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Phaser(space) proc idea
tinkerbelch
Member Posts: 138 Arc User
It seems the phaser proc will always be gimped with short disables times and lockout for both npcs and pvp.
Ideas on this have been shared a lot before. For example, It would be nice if the lockout was reduced (and not team wide) for npc targets but keep for pvp. However, many npcs (borg) still only disable for 1 second so tactically there is no time to sneak a torpedo in.
Accuracy bonus for phasers has also been shared. Giving that accuracy bonus does not carry over to fire-at-will, it is of limited help.
Maybe a better way for phasers would be to remove the proc and make it drain less energy. -8 instead of -10 (combine with cruiser commands for more reduction). This would make them the most efficient energy weapon type. It may not help builds that already counter drain, but it would give more options.
Might be very useful to people starting out who do not know the various game mechanics behind energy weapons. Drain, leech consoles, buffer energy above 125, etc. Or have just not started working on AP, plasma, and other builds.
I really do think we should keep pushing for a change for phasers. I think there is a good chance anything would be better than current proc with lockout.
Ideas on this have been shared a lot before. For example, It would be nice if the lockout was reduced (and not team wide) for npc targets but keep for pvp. However, many npcs (borg) still only disable for 1 second so tactically there is no time to sneak a torpedo in.
Accuracy bonus for phasers has also been shared. Giving that accuracy bonus does not carry over to fire-at-will, it is of limited help.
Maybe a better way for phasers would be to remove the proc and make it drain less energy. -8 instead of -10 (combine with cruiser commands for more reduction). This would make them the most efficient energy weapon type. It may not help builds that already counter drain, but it would give more options.
Might be very useful to people starting out who do not know the various game mechanics behind energy weapons. Drain, leech consoles, buffer energy above 125, etc. Or have just not started working on AP, plasma, and other builds.
I really do think we should keep pushing for a change for phasers. I think there is a good chance anything would be better than current proc with lockout.
Post edited by tinkerbelch on
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Support 90 degree arc limitation on BFaW! Save our ships from looking like flying disco balls of dumb!
Phasers work just fine, DPS record is 120k in a T5-U escort using Phaser Cannons. Go away now.
They aren't talking about the DPS they are talking about the proc effect.
Works just fine for me.
It's easier for some folks to press spacebar to play a game rather than to read and understand simple topics in a forum.
Anyways, does seem like phaser procs need a little something. Although, I can't say I'd go for what kjwashington mentioned. Seems like that might be treading on Tetryons turf.
The stun-like idea the other suggested wouldn't be too bad, if properly done. Would end up making phasers into more of a crowd control type of thing.
Could make a proc where it can reduce an enemy's damage output for specificed short duration.
Although, before I go poking at things more, it would seem that they aren't really going to mess with original procs anymore as for some time now they've been adding variants of types of weapons. Like, there's the old plasma-disruptors or the bio-molecular weapons.
In other words, I guess we might as well be throwing new ideas at the devs rather than suggesting they change the old procs. They've probably figured it's good to keep the old procs the way they are while adding new variants to help please those to use phasers, disruptors and such while having a different effect.
Isn't that more due to the Tempest's Nadion Saturation Bomb than using Phasers?
It sure feels like a .0000025% chance. You've got a 2.5% chance of getting a 25% chance of doing something useful and that chance is subject to lock out periods so it's not really even a 2.5% chance.
I'd like weapon modification customization, including the ability to replace innate weapon procs with weapon mods.
The AP lack of proc suggests that a proc is roughly comparable in value to a mod.
And you'd have a lot less griping about individual weapon procs if any proc could be replaced with an additional mod.
I'd rather they buffed the other procs to AP levels of usefulness rather than nerfing AP (yes i'm an AP user).
How about tying the proc rate to CritH? Of course the numbers on the procs may need adjusting. Having the procs proc 25% of the time (for non roms) will be silly op as it stands now
This idea was off the top of my head but my point is that people have invested heavily in AP (as they have the other types) and i'd rather see no player hit by the nerf bat
I'm tired of irritating little children like you trying to make Phasers OP just because they're your favorite weapon.
These threads don't want Phasers balanced (because they are BTW) they want them to be overpowered.
No thanks. :rolleyes:
They already have a Weapon that reduces the enemies damage output... Voth Antiproton.
I like my Phaser proc just the way it is, stop trying to mess it up.
Cryptic has already said on another issue a while ago (I forget what the issue was tbh), that its easier for them to bring an outlier in line with the other points of data than for them to buff everything else around the outlier.
While I think making every proc happen on a critical hit would be interesting, as you said, how would it work with the procs that have 25% chance, etc.
Support 90 degree arc limitation on BFaW! Save our ships from looking like flying disco balls of dumb!
Protonic Polaron already does that, I like unique weapons effects from time to time but I think it would be a very bad idea to do it to all weapon procs... CRTH would just become the new flavor of the month.
That would actually make them superior to the supposedly-anti-shield-tetryon deal. Tetryons should be tweaked for exactly this purpose.
Also, I'd recommend the removal of the nerfs to subsystem attacks from years ago. Years ago, Phasers were the King of STO (yes, I know, hard to believe, right?). Phaser proc had no lockout timers, and a team full of Feds slamming a target was a very powerful series of attacks. I still remember withstanding concentrated fire from a bunch of Feds in PVP was a bit of an artform in itself with Subsystems dropping randomly every few seconds.
