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PVE Queue Update

ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,481 Arc User
So there are changes to the PVE Queues being implemented with the Fifth Anniversary rollout tomorrow that reduces some rewards, increases fail possibilities on some older Queues, etc. An official feedback thread was established in the Tribble section of the Forums. Universally panned. Other threads opened by Players were closed as there was an official feedback thread and duplicate threads (or spam) are mot allowed.

The official feedback thread was also closed and do you know what? Those 'proposed' changes are being implemented intact as first specified tomorrow without any change whatsoever.

What was the point of the feedback thread?
Post edited by Unknown User on
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Lt. Philip J. Minns
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Comments

  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1355171

    Don't you just hate when things like that happen? :rolleyes:
  • casper32433casper32433 Member Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    So that cryptic and pwe can ignore the player base as usual and TRIBBLE more people off.
  • mandarsmashmandarsmash Member Posts: 78 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    I can accept or even like everything in the patch notes except for the changes made to the PvE queues.

    Really? Did we need them to be even less attractive to players? Who wants to actually run these things anymore? Why is there a need to make these queues harder on lower difficulties instead of easier?

    This is stupid. Plain stupid. I'd be surprised to see anyone seriously support these changes for Normal/Advanced. If people want challenge, go make Elite harder. Normal/Advanced are for us regular people, and none of us want the changes that are being made.
  • captainedwards09captainedwards09 Member Posts: 180 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Reducing the rewards for many of the queues makes absolutely no sense to me considering how dead they have been over the last few months.

    Not to mention I still don't believe there was any given reason why No Win Scenario was being removed, or any info on when/if it is coming back.

    I'll just have to accept that there is no logic in some of these decisions, at least it seems that way.
  • sarcasmdetectorsarcasmdetector Member Posts: 1,176 Media Corps
    edited January 2015
    Normal/Advanced are for us regular people...

    Normal for casual players.

    Advanced for Advanced players.

    Elite for the Best of the best players.
  • starkaosstarkaos Member Posts: 11,548 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Normal for casual players.

    Advanced for Advanced players.

    Elite for the Best of the best players.

    Unfortunately the lack of rewards like BNPs, VCI, IIs, etc in normal queues and solo content force casual players into Advanced.
  • reginamala78reginamala78 Member Posts: 4,593 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Normal for casual players.

    Advanced for Advanced players.

    Elite for the Best of the best players.

    Nah.

    Normal is for training-wheels mode to learn how it works.

    Advance is for normal players.

    Elite is for minmaxers.

    We never had to expend actual effort or lower ourselves to practicing *shivers in disgust* for the old Elites, so why ruin a good thing with this new Advanced? People who want to play Seriously, they can go play Elite and leave the rest of us alone.
  • sarcasmdetectorsarcasmdetector Member Posts: 1,176 Media Corps
    edited January 2015
    Nah.

    Normal is for training-wheels mode to learn how it works.

    Advance is for normal players.

    Elite is for minmaxers.

    We never had to expend actual effort or lower ourselves to practicing *shivers in disgust* for the old Elites, so why ruin a good thing with this new Advanced? People who want to play Seriously, they can go play Elite and leave the rest of us alone.

    Those who don't want to play seriously can have Normal.

    Those that want to put in a medium amount of effort can have Advanced.

    Those that want to be serious can have Elite.

    If you don't want to put any effort or thought at all into you build then you do not deserve to get Advanced or Elite rewards. Effort = Reward. Risk = Reward.
  • reginamala78reginamala78 Member Posts: 4,593 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    If you don't want to put any effort or thought at all into you build then you do not deserve to get Advanced or Elite rewards. Effort = Reward. Risk = Reward.

    Never had to before, why start now?

    I swear, its like people think this game is important or something.
  • shurato2099shurato2099 Member Posts: 588 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Note to self: wear flame retardant uniform tomorrow ...

    Can't say that we didn't warn them but they went and nerfed anyway. This isn't going to be pretty.
  • hitonozanshihitonozanshi Member Posts: 176 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Note to self: wear flame retardant uniform tomorrow ...

