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monitization abuse
cromarty1
Member Posts: 138 Arc User
well when I started playing sto it started free to play with some nice monetization that was harmless vary little to drop real cash to have an artificial boost. it was ok nothing to spend much more than what a pay to play game cost for a year. what you get was clear buy ship you want to fly now or if you want to gamble you can gamble by keys. it was great epic even compaired to the 3 games before with terrible trust in monetization witch for those games was just a big word for pay to win. I liked that with sto thare was little powercreeping for real cash really only time saved at about 20 hours saved for 10 bucks. not bad at all for a monthy payent of 20 bucks that a pay to play would cost and buying keys was really the only way to take a risk witch was a nice idea. never seen a game with a good choice to play it safe its only a game or gamble im old enuff too I can handle burning a $10 for nothing. a grind that was progressive making me feel like I was doing something with my time in game despite having caps on currency grinding that's mostly to stop the feeling of doing something with more time in game.
this lasted about 3 months its like new years 2014 the company that owned the game made a pact to ruin exzactly what was different about sto that I liked and as of april 2015 all the stuff I explained above is gone now. blowing $1000s and $1000s for nothing is possible now. nothing to buy without risk with real cash. had a play it safe gone! game as a whole is now like over 80% all about the powercreep nothing else matters not even a game that is canon to its own theme now. so please tell me whats good that's left and talk about what you like in a monetizing game and stuff as its looking like the fact game developers can easily abuse the idea of monetization is what makes monetization bad. I talked to gamer elites not just theme seekers and a pole made in march put the numbers in over 4 out of 5 monetized games of the last year have become repetitively abusive in terms of making the game pay to win nothing paid with real cash without risk, a grind you can get old and still get nothing dune for free and basicly sleezy things.
so please talk what do you like about free to play is it fair that free to play is not really fun till spending what a pay to play cost over 2 or three years all at once let me know.
this lasted about 3 months its like new years 2014 the company that owned the game made a pact to ruin exzactly what was different about sto that I liked and as of april 2015 all the stuff I explained above is gone now. blowing $1000s and $1000s for nothing is possible now. nothing to buy without risk with real cash. had a play it safe gone! game as a whole is now like over 80% all about the powercreep nothing else matters not even a game that is canon to its own theme now. so please tell me whats good that's left and talk about what you like in a monetizing game and stuff as its looking like the fact game developers can easily abuse the idea of monetization is what makes monetization bad. I talked to gamer elites not just theme seekers and a pole made in march put the numbers in over 4 out of 5 monetized games of the last year have become repetitively abusive in terms of making the game pay to win nothing paid with real cash without risk, a grind you can get old and still get nothing dune for free and basicly sleezy things.
so please talk what do you like about free to play is it fair that free to play is not really fun till spending what a pay to play cost over 2 or three years all at once let me know.
Post edited by cromarty1 on
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what exactly is the pay to win items?
as for canon, you do know they have to get permission from CBS, the IP owner for any expansions.
Monetization is designed to raise money.
This game has over 40 Devs working on it.
at $80k per year.
That's $3.2 million needed just to cover their wages, let alone any support staff.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
after monthly or lifetime subs there is nothing beyond the reach of a ftp player who has the patience to grind the dil for it.
of course cryptic is going to try and temp you with the latest shinnies they want to make money so they can pay the bills, but its up to you how much or little you want to spend or if you want to spend any at all, nobody is forcing you to spend money only your own impatience.
I have even known of ftp players who have bought one of the latest T6 ship packs by grinding the dil for it.
thers not many players from other ftp games that can say anything even remotely close to that.
When I think about everything we've been through together,
maybe it's not the destination that matters, maybe it's the journey,
and if that journey takes a little longer,
so we can do something we all believe in,
I can't think of any place I'd rather be or any people I'd rather be with.
Even after all the personal qualms I have with their buisness model that still stands.
Most other f2p mmos have paywalls left and right and are a nightmare to play without a sub or spending some real cash for stuff like a 3rd skill/action bar, more than 16 inventory slots or even friggin crafting slots so you can craft at all (srsly I've seen some bad bull**** in other games).
They may be pulling off a lot of **** here, no doubt 'bout that, but sto's f2p model really is one of the most player friendliest by far.
I don't know how much more generous people want Cryptic to be.
If you started with FTP the game already had some 30 C-Store ships to buy ranging from T1 to T5. Every one of those C-Store ships came with a Console or ability which made it better then the free version. Heck, the C-Store Excelsior was the best combat Cruiser in game.
