I should have paid more attention in maths class, took me lots of attempts on the digit puzzle
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
So far every time Cryptic has done any type of puzzle, there were people complaining. Too hard, too tedious, people being color blind, tone-deaf, dyslexic, one-handed, whatever. I think they'll stick with them anyway.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Thank you Cryptic or whoever for your brilliance of running players out of the game.
These puzzle annoy the TRIBBLE out of me so bad... I am considering not playing STO anymore.. I've been here since the start of the game.. 6 years now.. spent close to 10 grand on your game US dollars... so keep putting puzzles in the game so you can run off more players.
Now for those of you who just love puzzles... go play a puzzle game!
Temp, Probe Puzzles are the final straw for me... You lost me STO over the stupid puzzles .. and I bet those that LOVE those puzzle.. are Free to Play guys. Run off some more paying cuxtomers.. and keep all those non-pay players.
this forum's quality would rise significantly if each post required a puzzle like this before being posted.
So anybody that thinks those games are tedious and unneccessary, please reflect on why you find a 10-30 second puzzle frustrating in a game that 90% of the time requires you to press a button to succeed.
10-30 seconds? Are you being an TRIBBLE? 1-=30 seconds there would be no real complaint. What you find EZ and only 10 seconds... some of us have a hard time with and can't do in 20 minutes !!!! Why do you think we are in this thread?
Tides of War Fleet Staff contacts: @duketbar (Fleet Officer) Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
You think I'm a F2Per? *runs over Duke in General's Chariot*
I have no idea if your F2P or not, what I do know is you can keep the puzzles ! All yours
Tides of War Fleet Staff contacts: @duketbar (Fleet Officer) Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
Honestly, the 4-digit code was the one that irked me the most. The quasi-Sudoku doesn't even qualify as a puzzle at that difficulty level, the word salad can be a tad tricky if you don't pay attention, depending on the words... the code? Quite manageable, but tedious.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Honestly, the 4-digit code was the one that irked me the most. The quasi-Sudoku doesn't even qualify as a puzzle at that difficulty level, the word salad can be a tad tricky if you don't pay attention, depending on the words... the code? Quite manageable, but tedious.
+1
Additionally to the new games they could have thrown in all the others to mix things up a bit.
Also is it normal that the 4-digit code pops up like 90% of the time or was the game doing that on purpose to annoy me?
Srsly I barely saw any of the 2 others.
I want all my money back as they have changed the product into something I didn't buy .. its not a puzzle game I bought.. but exploration and fighting.
BESIDES that.. I have very powerful computers.. .so why... do I have to solve the problem of a puzzle? Let the dern computers do it!!!
AGain.. if I wanted Myst.. that is what I would have bought.
Tides of War Fleet Staff contacts: @duketbar (Fleet Officer) Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
No subtracting will not work I tried it and I got nothing out of it.
Okay, so first row, start with 15, then subtract 3, that's 12, then subtract 5, that's 7. A = 7
Second row, start with 15, subtract 2, that's 13, subtract 9, that's 4. B = 4
Third row, start with 15, subtract 6, that's 9, subtract 7, that's 2. C = 2
I LoL'd... did you make it look like a preschooler drew that on purpose to troll the OP ?
Thank you Cryptic or whoever for your brilliance of running players out of the game.
These puzzle annoy the **** out of me so bad... I am considering not playing STO anymore.. I've been here since the start of the game.. 6 years now.. spent close to 10 grand on your game US dollars... so keep putting puzzles in the game so you can run off more players.
Now for those of you who just love puzzles... go play a puzzle game!
Temp, Probe Puzzles are the final straw for me... You lost me STO over the stupid puzzles .. and I bet those that LOVE those puzzle.. are Free to Play guys. Run off some more paying cuxtomers.. and keep all those non-pay players.
Brilliant move STO
I almost failed to see the sarcasm. Brilliant post!
'3 by 3 square with numbers'
This one is the easiest, each row and column add up to 15, all you have to do is subtract each number in a column or row from 15 and you have your solution.