    Can't say that we didn't warn them but they went and nerfed anyway. This isn't going to be pretty.

    Are you kidding?! The "I told you so" schadenfreude will be GLORIOUS! *grabs popcorns* :D
    The Jar kitty is watching you. :D
  • rsoblivionrsoblivion Member Posts: 809 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    TBH I think the Advanced queue's Optional's should be returned to being optional. Elite having mandatory objectives (please rename them to this) is fine.

    Balance still needs a revamp from someone outside the core of Cryptic. They just don't have enough playtime or comprehension of MMO/Game balance to get it right.
    Chris Robert's on SC:
    "You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
  • lored2deathlored2death Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Note to self: wear flame retardant uniform tomorrow ...

    Can't say that we didn't warn them but they went and nerfed anyway. This isn't going to be pretty.

    Got that right. Its not just the nerfs, either. Just wait until the players who don't use or rarely use the forums have a realization about the unfinished boff system. I'm just going to sit back and observe over the next week or so as I watch, yet again, Cryptic having to lay in a bed they've made for themselves.

    The *only* unfortunate side is I think those who actually work on the game have some sort of professional pride in the job they do and they'll have to take the heat for the nerfing and rushed boff system. The devs aren't killing STO, the management is.
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Those who don't want to play seriously can have Normal.

    Those that want to put in a medium amount of effort can have Advanced.

    Those that want to be serious can have Elite.

    If you don't want to put any effort or thought at all into you build then you do not deserve to get Advanced or Elite rewards. Effort = Reward. Risk = Reward.

    But that gets into actually balancing the various queues, no?

    Take Advanced for example, it feels like there are...

    Advanced Normal
    Advanced Advanced
    Advanced Elite

    ...all bearing the name Advanced.

    Hell, with some of the Normals it's dubious, imho, why they even exist - they're easier than episode missions on Normal but done as team missions?

    Same with Elite, stuff that's Elite Normal - Elite Advanced - and Elite Elite.

    And well, I think that's where some of the complaints will be coming about...as they attempt to "fix" those easier versions to be what was intended, folks will get upset that the changes were made that way instead of "fixing" the harder to be easier.

    And with them looking at adding E-Marks to single-player content, for me it leaves a big ol' question of why Normal will even exist, eh?

    I guess I'm just too used to how things have been done here and there in other games...cause I'd expect:

    Mission level difficulty.

    Normal level difficulty being akin to a standard dungeon run in another game. It's going to require more effort from each individual than they had to put forth in quests and offer better rewards.

    Advanced level difficulty being akin to doing a heroic dungeon run in another game. It's going to require more effort and better gearing than just hitting up a Normal did. It's also getting more into teamwork. As such, it's going to reward better.

    Elite level difficulty being akin to doing a raid in another game. Yep, that much more effort and better gearing than Advanced did. The teamwork I'd picture would require premades to do it. And yep, the better rewards for it.

    But that's not what STO's got at all, even if they were to balance out things on somewhat of an average for the difficulties they list, it would still come under those typical expectations.

    And at the end of the day, is STO even meant to have anything like that?

    What if they split the difference between Normal and the easier Advanced...calling that Normal and offering the Advanced rewards?
    What if they split the difference between Advanced and the easier Elite...calling that Advanced and offering the Elite rewards?
    What if they took Elite...and made it something they bumped up with each addition of powercreep to the game, providing different accolades and titles so folks could distinguish when they did it...while offering the best possible rewards for it compared to Normal or Advanced?

    But would that effort be wasted...? Cause is STO that kind of game? I don't think it is...

    Will be interesting to see where things go though...they've got plans, heh - though it always seems their left hand is dragging behind what the right hand is doing so it never seems like they're getting where they're trying to get.
  • aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,891 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Normal for casual players.

    Advanced for Advanced players.

    Elite for the Best of the best players.

    Not in this game .





    ... in other games, perhaps ... , but not in this one ... . Other games follow some kind of logic ...
  • shadowwraith77shadowwraith77 Member Posts: 6,395 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Well, can't wait to see how dead the pve queues wind up being this time, people thought it was bad before, just wait for the new quicker fails, even less queues being filled, all for the low low cost of your sanity and life.

    And what is your reward?

    Even less marks and, quite possibly dilithium soon!
    tumblr_nq9ec3BSAy1qj6sk2o2_500_zpspkqw0mmk.gif


    Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!

  • aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,891 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Well, can't wait to see how dead the pve queues wind up being this time, people thought it was bad before, just wait for the new quicker fails, even less queues being filled, all for the low low cost of your sanity and life.

    And what is your reward?

    Even less marks and, quite possibly dilithium soon!

    If you think the queues will be dead soon, wait until they put Borg BNP's and the rest of those queue awards into single player content .





    ... now THOSE will be some dead queues ...
  • shadowwraith77shadowwraith77 Member Posts: 6,395 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    aelfwin1 wrote: »
    If you think the queues will be dead soon, wait until they put Borg BNP's and the rest of those queue awards into single player content .





    ... now THOSE will be some dead queues ...

    Well, might as well have them do it now, for all the good they are doing to killing off pve pug queues.
    tumblr_nq9ec3BSAy1qj6sk2o2_500_zpspkqw0mmk.gif


    Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!

  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Well, can't wait to see how dead the pve queues wind up being this time, people thought it was bad before, just wait for the new quicker fails, even less queues being filled, all for the low low cost of your sanity and life.

    And what is your reward?

    Even less marks and, quite possibly dilithium soon!

    It would be nifty if the Quick Play public queues showed the folks that were playing out of private queues...cause the public queues might be dead, but folks are running all sorts of things via private queues.

    Folks might enjoy joking about the "reporting error"; but the public queue window's simply not showing everything that folks are doing.

    Take a look at how many folks show are doing ISN/ISA, eh? Then do a /who sibiran, yeah?

    Folks are tired of AFKers, leechers, unprepared folks, and the failures...it's been a growing trend - go private. Basically doing /trade pugs instead of public pugs if one is familiar with that term from other games.
  • aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,891 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Well, might as well have them do it now, for all the good they are doing to killing off pve pug queues.

    True ... , but the Metrics Boys like to do things piecemeal ... .
  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,055 Media Corps
    edited January 2015
    Tomorrow will be most interesting.

    Tonight Captain Gecko hinted in a tweeted response to MASSIVELY:
    MASSIVELY: Can MMO stories rise above mediocrity? http://ow.ly/I6wgk #globalchat

    Al Rivera: @massively I think so. Tube in tomorrow :)


    In all honesty, if Cryptic didn't have a big push tomorrow I'd be disappointed and convinced that they're given up their long term plans for STO. I don't believe that to be true. I'm expecting a kick-TRIBBLE video, and multiple posts following the successful launch of this 'stealth update'.

    The launch tomorrow doesn't have to be perfect. There are issues with everything from the PVE queues to the new officer systems that will generate a few fires. That's to be expected.

    I'm excited about the new ships. To hell with the balance - lets dps the heck out of everything. No need of SCI and ENG toons - TAC is all your gonna need from this point going forward.

    The Delta Rising content was excellent, but the planning and coding was not. I'm not expecting this to be any better.

    Tomorrow will be interesting indeed.
  • imruinedimruined Member Posts: 1,457 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    Well, might as well have them do it now, for all the good they are doing to killing off pve pug queues.

    I gotta say, if the special rewards (neural processors etc) will be obtainable through PVE solo content, at that point in time STO will virtually become (even more so than it is now) an always-online-single-player-RPG with Coop elements...
    The entitlement is strong in these forums...

    not_funny_Q_shadows_small.jpg
  • js26568js26568 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    imruined wrote: »
    I gotta say, if the special rewards (neural processors etc) will be obtainable through PVE solo content, at that point in time STO will virtually be an always-online-single-player-RPG with Coop elements...

    I hope you're not saying that that is a good thing.

    I already have lots of single player games. The social element of this game is what keeps me playing it.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free Tibet!
  • imruinedimruined Member Posts: 1,457 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    js26568 wrote: »
    I hope you're not saying that that is a good thing.

    I already have lots of single player games. The social element of this game is what keeps me playing it.

    No, I wasn't implying it's a good thing... I'm kinda on the fence to be honest...

    I was just commenting that STO is already quite single-player centric, but allowing players to obtain the special items outside of ques, there's virtually no need to run STF's any more...

    I reckon it would be convenient in gearing up alts etc, but I highly doubt it will have a positive impact on the social side of STO, hence why I'm some what undecided if it's a good, or bad, move... There's nothing stopping people running STF's with friends, but it could be the final nail for PUGs...
    The entitlement is strong in these forums...

    not_funny_Q_shadows_small.jpg
  • js26568js26568 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    imruined wrote: »
    No, I wasn't implying it's a good thing... I'm kinda on the fence to be honest...

    I was just commenting that STO is already quite single-player centric, but allowing players to obtain the special items outside of ques, there's virtually no need to run STF's any more...

    I reckon it would be convenient in gearing up alts etc, but I highly doubt it will have a positive impact on the social side of STO, hence why I'm some what undecided if it's a good, or bad, move... There's nothing stopping people running STF's with friends, but it could be the final nail for PUGs...

    I guess the new players that have yet to make in-game friends or join fleets will just have to sit and wait, fingers crossed, hoping against hope that an STF queue eventually pops for them. Players shouldn't have to organise themselves into groups just to play an STF. It's counter-intuitive. The STF queues should be full enough to let players jump in without being forced to join some channel or other. I'll admit that there were STF queues that never ever launched before DR (I don't think I've ever played "Mine Trap" in the 3 years I've been playing) but the situation got worse after DR launched.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free Tibet!
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    js26568 wrote: »
    Players shouldn't have to organise themselves into groups just to play an STF.

    My jaw didn't actually drop to the floor reading that...but it definitely tried.
  • js26568js26568 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    My jaw didn't actually drop to the floor reading that...but it definitely tried.

    Does the idea of playing a Pug STF offend you so much that you feel compelled to post nonsense like that? I'll say it again - players should not have to organise themselves into a group to play an STF.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free Tibet!
  • virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    js26568 wrote: »
    Does the idea of playing a Pug STF offend you so much that you feel compelled to post nonsense like that? I'll say it again - players should not have to organise themselves into a group to play an STF.

    What offends me is the thought process that if somebody wants to run something and does not see a group forming there, that they won't try to form a group. They won't hit up the forums, a zone, or put out feelers on where they can find folks that might be doing that queue.

    I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth...I don't have those kind of entitlement issues. If I want something, I can get off my fat TRIBBLE and do something about it other than whine about it, make excuses, or blame somebody else...

    Can ask folks in OPvP if I ever x'd up for anything there for the years I hung out there...or...if I just hit the pug queues for PvP. Can ask folks in 10k if they've seen me x up for anything in the short period I've been there (I never hit join, didn't really see the point - but when almost everybody I knew disappeared, it gave me something to read while flying around in circles). Can ask folks in Inner Circle if I've ever x'd up for anything there,

    All I do is pug...

    So yeah...the "Waaah, there's nobody using the public matchmaking system but I want to run something but don't want to have to go find folks to do it...really sucks!"...offends me.
  • js26568js26568 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited January 2015
    What offends me is the thought process that if somebody wants to run something and does not see a group forming there, that they won't try to form a group. They won't hit up the forums, a zone, or put out feelers on where they can find folks that might be doing that queue.

    I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth...I don't have those kind of entitlement issues. If I want something, I can get off my fat TRIBBLE and do something about it other than whine about it, make excuses, or blame somebody else...

    People shouldn't have to go looking for a group to play an STF with. There should be healthy queues already.

    What part of that is confusing you?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Free Tibet!
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