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Infographic: Costs of Upgrading in Delta Rising

ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,055 Media Corps
Interesting Infographic: Costs of Upgrading in Delta Rising
Post edited by ddesjardins on
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  • antoniosalieriantoniosalieri Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Not sure where you pulled your numbers from but someone needs to teach you how to play the game a bit I think. ;) lol

    The costs are quite frankly not that high... there are plenty of ways to reduce the costs.

    As far as EC vs D costs.

    It really comes down to how you choose to play and upgrade. You can choose to use high end tech and spend the least amount of D or you can go the other way and spend almost nothing on Tech and burn more D. (for some people that have been hording on alts for months that isn't as crazy as it sounds).

    To be completely honest with you even if your math is Correct for the majority of the playerbase... which imo it isn't.

    Asking people to grind for a few months per toon... IS PRETTY LIGHT in terms of the standard MMO these days.

    Don't get me wrong I'm not advocating the stupid grind core junk this game has become... lets not kid ourselves though the game was exactly that for a few years prior to DR.

    To give you a better idea why I said your math is terribly wrong... let me give you an example from ONE of my toons.

    4 Gold DHC... Started with MK 2... Used Experimental Superior + Blue Research tech on each. (crafted the superiors for around 3mil each cost (as I did each my purple bits) and picked up the blue upgrades) Ran 20 weapons this way 7,200 D cost to roll to mk 7.
    Out of 20 weapons I had 7 UR and 2 Gold.
    Sold 1 gold
    Sold 4 Ur
    They didn't have the mods I wanted... someone wanted them... Covered all my costs on Tech and boosters.
    Applied Superior Tech to remaining 4 guns.
    Aprox 40 Superiors used in total Crafting cost aprox 900k Each = 36 Million (Still ahead after selling the previous crafted gold and spare URs)
    All 4 DHC now at mk 14... 3 Gold one still UR.
    Aprox another 40k in D

    No rush Will upgrade the last one in the next while when I feel like rolling. (no major thing to be honest with you)

    So bottom line I spent around 96 Million EC... and 50k or so in D... to make one perfect MK 14 Gold set (ok 3... + one mk 14 UR)
    I sold one gold and 3 urs ..... for a total of 90 Million(aprox) Ec

    So bottom line this set for one of my toons cost me 9 million EC and around 50k in D.

    I have repeated that now on around 7 toons... that all have nearly perfect mk 14 gold weapon sets.

    As for shields and engines ect... there not worth rolling for gold on... Fleet consoles are cheap to roll to mk 14. (again gold is not a big deal.... if it happens great if not there is for sure no rush)

    The only thing that makes any difference in running content is the guns... Upgrade your weapons to mk 14 gold. (only upgrade mk 2s... sell a handful of cast off mods... and you can easily cover your costs).

    Since DR has hit I have fully upgraded a couple toons... upgraded what matters on a few more... I have been spending the D I have been earning in game no doubt.. not saving anything (so what)... EC wise I have MADE billions since DR has launched. I still can't believe anyone is moaning about the costs of DR.

    High yes... hard on casuals yes (casual being = to the top grinders in this game is a dead idea). To people playing the game though, doesn't seem anywhere close to out of line compared to most other MMOs these days. (perhaps thats why there all bleeding numbers)
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  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,055 Media Corps
    edited November 2014
    It's not 'my math' but ok.

    The infographic was called correctly - Costs of Upgrading Gear in Delta Rising, and not 'building your own gear from scratch.

    It is representative of a number of players because I was one of the players invited to the survey. My experience was well within those numbers. And while you might have started in a significantly different place, the survey was for people upgrading from existing sets - not starting from scratch.

    A total aside, I've just read up on another player who's costs were significantly higher than in the infographic.

    If I can duplicate your success rate, I'll upgrade all my toons. But I limit myself to a few hours a day 'cause the people I used to play with have moved to another MMO.

    It doesn't change the fact that a single toon casual player doesn't have a hope in hell.

    My two bits

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  • mustrumridcully0mustrumridcully0 Member Posts: 12,958 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Now do the same infographic for what people needed to do to be decked out with all Mark XII gear and Reputation Set and 4 Reputation Traits.
    Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
  • casper32433casper32433 Member Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Not sure where you pulled your numbers from but someone needs to teach you how to play the game a bit I think. ;) lol

    The costs are quite frankly not that high... there are plenty of ways to reduce the costs.

    As far as EC vs D costs.

    It really comes down to how you choose to play and upgrade. You can choose to use high end tech and spend the least amount of D or you can go the other way and spend almost nothing on Tech and burn more D. (for some people that have been hording on alts for months that isn't as crazy as it sounds).

