Yeah, I hate this ship, LOL... doesn't help that it gains "canon-access" level because it appeared in Enterprise, an abomination to canon itself.
ENT was better than VOY and we got a whole expansion of VOY. If it were up to me we'd replace VOY in the Star Trek canon with the Star Wars Holiday Special.
I think we should get a ENT expansion. We know that the Xindi are, by 2410, members of the Federation. And in the show, the Sphere Builders weren't destroyed, only forced to retreat. I think if they started to re-emerge and try another Delphic Expanse elsewhere, say in the Delta Quadrant, it would be an interesting episode.
I wonder how Cryptic would involve the Iconians?
As to a Universe-class ship in-game, I submit this size comparison. Bear in mind that a Galaxy-class ship is 641 meters long.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
i think they should SHOT designer of ent-j - and proposed movie ent-f + designer of in game ent-f.
all 3 are so big ugly so i can vomit every time i see them.
Given that Drexler designed Ent-J, I would say your opinion lost all weight. Besides, the design was meant to be a one shot in an alternate timeline.
In the Ships of the Line book, the Altair, a small prototype based on the Ent-J was shown to be in service in the early 2370s. Drexler, also, designed an Altair with a saucer called the Congo Class, shown on the Ships of the Line Cover. Personally, I never really cared for the design-lineage, but I get that the Enterprise-J was supposed to be so advanced its magic, which is akin to the what the original Enterprise was supposed to convey to the 1960s audience.
The thing looks like it skipped leg day at the gym for quite some time, it just looks ugly. Its hard to believe that it ever got on Trek at all when previous ship designs are so much better. (Galaxy, Sovereign for example)
I don't see it as impractical, I see it as the product of an immensely advanced post-scarcity society where spending a lifetime aboard a ship is probably not at all unusual. Perhaps more akin to The Culture than to the Federation we're familiar with. It's probably essentially a city used for very long-term exploration, with most of its occupants performing societal functions rather than crew functions. An extreme evolution of ideas begun in the Galaxy class.
Meh, I could buy that, but if you go for the "Explorer City in Space" idea... then why was the only canonical appearance of this ship in a battle? A "decisive" one, at that?
That's my issue with it (aside the fact that I loathe Enterprise, LOL)... it's impractical on the battlefield. A ship bigger than ESD is easier to hit, and is far less maneuverable. That's what makes it impractical, the same reason why Dyson spheres are impractical. Bigger does not always mean better. Further, if the 1701-J has some fancy new drive system (I believe the designer said that), then that negates the need for it to be so huge.
The ENT J is so much better looking than the old galaxy or even the Oddy. I'd love to see it but the die hard fans wouldn't buy into it. Then again beauty is on the eye of the beholder...some other trash its real beauty
The ENT J makes the Oddy or the galaxy look like 3rd world ugly
Second year into STO - they wanted to add the ENT-J to the game. CBS said flat out "No." (Reason: it was a 26th century ship.) What came put of all that was the 'Design the Next Enterprise' contest open to fans (the running and Judging of which turned into a unmitigated PR disaster as some people thought that fans would get a say in deciding the winner - and that vocal minority crucified the design AND the designer who won the contest (probably one of the worst STO community displays I have seen too - it was embarrassing.)
Funny thing is: Soon after all that, Cryptic got bought out by PWE, the F2P conversion for STO was announced and CBS agreed that Cryptic could put 'special' ships (including ships from Star Trek's 'future' period - like the 29th century 'Welles' class); and they've been doing that since STO F2P launched.
That said, because CBS did publically say 'no' to the 1701-J; it's unlikely we'd ever get it in this game as I doubt CBS would want to publically be seen reversing itself as that would probably lead to TOS fans (myself included) starting a "We REALLY want a T5 (or T6) Constitution class ship in game!":D:P:eek:;)
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Meh, I could buy that, but if you go for the "Explorer City in Space" idea... then why was the only canonical appearance of this ship in a battle? A "decisive" one, at that?
That's my issue with it (aside the fact that I loathe Enterprise, LOL)... it's impractical on the battlefield. A ship bigger than ESD is easier to hit, and is far less maneuverable. That's what makes it impractical, the same reason why Dyson spheres are impractical. Bigger does not always mean better. Further, if the 1701-J has some fancy new drive system (I believe the designer said that), then that negates the need for it to be so huge.
Well...to reference The Culture again, as a society that didn't engage in war frequently or lightly, they didn't have dedicated warships (an ideal shared by the Federation prior to the Borg threat). But their largest ships, the General Systems Vehicles, were extremely large, extremely advanced, and extremely powerful, and could more than hold their own against the Idiran warships.
