Well keep in mind reputation grinding is easy for those of us who have been here for the roll out of each one but not so much for newer players.
Lobi Piece alone are: Bioneural Infusion Circuits, Tachyokinetic Converter and the Hirogen Console. Plus the two crafted consoles and all the various reputation equipment. Psychological Warfare ain't exactly cheap either...
And we won't even discus upgrade costs to go epic on everything.
I don't have any skill points in those skills so Holodeck results are from equipment only as I also removed traits, Boffs and Doffs, the Tribble results are also equipment only checked after a fresh transfer of the stripped character.
HOLODECK
Subspace Decompiler Skill: +0
Countermeasures Systems Skill: +36
Well keep in mind reputation grinding is easy for those of us who have been here for the roll out of each one but not so much for newer players.
Lobi Piece alone are: Bioneural Infusion Circuits, Tachyokinetic Converter and the Hirogen Console. Plus the two crafted consoles and all the various reputation equipment. Psychological Warfare ain't exactly cheap either...
And we won't even discus upgrade costs to go epic on everything.
Psychological Warfare - Got that one because it was science and it was dirt cheap back in the day. Now I get to enjoy it with the skill revamp.
The consoles are certainly expensive, but I only buy from the lobi store on those rare occasions they throw a Lobi sale.
Well your lucky and/or smarter than most but my point was more for the entirety of the player base not outliers like you and me. Most importantly for newer player because that's what the Revamp is really about.
psychological warfare has certainly spiked in price 'recently'...i should know, as i've been selling quite a few for tidy sums over the past few weeks
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
20% bonus to control is the equivalent of several consoles depending on base skill level. Another one of those things that may need a slight balance pass because of the revamp.
At 500 control you get a bonus of +100 which is the equivalent of three consoles. LOL
Reason the difference isn't for any reason other than for Captain Training of Bridge Officers. Since both of these skills require 6 pumps to train a Bridge Officer skill for Science Captains, I had to invest 6 pumps into both of these skills just to be able to Train (before and after the current PADD system got introduced).
That said, my Science Captain has TRIED to make use of these skills (on Holodeck), I even went so far as to try and go out of my way to make use of them in support of my build on a Science B'rel Retrofit. The thing is, because of how Science Skills (space) are laid out, it's next to Can't Be Done for using these Skills effectively. Specifically ...
Jam Sensors I
Scramble Sensors I
Tyken's Rift II
Gravity Well III
I keep coming back to this arrangement of Science Skills on my Commander Science Bridge Officer on the B'rel Retrofit ... even after the R&D Science Trait made Particle Generators pretty much "mandatory" for Science that is going to be doing something relevant to damage. But even then, flying a Torpedo Boat it was honestly way more complicated than absolutely necessary to make use of these specific skills.
To be clear for feedback, I really wish that Viral Matrix was more competitive/useful so as to get more use out of Decompiler, but as things are on Holodeck, if you're not using Viral Matrix III with a full suite of Systems Engineers to support it, you're wasting your time in PvE ... and that's expensive!
I'm also somewhat bizarre in that I use Nukara Web Mines on my T6 Kor, and they actually make use of Subspace Decompiler (to extend the Stun time), so in a sort of a backhanded way I actually make "use" of Decompiler all the time on my Science Captain, but because of excessive Resistances that NPCs now have, the Stun time is actually almost always shorter than the 4 seconds of Damage over Time, so the effectiveness isn't good. Sad thing with Nukara Web Mines though is that because they do Physical Damage instead of Kinetic Damage, they have no synergy interaction with the Omega Kinetic Shearing Trait (because the Mines deal Physical instead of Kinetic and deal 0 Impact Damage, so 40% of zero is zero) ... but that's a different complaint.
Worse, there are no Science Consoles that give +Decompiler Skill, and there are precious few Deflectors that offer a bonus to +Decompiler (Klingon Honor Guard being an exception). So being able to stack up "enough" Decompiler is just really really hard to do through Equipment.
Countermeasures ... for a long time, my Science Captain was actually using +Countermeasures Consoles to buff up Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors ... until the R&D Science Level 15 Trait came along ... and then +Countermeasures simply didn't offer enough boost relative to the Return On Investment from Particle Generators. Ever since then, Countermeasures is appreciated, and I do still use Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors, but I just can't afford to Equip for it in comparison to Particle Generators. Largely that's a factor of all the Science Skills are somewhat "balkanized" on Holodeck such that you have to hyperspecialize into what you're going to boost to the expense of everything else. It's not as bad as how NO ONE would ever stock up on +Stealth Consoles, because +30 Stealth (on Holodeck) IS NOTHING on a Base 5000 scale(!), especially when there's no buffing from AUX Power for Stealth (but there *is* for Perception).
