1. 75%, or whatever, could be 50%? Just throwing a number out there. It's definitely not a "if done exactly this way" thing. I'm sure it could be tweaked until it made more sense.
Doesn't account for missions with multiple goals or goal locations such as Cure, Khitomer, and Borg Disconnected. Lower HP would make it a bit easier, but having to go back and forth generally isn't how those STFs work anyway, at least for good teams, and that's the whole point of this exercise isn't it?
2. If one can and does do the content already, It's what- a 5 minute mission to unlock the queues? Admittedly, I only have 5 alts, so it wouldn't be that big a deal to me.
Except some missions are, as I stated above, extremely difficult to impossible to complete with one person.
6. The "But science/engineering characters can't do this" is flat out wrong. I have (undergeared) sci alts that can do it. There are Science captains at 75k DPS!
I didn't say specific careers couldn't do it, I said specific play styles can't. A player who is geared for support and healing isn't going to have much damage output and his efforts are largely wasted on AI partners. Or do you expect them to change their build specifically so they can clear this mission, which ends up being a waste because that's not how they're going to play the real thing anyway.
The universe has a wonderful sense of humor. The trick is learning how to take a joke.
6. The "But science/engineering characters can't do this" is flat out wrong. I have (undergeared) sci alts that can do it. There are Science captains at 75k DPS!
...
More the exception than the rule. Problem with your proposition is specific requirement, player in this type of mission must have heavy firepower (make large DPS numbers) in order to successfully pass. Sci and Engi builds shouldn't be DPS centric, they are support centric. If sci Captain plays as he should - crowd control in crucial part of mission, he can't be sure that NPCs will blow the gate and if he plays as DPS sci then he won't learn how to hold nanite spheres - most important contribution to Infected Space regardless of class.
Much better approach is mandatory number of successful completion of Infected Normal with PUG group as requirement for Infected Advanced but that would be problem for other missions where ques are not populated enough.
PS. I apologize for any mistakes in my English.
Max. One-Hit: 114,966 (Quantum Torpedo - Salvo II (Federation Typhoon Class Battleship))
You seem a bit too disdainful to be actually helping anyone.
That's because he doesn't want to help anyone. He just wants to keep "n00bs" out of his STFs, so that he can acquire the rewards that he deserves, without anyone spoiling things for him.
That's because he doesn't want to help anyone. He just wants to keep "n00bs" out of his STFs, so that he can acquire the rewards that he deserves, without anyone spoiling things for him.
That's because he doesn't want to help anyone. He just wants to keep "n00bs" out of his STFs, so that he can acquire the rewards that he deserves, without anyone spoiling things for him.
You do know that I run 99% of my queues from the DPS channels, right? Leechers and trolls in PUGs have little effect on me personally. :rolleyes:
Massively obvious assumption failure on your part.
Or, lack of reading comprehension, since I've stated it in this thread, even.
Doesn't account for missions with multiple goals or goal locations such as Cure, Khitomer, and Borg Disconnected. Lower HP would make it a bit easier, but having to go back and forth generally isn't how those STFs work anyway, at least for good teams, and that's the whole point of this exercise isn't it?
Separate NPC spawns? Half instances? Truncated versions, maybe?
I didn't say specific careers couldn't do it, I said specific play styles can't. A player who is geared for support and healing isn't going to have much damage output and his efforts are largely wasted on AI partners. Or do you expect them to change their build specifically so they can clear this mission, which ends up being a waste because that's not how they're going to play the real thing anyway.
The specific play that may or may not help a team in the actual STFs themselves? Wouldn't it demonstrate how useful (or not) one's choices would be in a STF environment? Kind of the point.
I can at least ask in French if they speak English, and can sorta recognize French, but not understand everything. But most of the time I see English. Probably because I'm on Pacific time.
Isn't the universal phrase for that.. "Speak English itches"
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
In game off course one uses caps, but on the forum it's not necessary.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
I'll save the preface, since it's been discussed/argued over/trolled enough since DR.
Gating the Advanced and/or Elite queues could be (theoretically) implemented as follows:
A single player (skippable) mission, at the end of a story arc, in each player's journal. Let's, for example, take Infected Space Advanced.
At the end of the Borg story arc, there appears a few missions- one being "Infected Space Simulator." This mission is single player only. You can not get help from someone else to complete this mission. Period. This mission is repeatable.
The mission begins the same as any Infected Space Advanced begins. Only, instead of other players, you are teamed with 4 NPCs. Two escort types, and either one cruiser/battlecruiser and one science vessel, or two cruisers/battlecruisers.
It is, effectively, Infected Space Advanced, albeit one with 75%(?) hitpoints for critters. There is a timer for this mission.
If objectives are not met, a popup stating "You are not yet ready for this engagement" is displayed.