Pre-FTP the game would cost you $180.00 a year just in Subscription. If you also wanted some C-Store ships you had to pay extra - and there was no Stipend to get it for a discount. So if you wanted the Excelsior it was +$20.00. If you wanted the Galaxy X it was +$25.00 more. If you just bought only 2 C-Store ships a year you had $220.00 invested into STO. And that does not include what you spent on Skins, Uniforms, playable Species, Boffs, etc.
I seriously doubt that most of the people currently playing STO spend $200.00 a year on the game.
Now let us talk about the difference between NEED and WANT. Wanting a Lockbox ship is not the same as needing a Lockbox ship. You do not need a T5.5 ship, let alone a T6 or T6.5 ship, to play STO. I can take my level 40 free T5 Sovereign with my free Mk XII Rep and Fleet Gear into any Advanced STF in this game and complete the objectives without difficulty - keeping in mind that Advanced is slightly more difficult then the old Elite STFs. There is nothing in a Lockbox or in the C-Store that is required for me to play and succeed in this game.
I might WANT those items because they look cool to me - just like a Lamborghini looks cool to me - but I do not NEED them to complete the objectives in the game; just like a do not NEED a Lamborghini to drive my children to school.
It is no company's fault if consumers are too stupid to separate WANT and NEED in their own minds. No one is forcing you to spend $30.00 on a C-Store ship. You are forcing yourself due to your own lack of willpower and inability to separate what you want from what you need.
Do not blame Hershey's if you spend $100.00 a month on their chocolate and weight 300 lbs. Blame yourself. It is all about free will and making your own choices, good or bad.
Okay Soppy... think of it this way the stipend is 500 Zen = $5.00 USD X 40 months = $200.00 USD or the Lifetime on sale.
Er EVERYTHING in this game is free (bar vet rewards) there is nothing in this game that can not be obtained from playing.
Dil -> Zen exchange is there for a reason.
The EC exchange is there for a reason.
You do not! Have to spend a single penny on this game unless YOU choose to do so.
So when people moan about pay to win etc etc etc etc etc you just aren't playing right.
You just have to invest a bit of time in playing.
End of sorry to be blunt but it annoys me when people moan about how they had to sink real money into a game that has the best free to play model I have seen thus far.
If you want pay gates then go play a sub based game or one that requires money for game expansions etc then tell me this game isn't free.
I think 'speculating' is rather too nice a way of putting it, rather, he's just pulling numbers out of his backside and trying to weave a web of bullsh*t to make himself seem more intelligent and 'right' than he really is.
I cannot comment on how much Devs make in that area, but I would guess high 70s+ just based on cost-of-living.
Agree with this but only to a point.
We have seen a number of trends within the game that has meant this statement (whilst still technically true) has become less true to a certain degree.
'All the best stuff' comes from a variety of places, some of it is C-Store, some of it is gamble box, some of it is Rep/mission rewards, some of it is upgrade gamble.
Yes, you can get all of this either by playing (in the case of Rep/mission rewards), buying it from C-Store using Dil->Zen or either trying your luck with RNG gods or buying from other players for EC. The problem is that free-to-players have seen their grind 'buying' power decrease over time through two major changes/trends.
1. Nerf of EC/Contraband Farming.
Foundry missions that once paid out 750k a time now grant 150k. This was a large nerf. Also slavers no longer steal contraband anthing near the rate they used to. Both methods were ways of a player to accumulate wealth by playing.
2. Devaluation of Dilithium.
There has been a lack of true dilithium sink in anything near the magnitude of the fleet base system (gear upgrades was a small sink to a point - that point being when people got sick of the RNG in rarity upgrades). Simultaneously there has been an effort for dilithium to be more plentiful and to be rewarded all over the game (Delta Recruits, added to mission replays etc etc. Yes the dil->Zen exchange has been higher than it is now (when it was first launched and people were sitting on mountains of the purple stuff) but in the last 18 months there has been a 50+% swing in the exchange rate, devaluing player time/effort.
To be honest the only way to 'earn' all of the 'best' stuff these days is to basically cheat/scam it off other players playing the market like a true ferengi (buy low sell high) - which is great if you have the lobes, but isn't really the game i signed up to play...
...#LLAP...
Sorry, but...
http://i.imgur.com/3ztBOMY.gif
I knew this would happen as it did, but the keys were account bound, so I could not give them away.