I've always assumed we were seeing something similar with Enterprise-J just as Enterprise-D was not a warship, and had many civilians on board, yet put itself (including saucer section) in harm's way when necessary, I expect a Universe-class starship would probably be one of the most powerful ships of its time, even if not built primarily for a combat role. As such, it would naturally be present for a decisive battle if possible.
I always looked at this ship in terms of something like the SDF-1 which literally has an entire city inside of it.
As we continue to "expand" it seems inevitable that we will start to use something akin to the Voth "City Ships."
You could start seeing ships that you could drive in, equipped with things like shopping centers, parks and large arboretums, actual resteraunts, large holodecks, etc.)
VADM William "Darkshadow" Shadow | Join Date: Apr 2009 | USS Immortal NX-93608-F (Oddyssey Tactical Cruiser) VADM RogueshadowIRW Kirino Kosaka (Valdore Retrofit) LT General MorboIKS Karac (Bortasqu War Cruiser) LT General PosuIKS Saya Takagi (Chel Grett Warship)
Given that Drexler designed Ent-J, I would say your opinion lost all weight. Besides, the design was meant to be a one shot in an alternate timeline.
In the Ships of the Line book, the Altair, a small prototype based on the Ent-J was shown to be in service in the early 2370s. Drexler, also, designed an Altair with a saucer called the Congo Class, shown on the Ships of the Line Cover. Personally, I never really cared for the design-lineage, but I get that the Enterprise-J was supposed to be so advanced its magic, which is akin to the what the original Enterprise was supposed to convey to the 1960s audience.
so what ? because designer was drexler it make it beatiful ? all it mean to me is that even good designer can have weak, well not moment, but creation.
ent-j to my eays is exactly what was famous fiat (cant recall type - that one which did have lighs directly under windshiled), which was subject to many jokes, with most famous one " are you alone ? dont worxy even some ppl liked this car".
ent j is simply to me ugly and it will never change, i cant even get used to that design.
orig ent, ent a + e, are simply beatuies, while ent b having some charm, for ent d it get some time to adjust and ent c is well tolerable, for some heresy like ent-j i can never get used.
and i REALY dont get that design line, if it was meaned to be flying starbase, why the hell it was at frontline figting sphere creators ?
Does the OP know the alphabet? The Enterprise J is a full 4 letters after the Enterprise F. That means we'd need to see all of those other Enterprises before we get to see the J. Plus the ship is active in the 26th century. That's 100 in game years after where we're at in STO. Plus it's fugly as hell. Plus a dev said it'll never happen. Need any more?
When you see "TRIBBLE" in my posts, it's because I manually typed "TRIBBLE" and censored myself.
Well...to reference The Culture again, as a society that didn't engage in war frequently or lightly, they didn't have dedicated warships (an ideal shared by the Federation prior to the Borg threat). But their largest ships, the General Systems Vehicles, were extremely large, extremely advanced, and extremely powerful, and could more than hold their own against the Idiran warships.
I've always assumed we were seeing something similar with Enterprise-J just as Enterprise-D was not a warship, and had many civilians on board, yet put itself (including saucer section) in harm's way when necessary, I expect a Universe-class starship would probably be one of the most powerful ships of its time, even if not built primarily for a combat role. As such, it would naturally be present for a decisive battle if possible.
well, you reasoning sound good, but after certain treehold, any bigger size simply meant bigger target and less survival chance.
nice example is with tiger 1, tiger 2 and mouse line of german tanks.
t1 was very good for his role, t2 was bigger, heavier and more armed, but much less mobile so it did have less use on battkefield. And mouse ? well, it was so big and heavy so it nearly cant move at all. (14 km/h max is not "speed", and thats on paved road).
somtimes biiger simply isnt better.
I kinda figured which one that was without the link, but took it anyways to be sure. I was right; I got one word for that ship - fugly. If it comes, I'll be happy for ya, but I don't want one, TYVM.
The Enterprise J was vetoed by CBS several years ago when DStahl originally asked to include it. As a compromise CBS agreed to a futuristic Enterprise for the game via a design competition. That is how we ended up with the Odyssey Class Enterprise F.
Wait.. What ?!
I have one in my old game that I don't play anymore.
Star Trek Legacy
The game did not have the best graphics but it sure had the Ent J
well, you reasoning sound good, but after certain treehold, any bigger size simply meant bigger target and less survival chance.
nice example is with tiger 1, tiger 2 and mouse line of german tanks.
t1 was very good for his role, t2 was bigger, heavier and more armed, but much less mobile so it did have less use on battkefield. And mouse ? well, it was so big and heavy so it nearly cant move at all. (14 km/h max is not "speed", and thats on paved road).
somtimes biiger simply isnt better.