If successful, a score will appear, and you will receive an accolade. This accolade will unlock the Advanced version of Infected Space for this character. The accolade will take into consideration 1. time, 2. # of deaths, and 3. DPS. If one completes this by buffing the NPCs, it helps with time (and the overall DPS). If one does high DPS, it helps with time. If one dies repeatedly, it detracts from time. One can heal the NPCs, as they can be destroyed.
I think this would work with any and all queues. It can't be "gamed," unless someone plays your account for you. And, if there is an "Elite" version of the STF, an additional accolade can be acquired based on score, as well. One could gain all accolades from a single mission based upon score, thus unlocking Advanced and Elite, if applicable.
If one does not acquire these accolades, one can not join Advanced or Elite queues. These missions can be completed once for all requirements, thus not being a massive hassle to acquire, for those who already know how to do this content.
No one complains about not being able to learn the STFs, no one complains about people not knowing what they're doing (in a general sense), and no one has to do these if they choose not to do so. They aren't 100% of the strength of the actual STFs, so there would be some learning- but they would be harder than Normal, and closer to what the actual Advanced or Elite STFs would be like.
TL;DR a repeatable, skippable mission to see if one can unlock Advanced difficulty in queues.
^^ Cute idea.
Only thing is, Advanced/Elites generally fail from a lack of coordination more than a shortage of DPS. Good luck getting your thing coordinated with the NPC's.
Only thing is, Advanced/Elites generally fail from a lack of coordination more than a shortage of DPS. Good luck getting your thing coordinated with the NPC's.
Lack of basic instance knowledge and coordination...so wouldn't a mission that teaches about the instance help with the basic instance knowledge, eh? And with that coordination, NPCs potentially TRIBBLE things up - wouldn't that be a method for players to learn about trying to cover/resolve that potential coordination and how to react?
Lol, I'm picturing a flight attendant pointing to emergency exits now for some reason. :eek:
Back to the overall concept though, I still think Cryptic needs to address it from the bottom up.
Mission Rewards, Normal Rewards, Advanced Rewards, Elite Rewards...if they start from the bottom and thus provide access there, when they go to gate Advanced/Elite, they won't be completely cutting folks off.
The problem is not the players, it's the game it's self. The game is designed to be able to do this content with ANY end game ship. So let's say we did gate it like you ask, I take a ship that can do the content and be done with it fairly easy. Then I switch back to my Galaxy, which then makes it harder for myself and the next group I do it with because it's not capable of doing the dps you would like to see out of each group member. Then is the problem I am a noob or that the ships do not match up with each other?
Large amount of problems get blamed on the players and some players may deserve it but most do not. The game has really poor balance. Careers are balanced poorly, the ships are balanced poorly plus the game is more pay to win now then it was in LoR. Nearly every other mmo goes about trying to balance things against each other. STO almost seems to go out of it's way not to do so.
In the end if you do not want to team with people that you think will not provide the best experience then it maybe best to avoid content with random people.
Join a Fleet composed of personnel who have the exact same overwhelming opinion of themselves. Because they have trained their whole lives to become expert at playing a dozen or so missions in a not very good video game based upon a very popular science fiction franchise.
Imagine the joy and happiness you will bring to yourself when you are no longer surrounded by mere mortals who let pesky things like a girlfriend or a mortgage payment distract them from their true calling in life.
Stopped PUGging after DR for two reasons.
1) Rewards no longer worth the time and effort.
2) No longer wanted to associate with people like you, OP. I was gravely concerned I might get some of that on myself and not be able to wash it off.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
The problem is not the players, it's the game it's self. The game is designed to be able to do this content with ANY end game ship. So let's say we did gate it like you ask, I take a ship that can do the content and be done with it fairly easy. Then I switch back to my Galaxy, which then makes it harder for myself and the next group I do it with because it's not capable of doing the dps you would like to see out of each group member. Then is the problem I am a noob or that the ships do not match up with each other?
Large amount of problems get blamed on the players and some players may deserve it but most do not. The game has really poor balance. Careers are balanced poorly, the ships are balanced poorly plus the game is more pay to win now then it was in LoR. Nearly every other mmo goes about trying to balance things against each other. STO almost seems to go out of it's way not to do so.
In the end if you do not want to team with people that you think will not provide the best experience then it maybe best to avoid content with random people.
I'm sorry, but all I see there are excuses.
1) It's the ship, not the player! Yet others are fine in the ship...so obviously it is the player.
2) It's the career, not the player! Yet others are fine with those careers...so obviously it is the player.
3) Don't queue with random folks then! So leave the public queues in an unhealthy state that reflects poorly on the game because players like to make excuses?
Just because there are Tacs out there with teams backing them up pushing out over 100k in certain ships...doesn't mean diddly squat until there is content that's requiring over 100k. It's just an excuse...and players are quick to make excuses and blame others rather than accept any personal responsibility for what they're bringing to a team that's hoping to at least having a chance at a successful run.
