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Scryer v. Geneva
frasier13
Member Posts: 74 Arc User
Looking for some community help here. Currently piloting the Pathfinder on my Science toon and am finding it a bit underwhelming (maybe just doing it wrong). Was wondering if anyone had any inputs/advice on either the Scryer Intel Ship or the Geneva Science Command Ship. I'm leaning towards the Geneva for the survivability (run the Tac version on my Tac toon and nearly indestructable while putting out pretty decent damage). Anyway, any advice/comments would be great
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The Geneva, while it has a Science LTC slot, it has very little to do with a science vessel. Being able to slot GW1 doesn't make it one either. It is a cruiser and you should really take that into consideration.
I own the Geneva myself, and from what i have experienced it is an excellent cruiser and the console is quite powerful. I can't tell you too much about the Scyer. I don't own it and thus don't have any experience with it. The thing i can tell you though, is that it is very different to the Geneva.
So the real question is: Do you want a Cruiser or a Science Vessel?
And i think that's your decision to make.
If you want a tac oriented science ship that's T6- Dauntless it. The BOFF layout & console layout is similar to my tac Vesta I fly still.
The Geneva Class is a tank though... the universal Lt. slot you can add another science BOFF or a tac BOFF. Personally, if you must go fly a cruiser, get the Guardian Class at least with the Lt. Cmd. tac and science seats.
The scryer has an build in buff to exotic damage and has gather intel....
Gather intel is the "fck you" button....
You are probably right. I have always been a Tac and I am not as good at Science as I'd like.
Thanks all for the inputs. Think I may try to work on my skills a bit more before I revert to trying a new ship. From what it sounds like I should be able to get more out of my Pathfinder.
The Scryer itself is otherwise what felt - to me - as not that amazing a science vessel. It felt only decent, with the intel abilities being its claim to fame in being able to combine potent science abilities with some surgical strike. But then if you're going to take that angle, you'd find more synergies for that in the Phantom too.
Which comes back to the Pathfinder, which is a comparable vessel but more optimized as a straight up science vessel. Before secondary deflectors came in for all science vessels, it was largely seen as one of the best science vessels out in the game. The only science vessels apparently posing competition were the Vesta variants, the Dauntless; the lockbox Voth science vessel and Temporal science vessel.
I think the Dauntless is a load of TRIBBLE. I don't find the lockbox ships to be all that amazing since Tier 6 became available. That leaves the Vesta is you want to go the Science DPS route; or stick to the Pathfinder if you're more inclined towards good all around science performance.
Personally, my goto choices are the T5U Fleet Reconnaissance Science Vessel (the Luna-class) or the T5U Dyson Reconnaissance Science Destroyer (which is currently bugged).
That said, my sci Vesta is still my pvp darling.
While the scryer is also a very capable and deadly pvp ship, it operate very differently from my Vesta. And I'm not comfortable changing my playstyle atm.
In terms of PvE the scryer is breath of fresh air, I really enjoy the gather Intel component. And as my first ship that cloaks, its pretty darn interesting flying this ship.
The T6 Intrepid is no joke either though, it is as good as the others I've mentioned.
I noted the scryer because its not quite your average science ship. It can use surgical strike 3 (if you so choose) and has the gather Intel component, which I'm having a ton of fun with atm.
And the scryer trait is a very nice one for science captains.
Gather Intel works well on the big pve NPCs, like Borg tactical cube. But yeah on small targets its not much use. Still I've been enjoying learning how to use it effectively.
I disabled shield visuals and used the white ship skin with blue highlights, and it actually looks much better. Wasn't a fan of that dark blue look.
The lighter color brings out the features more, its slowly starting to grow on me.
Try using the nacelles from the eclipse and fill in the saucer. It looks OK, like that.
But ya, I have the scryer and the pathfinder and while the pathfinder is great, the scryer and it's override subsystem safeties III and surgical strikes III or ionic III (if you want the super ionic/grav well III combo) is a whole other animal.
Override subsystem safeties III is a game changer for science ships, I just wish I could use aux to bat on science ships to have it off cooldown more often. So many abilities that scale off of that immense power...
While it may or may not be a case of doing it wrong, the underlying question would remain of whether doing it right would still be wrong for you. Just because you've got a Sci toon there doesn't mean you need to spam Sci stuff mindlessly.
Perhaps what the actual Sci career offers could add some flavor/seasoning/so forth to the kind of style of play that you enjoy if it's not really a case that you're all into the other stuff, eh?
Comes down to what your goals are...what you're looking to do and enjoy. If you're looking to do the Sci/Sci thing, may want to ask folks for some input on what you're doing with the Pathfinder before moving on to the Scryer...test it out a bit on the ship you've already got sort of thing, get that feel for it. If it's all just kind of meh to you, then moving to the Scryer may not change that much for you.
Goes back to what the Sci career has and what that can bring to any particular, cause not all Cruisers - Escorts - Science Vessels - etc are the same.
Abilities
Sensor Scan...
self: +StealthSight
targets: -Stealth
targets: -Damage Resistance
Can be DOFF'd to reduce the outgoing damage of targets.
Subnucleonic Beam...
target: remove all removable buffs
target: increase recharge on abilities
Can be DOFF'd to knock impulse engines offline.
Scattering Field...
PBAoE: +All Energy Damage Resistance Rating
Photonic Fleet...
Summon uncontrollable pets.
Science Fleet...
team: +Starship Shield Emitters
team: +Starship Power Insulators
team: +Shield Damage Reduction
Traits
Conservation of Energy...
+10% Bonus Exotic Damage from taking Energy Weapon damage, can 3stack.
Photonic Capacitor...
-20s on Photonic Fleet recharge when using Science abilities, max trigger 1/10s.
Fleet Physicist (Lock Box)...