Otherwise I would have done just that.
Now, I gave the loot to a low level player, he asked me what he should do with it.
I think, that basically says enough, no? XD
I'll never open a box, unless, like with the account bound keys, I have no alternative option.
Hmm, maybe I could have sold them, if they were not bound?
Yes, you are of course right here. My original post did have a section on this but I cut it as it felt like i was going off track. I guess my point about foundry EC nerf is this... If someone with no EC came to me and asked how do I earn some EC, in the past I would say farm some foundry on your toons for a few days and you will be sorted. Post-nerf the answer is pick up your credit card, buy Zen->Key->sell on auction house. The reduction in EC inflation is of course a good thing, it just seems harder to create EC out of gameplay now.
Ok, i admit here i was a little loose with words. There are two ways to play the market.
1.The way you describe is the speculative way - buying things when there is alot of it (or its not very good/not in demand), selling it later when it is more scarce (has been made better/there is higher demand). This is often a long term game and requires large amounts of initial capital. Public service? - sure, allowing older items to still be available (but obviously at a price).
2. The other way is to rely on the stupidity of other players. Not scamming or cheating per say, but relying on people that want to swap a JHSS for a pair of Delta Expedition T6s, or who post fleet ship modules on the exchange for 2m EC without checking their value, or who don't know how the filters work and buy your items that are 15% higher than the lowest price.
I am just saying - standing by the exchange all the time (and yes of course I do it, alot!) just isnt that much fun and I wouldn't describe it as 'playing the game'.
...#LLAP...
According to the following article from US News & World Report (which was probably written in 2014 because there is no date for the article):
http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/software-developer/salary
That is for the entire industry, not just game development, and it is for all states within the US.
If that's still too hard to win and you feel the need for more power, you can then upgrade the remaining 4 pieces of equipment on your rig, deflector, engine, warpcore, and shield, plus your 9 consoles which only cost 1/3 as much to upgrade. All, by the way, still well within the approximately 400,000,000 dilithium you just bought for the 20 dollars you mentioned.
Now that's assuming a tier-5 ship, not tier 5u or tier 6. You can turn your tier-5 ship into something that feels like an end-game ship on the cheap by dropping 7 bucks for an upgrade token. Now this only leaves you with 13000 zen left over from the original 20 you were willing to spend, but even that will score you 260,000 dilithium, enough to upgrade your ship gear to tier-14.
If gathering crafting mats in game is beneath you, an R&D pack can be purchased from the exchange to save you that hassle of building your character. The best value is to buy the 4 pack for approximately 10 dollars. Removing another 7 for your T5U upgrade that leaves you with only 300 zen to turn into 60,000 dilithium. Well, that'll only upgrade 3 and 1/3 of your weapons and none of your other gear. It's at this point that pacing your purchases so you have something to spend your 20 dollars on next month is a good idea. But that's okay, because with 3 mark 14 weapons up front your T5U ship should be able to eat through the PVE content with minimal effort. My strong recommendation is to obtain tier-14 weapons and ship equipment first, then obtain a Tier-6 ship, and then start getting things like purple quality lockbox doffs and traits.
This ofcourse assumes 0 in game effort to build your ship and character. If you are willing to put in effort of your own, even to obtain things that can't be purchased with real world currency, such as reputation traits or level 60, you will obtain energy credits and dilithium at the same time.
But I hear you ask, "Jermbot, I'm not talking about taking a Tactical Escort-R, turning it into T5U and equipping it with tier-14 weapons to casually do all of the game's mission content as well as the normal and advanced difficulty STF's. I'm gonna leave that noise to the Cisco cos-players."
"When I say they are monetizing, I'm talking about them making awesome tier-6 ships with new bridge officer abilities that make my Tactical Escort go limp with envy. How much real world cash will it take for me to get a top of the line ship."
Okay, 30 bucks is the going rate, so at your current spending limit, a month and a half if you assume no in-game effort on your part. Now, after you've upgraded your weaponry and ship equipment, you're welcome to start churning the dilithium you grind through play back into Zen to help offset the costs, but that can seem like a sysephean task to a casual player.
I personally like the Fa'het, but the Phantom looks to be the aesthetic successor to the Defiant that I'm imagining you using for no particular reason. Or you can wait for them to come up with a second set of iconic ships, of which I'm almost certain an actual T6 Defiant with piloting abilities will be an option, I imagine it coming with a T6 Mogai and a T6 B'rel.