If a person has one ship that they can rock and roll with and another ship they know their build/how they fly it is not up to par, and yet they take that into the queue...they're just trolling the queue and their fellow players. The person knows that the build is not enough to snuff for the content...that's a player issue. They can hit up the forums, reddit, their fleet if they're in one, etc, etc, etc for advice on how they could get it up to par...cause there are folks flying all sorts of things.
And yeah, the public queues looking as dead as they are because folks have gone private (which the public queue numbers do not reflect those players that have gone private) just leaves the game looking dead...cause even folks that don't care about quick 'n easy runs, but just want a shot at success rather than a guaranteed failure have been driven away from the public queues.
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Normal from single-player missions, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, yeah?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Advanced from Normal queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, eh?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Elite from Advanced queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, right?
And then it could get into some form of gating for Normal, Advanced, and Elite (yeah, I even said gating for Normal)...where the rewards for Normal, Advanced, and Elite could be improved based on the expected effort/time the players would have to put in.
But why bother, eh? Just let the players continue to make excuses and blame everything else...doesn't matter if new players come along see dead queues and just leave - doesn't matter if older players just get tired of seeing dead queues and just leave...it's not like people leaving means less revenue which means less development...and could potentially even lead to the game shutting down. Let's just keep on making excuses...
More the exception than the rule. Problem with your proposition is specific requirement, player in this type of mission must have heavy firepower (make large DPS numbers) in order to successfully pass. Sci and Engi builds shouldn't be DPS centric, they are support centric. If sci Captain plays as he should - crowd control in crucial part of mission, he can't be sure that NPCs will blow the gate and if he plays as DPS sci then he won't learn how to hold nanite spheres - most important contribution to Infected Space regardless of class.
Much better approach is mandatory number of successful completion of Infected Normal with PUG group as requirement for Infected Advanced but that would be problem for other missions where ques are not populated enough.
PS. I apologize for any mistakes in my English.
I assume with Engi builds you are talking about tanks. Tanks need to deal damage in order to get and hold aggro. A tank that does not deal enough damage is not tanking. And pretty much all Engi ships at tier 5 have 8 weapon slots, they are there for a good reason.
And while Sci ships only have 6 weapon slots and will deal less damage with their weapons than tacs and engis, you have mentioned crowd control abilites. The last time i checked, tractror beam repulsors (especially with the reverse doff) and grav well can deal huge amounts of damage as well.
Both classes are very capabale to deal way more damage than you ever will need for any content in the game. And this is certainly not just a question of having good gear. Understanding captain/boff abilities and using them properly, improving your piloting skills and managing your ship power system will improve a player a lot more than better gear ever can.
And exactly teaching this knowledge is where Cryptic fails atm. The game simply needs better and deeper tutorials and better introductions for every queue missions.
don't pug, simplest solution
tell cryptic to quit locking required items in elite/advanced. more complicated.
most wouldn't even bother with either if required mats and various specialty rep items weren't in those. creating a gate means players who need those items to get rep gear or craft gear can't get them bordering on a catch 22.
think before you post bad ideas...already have cryptic not thinking when they implement mechanics don't need players learning from their bad habits or emulating them.
Dr. Patricia Tanis ~ "Bacon is for sycophants and products of incest."
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
1) It's the ship, not the player! Yet others are fine in the ship...so obviously it is the player.
2) It's the career, not the player! Yet others are fine with those careers...so obviously it is the player.
3) Don't queue with random folks then! So leave the public queues in an unhealthy state that reflects poorly on the game because players like to make excuses?
Just because there are Tacs out there with teams backing them up pushing out over 100k in certain ships...doesn't mean diddly squat until there is content that's requiring over 100k. It's just an excuse...and players are quick to make excuses and blame others rather than accept any personal responsibility for what they're bringing to a team that's hoping to at least having a chance at a successful run.
If a person has one ship that they can rock and roll with and another ship they know their build/how they fly it is not up to par, and yet they take that into the queue...they're just trolling the queue and their fellow players. The person knows that the build is not enough to snuff for the content...that's a player issue. They can hit up the forums, reddit, their fleet if they're in one, etc, etc, etc for advice on how they could get it up to par...cause there are folks flying all sorts of things.
And yeah, the public queues looking as dead as they are because folks have gone private (which the public queue numbers do not reflect those players that have gone private) just leaves the game looking dead...cause even folks that don't care about quick 'n easy runs, but just want a shot at success rather than a guaranteed failure have been driven away from the public queues.
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Normal from single-player missions, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, yeah?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Advanced from Normal queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, eh?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Elite from Advanced queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, right?
