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Forums > Home› Star Trek Online General Discussion

Sad this game is now Pay to Win

xuelxuel Member Posts: 169 Arc User
edited May 2015 in Star Trek Online General Discussion
It is really sad this GREAT game is now Pay to Win, with all the t6 ships costing RL money (zen, and zen for lockbox keys). Yes I know you can buy zen with dilithium but that zen still cost someone some RL $. It wouldn't be as bad if there was slightly weaker t6 ships then the zen store or lockbox/lobi ships. Such as no rank 5 ability like the fleet versions, and no special console, give ship some change(s) to model/skin that shows it's a free version (while letting those who bought the zen version(s) to use skin if they like.

It's just depressing seeing all these new t6 ships come out and ONLY way to get them is to buy them with Zen. Causeing this game to be a Pay to Win rather then Free2Play with option for Lifetime sub for added bonus's. Yes I know they got to get their money somehow but it's getting out of hand.
Post edited by xuel on

Comments

  • azntrigboiazntrigboi Member Posts: 139 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Late to the party much? The best ships have always come out of some Zen transaction whether it be through fleet modules, lockbox keys, or directly in the store.
  • lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,896 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    This game is the farthest from P2W I've ever seen, if you put the time into it you can earn pretty much anything in the game for free...

    If you don't have the patience to grind and rather just throw your wallet at the problem...well that's just player error
    Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
  • desertjetsdesertjets Member Posts: 207 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    When people say pay to win, I always want to ask -- win what? Seriously what do I get to win in this game. There isn't a high score list or a leaderboard, so yeah.
  • dirlettiadirlettia Member Posts: 1,632 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    For the last years prior to the Tier 6 the VA ships were all Zen store only as well so no change there.
    Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
  • thisslerthissler Member Posts: 2,055 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    xuel wrote: »
    It is really sad this GREAT game is now Pay to Win, with all the t6 ships costing RL money (zen, and zen for lockbox keys). Yes I know you can buy zen with dilithium but that zen still cost someone some RL $. It wouldn't be as bad if there was slightly weaker t6 ships then the zen store or lockbox/lobi ships. Such as no rank 5 ability like the fleet versions, and no special console, give ship some change(s) to model/skin that shows it's a free version (while letting those who bought the zen version(s) to use skin if they like.

    It's just depressing seeing all these new t6 ships come out and ONLY way to get them is to buy them with Zen. Causeing this game to be a Pay to Win rather then Free2Play with option for Lifetime sub for added bonus's. Yes I know they got to get their money somehow but it's getting out of hand.

    If things continue as they have, you should be getting four free T6 ships per year.

    Not sure exactly where you're going with this, but there are free options in the game.

    Never mind the Dilithium option you already mentioned. (Someone sold Zen of their own free will you know.)
  • induperatorinduperator Member Posts: 806 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    xuel wrote: »
    It is really sad this GREAT game is now Pay to Win, with all the t6 ships costing RL money (zen, and zen for lockbox keys). Yes I know you can buy zen with dilithium but that zen still cost someone some RL $. It wouldn't be as bad if there was slightly weaker t6 ships then the zen store or lockbox/lobi ships. Such as no rank 5 ability like the fleet versions, and no special console, give ship some change(s) to model/skin that shows it's a free version (while letting those who bought the zen version(s) to use skin if they like.

    It's just depressing seeing all these new t6 ships come out and ONLY way to get them is to buy them with Zen. Causeing this game to be a Pay to Win rather then Free2Play with option for Lifetime sub for added bonus's. Yes I know they got to get their money somehow but it's getting out of hand.

    The game practically relies on Ship sales to sustain itself if you don't want to buy a Tier 6 ship then don't you don't need a Tier 6 ship to do almost all of the content in the game.
  • fltcaptalanfltcaptalan Member Posts: 47 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    There are two "free" ones, the breen carrier, and the kobali cruiser, you had to grind for them, during special events, but I'd like a t-6 that you would get at 50 or something with a rank up token
  • rmy1081rmy1081 Member Posts: 2,840 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Pay for awesome things? Maybe

    Pay to win? nope
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • thecosmic1thecosmic1 Member Posts: 9,365 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    This thread smells strongly of an LTSer's entitlement thread to me.