Either way, my recommendation is to only buy a T6 ship if you legitimately like it/want it/would be willing to play it for months or years. Too many tears were shed when players who had purchased T6 command cruisers discovered the iconic cruisers being released months later.
"Stop being coy Jermbot, you know what this is about, the cost of buying a Vaadwaur Escort/Xindi Assault Carrier/Benthan Assault Cruiser/Jem'hadar Strike Ship, those are the 'real end game ships.'"
Ah yes, spending millions of energy credits for a slim advantage or cosmetic option. Yeah, this game hits a nasty bell curve when you decide to increase your effectiveness beyond what I'm going to refer to as the 'casual level.' I'm still living high off of the 75 million energy credits I made selling a Xindi-conn officer to someone trying to put together a Zemok build. And that was pricing him to move, I could have made quite a bit more if I were willing to put in the time.
To be honest, there are easier ways of making your character more effective than aiming straight for the most expensive toy in the box and then bemoaning how expensive it is to buy it outright. Don't want to spend 75 dollars or more selling lockbox keys to be able to purchase a T6 Xindi-Escort, spend half of that on a Pahnton, Fa'het, or whatever the Klingon intel raptor is called. Don't want to spend millions of energy credits on a CrtDx3 beam bank, find one that's CrtDx2, it'll be monumentally cheaper and still pretty kickass. Eventually you'll reach the stage where changing ships is the most cost effective way to improve your performance, and if you're still playing the game when you've hit that stretch of this game's exponentially expensive advancement scheme you'll have developed the tools and expertise necessary to earn the energy credits you need to obtain it.
well id have to sugest fire them all force them to prove what thay contribute because im seeing better games with new engines and no glitchs by teams of 10
and by way of whats pay to win is a lot more now than a year ago but mostly time this is whats up if you spend $10 and get all dilithium that's 300 hours on 12 toons saved today a year ago not even 100 hours on 12 toons
and when zen so costly its now under 40 zen per toon perday consistently you do the math on that new tier 6 ship sold grinding for zen is about gone now if it was not with delta rising and the way a zenn ship is sold it does not say we may rob it after you buy it but we will take your money
how that's not a scam is just bs you should not be able to misrepresent a sale period no ifs ands or buts its genaraly the basics of what makes a scam a scam not getting whats sold as its being sold
Aye. Ive got tons of costume packs, cstore ships, and more lockbox ships than i can count at this point that i disnt pay a dime for. Thats not to say i never buy zen, but to date over the last five years the total is less than $100
You should learn to write a little better, use punctuations and not write something that is basically a wall of text. You should also write a bit more clearly as well because most of what you have written comes off like gibberish.
If you don't like STO anymore then stop playing and play some other games since you have stated you've seen better games with new engines.
The exchange rate for refined dilithium to Zen is basically dictated by supply and demand. I am assuming the exchange rate has spiked up because of the increased in demand for Zen. If I am selling Zen that I purchased and I am seeing a lot of people who wants my Zen, then I am going to charge more for the Zen I want to sell because I can. If you are not willing to give me 230 dilithium per Zen, then based on the current demand, some other player will. When the demand for Zen falls, then so will the exchange rate.
Or get a ship through events for free. The Breen carrier is a great ship, and I'm learning to like the Kobali cruiser as I play it now. Then you need * 0 * cash monies!
OP, since you ill be rage quitting soon: can I haz ur stuffs?
thousands of monies = lots of stuffs!!!!!
As for PVP most people have given up. Because there is no way to be competitive without hundreds of dollars of extras like All Hands On Deck, Leech, XIV Epics, etc.
no I did that already then the ways to dump millions of dilithium to do nothing whent up 100 fold the next week making a subscription meaningless and the ships and stuff meaningless at endgame
and robing people and not refunding them for braking thare gear really braking the gear and forcing an agreement that basicly says thay have no responsibility at all selling anything to anyone who has paid for anything its an agreement to alow sales fraud witch it is in a basic sense
if I buy a pepsi thay cant force me to give it back because its not the flavor thay wanted and if thay did that would be robbery a crime to be locked up for doing and im not alone this stuff is sales fraud its tricky sleezy and if thay cant manage sales and responability to the customers dont do it ok its the sellers responability this user agreement needs to be voided and legal support for it just gone and any company that would fight that should be investigated crimanaly