And then it could get into some form of gating for Normal, Advanced, and Elite (yeah, I even said gating for Normal)...where the rewards for Normal, Advanced, and Elite could be improved based on the expected effort/time the players would have to put in.
But why bother, eh? Just let the players continue to make excuses and blame everything else...doesn't matter if new players come along see dead queues and just leave - doesn't matter if older players just get tired of seeing dead queues and just leave...it's not like people leaving means less revenue which means less development...and could potentially even lead to the game shutting down. Let's just keep on making excuses...
You can not be serious if you think there's not a problem with balance. If you really think all the ships perform as well as each other.
The problems I have seen is not failing but people becoming upset over not getting something done as fast as they wished to do so.
Other games I play people discuss and talk with each other before they start the instance or a major fight. They explain and help each other. In STO that doesn't happen often and when someone talks more often then not it's to link a dps meter and mock the other players in the group.
As for trolling the q by playing with the ship you wish to play with, that's the way the game is designed. It's designed to be able to use any end game ship and they do not perform nearly as well as each other. You can try to help and do the instance the way it's suppose to be done as a eng in a galaxy but your going to end up with people then mocking you for your dps, it happens all the time.
You can not be serious if you think there's not a problem with balance. If you really think all the ships perform as well as each other.
You can not be serious if you think I said that. Was that said anywhere? No? Was the imbalance even pointed out? Tac in certain ships? Yes? But people meeting minimal requirements for content is not about the insane lack of balance that exists with what is potentially available because of career and ship choice. When it becomes a case that the minimal requirements reflect that...then it will be an issue.
Just because a Tac in a Scim with a team backing him can pull 180k doesn't mean that an Eng in a Galaxy can't pull 6-8k.
There is obviously a lack of balance between ships and careers when it comes to potential...but the potential is at the other end of the spectrum. Content doesn't require anywhere near the potential of even the worst T5 9 console ship.
And following the wisdom that's so often given to those that wish folks would put the least bit of effort into the run having the slightest chance of success, if you don't want folks mocking you...don't queue with random people, eh?
Sounds stupid, doesn't it? Getting the picture now?
I mean, seriously, who freaking cares if some douche is mocking their DPS if they were contributing to the success of the run? TRIBBLE that douche, I mean really...grow the Hell up.
I play by simple rules...I try to pad the requirements for content a bit, so that I'm more than just the minimal. If somebody wants quick 'n easy runs, then yes - there are channels for that. I'm looking to support a healthy public queue system where everybody there is at least trying to succeed - I don't care if somebody wants blink 'n done runs. I'm a casual player. This is a pretty casual game. I'd like a healthy casual public queue system.
I don't expect optionals always to be made - they're called optionals for a reason. I do expect there to be some failures - stuff happens. What pisses me off is when folks show up that are basically guaranteeing a failure - removing any chance of the success...
Gating Endgame PvE Queue's via pre-requisite SP version.
Not a bad idea, but I think the wrong way to go about it. A tutorial mode would be a better way to do it. With a voiceover triggered and highlights on the changing targets/objectives. Also warnings for things like the Sphere's which heal the Transformers in ISA etc...
That would be a better way to do it. They go through the Tut (basically same as watching the YT vid of it) and then get a SP tryout of it. Then Normal is unlocked. Once they complete normal 5 times Adv is unlocked etc...
It's not a perfect solution but it's better than the current 0 DPS players jumping in and trolling Adv all the time.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
You can not be serious if you think there's not a problem with balance. If you really think all the ships perform as well as each other.
The problems I have seen is not failing but people becoming upset over not getting something done as fast as they wished to do so.
Other games I play people discuss and talk with each other before they start the instance or a major fight. They explain and help each other. In STO that doesn't happen often and when someone talks more often then not it's to link a dps meter and mock the other players in the group.
As for trolling the q by playing with the ship you wish to play with, that's the way the game is designed. It's designed to be able to use any end game ship and they do not perform nearly as well as each other. You can try to help and do the instance the way it's suppose to be done as a eng in a galaxy but your going to end up with people then mocking you for your dps, it happens all the time.
Yes, different ships perform different. But there simply is no T5 ships which is not capable to do advanced/elite content. But there are plenty of captains that are not capable atm to play the higher difficulties. Reasons for that are many. Some simply are new, some simply are overwhelmed by all the options the game throws at you (better tutorials would help here) and some simply refuse to change their way and those cannot be helped.
And who has the burden to talk before a match? The person that knows what he/she is doing or the person that does not? How do you thing the person with knowledge acquired it? Certainly not by being passive.
And the mocking certainly goes both ways. Don't behave like there are only high DPS players that behave like dicks.
Alternatively, those who dislike how others play or build their ships can utilize the existing tools in game to socialize, make friends, join fleets and create private queues with those friends/fleetmates from now until the end of time.