    I can hear the subtle whisper: "I bought an LTS 5 years ago and so I should get everything for free!"
    STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 5,166 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    STO has one of the most generous F2P models out of any game I have seen. You can literally get any item from the game store without spending 1 cent of your own money by trading dilithium for zen. So no, this game is definitely not "pay to win". If you want to call it GRIND to win, I won't disagree, as "grind" is a subjective term.
    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • induperatorinduperator Member Posts: 806 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    thegrandnagus1 wrote: »
    STO has one of the most generous F2P models out of any game I have seen. You can literally get any item from the game store without spending 1 cent of your own money by trading dilithium for zen. So no, this game is definitely "pay to win". If you want to call it GRIND to win, I won't disagree, as "grind" is a subjective term.

    Not to mention the expansions and content are free too. I remember how bad Mech Quest was, Now THAT was Pay to Win...
  • sheldonlcoopersheldonlcooper Member Posts: 4,042 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Also both the Kobali and the Breen free T6 ships are very good ships. Maybe they aren't the very best ships but the Kobali is in the top 5 tanks and the Breen is very nice for tac/sci hybrid style (which I happen to enjoy). I also suspect the Risian ship will also be in this caliber.
    Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
  • lianthelialianthelia Member Posts: 7,896 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    thegrandnagus1 wrote: »
    STO has one of the most generous F2P models out of any game I have seen. You can literally get any item from the game store without spending 1 cent of your own money by trading dilithium for zen. So no, this game is definitely not "pay to win". If you want to call it GRIND to win, I won't disagree, as "grind" is a subjective term.

    ^ this...

    Sure it may take a while to get what you want but it's still free...the way they're literally tossing dilithium at us recently you don't need to spend a ton of time maxing 8k a day.
    Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
  • xenificationxenification Member Posts: 615 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    xuel wrote: »
    It is really sad this GREAT game is now Pay to Win, with all the t6 ships costing RL money (zen, and zen for lockbox keys). Yes I know you can buy zen with dilithium but that zen still cost someone some RL $. It wouldn't be as bad if there was slightly weaker t6 ships then the zen store or lockbox/lobi ships. Such as no rank 5 ability like the fleet versions, and no special console, give ship some change(s) to model/skin that shows it's a free version (while letting those who bought the zen version(s) to use skin if they like.

    It's just depressing seeing all these new t6 ships come out and ONLY way to get them is to buy them with Zen. Causeing this game to be a Pay to Win rather then Free2Play with option for Lifetime sub for added bonus's. Yes I know they got to get their money somehow but it's getting out of hand.

    the reason for that is it is a game that didnt really want to go F2P but had no choice.

    I use Swtor as an example of this.

    Both this and swtor have 2 defining things they both didnt want to go F2P but had no choice to make more money as sub plans seem to be dying out (though I would argue that it drastically depends on whether the game delivers or not) - WoW is not a good example as it came out in the early days of sub plans so it essentially got the bulk of sustainable players and generated a massive fan base because of this. You could also argue heavily that the player base was the only reason it became so popular because of the amount of dedicated players etc.

    Swtor makes money the same way STO does the only difference between them is STO is totally doable as free to play it just takes time, Swtor however is extremely restrictive on the Free2play side of things.

    you surely must understand that these games wanted to remain sub only however any game that starts out as a sub based game needs to make money and often or not more money than it needed to before, (parent company moaning at them etc).

    I dont like it anymore than the next person but its not something we have any control over.

    that said the game is quite generous to its players compared to most MMO's. It just seems worse than it is from the outside looking in.
  • hyplhypl Member Posts: 3,719 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    That's odd...

    I haven't paid anything, except time. Does time count? I paid time and I'm winning! :D
    HyperLimited - UNUSED ROMULAN NOTIFICATIONS
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  • thecosmic1thecosmic1 Member Posts: 9,365 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Honestly, do we not get at least 1 of these types of threads every time a new ship comes out?

    Player wants new ship. Player does not want to buy new ship. Player complains how the game is P2W because you must buy new ship. Rinse and repeat.
    STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
  • xenificationxenification Member Posts: 615 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    Honestly, do we not get at least 1 of these types of threads every time a new ship comes out?

