Why were fleet alert marks nerfed?

knuhteb5 · January 2015

I already had to do around 75-80 fleet alert runs just to get enough marks to get a fleet spire tac console so why are mark awards being nerfed? Can a dev please explain the reasoning behind this? Fleet alerts already award a pathetic amount of marks; please don't make it worse.

seriousdave · January 2015

There's logic behind that tactic. The stuff that was nerfed also was the stuff everyone played all the time, like CCA. So by nerfing that the rest becomes more attractive, in theory at least.

That maybe bugs, inbalances or dumb fail conditions are the main reason why 80% of the queues are emtpy is completely out of question, right?:rolleyes:

razar2380 · January 2015

Another reason they would reduce fleet mark rewards is if they are going to come out with a new fleet holding, or Tier soon. If so, then they will nerf the rewards so that it will take longer for small fleets to fill projects. That is just something they would do, without thinking it through.

aelfwin1 · January 2015

seriousdave wrote: »

There's logic behind that tactic. The stuff that was nerfed also was the stuff everyone played all the time, like CCA. So by nerfing that the rest becomes more attractive, in theory at least.

That maybe bugs, inbalances or dumb fail conditions are the main reason why 80% of the queues are emtpy is completely out of question, right?:rolleyes:

That ... , or it's a preparation by Cryptic towards the next Fleet Asset to be introduced in the next season .

... call it a "pre-nerf" for impending content, to get you to play moar in the future ...

EDIT : ninja'd by Razar ...

rsoblivion · January 2015

Worst nerf going, I need to get around a million fleet marks as it is, it's driving me mad.

ussprometheus79 · January 2015

rsoblivion wrote: »

Worst nerf going, I need to get around a million fleet marks as it is, it's driving me mad.

A million? :eek:

Dr. Evil style plans for STO domination?

rsoblivion · January 2015

Ok maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but I do need 5 Spire consoles (50K per console), the 6th DoFF slot (150K) some Plasma Generating Weapon Sig Nullifiers (50K per console again or 12.5K for Mk X's)...

Then I need some ground items like UR Plasma Grenades etc...

Not forgetting the Fleet Singularity or the Fleet Shield which are both in the 100K region...

A million isn't actually too far off.

sunfrancks · January 2015

The devs were not happy having half the queue's being empty, so they hatched a plan to make them all empty.

I think it might just succeed...

sqwished · January 2015

To be honest the nerfs to all of the rewards are a dumb idea. But let's not forget they've thrown use a few bread crumbs in that they've raised the level of spec and xp points gained. Also they've ramped up the rewards for the one Stf that is directly tied in with their delta block story arc namely bug hunt.

But could someone please explain to me why they've decided to nerf the "damage" of the Kang in Cure? Because it can be interpreted in one of two ways. The first being they've reduced the amount of damage it takes from the assimilated borg ships (which wouldn't really be a bad thing) or they've reduced the damage the Kang actually does. In which case it proves that cryptic really doesn't have any idea of what goes on in their own game since the only damage the Kang does is via a warp core breach which by that time in advanced the mission has already passed the failure point.

defcon1776 · January 2015

seriousdave wrote: »

There's logic behind that tactic. The stuff that was nerfed also was the stuff everyone played all the time, like CCA. So by nerfing that the rest becomes more attractive, in theory at least.

I guess nobody is playing Bug Hunt, nice buff!:rolleyes:

pwlaughingtrendy wrote: »

Bug Hunt:
Normal rewards have been increased by 25%

Advanced rewards have been increased by 50%.

Elite rewards have been increased by 75%.

virusdancer · January 2015

-

Is it actually a case of players liking the missions or are they just easy missions that are over-rewarding and providing a path of least resistance to something they want? They don't necessarily like the missions at all, but they like the path of least resistance.

Cause if there was no path of least resistance, well, then players would be free to play what they actually like, yeah?

defcon1776 wrote: »

I guess nobody is playing Bug Hunt, nice buff!:rolleyes:

Folks were playing for easy APCs, right? Oddly enough though, apparently it was under-rewarding Delta Marks. Not to get into one of those "I have a sandwich" things, but dayum...it's like it's raining Delta Marks 24/7 so I never even noticed...but apparently some folks did and brought it up to them.

nicha0 · January 2015

Playing queues for FMs is so S6 though, Doffs get you more than you can ever use. I bet each of my characters have had over 100k excess marks, most of which has been dumped into the 2k FM fleet projects.

fraghul2000 · January 2015

patrickngo wrote: »

'need?" no, "WANT". Nothing in this game is "needed". You need food to live, you need electricity to power your computer, but this is a game. everything about it is optional, including your spending.

What you're seeing is the use of the stick, because they don't want to use carrots.

and no one "needs", nor "wants" people like you. a completely superfluous existance.

nyxadrill · January 2015

reyan01 wrote: »

A mindset that I loathe with a passion, because as discussed numerous times before, metrics - and the beancounters who review them - have a habit of saying EXACTLY what The Powers That Be WANT them to say.

As a wise man once said..."There are lies, damn lies, and statistics"

The art to understanding ANY statistics/metrics is in correct interpretation. Judging by some of the decisions I've seen made of late, I see no evidence of that. :rolleyes:

I suspect the metrics are being, what I call, "selectively" viewed, in that they are being interpreted in a way that is more in keeping with the required business line.

That's a personal assumption that I'd gladly have proved wrong by the way!

jorantomalak · January 2015

sunfrancks wrote: »

The devs were not happy having half the queue's being empty, so they hatched a plan to make them all empty.

I think it might just succeed...

Above and beyond even thier greatest expectations

rsoblivion · January 2015

patrickngo wrote: »

'need?" no, "WANT". Nothing in this game is "needed". You need food to live, you need electricity to power your computer, but this is a game. everything about it is optional, including your spending.

What you're seeing is the use of the stick, because they don't want to use carrots.

What I see is a goal I set myself for the build I want to achieve. Before DR it was achievable pretty easily and there were good numbers playing the required queues like Fleet Alert etc...

Now it's much harder to get the needed Fleet Credit from Fleet Marks or other means. It's now a grind that will take nigh on 10x longer to get the gear I am after for a single character. I have 8 characters and I like to play them all, though I do have a Fed Main and a Rom Main. My KDF Main is languishing at 53 because I can't be bothered to do the Argala grind, so I'm just doing what I want ingame instead. Problem is that's around 17x slower than grinding Argala...

thatcursedwolf · January 2015

patrickngo wrote: »

'need?" no, "WANT". Nothing in this game is "needed". You need food to live, you need electricity to power your computer, but this is a game. everything about it is optional, including your spending.

What you're seeing is the use of the stick, because they don't want to use carrots.

You don't need your money, give it to me. You can forage for food, shelter, and clothing.

sonnikku · January 2015

Don't think of it so much as a nerf to your marks as much as a buff to your play time. Before you were playing the game less before you got all your stuff. Now you get to play it more. You get to.

aelfwin1 · January 2015

sunfrancks wrote: »

The devs were not happy having half the queue's being empty, so they hatched a plan to make them all empty.

I think it might just succeed...

In another Universe , you'd be labeled "rebel scum" for that !

patrickngo wrote: »

'need?" no, "WANT". Nothing in this game is "needed". You need food to live, you need electricity to power your computer, but this is a game. everything about it is optional, including your spending.

That might have been true before DR, but after it you find yourself sandwiched between HP and a timer with the only way out being DPS .

The time when optionals and relaxed gameplay is over ... , in the queues anyway .

What you're seeing is the use of the stick, because they don't want to use carrots.

I can agree with that to a point .
What many see is blatant manipulation towards playing certain DR content .
Thus places like Argala will only exist until Cryptic deems them worthy to exist .

D'angelo gives and D'angelo takes away .

... it may be just me, but lately I've had the urge to take a shower after reading the release notes ...

nimbull · January 2015

I don't play many queues because of timers that kill the instance if people don't meet the conditions. In PuGs people fail those quite a bit and frankly it makes the game not fun at all when you go in and not five minutes later your out and locked from doing it for like a half hour. If they make the remaining instances I play as un-fun as the ones I avoid then I'll be totally bored with this game.

Yeah I know, "FIND A FLEET" well I'm already in one and we do instances a lot of times. That being said, some of us even in fleets like to do PuGs to meet new people possibly. Also you don't find new people very easily to get fresh blood in fleets when PuGs are avoided like the plague for whatever reason.

meimeitoo · January 2015

reyan01 wrote: »

A mindset that I loathe with a passion, because as discussed numerous times before, metrics - and the beancounters who review them - have a habit of saying EXACTLY what The Powers That Be WANT them to say.

I mindset I was apparently not allowed to talk about.

meimeitoo · January 2015

rsoblivion wrote: »

Ok maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but I do need 5 Spire consoles (50K per console), the 6th DoFF slot (150K) some Plasma Generating Weapon Sig Nullifiers (50K per console again or 12.5K for Mk X's)...

Then I need some ground items like UR Plasma Grenades etc...

Not forgetting the Fleet Singularity or the Fleet Shield which are both in the 100K region...

A million isn't actually too far off.

Not to state the obvious, but, erm, that's what contributing to your Fleet is all about. If you want Fleet Credits, contribute to your Fleet: helps you, and the rest of your Fleet too. I've spent untold millions of FC on a manifold of various Fleet consoles and all that. And I like to keep at least 2 million FC handy, for a rainy day.

sheldonlcooper · January 2015

Yeah this was a cruel one, especially for the very casual player. This is a great early mission for players to get their feet wet. The nerf is petty and spiteful like the vendor trash nerf.

meimeitoo · January 2015

sheldonlcooper wrote: »

Yeah this was a cruel one, especially for the very casual player. This is a great early mission for players to get their feet wet. The nerf is petty and spiteful like the vendor trash nerf.

Fleet Alert was one of my favorite means to get some noticeable FC, back in the day. Much like the old Mirror Event was instrumental to my leveling up. It's a sad day when something as innocuous as Fleet Alert gets hit with a 50% nerf bat.

Fleet Alert was topping in the metrics?! Probably because almost everything else in the public queue is dead, is why. I'm really quite distressed about the way a cetain someone is interpreting these metric. The conclusions I would draw from them would be radically different, I can tell you that.

hyperionx09 · January 2015

As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink from it.

They just keep nerfing queues thinking it'll lead others to the un-played/under-played queues, but that's still not going to make players play them, for one reason or another (time/gain efficiency or too many bugs).

jorantomalak · January 2015

Nerf fleet marks ....check

Nerf something random ......check

Nerf fleet marks again?....double check

Now

Lets nerf them all again for good measure

fruitvendor12 · January 2015

meimeitoo wrote: »

Fleet Alert was topping in the metrics?! Probably because almost everything else in the public queue is dead, is why. I'm really quite distressed about the way a cetain someone is interpreting these metric. The conclusions I would draw from them would be radically different, I can tell you that.

I've been playing FA quite a bit. Recently. Because the queues are essentially dead and even channels like PESTF are barely filled over the day.

I absolutely agree with you. Metrics are worse than useless if there is no context to explain data into information.

forcemajeure · January 2015

The metrics say: The players aren't doing what we want them to.

"The floggings shall continue until morale improves!"

zathri83 · January 2015

Pvpers found fleet alert to be too OP.

dareau · January 2015

rsoblivion wrote: »

Ok maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but I do need 5 Spire consoles (50K per console), the 6th DoFF slot (150K) some Plasma Generating Weapon Sig Nullifiers (50K per console again or 12.5K for Mk X's)...

Then I need some ground items like UR Plasma Grenades etc...

Not forgetting the Fleet Singularity or the Fleet Shield which are both in the 100K region...

A million isn't actually too far off.

meimeitoo wrote: »

Not to state the obvious, but, erm, that's what contributing to your Fleet is all about. If you want Fleet Credits, contribute to your Fleet: helps you, and the rest of your Fleet too. I've spent untold millions of FC on a manifold of various Fleet consoles and all that. And I like to keep at least 2 million FC handy, for a rainy day.

And may I note that every contribution leads to the acquisition of fleet credits.

13 fleet marks (650 fleet credits) per run is not a crippling decline to your fleet credit earning rate, unless said earning rate is 100% fleet marks.

Take the day's dil from your ISA run and contribute that to the fleet instead of spending it on the dil sink du jour, or converting it to Zen. Toss a few DOffs into that rabbit hole. Either one can make up the "missing" 650 FCs from a single FA run. While those costs might get "prohibitive" if you make multiple FA runs per day, this might be time to branch out some...

Bug hunt is receiving a slight rewards buff. Mine trap, Atmosphere Assault, and Nukara Prime's Self Destruct mission are all receiving buffs to the reward, and all of them are greater than 100% (so more than double the rewards), Atmosphere Assault Advanced is getting 400% more reward.

IIRC, all of these missions reward fleet marks as an alternative, I'd say that AAA's 400% boost is more than the 13 lost from FA. Go grind those shuttle missions - now with even weaker walkers for quicker kills...

Is Ba'al the Stargate Lord of Metrics (Or god, or alien master, or whatever they call these people)? If so, remember to praise Ba'al for changing the queue metrics favorably... I mean, obviously the zeroes in AAA were a reporting error if the rewards need to go up 400% and there's no chart proving that AAA "horrendously underpaid" according to the standard average desired payout... :P

crusader2007 · January 2015

The issue with Fleet Marks was discussed deeply on Triibble threads. Most players express frustration at the NERF and communication of WHY this was needed with no clear outcome:

http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1354311

What a shame! It looked like a great patch until it got to the Fleet marks section. I guess now not only killed PvPs but also any sort of fleetmark PvEs :mad:

Why were fleet alert marks nerfed?

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