This one is quite easy. Anyone that has problems with this frankly didn't pay attention to the in-game directions.
'4 digit code'
This one is a pain, you have to 'crack' the 4 digit code. Change only 1 digit at a time, start with the first one, increase the value until it says you have a correct digit in the correct location. Ignore the correct digit in incorrect location, it's worthless. Keep going through the digits until you get all 4. It's just a simple brute force attack, I have no idea who would think this is fun, it's the kinda thing people make programs to do because it's so tedious.
The devs FINALLY came up with a new and interesting mini-game and instead of finding a good solution to solving it, people just bash their heads against the wall and complain that it "sucks."
Here's the REAL solution since your suggestion is worthless. Start by selecting the following test solution.
Digit 1: 1
Digit 2: 2
Digit 3: 3
Digit 4: 4
After doing this, you should click test and you'll know how many of these options are theoretically correct. After this test, you can swap any of the digits to 5 to find out if 5 should be in any one of the 4 digits. Assuming that 5 doesn't show up as being in either the correct position or spot, then you know that 5 shouldn't be tried anymore. If it does, then you know that either one, you have 5 in the correct spot or two, that you need to try 5 in a different spot. This eliminates needless and mindless "brute force" attacks. You can also determine whether some of the other numbers are in their correct spots/incorrect spots based on swapping out 5. From there it's a simple task of deduction and logic to swap out numbers.
On average this takes me less than a minute and it's never taken longer than 90 seconds. If you put some effort into it, the same will be true for everyone.
'Find the word in the jumble of text'
This one is easy, it just takes persistence. You have a bunch of words, most with letters replaced with underscores, you have to find which word selection matches the jumble. Just go through the list with 1 of the choices in mind, and see if it matches any of the options, if it doesn't, go to the next option and do the same thing.
This is good advice for people that can't multitask. Personally, I just repeat all three words out loud as I read each incomplete word. Works much faster for me.
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Best way to do the code cracking (with a little more finesse than brute force) is:
1. Set first number to +1 (so if 0, 1; 1, 2 ect)
2. If correct place, go to 5.
3. If correct but in wrong place, go down the four numbers with the value until you get it
4. If incorrect, that value is not needed to be checked again for any number, so repeat 1., adding one to the start value
5. Repeat steps 1 to 4 for next number of the code
6. Should you have checked all the numbers, it will be a repeat of one of the code numbers again - so try them
7. Code should now be unlocked
Well, I just started looking for probes this afternoon. I've gotten the 4-digit game every time (6 in a row). So, I can't comment on the others.
In theory, mini-games are fine. I was never bothered by the wave form game or the dilithium matching game...but it had nothing to do with their difficulty or tediousness. It was because they were 100% optional. You easily can get 8k dilithium each day without doing the mining minigame. You can get tons of crafting mats without ever doing that minigame. In fact, failing it, you still get crafting mats.
These probes are a totally different situation. There's a trait associated with this. That's much more significant than some extra dilithium or extra crafting mats. It's something that you can ONLY get by collecting the probes. Yes, it's still optional in that you don't need that trait, but but unlike the other examples, it's not obtainable in another way.
So, what would have been a great solution? Two options.
Option 1: Find probe...do minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 25 Marks.
Option 2: Find probe...skip minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 0 Marks.
Also, some people have issues with certain types of puzzles. Spatial awareness recognition issues that have nothing to do with being dumb. Some are just plain bad with math. Again, not necessarily due to being dumb.
So, the solution to this would be to give the choice of which puzzle to do.
Click probe...choose a minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 25 Marks.
Would there still be complaining? Of course. It's the internet. Complaining is a fact of life. But sometimes it's important to recognize that people actually have a valid point. For me at least, the 4-digit game is very simple. It's also mind-crushingly boring. I actually cringe a little bit when I find a probe.
Having puzzles in a game like this is fine, but they should feel as if they serve a purpose (like the arrow puzzle in one of the Breen missions). These feel like an attempt to waste my time. Not challenging. Not interesting. Certainly not fun after the third time.