That's because he doesn't want to help anyone. He just wants to keep "n00bs" out of his STFs, so that he can acquire the rewards that he deserves, without anyone spoiling things for him.
Exactly. And this is also an attempt to force a DPS oriented gameplay upon others, by locking up the content from them. So its just a: either go that way or go TRIBBLE yourself "wall".
Only Cryptic can solve the dead queues problem by removing the fail cooldown (for real, I've never encounter something stupid like this, you are actually encouraged to try again, right away, in allmost any MMO) and by restoring the old fail conditions aka make the optionals... optional again.
Yes, different ships perform different. But there simply is no T5 ships which is not capable to do advanced/elite content. But there are plenty of captains that are not capable atm to play the higher difficulties. Reasons for that are many. Some simply are new, some simply are overwhelmed by all the options the game throws at you (better tutorials would help here) and some simply refuse to change their way and those cannot be helped.
And who has the burden to talk before a match? The person that knows what he/she is doing or the person that does not? How do you thing the person with knowledge acquired it? Certainly not by being passive.
And the mocking certainly goes both ways. Don't behave like there are only high DPS players that behave like dicks.
You know one place they could start that I think almost everyone would agree on that could improve things is to put sane gear on a ship when you get it. Also they could have a few suggestions for builds for each ship and the ability to pick among those pre built builds to put in place.
As for who should talk to who, of course a new player should ask and talk but that's never been the case in any game. Most the time either a healer or a tank in other games takes up the role of helping to lead the group and explains things.
STO is a very casual game and it's the very first mmo for many players. Group content is not really in place for when leving, or at least that matters and requires them to do well. So for many these elite stfs are the first content they have ever done that does take teamwork.
The game could use more tools to help players better understand how they are doing. World of ******** has different challenges for players to do to help them improve and to allow them to learn to play better. That could be something STO could look into and add to this game.
I assume with Engi builds you are talking about tanks. Tanks need to deal damage in order to get and hold aggro. A tank that does not deal enough damage is not tanking. And pretty much all Engi ships at tier 5 have 8 weapon slots, they are there for a good reason.
And while Sci ships only have 6 weapon slots and will deal less damage with their weapons than tacs and engis, you have mentioned crowd control abilites. The last time i checked, tractror beam repulsors (especially with the reverse doff) and grav well can deal huge amounts of damage as well.
Both classes are very capabale to deal way more damage than you ever will need for any content in the game. And this is certainly not just a question of having good gear. Understanding captain/boff abilities and using them properly, improving your piloting skills and managing your ship power system will improve a player a lot more than better gear ever can.
And exactly teaching this knowledge is where Cryptic fails atm. The game simply needs better and deeper tutorials and better introductions for every queue missions.
Tanking is innate engi ability, I'm thinking more of healing. You misunderstood part about Sci. I wanted to say that mission for Sci characters should learn them how to control crowd which is single most difficult and most important part of PUG ISA (private groups should have fewer problems with early generators destruction) and in OP's type of mission Sci character must be DPS centric. TBR with Doff, GW with maxed skills are part of Sci DPS build but High End build. OP wants to create entrance mission for STF beginners, not for End Game characters.
Max. One-Hit: 114,966 (Quantum Torpedo - Salvo II (Federation Typhoon Class Battleship))
Has anyone considered making a staged 'tutorial' for STFs via the Foundry?
You may not be able to mimic some of the abilities or run a timer, but you can control the spawning of encounters(hostile and friendly) with instructional dialogue between each 'stage' of the mission. This way, you'd be able to narrow or widen the scope by spawning probes while teach lane defense in Khitomer or spawn some friendlies to simulate a team-battle against a Tac cube.
Perhaps the team might even be willing to make running such missions a prequisite for Advanced+ if they're done well. It would free up their resources to work on future content with a small curation investiture. Heck it could even be a content with rewards of some kind..
Has anyone considered making a staged 'tutorial' for STFs via the Foundry?
You may not be able to mimic some of the abilities or run a timer, but you can control the spawning of encounters(hostile and friendly) with instructional dialogue between each 'stage' of the mission. This way, you'd be able to narrow or widen the scope by spawning probes while teach lane defense in Khitomer or spawn some friendlies to simulate a team-battle against a Tac cube.
Perhaps the team might even be willing to make running such missions a prequisite for Advanced+ if they're done well. It would free up their resources to work on future content with a small curation investiture. Heck it could even be a content with rewards of some kind..
There is one for one of the borg ground missions. Maintenance just started so cannot check.
This program, though reasonably normal at times, seems to have a strong affinity to classes belonging to the Cat 2.0 program. Questerius 2.7 will break down on occasion, resulting in garbage and nonsense messages whenever it occurs. Usually a hard reboot or pulling the plug solves the problem when that happens.