Viral Matrix, Photonic Shockwave, Tricobalt explosions... All these disable attacks were based on Subspace Decompiler Skill, one of Science's 2 highest tiered skillboxes. Cryptic nerfed it where only certain systems could be affected and artificially lessened the effects in both PVE and PVP. Remove the nerfs, increase the effect of Inertial Dampeners to resist (that is already the offsetting skillbox against Disables that do not involve energy drains).
I was refering to the fact that the procs (in my fed tacs case) would be happenening roughly one shot in four (so for example disruptor weapons would always be stacking de-buffs) which would mean all the procs would be op and in need of adjustment. In the case of phaser for example the CritH of the player is the proc rate and when you proc it rolls for which subsystem as per usual.
But if what you say about the outliers is correct (I do believe you BTW) then it's AP that will get the nerf along with plasma (again) imo.
Plasma and AP are the energy weapon of choice(again imo).
Sorry about the wall of text
Oh yeah, I forgot about those fancy things. The voth ones that is.
But if you were reading, I also said variants of things get added into the game as old procs remain the same. So, iif anything, I was mentioning any changes folks would want would be a variant, not a change to the old procs (because it's not gonna happen). Not sure where you got the idea of me trying to "mess it up."
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
How about having a weapon proc at a 25% chance on critical hit?
By doing that the player could actively affect space weapons proc chances for ALL weapon types, not only Antiproton like nowadays .
If you haven't noticed, everyone and their dog is buffing CrtH chances with Vulnerability Locater consoles already for months now.
Heck even i run them, lol.
I couldn't have said it better.
The difference between the AP and no Proc weapon is around 4-5%.
If you consider procs, APs advantage is less than the above. If you consider builds, AP becomes weaker or advantage becomes insignificant.
The best Phasers for PvE are the Phased(xindi) and Phaser Undine Rep not what you guys are beating at, the crafted/stander Phaser proc.
Both of what I mentioned you have to build around and of course more expensive than the crafted Phaser or the crafted AP to optimize and get the UR CritD mod.
Once you start going down the discussion of build, you want to use the Nadeon Bomb or 2pc set Undine or whatever fancies you depending on what is your goal in the game. Since you are all build blind when considering weapon procs, there is no point with the discussion of weapon procs nor this thread because you all want to discuss to change the procs and limit it to the PvP version of Phaser but want to exclude builds if the procs need change or not.
The strength of AP lies on how it compliments with the build. high crith, consoles with critd, romulan SROs, if you take that away, the AP proc becomes not as useful as you guys paint it. What are you gonna do with 20 xtra critd when you got 0-5 crth? Thats why builds are important in determining if procs are better or not.
Ap proc adds 20% CrtD
Adding CrtH to to phasers then tie it to being mounted on a Fed ship with a bonus to the proc rate would go nice to giving Feds a equaling to the Rom SRO's advantage
something along the same lines for photon torpedos
Give the C-store ships a boost using Canon weapons
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Like I said, you are using the standard Phaser proc for pvE. But why in the world are you using standard phaser proc for PvE?
Feds have access to SRO, and pirate BoFFS. Phaser builds are not suppose to be exactly like AP builds just like what you guys want.
But then that is the clue for me, players who have no idea how to build optimal phaser builds are the one's beating for an upgrade of phasers. Thus, the problem has nothing to do with the phasers, more with the player not knowing how to build nor fly one.
A-Men.
/ten chars
I thought this thread was about the Phaser (Space) proc and not the Xindi Phaser proc and how to make it not suck. Why ever would people be talking about the Phaser proc that sucks. The mind boggles.
To many players
A Fed ship uses phasers.....................Not AP not plasma
It uses quantum or photon torpedo's
Klingons use disruptors
This is about weapon procs not builds you fail to see the point or your intentionally trying to cloud the point
For PvE the phaser proc is ( Worthless ) that is the point and it should not be
90% of the game is PvE and a lot of players are ( Fed ) and a lot of Fed players would like to have there Canon weapons for their ships to be of equal value to the rest of the weapons
Its about the value of the Proc not the build
And the value of the phaser proc is about worthless
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
Why bother to change a proc of one phaser type, when there other phaser types? Isnt that just a waste of time for the devs?
Even if you use the current Standard Proc, the damage difference is less then 5% with AP proc. Minus build consideration, less than 5% is insignificant for an average player to consider.
If we use the current Standard Phaser weapons with build to consider, it should just as be effective or even more effective than AP weapons except the catch is you got know how to build one and fly one.
Based on what magical stat is Fed players want this and that?
In the first place, they are role players, not competing for DPS right? So why even be bothered with a less than 5% difference. it is a very small difference even if you take out the build for consideration.
I believe you consider no build whatsoever, the AP Proc does nothing. You need a decent build to actually make that 20CritD proc work.
Just because it doesn't do what YOU want it to, doesn't make it horrible! I've had to say that so many times I'm just about sick of it.
"Waaaa my favorite item isn't overpowered! Waaaa"
If you did more than 3k DPS maybe your battles would not be so long ?
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse