So if we implement a modified Turing Test to determine if a machine is sentient, then humans will have to be tested as well? IMO, the Turing Test is flawed since it works by fooling a human to think a machine is human as well. Therefore, machines will have to think and act like humans to pass the test. Machine sentience would be different from human sentience due to humans and machines having different hardware, software, and peripherals.
to quote some of the progress made by the soong foundation in 2394
"
The case at the heart of the fight over the legal status of artificial lifeforms came to a close when the Supreme Court of the Federation ruled that The Doctor is indeed a sentient being, and, as such, he had the right to self-determination and the right to retain the mobile emitter brought back from the Delta Quadrant.
The court went on to set standards which artificial lifeforms must pass to be considered sentient, and ruled that any that cannot do so are technological constructs that are the property of their creators or owners.
"This is a major victory," said Alyssa Cogly-Shaw of the Soong Foundation after the ruling. "These are people, not replicators. We won't stop until every photonic lifeform has the right to choose how they want to live.""
There are standards set for what constitutes a sentient being according to the path to 2409.
Since any holographic lifeforms created by the federation or in this case generated by the ship AI of a galaxy class vessel since its owned by the federation would mean Moriarty has basic rights of a citizen, so his continued incarceration without a court case is a violation of due process which is even used by federation players as a conversation choice to mock empress sela. If they do not allow him to defend his case it would cast a rather bad light on the morale of the federation, to look the other way when it comes to their security or when it helps them.
ktamradio If you are looking for some nice music while playing clicky clicky click!
to quote some of the progress made by the soong foundation in 2394
"
The case at the heart of the fight over the legal status of artificial lifeforms came to a close when the Supreme Court of the Federation ruled that The Doctor is indeed a sentient being, and, as such, he had the right to self-determination and the right to retain the mobile emitter brought back from the Delta Quadrant.
The court went on to set standards which artificial lifeforms must pass to be considered sentient, and ruled that any that cannot do so are technological constructs that are the property of their creators or owners.
"This is a major victory," said Alyssa Cogly-Shaw of the Soong Foundation after the ruling. "These are people, not replicators. We won't stop until every photonic lifeform has the right to choose how they want to live.""
There are standards set for what constitutes a sentient being according to the path to 2409.
Since any holographic lifeforms created by the federation or in this case generated by the ship AI of a galaxy class vessel since its owned by the federation would mean Moriarty has basic rights of a citizen, so his continued incarceration without a court case is a violation of due process which is even used by federation players as a conversation choice to mock empress sela. If they do not allow him to defend his case it would cast a rather bad light on the morale of the federation, to look the other way when it comes to their security or when it helps them.
What does my post or the post I quoted have to do with Star Trek? What happens in Star Trek won't necessarily happen in real life. For all we know, we could end up with an Emperor of the Earth by the time machine sentience becomes a reality.
What does my post or the post I quoted have to do with Star Trek? What happens in Star Trek won't necessarily happen in real life. For all we know, we could end up with an Emperor of the Earth by the time machine sentience becomes a reality.
ahh sorry, my bad XD
"The Turing test is a test of a machine's ability to exhibit intelligent behavior equivalent to, or indistinguishable from, that of a human."
What I was trying to say was that a test for sentience would not be needed as the path to 2409 states there already exists a accepted standard for sentience in artificial lifeforms.
Does that make more sense? X_X
ktamradio If you are looking for some nice music while playing clicky clicky click!
Not sure if he was made 'human' when he 'left' the holodeck. He was oldish and its now 40yrs later. If they programmed him to age then... "He's Dead, Jim."
James Moriarty was one of the, if not the very first sentient photonic lifeform every created by star fleet. His attempt to take control over the enterprise does not make him a security risk, he merely tried to gain his own freedom in a time where it was not yet feasible for a holographic lifeform. With the mass production of personal holographic emitters, the professor and his girlfriend should finally be freed!!!!
Please free the professor from his imprisonment without trial, star fleet is not the obsidian order!!!
The Professor was imprisoned for over 40 years it is time to reintegrate him into society now that sentient photonic life forms have rights, his imprisonment is a gross breach of federation law!!!!
PHOTONS BE FREE!!!!!
PS: no I'm not a pro hologram terrorist!
But seriously I'd save up zen to pay for his bail or dilithium to finance the production of his own emitter! I don't care if he shows up in the story or not or is left to his own devices but please free the poor sap!
what makes you think hes not free, he is living in a virtual universe that is as real to him as this one is to you, what makes you think that living in the real world would make him any more happy then he may be now?
take the character Cypher from the matrix as an example, his only desire was to get back into the matrix and forget that the real world existed because he realised he was happier there then he was being out of it.
like the man said "What is real? How do you define 'real'? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain." I believe this applies to Moriarty as much as it does to anyone even though his brain is also virtual.
also take Detective Zev Bernstein from the movie the 13th floor when he learned he was just a virtual character in a virtual world did he want to be freed from that world? no, all he wanted was to be left alone to live his virtual life with his virtual family in his virtual world.
or think of it like this, supposing you found you were a virtual character in a virtual world, would you want to leave the virtual world you know and the family you love to see a world you don't know and are unsure of never to see your family again.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
Every time something like this comes up people have a habit of overthinking the situation. It's pretty much a given that in STO terms canon and even common sense can be twisted.
