. From here you have to earn PvP Marks to buy better gear. The thing here is, you have to have to the piece in question. So to upgrade a white phaser beam array to a green, it would cost 1 white phaser beam array and X amount of PvP marks. Then the same for green to blue, blue to purp.

    Now the thing here is people would also want to be able to craft/upgrade their pvp. This is not a problem. Create a PvP Craft Token and a PvP Upgrade Token. I'd make these character bound, as a Daily reward for PvP. This way there is not farming or buying your way to the top. Our current upgrade tech would work with upgrading. But you couldn't do it without the Upgrade Token.

    For Crafting, the token gives the player the ability to craft randomly PvP modded gear. The PvP vendor would only have a standard issue of each rarity. I wouldn't put any mods on the vendor gear, just basic stats. Then leave it up to the player to craft and upgrade the modded gear. I'd make this the only Character Bound crafted gear. This way, there is no buying your way to the top. You want better gear, you have to go PvP to get it.

    Edit:
    Before I forget, I had better explain. That I, me personally, I wouldn't add the PvP Craft and Upgrade Token to the Z Store. But with how things are. They would end up there. So for the Z Store, they would need to be priced accordingly. The best price I can think on this would be, 250 Zen per token.
    Post edited by trennan on
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  • asuran14asuran14 Member Posts: 2,326 Arc User
    I would not go with pvp specific gear at all, as it creates a divide between new pvpers an those Vet-pvpers, which can actually run off players when they have to grind just to be less than merely a speed bump to the vet-players. I would go with a dual-stat system in which you give each set of abilities, well as gear a set of stats for both pve an pvp content separately, this allows newer players to use gear they get in missions/drops for pvp an not just get stomped till they get enough pvp-rewards to afford pvp-specific gear. This also makes gear gained from pvp more appealing as it is useful in pve (vis-versa for pve gear in pvp), but also makes it that pvp can now also be a alternative method of leveling and gearing up your character, since the gear would be universally usable for both sets of content.

    Also it would just be nice to have two sets of stats that govern how the ability/gear/trait works in pvp or pve content, as than you only make adjustments to the stat corresponding to that style of content, and that change would not affect how useful the same ability is in the other content. Even though this might be a quite large overhaul to rework the system into a dual-stat system, but I think it would be well worth work/resources/time to implement, since pvp an the abilities could use an overhaul anyway at this point. Think of the saved headaches of changes to pve or pvp that only affect that area of the content the change is meant for.

    I can say that I think the recruitment events for the different factions, or even a yearly event for specific factions that keep happening over the course of time would be nice. Things in which you do activities an missions that fit your faction, but than at the end of the event you gain bonuses of your other account characters, but which each of these events are specific for their faction.
  • borg0borg0 Member Posts: 47 Arc User
    Here is the perpetual cycle of KDF: Cryptic wont put any effort into KDF unless there is a strong players base. There is no strong players base because there is a lack of contents. It's called the chicken and egg problem or a temporal paradox.

    This subject has been perpetual since the 2nd year if I'm not mistake. The only fun thing when playing KDF back then was killing Feds in the free pvp zone - I dont even remember the name of the place lol.
  • phenomenaut01phenomenaut01 Member Posts: 714 Arc User
    I love all of the ideas about PVP guys, but really, that should be considered a separate issue...sort of.

    Would PVP bring more players across the yard to play the other side, just to even out the field a bit? Sure. But PVPers are really a separate sub-section of the community, and aren't necessarily all KDF players. The "solutions" that have been brought up here would be great to solve the PVP issue, but don't necessarily solve the problem with the low numbers on the KDF side. In fact, I'm sure that if PVP was fixed and re-implemented tomorrow, it would be more of a FED vs. FED situation - or maybe FED vs. MIrror Universe - and the excuse would be that there aren't enough KDF players to allow for even sides in any of the PVP queues.

    Yeah, that old cyclical argument rears it's head again. "Nobody plays KDF, so we don't create content for them specifically anymore, but because there's no KDF specific content anymore, nobody plays KDF".

    Obviously, whatever solution is reached - if any - has to be low impact to the development schedule and the to the bank account.

    It would certainly be a lot easier if we actually had some conversation coming from the Development team on what they would be willing and able to do, but that's not likely to happen - no, I'm not inviting any Cryptic bashing here. We've all heard the stories and feedback from those that have attempted to have this conversation in the past.

    It's true that anything we say in here is just idle chatter and speculation. But if we keep having the conversation in a single thread, and we keep things constructive, then maybe that might bring some attention to things.

    I've been really happy with the way this conversation has gone so far. I'd expected it to devolve into the negative after the first page (not because it was KDF related, but more because it's just the way the forums...most forums..seem to work), but so far everyone has had some great input, and everything - for the most part - has been thought provoking.

    Maybe I'm being overly optimistic just by thinking that the damage isn't already done, and that the problem can still be fixed. But in my experience in MMO's since way back, the community CAN make a difference. It won't happen overnight, and it may never live up to expectations, but change can happen.

    I'm still pondering other ways to draw players to stick around on the KDF side. Keep brainstorming!
  • knightnbluknightnblu Member Posts: 91 Arc User
    I have always said that the KDF had massive potential for story telling. Here are my ways for increasing participation on KDF side:

    Integrated Missions

    Bring the Fed toons into the KDF side by bringing them into missions where they have to go into KDF space, speak and interact with KDF toons on KDF worlds, and work with the KDF to complete the mission objectives. I envision this as a three to five mission story arc that would be integral to an important Fed objective. Let them play with some of the cool ships, drink some bloodwine, and give them a targ of their very own to take with them.

    The both factions get new content and the Feds get a good introduction to KDF side and get to see a side of STO that they don't get to interact with much. I think that part of the reason that you fly a Bird of Prey on the Fed side is whet your appetite for more Klingon material, but the exposure is too brief.

    Revamp Dialog

    One of the things that really bugs me is the warm and fuzzy things that they make my KDF toon say. Part of making the KDF stand out is keeping the faction unique. Klingons, and by extension those that identify with them, don't care about being politically correct and they don't care for your feelings either. They are brusque, brash, and aggressive. Their dialog and actions should reflect this. When faced with choice between Fed and Fed lite, most people go full Fed. By adjusting the dialog and actions of the KDF to reflect who these people really are, you increase their appeal.

    Make Female Orions Sexual

    Star Trek lore always has Orion females portrayed as sexual beings. They use their sexuality to dominate and control men of nearly every species through pheromones. The longer you are around one, the deeper her control runs. You can make some really hot looking Orion women, but you don't get that raw sexuality from them. I'm not saying make STO rated M for mature, but I wouldn't mind PG-13.

    Expand Klingon Culture

    Add some blood decals on Klingon worlds, make the back alleys and streets dangerous and the seedy areas seedy. Don't just tell us that we are in a slum, show us. One of the things I loved about the new Mirror universe Bajor was how run down and seedy it became in the hands of the Terran Empire. Klingon worlds should have their seedy side as well.

    That's a pretty short list and one that shouldn't break the bank. KDF has been dry for sometime and is due a makeover. These changes would make the faction distinct and fun to play.
  • morgueragemorguerage Member Posts: 54 Arc User
    Get rid of private match pvp rewards and buff normal que back to normal
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