The problem is not the players, it's the game it's self.
Exactly! which is why a tutorial is what I'm proposing. There is nothing that would teach someone new what to do. They could join a fleet (I did), and learn, but either that isn't happening, or the fleets they're joining aren't helping them. If they ran private queues, the accolade/unlock wouldn't be needed. So they could still learn in private queues (like I did).
This isn't hurting me, or anyone else who runs private queues. It's making it more difficult for average people who can't carry someone that is either going in blind, or just wants rewards and wants to get them for nothing.
Not a bad idea, but I think the wrong way to go about it. A tutorial mode would be a better way to do it. With a voiceover triggered and highlights on the changing targets/objectives. Also warnings for things like the Sphere's which heal the Transformers in ISA etc...
That would be a better way to do it. They go through the Tut (basically same as watching the YT vid of it) and then get a SP tryout of it. Then Normal is unlocked. Once they complete normal 5 times Adv is unlocked etc...
It's not a perfect solution but it's better than the current 0 DPS players jumping in and trolling Adv all the time.
This would serve as a tutorial- I don't think Normal needs any kind of tutorial, only because people aren't jumping into Normals for rewards- whether they are able to complete the content or not. I also don't think the Normals prepare someone for the higher level stuff. A video would be nice, but how many people would just go afk and not watch it?
Comments
Doesn't account for missions with multiple goals or goal locations such as Cure, Khitomer, and Borg Disconnected. Lower HP would make it a bit easier, but having to go back and forth generally isn't how those STFs work anyway, at least for good teams, and that's the whole point of this exercise isn't it?
Except some missions are, as I stated above, extremely difficult to impossible to complete with one person.
I didn't say specific careers couldn't do it, I said specific play styles can't. A player who is geared for support and healing isn't going to have much damage output and his efforts are largely wasted on AI partners. Or do you expect them to change their build specifically so they can clear this mission, which ends up being a waste because that's not how they're going to play the real thing anyway.
The universe has a wonderful sense of humor. The trick is learning how to take a joke.
Much better approach is mandatory number of successful completion of Infected Normal with PUG group as requirement for Infected Advanced but that would be problem for other missions where ques are not populated enough.
PS. I apologize for any mistakes in my English.
That's because he doesn't want to help anyone. He just wants to keep "n00bs" out of his STFs, so that he can acquire the rewards that he deserves, without anyone spoiling things for him.
You do know that I run 99% of my queues from the DPS channels, right? Leechers and trolls in PUGs have little effect on me personally. :rolleyes:
Massively obvious assumption failure on your part.
Or, lack of reading comprehension, since I've stated it in this thread, even.
Separate NPC spawns? Half instances? Truncated versions, maybe?
Khitomer: Cube, one gate, boss.
Cure: One cube, chosen at random so it's known there are 3. Boss.
Borg disconnected: One section, toned down bosses.
That's 5 seconds worth of thought. Nothing a 7k-ish DPS person couldn't handle with 4 NPCs.
The specific play that may or may not help a team in the actual STFs themselves? Wouldn't it demonstrate how useful (or not) one's choices would be in a STF environment? Kind of the point.
Isn't the universal phrase for that.. "Speak English itches"
If you type louder, they're more likely to understand. :cool:
^^ Cute idea.
Only thing is, Advanced/Elites generally fail from a lack of coordination more than a shortage of DPS. Good luck getting your thing coordinated with the NPC's.
Lack of basic instance knowledge and coordination...so wouldn't a mission that teaches about the instance help with the basic instance knowledge, eh? And with that coordination, NPCs potentially TRIBBLE things up - wouldn't that be a method for players to learn about trying to cover/resolve that potential coordination and how to react?
Lol, I'm picturing a flight attendant pointing to emergency exits now for some reason. :eek:
Back to the overall concept though, I still think Cryptic needs to address it from the bottom up.
Mission Rewards, Normal Rewards, Advanced Rewards, Elite Rewards...if they start from the bottom and thus provide access there, when they go to gate Advanced/Elite, they won't be completely cutting folks off.
Large amount of problems get blamed on the players and some players may deserve it but most do not. The game has really poor balance. Careers are balanced poorly, the ships are balanced poorly plus the game is more pay to win now then it was in LoR. Nearly every other mmo goes about trying to balance things against each other. STO almost seems to go out of it's way not to do so.
In the end if you do not want to team with people that you think will not provide the best experience then it maybe best to avoid content with random people.
Join a Fleet composed of personnel who have the exact same overwhelming opinion of themselves. Because they have trained their whole lives to become expert at playing a dozen or so missions in a not very good video game based upon a very popular science fiction franchise.
Imagine the joy and happiness you will bring to yourself when you are no longer surrounded by mere mortals who let pesky things like a girlfriend or a mortgage payment distract them from their true calling in life.