A minor character such as this would be fine as cameo material. He could be a random NPC you find at Facility 4028 you could chat with, or a Doff from a special event. If Data reappears in the future you could even have him participate in a mission or two.
what makes you think hes not free, he is living in a virtual universe that is as real to him as this one is to you, what makes you think that living in the real world would make him any more happy then he may be now?
take the character Cypher from the matrix as an example, his only desire was to get back into the matrix and forget that the real world existed because he realised he was happier there then he was being out of it.
like the man said "What is real? How do you define 'real'? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain." I believe this applies to Moriarty as much as it does to anyone even though his brain is also virtual.
also take Detective Zev Bernstein from the movie the 13th floor when he learned he was just a virtual character in a virtual world did he want to be freed from that world? no, all he wanted was to be left alone to live his virtual life with his virtual family in his virtual world.
or think of it like this, supposing you found you were a virtual character in a virtual world, would you want to leave the virtual world you know and the family you love to see a world you don't know and are unsure of never to see your family again.
that's all theoretical but fine, the problem I have with is... he should have the choice don't you think? if he prefers the confines of the virtual world his memories can be altered if he desires so. but at least he'd have a choice if he gets to defend his case to decide if he wants to go or stay. :<
ktamradio If you are looking for some nice music while playing clicky clicky click!
There is a discrepancy in that episode. Moriarty drew an outline of the Enterprise on a piece of photonic paper. So by all aspects of the episode that paper should have vanished when it left the holodeck, but Data is seen carrying it and showing it to Captain Picard.
If the paper could have left the holodeck, why couldn't Moriarty?
Answer The writers said so.
For me Free Moriarty!
That's not quite how holodecks work, holo technology Is a combination of light projection, tractor/repulsor beams, transporter and replicator tech, many of the less complicated items such as pieces of paper are actual real physical objects replicated into the holo environment, so it's entirely possible for data to take that piece of paper with him.
that's all theoretical but fine, the problem I have with is... he should have the choice don't you think? if he prefers the confines of the virtual world his memories can be altered if he desires so. but at least he'd have a choice if he gets to defend his case to decide if he wants to go or stay. :<
Right - I totally agree: to say "he doesn't know he's in a prison" or "he doesn't know he's being lied to" so that makes it all ok - is clearly wrong.
Right - I totally agree: to say "he doesn't know he's in a prison" or "he doesn't know he's being lied to" so that makes it all ok - is clearly wrong.
A Prison of Ignorance is still a prison
not to mention he wanted to escape the fake world of the holodeck and they got sealed in a simulation... sounds like the holohell equivalent of the matrix X_X
ktamradio If you are looking for some nice music while playing clicky clicky click!
Comments
to quote some of the progress made by the soong foundation in 2394
"
The case at the heart of the fight over the legal status of artificial lifeforms came to a close when the Supreme Court of the Federation ruled that The Doctor is indeed a sentient being, and, as such, he had the right to self-determination and the right to retain the mobile emitter brought back from the Delta Quadrant.
The court went on to set standards which artificial lifeforms must pass to be considered sentient, and ruled that any that cannot do so are technological constructs that are the property of their creators or owners.
"This is a major victory," said Alyssa Cogly-Shaw of the Soong Foundation after the ruling. "These are people, not replicators. We won't stop until every photonic lifeform has the right to choose how they want to live.""
There are standards set for what constitutes a sentient being according to the path to 2409.
Since any holographic lifeforms created by the federation or in this case generated by the ship AI of a galaxy class vessel since its owned by the federation would mean Moriarty has basic rights of a citizen, so his continued incarceration without a court case is a violation of due process which is even used by federation players as a conversation choice to mock empress sela. If they do not allow him to defend his case it would cast a rather bad light on the morale of the federation, to look the other way when it comes to their security or when it helps them.
What does my post or the post I quoted have to do with Star Trek? What happens in Star Trek won't necessarily happen in real life. For all we know, we could end up with an Emperor of the Earth by the time machine sentience becomes a reality.
ahh sorry, my bad XD
"The Turing test is a test of a machine's ability to exhibit intelligent behavior equivalent to, or indistinguishable from, that of a human."
What I was trying to say was that a test for sentience would not be needed as the path to 2409 states there already exists a accepted standard for sentience in artificial lifeforms.
Does that make more sense? X_X
http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/The_Light_Fantastic
what makes you think hes not free, he is living in a virtual universe that is as real to him as this one is to you, what makes you think that living in the real world would make him any more happy then he may be now?
take the character Cypher from the matrix as an example, his only desire was to get back into the matrix and forget that the real world existed because he realised he was happier there then he was being out of it.
like the man said "What is real? How do you define 'real'? If you're talking about what you can feel, what you can smell, what you can taste and see, then 'real' is simply electrical signals interpreted by your brain." I believe this applies to Moriarty as much as it does to anyone even though his brain is also virtual.
also take Detective Zev Bernstein from the movie the 13th floor when he learned he was just a virtual character in a virtual world did he want to be freed from that world? no, all he wanted was to be left alone to live his virtual life with his virtual family in his virtual world.
or think of it like this, supposing you found you were a virtual character in a virtual world, would you want to leave the virtual world you know and the family you love to see a world you don't know and are unsure of never to see your family again.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
A minor character such as this would be fine as cameo material. He could be a random NPC you find at Facility 4028 you could chat with, or a Doff from a special event. If Data reappears in the future you could even have him participate in a mission or two.
that's all theoretical but fine, the problem I have with is... he should have the choice don't you think? if he prefers the confines of the virtual world his memories can be altered if he desires so. but at least he'd have a choice if he gets to defend his case to decide if he wants to go or stay. :<
That's not quite how holodecks work, holo technology Is a combination of light projection, tractor/repulsor beams, transporter and replicator tech, many of the less complicated items such as pieces of paper are actual real physical objects replicated into the holo environment, so it's entirely possible for data to take that piece of paper with him.
Right - I totally agree: to say "he doesn't know he's in a prison" or "he doesn't know he's being lied to" so that makes it all ok - is clearly wrong.
A Prison of Ignorance is still a prison
not to mention he wanted to escape the fake world of the holodeck and they got sealed in a simulation... sounds like the holohell equivalent of the matrix X_X