    To be completely honest with you even if your math is Correct for the majority of the playerbase... which imo it isn't.

    Asking people to grind for a few months per toon... IS PRETTY LIGHT in terms of the standard MMO these days.

    Don't get me wrong I'm not advocating the stupid grind core junk this game has become... lets not kid ourselves though the game was exactly that for a few years prior to DR.

    To give you a better idea why I said your math is terribly wrong... let me give you an example from ONE of my toons.

    4 Gold DHC... Started with MK 2... Used Experimental Superior + Blue Research tech on each. (crafted the superiors for around 3mil each cost (as I did each my purple bits) and picked up the blue upgrades) Ran 20 weapons this way 7,200 D cost to roll to mk 7.
    Out of 20 weapons I had 7 UR and 2 Gold.
    Sold 1 gold
    Sold 4 Ur
    They didn't have the mods I wanted... someone wanted them... Covered all my costs on Tech and boosters.
    Applied Superior Tech to remaining 4 guns.
    Aprox 40 Superiors used in total Crafting cost aprox 900k Each = 36 Million (Still ahead after selling the previous crafted gold and spare URs)
    All 4 DHC now at mk 14... 3 Gold one still UR.
    Aprox another 40k in D

    No rush Will upgrade the last one in the next while when I feel like rolling. (no major thing to be honest with you)

    So bottom line I spent around 96 Million EC... and 50k or so in D... to make one perfect MK 14 Gold set (ok 3... + one mk 14 UR)
    I sold one gold and 3 urs ..... for a total of 90 Million(aprox) Ec

    So bottom line this set for one of my toons cost me 9 million EC and around 50k in D.

    I have repeated that now on around 7 toons... that all have nearly perfect mk 14 gold weapon sets.

    As for shields and engines ect... there not worth rolling for gold on... Fleet consoles are cheap to roll to mk 14. (again gold is not a big deal.... if it happens great if not there is for sure no rush)

    The only thing that makes any difference in running content is the guns... Upgrade your weapons to mk 14 gold. (only upgrade mk 2s... sell a handful of cast off mods... and you can easily cover your costs).

    Since DR has hit I have fully upgraded a couple toons... upgraded what matters on a few more... I have been spending the D I have been earning in game no doubt.. not saving anything (so what)... EC wise I have MADE billions since DR has launched. I still can't believe anyone is moaning about the costs of DR.

    High yes... hard on casuals yes (casual being = to the top grinders in this game is a dead idea). To people playing the game though, doesn't seem anywhere close to out of line compared to most other MMOs these days. (perhaps thats why there all bleeding numbers)

    Before you go saying you think someone's math i probably wrong maybe you should learn how to read the words associated with the numbers. Op clearly states from Mk XII to Mk XIV. Op is showing what the cost would be to the casual player that doesn't sell anything they upgraded becuase it didn't have the attributes they wanted. Good for you that you found a better way of doing it I applaude you, but please next time you decide to say someone is probably wrong in their math make sure you read things properly.
  • originalkaticoriginalkatic Member Posts: 81 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    This doesn't include the time or Dil required to get anything better than the default T5 ships to start the upgrade process with.

    If someone wanted to get an Odyssey, for example, at 2500 Zen, current exchange rate is around 153 Dil per Zen, so that's 382,500 Dil requiring a little less than 48 days of getting the full 8k Dil, whether that's all on one toon, or split up among many is irrelevant, that's for just one T5.5 ship.

    Even if you don't want a Cash shop ship you might very well have the extra Dil grinding, EC grinding, or Fleet Credit grinding necessary to get the various Fleet variants, then the upgrade token, *before* you even look at kitting it all out.

    In reality, these estimates are low.
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  • aspartan1aspartan1 Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    A fairly conservative metric image to be sure. A nice job nonetheless. :cool:
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  • sunfranckssunfrancks Member Posts: 3,925 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    The infographic Cryptic doesn't want you to see....

    Good job!
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  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    lol I wish it were that cheap, especially since it's easy for me to make ec. It's all about getting the right gear IMO, and the right gear costs a lot more, there's RNG on item bonuses etc. But as someone not loaded in tier 12 gear yet these estimates are super conservative, especially if I want elite gear. Nevertheless it's a non issue for me. I play for fun not to grind.

    Also where did you pull those numbers? 650k a day at 4.5 hrs a day? I'm a total noob to lvl 50 let alone 60 and I can pull 650k in 10 minutes. Super conservatively (for people that sit around talking more than playing) I'd say 40 hrs to pull the 120m ec mentioned and you put up a 138 hour estimate.
  • meimeitoomeimeitoo Member Posts: 12,395 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I don't see Rarity Upgrades in this graph: and they are the ones that add the ridiculous multiplication factors.
    ChCDpuh.jpg
  • rsoblivionrsoblivion Member Posts: 809 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Making gear at low level then upgrading it is pretty easy, but still costly. The hard part is upgrading things like Phased Biomatter or other speciality weapons, combined with the cost of rep gear etc...