Stopped PUGging after DR for two reasons.
1) Rewards no longer worth the time and effort.
2) No longer wanted to associate with people like you, OP. I was gravely concerned I might get some of that on myself and not be able to wash it off.
I'm sorry, but all I see there are excuses.
1) It's the ship, not the player! Yet others are fine in the ship...so obviously it is the player.
2) It's the career, not the player! Yet others are fine with those careers...so obviously it is the player.
3) Don't queue with random folks then! So leave the public queues in an unhealthy state that reflects poorly on the game because players like to make excuses?
Just because there are Tacs out there with teams backing them up pushing out over 100k in certain ships...doesn't mean diddly squat until there is content that's requiring over 100k. It's just an excuse...and players are quick to make excuses and blame others rather than accept any personal responsibility for what they're bringing to a team that's hoping to at least having a chance at a successful run.
If a person has one ship that they can rock and roll with and another ship they know their build/how they fly it is not up to par, and yet they take that into the queue...they're just trolling the queue and their fellow players. The person knows that the build is not enough to snuff for the content...that's a player issue. They can hit up the forums, reddit, their fleet if they're in one, etc, etc, etc for advice on how they could get it up to par...cause there are folks flying all sorts of things.
And yeah, the public queues looking as dead as they are because folks have gone private (which the public queue numbers do not reflect those players that have gone private) just leaves the game looking dead...cause even folks that don't care about quick 'n easy runs, but just want a shot at success rather than a guaranteed failure have been driven away from the public queues.
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Normal from single-player missions, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, yeah?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Advanced from Normal queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, eh?
...if Cryptic were to provide some form of reward for folks not ready for Elite from Advanced queues, then that would cut down on some of the folks that feel as if they have to do something they're not ready for, right?
And then it could get into some form of gating for Normal, Advanced, and Elite (yeah, I even said gating for Normal)...where the rewards for Normal, Advanced, and Elite could be improved based on the expected effort/time the players would have to put in.
But why bother, eh? Just let the players continue to make excuses and blame everything else...doesn't matter if new players come along see dead queues and just leave - doesn't matter if older players just get tired of seeing dead queues and just leave...it's not like people leaving means less revenue which means less development...and could potentially even lead to the game shutting down. Let's just keep on making excuses...
If you don't like how others play then find a fleet and do private queues where you can all circle jerk your e-peens.
I assume with Engi builds you are talking about tanks. Tanks need to deal damage in order to get and hold aggro. A tank that does not deal enough damage is not tanking. And pretty much all Engi ships at tier 5 have 8 weapon slots, they are there for a good reason.
And while Sci ships only have 6 weapon slots and will deal less damage with their weapons than tacs and engis, you have mentioned crowd control abilites. The last time i checked, tractror beam repulsors (especially with the reverse doff) and grav well can deal huge amounts of damage as well.
Both classes are very capabale to deal way more damage than you ever will need for any content in the game. And this is certainly not just a question of having good gear. Understanding captain/boff abilities and using them properly, improving your piloting skills and managing your ship power system will improve a player a lot more than better gear ever can.
And exactly teaching this knowledge is where Cryptic fails atm. The game simply needs better and deeper tutorials and better introductions for every queue missions.
How is expecting folks to make at least a minimal reasonable attempt to contribute to a team's success in a queue elitism?
How is suggesting something that would help folks make that minimal reasonable contribution to a team's success in a queue a bad thing?
don't pug, simplest solution
tell cryptic to quit locking required items in elite/advanced. more complicated.
most wouldn't even bother with either if required mats and various specialty rep items weren't in those. creating a gate means players who need those items to get rep gear or craft gear can't get them bordering on a catch 22.
think before you post bad ideas...already have cryptic not thinking when they implement mechanics don't need players learning from their bad habits or emulating them.
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
You can not be serious if you think there's not a problem with balance. If you really think all the ships perform as well as each other.
The problems I have seen is not failing but people becoming upset over not getting something done as fast as they wished to do so.
Other games I play people discuss and talk with each other before they start the instance or a major fight. They explain and help each other. In STO that doesn't happen often and when someone talks more often then not it's to link a dps meter and mock the other players in the group.
As for trolling the q by playing with the ship you wish to play with, that's the way the game is designed. It's designed to be able to use any end game ship and they do not perform nearly as well as each other. You can try to help and do the instance the way it's suppose to be done as a eng in a galaxy but your going to end up with people then mocking you for your dps, it happens all the time.
You can not be serious if you think I said that. Was that said anywhere? No? Was the imbalance even pointed out? Tac in certain ships? Yes? But people meeting minimal requirements for content is not about the insane lack of balance that exists with what is potentially available because of career and ship choice. When it becomes a case that the minimal requirements reflect that...then it will be an issue.