Shield Heal-Over-Time to team members affected by Science Fleet.
Cause in Space, those 5 abilities and the 2+1 traits are all that separate the careers. Well, okay, the various careers can create certain rank3 training manuals; but with the manuals pretty easy to get and trade...yeah.
So again, it gets into what you're actually looking to play around with...what you're thinking...rather than what others think when they think Sci; and with that in hand, folks could offer in some feedback tailored to what you're looking to do instead of just assuming you're looking to do what they do...sort of thing.
That said, mind you - lol, I'm thinking about picking up the Geneva because I like to do that aggromagnet/tanky thing with my Sci guy. It's got a decent base for that, imho, and the LCdr Sci offers that GW1 for some crowd control action as well if needed. The hangar can offer some additional support or DPS.
It just comes down to what you're looking for...imho.
Aux to bat is not necessary, all hands on deck trait will work to reduce cool downs and combo that with reprocity and that's a deadly combo.
It's simple, really: Intel is best for boosting single target DPS. it's a lot of stealth, strike hard, escape. Command is best for AOE buffing and debuffing. If you want to go into fantasy terms, Intel is the rogue, Command is the Paladin.
Override Subsystems Safeties in Intel is GODLY. It's an amazing BO skill. Really. *Do not play Intel if you won't play this*. It boosts all your energy levels considerably, beyond the cap. I absolutely love using this when playing Science as it shoots my Aux super high and allows me to hit like a brick with Sci abilities. And the drawback of losing one of your subsystems for a few seconds afterwards is easily cleansed with Engineering Team. Personally, I like using this best with a drain build. Siphon Energy + OSS2/3 = All your energy levels capped or nearly so. For a long time. Even Sci ships can dish out the pain this way. Mix in Tyken's Rift 2 and your target is going to spend a good chunk of time as a lifeless floating hunk of metal.
Surgical Strikes in Intel is also quite strong, but has one very significant drawback: You can't AOE with it as it cools down BFAW and the Scatter Volley. You also cannot mix it with Rapid Fire or Beam Overload. It also affects only you. So in the end, it's a DPS *replacement* for those abilities, not an addition. This makes it feel kinda 'meh' for me, although on the Scryer, with it's limited tac slots, it's pretty good. What SS is actually pretty decent for is ships that mix beams and cannons. Although not sure why anyone would really do that given the choice.
Suppression Barrage in Command ... LOOOOOOOVE this ability! Love! Want to have it's children! It's as important to Command as OSS is to Intel. You can mix this with BFAW to utterly cripple every enemy ship in a 10km radius! From my understanding, speed applies to defense (heard it mentioned several times in forums, although I can't find official reference in the wiki), so if you're dealing with a pack of small craft or escorts, this effectively kills them. Less defense = more accuracy for you. On top of that, it debuffs the target's damage and accuracy. It really is a great great all rounder. I can't imagine flying my Geneva without it and have it permanently equipped in my commander slot. I'm not a PVPer, but this one ability makes me want to try.
...
Now in terms of their gimmick, Inspiration vs Gather Intel, I can absolutely tell you that Inspiration CRUSHES Gather Intel. CRUSHES. Hulk Smash. Gather Intel is ONLY good for when you're dealing with some huge boss ship that takes over a minute to destroy. It takes forever for Gather Intel to make something vulnerable and in nearly all cases, targets die too quickly for it to make a difference. Best to do is use Gather Intel on your primary target, and then have you team mop up the trash first before switching to said target.
Inspiration, on the other hand, is an ability that focuses on yourself. And it only goes away once you use it. So you can build up Inspiration over smaller fights, and then blow it when you get to a big one to let your whole team unleash hell for 15 seconds. It's a beautiful thing. More importantly, it's a guaranteed thing. I never use Gather Intel, but Inspiration is my baby for those big fights.
...
Now onto your original question ... it depends on what you want to do, really. Scryer is a pure science vessel that can cloak. Mind you, if you already have the Pathfinder, I feel the Scryer is kinda redundant. Personally, I prefer the Pathfinder, but the Scryer is still a very good ship. And while it's not Battle Cloak, having any sort of Cloak is nice for those times where you're in a combat zone and need to vanish quickly out of combat. You know, for when Real Life(tm) hits you
The Geneva (and the rest of that line) on the other hand is a cruiser. Play it like a cruiser. A really awesome cruiser with really awesome abilities. I picked it up on Friday and I just can't stop playing it. It's a lot of fun! But even with the LTCmdr science slot, it's quite limited for Science when compared with the Pathfinder or Scryer. But overall, until the fleet versions of the other T6 ships comes out, it is the single best line of cruisers in the game if you ask me. Although the Guardian is also very potent and definitely a consideration if you like cruisers because of OSS2 and it's ability to slot ltcmdr of both Tac and Sci.
My vote for you:
- If you don't yet have a good cruiser, go with the Geneva. It's so very very good. Especially if you like teaming up with friends.
- If you do already have a cruiser, then it depends on what you'd like to do. Geneva = cruiser playstyle + team buffing and aoe debuffing. Scryer = Deep science ship that's best for single target nastiness (Pathfinder can do AOE just fine). It also has a really good Mastery trait so you may want to pick it up just for that.
I actually like the look with the small Phantom Nacelles on her, a filled saucer, and a lighter hull material. To me looks kind of like an updated Oberth. I run Romulan Plasma so can mitigate the lack of tactical consoles with embassy +plasma consoles, and console + Experimental beam.
I still need a lot of tweaking on mine, I don't play my fed enough, spend most of my time KDF side, but this thread gave me some interesting ideas.
Yep virusdancer knows his stuff. Couldn't have found a better teacher.
Pretty sure he knows the game inside and out based on what I've read from his posts.