    A full set from crafting alone will leave you short without some of the fleet gear like locators for instance.

    All in all that infographic is very informative and highlights the stupidity of the situation we now face. Especially with the Dil costs...
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  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    rsoblivion wrote: »
    Making gear at low level then upgrading it is pretty easy, but still costly. The hard part is upgrading things like Phased Biomatter or other speciality weapons, combined with the cost of rep gear etc...

    A full set from crafting alone will leave you short without some of the fleet gear like locators for instance.

    All in all that infographic is very informative and highlights the stupidity of the situation we now face. Especially with the Dil costs...

    Agreed, the Dil costs are insane, especially if you're going for elite gear (we all are) but the EC costs and estimates are a joke, the EC is easy as pie even without paying. To me it's not a huge deal though as I'm not looking to max out all game content within a week.
  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,055 Media Corps
    edited November 2014
    bierstein wrote: »
    lol I wish it were that cheap, especially since it's easy for me to make ec. It's all about getting the right gear IMO, and the right gear costs a lot more, there's RNG on item bonuses etc. But as someone not loaded in tier 12 gear yet these estimates are super conservative, especially if I want elite gear. Nevertheless it's a non issue for me. I play for fun not to grind.

    Also where did you pull those numbers? 650k a day at 4.5 hrs a day? I'm a total noob to lvl 50 let alone 60 and I can pull 650k in 10 minutes.

    Farming EC isnt' what it once was. Having said that it's based on the amount of ec the average player can generate via doffing, drops value, etc done in the time it takes to grind out 8K dil on a single toon.

    Several of the respondents ran alts for the 10 days with that goal in mind. Thier results were consistent which those numbers.

    The survey group argued over whether to include results for people who can play the exchange effectively. 2 of the respondents are fairly regular ship sellers, and have ec flowing like water. The goal here was to show a single toon casual player starting from zero bank, but with a full set of gear earned while playing.

    I can flip 800k ec myself in a short period of time, but I have to use multiple alts. That wasn't the target audience.
  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Farming EC isnt' what it once was. Having said that it's based on the amount of ec the average player can generate via doffing, drops value, etc done in the time it takes to grind out 8K dil on a single toon.

    Several of the respondents ran alts for the 10 days with that goal in mind. Thier results were consistent which those numbers.

    The survey group argued over whether to include results for people who can play the exchange effectively. 2 of the respondents are fairly regular ship sellers, and have ec flowing like water. The goal here was to show a single toon casual player starting from zero bank, but with a full set of gear earned while playing.

    I can flip 800k ec myself in a short period of time, but I have to use multiple alts. That wasn't the target audience.

    Alts? barf. I still only have 1 character and I run what amounts to a freebie torpedo boat with breen torps/cluster etc. I've played just long enough to turn all my dilithium into 3,000z and just got the intel ship from my advanced escort (8 zen left yay) have spent probably 25k dil max since I started playing. That said it surprises me the average person in your survey group couldn't pull more than 650k in 4.5 hrs when I can pull it in 10 min reliably.

    That said I haven't flipped items since I was like lvl 30.

    If I went by your info-graphic as a new player I'd log in, grind ec for <10 min, then spend 4 hrs and 20 min gambling at dabo, spending latinum on oodles of subspace party amplifiers and setting up dance parties at ESD. (Ironically not far off of what I actually do)
  • kamatsudashkamatsudash Member Posts: 36 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    bierstein wrote: »
    Alts? barf. I still only have 1 character and I run what amounts to a freebie torpedo boat with breen torps/cluster etc. I've played just long enough to turn all my dilithium into 3,000z and just got the intel ship from my advanced escort (8 zen left yay) have spent probably 25k dil max since I started playing. That said it surprises me the average person in your survey group couldn't pull more than 650k in 4.5 hrs when I can pull it in 10 min reliably.
    Well I'll say good for you that you can obviously play the exchange, as I'd say that's how your able to make that money in 10 min work?

    I believe the people the infographic are targeting... are not the ppl playing the exchange, or farming X elite STF or however the hell your making 650K-1 million+ in 10 minutes. More like people like me -

    People who log in, do rep grind missions (like the Borg easy ground missions, Nukara easy ground missions, Romulan space patrol's, etc), story missions (I'm still working on DR myself), etc... I know I can make maybe 500K in a solid weekend of play by selling all the loot TRIBBLE to a vendor. I've tried looking to see if I can sell rare/VR items I find on the exchange, but generally they are never worth it (ie they sell on exchange for maybe 500-2,000 more EC than at vendor, and there are lots & lots at the low prices). I can push more if I go all out and grind all the rep missions possible... but that is offputting, boring and blah.