    Player wants new ship. Player does not want to buy new ship. Player complains how the game is P2W because you must buy new ship. Rinse and repeat.

    spoilt with free ship tokens from when you level up lol
  • induperatorinduperator Member Posts: 806 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    thecosmic1 wrote: »
    Honestly, do we not get at least 1 of these types of threads every time a new ship comes out?

    Player wants new ship. Player does not want to buy new ship. Player complains how the game is P2W because you must buy new ship. Rinse and repeat.

    Just another day right? Oh and today's troll thread is here too.
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Personally, I'm trying to match the consoles/traits they listed for the Pilot boats with those boats themselves...cause they feel like they were meant for a different kind of boat. It's kind of a twisted disconnect.

    http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/9226583-star-trek-online%3A-kdf-pilot-ship-stats
    http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/9226533-star-trek-online%3A-fed-pilot-ship-stats
    http://www.arcgames.com/en/games/star-trek-online/news/detail/9226623-star-trek-online%3A-rom-pilot-ship-stats
  • davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 10,689 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    The original post attempts to redefine the term "pay 2 win". It is factually incorrect, the best kind of incorrect.
  • UnknownUnknown
    edited May 2015
    This content has been removed.
  • sunfranckssunfrancks Member Posts: 3,925 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    You have 3 choices:

    Suck it up and buy them if you are that desperate.

    Earn in game Dilithium and convert it to zen to get the ships,

    Don't do any of the above and ignore them.


    I have been going with option 2 since 2011...
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  • aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    This can be viewed in several ways :

    From a PVP POV, it is P2W , has been for a while now .

    From a PVE POV ... , well that depends , as there are several factors :

    - The grind itself -- it used to be much easier .

    - The number of toons you choose to care for -- I can't count the times I've given up optimizing a toon out of mid-grind boredom .
    I mean, let's face it, if I would choose to bling out each of my 15 pre-DR STF capable toons to the max, I'd have to drop a nice set of change to get that done .

    So from that perspective , it does feel like I'd be paying to "have it all" , which to some equals to P2W .
    Especially if the alternative is to spend millions of Dil and possibly a few billions of EC to get all the bling my heart would ever want .



    ... YMMV ...
  • bobbydazlersbobbydazlers Member Posts: 4,534 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    when you have to pay to buy anything past your first ship, when you have to pay for any gear above basic white, when you have to pay to upgrade beyond mk12, when you have to pay for entry into winter, summer & anniversary events, when you have to pay for expansions or even seasons.

    when all those things happen I would agree the game had gone pay to win.
    as you can get all of that and more without spending a dime its about as free to play as you will ever see.

    When I think about everything we've been through together,

    maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,

     and if that journey takes a little longer,

    so we can do something we all believe in,

     I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.

  • gavinrunebladegavinruneblade Member Posts: 3,894 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    thegrandnagus1 wrote: »
    STO has one of the most generous F2P models out of any game I have seen. You can literally get any item from the game store without spending 1 cent of your own money by trading dilithium for zen. So no, this game is definitely not "pay to win". If you want to call it GRIND to win, I won't disagree, as "grind" is a subjective term.

    Don't forget the anniversary and other giveaway events they have. 2013 they gave $130+ us worth of free zen stuff to everyone, was a bit less in 2014 (because only one free tier 5 ship to compete with the three from 2013) but still over $100 us. Not everyone can be if it from all of it since they often have bought some of them before, or like the Rhode Island they offer it multiple times. But still, free is free.
  • orion0029orion0029 Member Posts: 1,122 Bug Hunter
    edited May 2015
    induperator wrote: »
    The game practically relies on Ship sales to sustain itself if you don't want to buy a Tier 6 ship then don't you don't need a Tier 6 ship to do almost all of the content in the game.

    I couldn't have said this better!

    Also, this isn't really a Pay to win game, with the dilithium exchange it's more of a 'pay to win quickly' game, you can get almost everything* in the game for free** if you want to.

    *With the exception of the 1000 day veteran ships, a couple of playable races, and two rows of account bank space.

    **Free, as in you can spend time in getting dilithium and exchanging it for zen, you can throw $$ at Cryptic and get the Zen that way too
  • pwlaughingtrendypwlaughingtrendy Member Posts: 2,966 Arc User
    edited May 2015
    Not all T6 ships cost ZEN, as MANY people have already refuted to the OP with. I'm closing this down because it's already flame worthy.
This discussion has been closed.