4 digit code is easy 1000 if it flags as in the wrong sopt move the 1 to 2 and put 2 in 1 = 2100 then 3010 if the first number hits as another incorrect you move it to the next open space. should not take more than about 10 tries
I can manage the Sudoku, I can manage the word one, those two don't bother me at all, BUT the Four digit one is TEDIOUS.
Also just reran "Boldly we rode" on my temporal character and I have to say, that of all the in game puzzels, I HATE that isolinear one the most ! GOD I forgot how painful it was grinding out that mission for a set of Dominion polaron beams !
I just got my Temporal dude to lvl 60 and once again, I say: NEVER AGAIN.... But you know I'm a liar
Their difficulty is ranging from ridiculous to very easy. That's not the problem.
The tediousness of the 4-digit puzzle is annoying. Sudoku and word puzzle: 10 seconds. 4-digits: 1 minute, due to sheer amount of clicks needed and clumsyness of input method.
I wish they'd come up with a smoother replacement for 4digits.
i still didnt understand, i tried some of puzzles, they are time sinks.
i am deaf, just barely understood some puzzles, most of other deafs friends in my community really dont do those or able to understood like i have tried. i would have to call my nephew for solving the puzzles, but he not often available due to his work shedule.
those kind of puzzles like in those "probes' are not fun for deaf folks, it's too much frustration to mess with it, they just want to play standard rpg themes and move on to next "chapter'.
'4 digit code'
This one is a pain, you have to 'crack' the 4 digit code. Change only 1 digit at a time, start with the first one, increase the value until it says you have a correct digit in the correct location. Ignore the correct digit in incorrect location, it's worthless. Keep going through the digits until you get all 4. It's just a simple brute force attack, I have no idea who would think this is fun, it's the kinda thing people make programs to do because it's so tedious.
And you'd be WRONG. Once you get the "right number, wrong location" you stop everything and change the second digit to that number. If that isn't right, change the third. If third isn't right, change the fourth. There's a reason why they are giving you this hint, so take the hint.
Or do it your way and go through at max 625 possible combinations. I'm sure after the 600th time, you might get it correct.
Honestly, I hate the word salad puzzle the worst. I thought I found the pattern (most of the time, it's all the same choice), but then another word salad puzzle comes along that kills the pattern. So, back to squinty reading I go...
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If there are posts here that do not appeal to you, or opinions you disagree with, the best way to deal with that is to resist the urge to add comments. Instead, engage with the content you like! Don't feed the trolls!
those kind of puzzles like in those "probes' are not fun for deaf folks, it's too much frustration to mess with it, they just want to play standard rpg themes and move on to next "chapter'.
The puzzles are pretty simple and do not require any sound queues. There are 3 types of puzzles.
#1 - Word Salad - Basically you need to decipher the word. This is the easiest and does not really require much thinking since you are given 3 choices to choose from and you must decipher three different words. I simply click on random words until the puzzle is solved. Usually only takes 1 minute.
#2 - "Sodoku" - This is pretty easy all you need to do is to pick a number for each row to make the row add up to 15. Just basic math is required. Again, it only takes 1 minute.
#3 - Random Number Sequence - This takes the longest since you need to figure out the 4 digit sequence using the numbers 1 thru 5. Worse case scenario you do the brute force method. Focus on 1 digit at a time and cycle through the numbers 1 through 5 until it tells you the correct number is in the correct position. At worse, you need to make a total of 20 guesses to guess the correct sequence.
The Four Numbers puzzle is very easy. Burstorian does it the same way I do it. I also keep a pen/paper handy to write down when I get right number, right place.
Seriously, they all make you think a bit. That's all.
Now a LTS and loving it.
Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything.
LOL, now who's wrong? It's 20 possible combinations because it tells you if you get 1 right, not like cracking a combo lock where you have to get all the digits in the right spot at once.
They're not wrong. Clearly, logic puzzles are not your forté.
This is the same as the game "Mastermind" and the number of possibilities he stated is correct. You don't seem to be accounting for the fact that you may NOT have something correct and therefore never get a "hint". One of my answers to that puzzle was 5451, which if solved by the trial and error method stated, would have taken a VERY long time.
It should never take more than 10 or 11 guesses and should normally be solvable in under 8, but the problem is it COULD take 10 or 11 guesses which wastes an enormous amount of time.
Comments
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Thank you Cryptic or whoever for your brilliance of running players out of the game.
These puzzle annoy the TRIBBLE out of me so bad... I am considering not playing STO anymore.. I've been here since the start of the game.. 6 years now.. spent close to 10 grand on your game US dollars... so keep putting puzzles in the game so you can run off more players.
Now for those of you who just love puzzles... go play a puzzle game!
Temp, Probe Puzzles are the final straw for me... You lost me STO over the stupid puzzles .. and I bet those that LOVE those puzzle.. are Free to Play guys. Run off some more paying cuxtomers.. and keep all those non-pay players.
Brilliant move STO
@duketbar (Fleet Officer)
Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
My character Tsin'xing
I have no idea if your F2P or not, what I do know is you can keep the puzzles ! All yours
@duketbar (Fleet Officer)
Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
+1
Additionally to the new games they could have thrown in all the others to mix things up a bit.
Also is it normal that the 4-digit code pops up like 90% of the time or was the game doing that on purpose to annoy me?
Srsly I barely saw any of the 2 others.
BESIDES that.. I have very powerful computers.. .so why... do I have to solve the problem of a puzzle? Let the dern computers do it!!!
AGain.. if I wanted Myst.. that is what I would have bought.
@duketbar (Fleet Officer)
Tides of War Website
Team Speak: ts.tidesofwar.net - no port, no pass (or simply type ToW in address bar of TS client)
I LoL'd... did you make it look like a preschooler drew that on purpose to troll the OP ?
Great stuff, except your matrix is all F'd up.
All rows and columns must = 15
Derp
The devs FINALLY came up with a new and interesting mini-game and instead of finding a good solution to solving it, people just bash their heads against the wall and complain that it "sucks."
Here's the REAL solution since your suggestion is worthless. Start by selecting the following test solution.
Digit 1: 1
Digit 2: 2
Digit 3: 3
Digit 4: 4
After doing this, you should click test and you'll know how many of these options are theoretically correct. After this test, you can swap any of the digits to 5 to find out if 5 should be in any one of the 4 digits. Assuming that 5 doesn't show up as being in either the correct position or spot, then you know that 5 shouldn't be tried anymore. If it does, then you know that either one, you have 5 in the correct spot or two, that you need to try 5 in a different spot. This eliminates needless and mindless "brute force" attacks. You can also determine whether some of the other numbers are in their correct spots/incorrect spots based on swapping out 5. From there it's a simple task of deduction and logic to swap out numbers.
On average this takes me less than a minute and it's never taken longer than 90 seconds. If you put some effort into it, the same will be true for everyone.
This is good advice for people that can't multitask. Personally, I just repeat all three words out loud as I read each incomplete word. Works much faster for me.
1. Set first number to +1 (so if 0, 1; 1, 2 ect)
2. If correct place, go to 5.
3. If correct but in wrong place, go down the four numbers with the value until you get it
4. If incorrect, that value is not needed to be checked again for any number, so repeat 1., adding one to the start value
5. Repeat steps 1 to 4 for next number of the code
6. Should you have checked all the numbers, it will be a repeat of one of the code numbers again - so try them
7. Code should now be unlocked
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In theory, mini-games are fine. I was never bothered by the wave form game or the dilithium matching game...but it had nothing to do with their difficulty or tediousness. It was because they were 100% optional. You easily can get 8k dilithium each day without doing the mining minigame. You can get tons of crafting mats without ever doing that minigame. In fact, failing it, you still get crafting mats.
These probes are a totally different situation. There's a trait associated with this. That's much more significant than some extra dilithium or extra crafting mats. It's something that you can ONLY get by collecting the probes. Yes, it's still optional in that you don't need that trait, but but unlike the other examples, it's not obtainable in another way.
So, what would have been a great solution? Two options.
Option 1: Find probe...do minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 25 Marks.
Option 2: Find probe...skip minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 0 Marks.
Also, some people have issues with certain types of puzzles. Spatial awareness recognition issues that have nothing to do with being dumb. Some are just plain bad with math. Again, not necessarily due to being dumb.
So, the solution to this would be to give the choice of which puzzle to do.
Click probe...choose a minigame...receive progression credit towards trait...receive 25 Marks.
Would there still be complaining? Of course. It's the internet. Complaining is a fact of life. But sometimes it's important to recognize that people actually have a valid point. For me at least, the 4-digit game is very simple. It's also mind-crushingly boring. I actually cringe a little bit when I find a probe.
Having puzzles in a game like this is fine, but they should feel as if they serve a purpose (like the arrow puzzle in one of the Breen missions). These feel like an attempt to waste my time. Not challenging. Not interesting. Certainly not fun after the third time.
Also just reran "Boldly we rode" on my temporal character and I have to say, that of all the in game puzzels, I HATE that isolinear one the most ! GOD I forgot how painful it was grinding out that mission for a set of Dominion polaron beams !
I just got my Temporal dude to lvl 60 and once again, I say: NEVER AGAIN.... But you know I'm a liar
"god damn it, TRIBBLE digits"
The tediousness of the 4-digit puzzle is annoying. Sudoku and word puzzle: 10 seconds. 4-digits: 1 minute, due to sheer amount of clicks needed and clumsyness of input method.
I wish they'd come up with a smoother replacement for 4digits.
i am deaf, just barely understood some puzzles, most of other deafs friends in my community really dont do those or able to understood like i have tried. i would have to call my nephew for solving the puzzles, but he not often available due to his work shedule.
those kind of puzzles like in those "probes' are not fun for deaf folks, it's too much frustration to mess with it, they just want to play standard rpg themes and move on to next "chapter'.
My character Tsin'xing
And you'd be WRONG. Once you get the "right number, wrong location" you stop everything and change the second digit to that number. If that isn't right, change the third. If third isn't right, change the fourth. There's a reason why they are giving you this hint, so take the hint.
Or do it your way and go through at max 625 possible combinations. I'm sure after the 600th time, you might get it correct.
Honestly, I hate the word salad puzzle the worst. I thought I found the pattern (most of the time, it's all the same choice), but then another word salad puzzle comes along that kills the pattern. So, back to squinty reading I go...
If there are posts here that do not appeal to you, or opinions you disagree with, the best way to deal with that is to resist the urge to add comments. Instead, engage with the content you like! Don't feed the trolls!
The puzzles are pretty simple and do not require any sound queues. There are 3 types of puzzles.
#1 - Word Salad - Basically you need to decipher the word. This is the easiest and does not really require much thinking since you are given 3 choices to choose from and you must decipher three different words. I simply click on random words until the puzzle is solved. Usually only takes 1 minute.
#2 - "Sodoku" - This is pretty easy all you need to do is to pick a number for each row to make the row add up to 15. Just basic math is required. Again, it only takes 1 minute.
#3 - Random Number Sequence - This takes the longest since you need to figure out the 4 digit sequence using the numbers 1 thru 5. Worse case scenario you do the brute force method. Focus on 1 digit at a time and cycle through the numbers 1 through 5 until it tells you the correct number is in the correct position. At worse, you need to make a total of 20 guesses to guess the correct sequence.
Seriously, they all make you think a bit. That's all.
They're not wrong. Clearly, logic puzzles are not your forté.
This is the same as the game "Mastermind" and the number of possibilities he stated is correct. You don't seem to be accounting for the fact that you may NOT have something correct and therefore never get a "hint". One of my answers to that puzzle was 5451, which if solved by the trial and error method stated, would have taken a VERY long time.
It should never take more than 10 or 11 guesses and should normally be solvable in under 8, but the problem is it COULD take 10 or 11 guesses which wastes an enormous amount of time.