Just because a Tac in a Scim with a team backing him can pull 180k doesn't mean that an Eng in a Galaxy can't pull 6-8k.
There is obviously a lack of balance between ships and careers when it comes to potential...but the potential is at the other end of the spectrum. Content doesn't require anywhere near the potential of even the worst T5 9 console ship.
And following the wisdom that's so often given to those that wish folks would put the least bit of effort into the run having the slightest chance of success, if you don't want folks mocking you...don't queue with random people, eh?
Sounds stupid, doesn't it? Getting the picture now?
I mean, seriously, who freaking cares if some douche is mocking their DPS if they were contributing to the success of the run? TRIBBLE that douche, I mean really...grow the Hell up.
I play by simple rules...I try to pad the requirements for content a bit, so that I'm more than just the minimal. If somebody wants quick 'n easy runs, then yes - there are channels for that. I'm looking to support a healthy public queue system where everybody there is at least trying to succeed - I don't care if somebody wants blink 'n done runs. I'm a casual player. This is a pretty casual game. I'd like a healthy casual public queue system.
I don't expect optionals always to be made - they're called optionals for a reason. I do expect there to be some failures - stuff happens. What pisses me off is when folks show up that are basically guaranteeing a failure - removing any chance of the success...
Not a bad idea, but I think the wrong way to go about it. A tutorial mode would be a better way to do it. With a voiceover triggered and highlights on the changing targets/objectives. Also warnings for things like the Sphere's which heal the Transformers in ISA etc...
That would be a better way to do it. They go through the Tut (basically same as watching the YT vid of it) and then get a SP tryout of it. Then Normal is unlocked. Once they complete normal 5 times Adv is unlocked etc...
It's not a perfect solution but it's better than the current 0 DPS players jumping in and trolling Adv all the time.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
Yes, different ships perform different. But there simply is no T5 ships which is not capable to do advanced/elite content. But there are plenty of captains that are not capable atm to play the higher difficulties. Reasons for that are many. Some simply are new, some simply are overwhelmed by all the options the game throws at you (better tutorials would help here) and some simply refuse to change their way and those cannot be helped.
And who has the burden to talk before a match? The person that knows what he/she is doing or the person that does not? How do you thing the person with knowledge acquired it? Certainly not by being passive.
And the mocking certainly goes both ways. Don't behave like there are only high DPS players that behave like dicks.
Wise words.
Exactly. And this is also an attempt to force a DPS oriented gameplay upon others, by locking up the content from them. So its just a: either go that way or go TRIBBLE yourself "wall".
Only Cryptic can solve the dead queues problem by removing the fail cooldown (for real, I've never encounter something stupid like this, you are actually encouraged to try again, right away, in allmost any MMO) and by restoring the old fail conditions aka make the optionals... optional again.
You know one place they could start that I think almost everyone would agree on that could improve things is to put sane gear on a ship when you get it. Also they could have a few suggestions for builds for each ship and the ability to pick among those pre built builds to put in place.
As for who should talk to who, of course a new player should ask and talk but that's never been the case in any game. Most the time either a healer or a tank in other games takes up the role of helping to lead the group and explains things.
STO is a very casual game and it's the very first mmo for many players. Group content is not really in place for when leving, or at least that matters and requires them to do well. So for many these elite stfs are the first content they have ever done that does take teamwork.
The game could use more tools to help players better understand how they are doing. World of ******** has different challenges for players to do to help them improve and to allow them to learn to play better. That could be something STO could look into and add to this game.
You may not be able to mimic some of the abilities or run a timer, but you can control the spawning of encounters(hostile and friendly) with instructional dialogue between each 'stage' of the mission. This way, you'd be able to narrow or widen the scope by spawning probes while teach lane defense in Khitomer or spawn some friendlies to simulate a team-battle against a Tac cube.
Perhaps the team might even be willing to make running such missions a prequisite for Advanced+ if they're done well. It would free up their resources to work on future content with a small curation investiture. Heck it could even be a content with rewards of some kind..
There is one for one of the borg ground missions. Maintenance just started so cannot check.
Exactly! which is why a tutorial is what I'm proposing. There is nothing that would teach someone new what to do. They could join a fleet (I did), and learn, but either that isn't happening, or the fleets they're joining aren't helping them. If they ran private queues, the accolade/unlock wouldn't be needed. So they could still learn in private queues (like I did).
This isn't hurting me, or anyone else who runs private queues. It's making it more difficult for average people who can't carry someone that is either going in blind, or just wants rewards and wants to get them for nothing.
This would serve as a tutorial- I don't think Normal needs any kind of tutorial, only because people aren't jumping into Normals for rewards- whether they are able to complete the content or not. I also don't think the Normals prepare someone for the higher level stuff. A video would be nice, but how many people would just go afk and not watch it?