I don't think that idea necessarily holds true in a world with deflector shields. There are economies of scale with a shielded shape available volume for power generation and shield emission increases much faster than the surface area of the shield. You may be able to hit that ship all day and halfway through the night without making much of an impression.
I don't think that idea necessarily holds true in a world with deflector shields. There are economies of scale with a shielded shape available volume for power generation and shield emission increases much faster than the surface area of the shield. You may be able to hit that ship all day and halfway through the night without making much of an impression.
well, it dont work for shields, but its still wokd FOR MASS fromw hich is ship build, simply bigger ship allway means less manuvable one, even you can work with gravity, unles it is maked that way that mass doesnt matter .
and if you devote so much space for shield generation to creat e impenetrable , you dont get much space for other things right ? so basicaly same thing as overarmored mouse.
so what ? because designer was drexler it make it beatiful ? all it mean to me is that even good designer can have weak, well not moment, but creation.
ent-j to my eays is exactly what was famous fiat (cant recall type - that one which did have lighs directly under windshiled), which was subject to many jokes, with most famous one " are you alone ? dont worxy even some ppl liked this car".
ent j is simply to me ugly and it will never change, i cant even get used to that design.
orig ent, ent a + e, are simply beatuies, while ent b having some charm, for ent d it get some time to adjust and ent c is well tolerable, for some heresy like ent-j i can never get used.
and i REALY dont get that design line, if it was meaned to be flying starbase, why the hell it was at frontline figting sphere creators ?
Is it me, or is this paragraph near illegible? I guess if your argument is not very good, might as well right.
I think it looks like TRIBBLE and it's the fugliest thing ever seen in sci-fi since the beginning of television.
But as others have mentioned already, the devs have already said no to this since it would be way to huge for them to put in the game and make it playable and workable in context of being a player ship.
I would have to say I complete agree with you, it is by far the second ugliest ship in Star Trek. It is only beat out by the Galaxy Class and it's clones. Thankfully the devs have stated no but you know how money talks.
FFS why does the subject keep popping up? O my God it's like a bad rash that won't go away, you know forum search is your best best friend.... The only thing missing now is for someone to ask when we get a tier 6 Constitution class or tier 6 the nx class
FFS why does the subject keep popping up? O my God it's like a bad rash that won't go away, you know forum search is your best best friend.... The only thing missing now is for someone to ask when we get a tier 6 Constitution class or tier 6 the nx class
Why not have a massive ship like the Enterprise J in game? I would be satisfied if we at least saw it in an episode.
Why not have a massive ship like the Enterprise J in game? I would be satisfied if we at least saw it in an episode.
I can see that working as we have had alternate timeline missions so this would just be one of those. They have shown they can do very good story missions and so I am sure they could come up with one for this.
Comments
ENT was better than VOY and we got a whole expansion of VOY. If it were up to me we'd replace VOY in the Star Trek canon with the Star Wars Holiday Special.
It's actually Big Ugly Fat Fellow, not Big Ugly Flying F**k.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
I wonder how Cryptic would involve the Iconians?
As to a Universe-class ship in-game, I submit this size comparison. Bear in mind that a Galaxy-class ship is 641 meters long.
Your father was captain of a starship for twelve minutes. He saved 800 lives, including your mother's, and yours.
I dare you to do better.
Given that Drexler designed Ent-J, I would say your opinion lost all weight. Besides, the design was meant to be a one shot in an alternate timeline.
In the Ships of the Line book, the Altair, a small prototype based on the Ent-J was shown to be in service in the early 2370s. Drexler, also, designed an Altair with a saucer called the Congo Class, shown on the Ships of the Line Cover. Personally, I never really cared for the design-lineage, but I get that the Enterprise-J was supposed to be so advanced its magic, which is akin to the what the original Enterprise was supposed to convey to the 1960s audience.
3/4 right.
BUFF stands for 'Big Ugly Fat ****er'.
That's just my humble opinion though.
^ This. The term was coined by the military personnel that worked with it. The "fellow" version was a PC edited version suitable for print.
Meh, I could buy that, but if you go for the "Explorer City in Space" idea... then why was the only canonical appearance of this ship in a battle? A "decisive" one, at that?
That's my issue with it (aside the fact that I loathe Enterprise, LOL)... it's impractical on the battlefield. A ship bigger than ESD is easier to hit, and is far less maneuverable. That's what makes it impractical, the same reason why Dyson spheres are impractical. Bigger does not always mean better. Further, if the 1701-J has some fancy new drive system (I believe the designer said that), then that negates the need for it to be so huge.
The ENT J makes the Oddy or the galaxy look like 3rd world ugly
Second year into STO - they wanted to add the ENT-J to the game. CBS said flat out "No." (Reason: it was a 26th century ship.) What came put of all that was the 'Design the Next Enterprise' contest open to fans (the running and Judging of which turned into a unmitigated PR disaster as some people thought that fans would get a say in deciding the winner - and that vocal minority crucified the design AND the designer who won the contest (probably one of the worst STO community displays I have seen too - it was embarrassing.)