But still ... spending 18,000 XP (each!) to get 6 pumps on Decompiler and Countermeasures is just too damn expensive for anyone other than Science Captains on Holodeck, especially since you really need to have dedicated Science Bridge Officer Ability slots to make any use of them, and they're in direct competition with Gravity Well and Tyken's Rift (and Tractor Beam Repulsors) for usefulness. Given then pretty much almost all Cruisers and Escorts aren't going to have enough Science Seats to make these Skills really "work" for a particular build, especially in comparison to the other options.
Side note ... it would be really nice to combine Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors into a single Bridge Officer Skill, such that you still get the volume of effect of Scramble Sensors in a radius around the $Target, but the actual $Target is Placated, as if it had been hit by Jam Sensors. I'd suggest that combining these two Bridge Officer Skills might help improve the "value" offered by Countermeasures on Holodeck (and the corresponding Skill on Tribble). Likewise, the Clean Getaway in Pilot Skills also offer a really small base value to increase, so they just don't last long, even if enhanced.
Tangential note ... be nice if Countermeasures added Confuse duration for Attack Pattern Lambda and the Intimidating Strikes Trait on Holodeck. Such a change made for the Skill Revamp for Tribble would again increase the value of Countermeasures on a broader basis once the new Skill Revamp goes to Holodeck.
Both Jam Sensors and the Breen Sensor Disruption Field were designed for pre season 5 content. With all the DPS going around, you basically use either of those and just not fire because most people will break that placate in 1-4 seconds.
Makes me wonder if all Placates should dispense with the Damage Dealt way of breaking them and instead resort to a Number Of Hits scalar instead. You then rig +Countermeasures to increase the number of hits (direct only, damage over time doesn't count for this) that can be taken before the Placate breaks, regardless of the amount of Damage dealt.
HOLODECK
Subspace Decompiler Skill: 84
Countermeasures Systems Skill: 84
TRIBBLE
Control Expertise Skill: 100
after some testing ive seen a massive scaling increase for disable abilities. psw now disables for 10+ sec and the tholian tarantula web trait disables for up to 12 seconds. scramble sensors around 50 secs.
just on a side note: noticed the dmg increase of exotic abilities on tribble but there is one ability still massively underperforming:
on holodeck with 509 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3942
on tribble with 510 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3089
just wanted to point this one out as the other abilities look ok with the new translation.
HOLODECK
Subspace Decompiler Skill: 84
Countermeasures Systems Skill: 84
TRIBBLE
Control Expertise Skill: 100
after some testing ive seen a massive scaling increase for disable abilities. psw now disables for 10+ sec and the tholian tarantula web trait disables for up to 12 seconds. scramble sensors around 50 secs.
just on a side note: noticed the dmg increase of exotic abilities on tribble but there is one ability still massively underperforming:
on holodeck with 509 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3942
on tribble with 510 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3089
just wanted to point this one out as the other abilities look ok with the new translation.
All abilites got hammered on the high end. Anyway, DRB has the resistance reduction portion that makes it deadly.
Comments
Lobi Piece alone are: Bioneural Infusion Circuits, Tachyokinetic Converter and the Hirogen Console. Plus the two crafted consoles and all the various reputation equipment. Psychological Warfare ain't exactly cheap either...
And we won't even discus upgrade costs to go epic on everything.
HOLODECK
Subspace Decompiler Skill: +0
Countermeasures Systems Skill: +36
TRIBBLE
Control Expertise Skill: +91
Psychological Warfare - Got that one because it was science and it was dirt cheap back in the day. Now I get to enjoy it with the skill revamp.
The consoles are certainly expensive, but I only buy from the lobi store on those rare occasions they throw a Lobi sale.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
At 500 control you get a bonus of +100 which is the equivalent of three consoles. LOL
Holodeck
Subspace Decompiler: 7
Countermeasures: 0
(and for reference, Graviton Generator: 128 and Inertial Dampers: 64)
Tribble
Control Expertise: 104
Tactical Captains (Holodeck, ungeared)
Subspace Decompiler Skill: +0
Countermeasures Systems Skill: +0
Engineering Captains (Holodeck, ungeared)
Subspace Decompiler Skill: +0
Countermeasures Systems Skill: +0
Science Captains (Holodeck, ungeared)
Subspace Decompiler Skill: +84
Countermeasures Systems Skill: +84
Reason the difference isn't for any reason other than for Captain Training of Bridge Officers. Since both of these skills require 6 pumps to train a Bridge Officer skill for Science Captains, I had to invest 6 pumps into both of these skills just to be able to Train (before and after the current PADD system got introduced).
That said, my Science Captain has TRIED to make use of these skills (on Holodeck), I even went so far as to try and go out of my way to make use of them in support of my build on a Science B'rel Retrofit. The thing is, because of how Science Skills (space) are laid out, it's next to Can't Be Done for using these Skills effectively. Specifically ...
Jam Sensors I
Scramble Sensors I
Tyken's Rift II
Gravity Well III
I keep coming back to this arrangement of Science Skills on my Commander Science Bridge Officer on the B'rel Retrofit ... even after the R&D Science Trait made Particle Generators pretty much "mandatory" for Science that is going to be doing something relevant to damage. But even then, flying a Torpedo Boat it was honestly way more complicated than absolutely necessary to make use of these specific skills.
To be clear for feedback, I really wish that Viral Matrix was more competitive/useful so as to get more use out of Decompiler, but as things are on Holodeck, if you're not using Viral Matrix III with a full suite of Systems Engineers to support it, you're wasting your time in PvE ... and that's expensive!
I'm also somewhat bizarre in that I use Nukara Web Mines on my T6 Kor, and they actually make use of Subspace Decompiler (to extend the Stun time), so in a sort of a backhanded way I actually make "use" of Decompiler all the time on my Science Captain, but because of excessive Resistances that NPCs now have, the Stun time is actually almost always shorter than the 4 seconds of Damage over Time, so the effectiveness isn't good. Sad thing with Nukara Web Mines though is that because they do Physical Damage instead of Kinetic Damage, they have no synergy interaction with the Omega Kinetic Shearing Trait (because the Mines deal Physical instead of Kinetic and deal 0 Impact Damage, so 40% of zero is zero) ... but that's a different complaint.
Worse, there are no Science Consoles that give +Decompiler Skill, and there are precious few Deflectors that offer a bonus to +Decompiler (Klingon Honor Guard being an exception). So being able to stack up "enough" Decompiler is just really really hard to do through Equipment.
Countermeasures ... for a long time, my Science Captain was actually using +Countermeasures Consoles to buff up Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors ... until the R&D Science Level 15 Trait came along ... and then +Countermeasures simply didn't offer enough boost relative to the Return On Investment from Particle Generators. Ever since then, Countermeasures is appreciated, and I do still use Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors, but I just can't afford to Equip for it in comparison to Particle Generators. Largely that's a factor of all the Science Skills are somewhat "balkanized" on Holodeck such that you have to hyperspecialize into what you're going to boost to the expense of everything else. It's not as bad as how NO ONE would ever stock up on +Stealth Consoles, because +30 Stealth (on Holodeck) IS NOTHING on a Base 5000 scale(!), especially when there's no buffing from AUX Power for Stealth (but there *is* for Perception).
But still ... spending 18,000 XP (each!) to get 6 pumps on Decompiler and Countermeasures is just too damn expensive for anyone other than Science Captains on Holodeck, especially since you really need to have dedicated Science Bridge Officer Ability slots to make any use of them, and they're in direct competition with Gravity Well and Tyken's Rift (and Tractor Beam Repulsors) for usefulness. Given then pretty much almost all Cruisers and Escorts aren't going to have enough Science Seats to make these Skills really "work" for a particular build, especially in comparison to the other options.
Side note ... it would be really nice to combine Jam Sensors and Scramble Sensors into a single Bridge Officer Skill, such that you still get the volume of effect of Scramble Sensors in a radius around the $Target, but the actual $Target is Placated, as if it had been hit by Jam Sensors. I'd suggest that combining these two Bridge Officer Skills might help improve the "value" offered by Countermeasures on Holodeck (and the corresponding Skill on Tribble). Likewise, the Clean Getaway in Pilot Skills also offer a really small base value to increase, so they just don't last long, even if enhanced.
Tangential note ... be nice if Countermeasures added Confuse duration for Attack Pattern Lambda and the Intimidating Strikes Trait on Holodeck. Such a change made for the Skill Revamp for Tribble would again increase the value of Countermeasures on a broader basis once the new Skill Revamp goes to Holodeck.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground
Subspace Decompiler Skill: 84
Countermeasures Systems Skill: 84
TRIBBLE
Control Expertise Skill: 100
after some testing ive seen a massive scaling increase for disable abilities. psw now disables for 10+ sec and the tholian tarantula web trait disables for up to 12 seconds. scramble sensors around 50 secs.
just on a side note: noticed the dmg increase of exotic abilities on tribble but there is one ability still massively underperforming:
on holodeck with 509 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3942
on tribble with 510 prtg and 130 aux
resonance beam III: 3089
just wanted to point this one out as the other abilities look ok with the new translation.
Disagree on the max HP.Mod for jamming. Would make them OP on boss ships.
Time for more dried frog pills on that one I think.
All abilites got hammered on the high end. Anyway, DRB has the resistance reduction portion that makes it deadly.