Funny thing is: Soon after all that, Cryptic got bought out by PWE, the F2P conversion for STO was announced and CBS agreed that Cryptic could put 'special' ships (including ships from Star Trek's 'future' period - like the 29th century 'Welles' class); and they've been doing that since STO F2P launched.
That said, because CBS did publically say 'no' to the 1701-J; it's unlikely we'd ever get it in this game as I doubt CBS would want to publically be seen reversing itself as that would probably lead to TOS fans (myself included) starting a "We REALLY want a T5 (or T6) Constitution class ship in game!":D:P:eek:;)
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Well...to reference The Culture again, as a society that didn't engage in war frequently or lightly, they didn't have dedicated warships (an ideal shared by the Federation prior to the Borg threat). But their largest ships, the General Systems Vehicles, were extremely large, extremely advanced, and extremely powerful, and could more than hold their own against the Idiran warships.
I've always assumed we were seeing something similar with Enterprise-J just as Enterprise-D was not a warship, and had many civilians on board, yet put itself (including saucer section) in harm's way when necessary, I expect a Universe-class starship would probably be one of the most powerful ships of its time, even if not built primarily for a combat role. As such, it would naturally be present for a decisive battle if possible.
As we continue to "expand" it seems inevitable that we will start to use something akin to the Voth "City Ships."
You could start seeing ships that you could drive in, equipped with things like shopping centers, parks and large arboretums, actual resteraunts, large holodecks, etc.)
USS Immortal NX-93608-F (Oddyssey Tactical Cruiser)
VADM Rogueshadow IRW Kirino Kosaka (Valdore Retrofit)
LT General Morbo IKS Karac (Bortasqu War Cruiser)
LT General Posu IKS Saya Takagi (Chel Grett Warship)
so what ? because designer was drexler it make it beatiful ? all it mean to me is that even good designer can have weak, well not moment, but creation.
ent-j to my eays is exactly what was famous fiat (cant recall type - that one which did have lighs directly under windshiled), which was subject to many jokes, with most famous one " are you alone ? dont worxy even some ppl liked this car".
ent j is simply to me ugly and it will never change, i cant even get used to that design.
orig ent, ent a + e, are simply beatuies, while ent b having some charm, for ent d it get some time to adjust and ent c is well tolerable, for some heresy like ent-j i can never get used.
and i REALY dont get that design line, if it was meaned to be flying starbase, why the hell it was at frontline figting sphere creators ?
well, you reasoning sound good, but after certain treehold, any bigger size simply meant bigger target and less survival chance.
nice example is with tiger 1, tiger 2 and mouse line of german tanks.
t1 was very good for his role, t2 was bigger, heavier and more armed, but much less mobile so it did have less use on battkefield. And mouse ? well, it was so big and heavy so it nearly cant move at all. (14 km/h max is not "speed", and thats on paved road).
somtimes biiger simply isnt better.
http://www.personalitypage.com/ENTJ.html
I kinda figured which one that was without the link, but took it anyways to be sure. I was right; I got one word for that ship - fugly. If it comes, I'll be happy for ya, but I don't want one, TYVM.
Wait.. What ?!
I have one in my old game that I don't play anymore.
Star Trek Legacy
The game did not have the best graphics but it sure had the Ent J
Heck here is a video with someone else actually flying it: http://youtu.be/JXfbMYAO58g
Greywolf Taskforce - Officer of the Fleet
I don't think that idea necessarily holds true in a world with deflector shields. There are economies of scale with a shielded shape available volume for power generation and shield emission increases much faster than the surface area of the shield. You may be able to hit that ship all day and halfway through the night without making much of an impression.
well, it dont work for shields, but its still wokd FOR MASS fromw hich is ship build, simply bigger ship allway means less manuvable one, even you can work with gravity, unles it is maked that way that mass doesnt matter .
and if you devote so much space for shield generation to creat e impenetrable , you dont get much space for other things right ? so basicaly same thing as overarmored mouse.
That is a mod, its not official.
The stock game never had the Ent J.
Is it me, or is this paragraph near illegible? I guess if your argument is not very good, might as well right.
I would have to say I complete agree with you, it is by far the second ugliest ship in Star Trek. It is only beat out by the Galaxy Class and it's clones. Thankfully the devs have stated no but you know how money talks.
Cirran
Why not have a massive ship like the Enterprise J in game? I would be satisfied if we at least saw it in an episode.
I can see that working as we have had alternate timeline missions so this would just be one of those. They have shown they can do very good story missions and so I am sure they could come up with one for this.