    The only other way I could possibly see to make money is converting my Dil to store money and buying key's, and then selling the key's on the exchange. But I honestly don't make enough raw dil to constantly get 8K refined dil everyday (and this is with 20 doff missions generally always running, getting contraband and turning it in for the 2K dil, doing the 320 dil daily at the academy, and maybe a rep grind missions or 2)

    So yeah, maybe you should check the wording of the OP & infographic - "CASUAL". I'm sorry, but you don't sound casual to me. And your idea of 'what a casual player is ludicrous and ridiculous IMO.
  • sonesthenesonesthene Member Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Interesting Infographic: Costs of Upgrading in Delta Rising

    First, thanks to whoever organized the survey. It obviously didn't happen without a lot of work. Though I think the numbers are likely to be somewhat overstated for a couple of reasons.

    Nobody should be paying the highest costs you quote as the costs of raising crafting skills are low (in everything except time). When crafting was added it should have been fairly obvious that something that needed it was about to turn up. Any casual player with at least 2 characters could easily have level 15 in all necessary crafting schools by now.

    For beam upgrades the rare material rubidium is from CCA, and that doesn't seem to be as hard as some of the other ones. I tried it yesterday and it seems doable without upgraded gear, though I didn't do as much DPS as I hoped I did double that of the lowest DPS team member. I also tried ISA, we just missed the optional timer by a few seconds but got the R&D pack. So materials are not completely out of reach by playing rather than buying.

    I also expect material prices on the exchange to fall over time as more people become geared enough to do the advanced versions.

    So as ever in an MMO, it's marathon not a sprint. I'm not particularly happy with some of the DR changes. I believe that PWE has gone for inept cash grabs and grinding that make the game a good deal less fun than it was. But I don't see a reason to upgrade everything now.

    A few targeted upgrades per alt will probably be how I'll start off. You may decide to do things differently.
  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Well I'll say good for you that you can obviously play the exchange, as I'd say that's how your able to make that money in 10 min work?

    I believe the people the infographic are targeting... are not the ppl playing the exchange, or farming X elite STF or however the hell your making 650K-1 million+ in 10 minutes. More like people like me -

    People who log in, do rep grind missions (like the Borg easy ground missions, Nukara easy ground missions, Romulan space patrol's, etc), story missions (I'm still working on DR myself), etc... I know I can make maybe 500K in a solid weekend of play by selling all the loot TRIBBLE to a vendor. I've tried looking to see if I can sell rare/VR items I find on the exchange, but generally they are never worth it (ie they sell on exchange for maybe 500-2,000 more EC than at vendor, and there are lots & lots at the low prices). I can push more if I go all out and grind all the rep missions possible... but that is offputting, boring and blah.

    The only other way I could possibly see to make money is converting my Dil to store money and buying key's, and then selling the key's on the exchange. But I honestly don't make enough raw dil to constantly get 8K refined dil everyday (and this is with 20 doff missions generally always running, getting contraband and turning it in for the 2K dil, doing the 320 dil daily at the academy, and maybe a rep grind missions or 2)

    So yeah, maybe you should check the wording of the OP & infographic - "CASUAL". I'm sorry, but you don't sound casual to me. And your idea of 'what a casual player is ludicrous and ridiculous IMO.

    Casual implies non number cruncher play for fun not farming etc. and sorry but 10 min isn't hardcore farming no matter how you slice it. My gear is below that of even most casuals, I don't put a lot of effort in as this is my for fun game, I play competitively in other games. I earn money by simply playing, and I don't mean playing the exchange. "Casual" doesn't mean stupid or incompetent as you seem to think. It means no effort put in, just play for fun and do what's fun. If my gear is bottom level (it is, to the point of next to free off just finishing episode missions, not even upgraded) and I put little effort in then sorry I AM a casual, I put little to no research into builds etc. I get enough of that in another game I play to not want the same here. I AM a casual, what I'm not is incompetent, neither are other casuals I know.

    If someone spends all of 2 min asking in ESD how to make money the people there are more than willing to answer. Whenever I have a question I usually ask there.

    I have 1 character, several pieces of gear still Mk X (some green), char skills strewn about poorly etc. If I'm not casual by your definition then you probably don't even know what the word means.

    That said the "infographic" has no sources which is going to be necessary in this case for credibility.

    I hear about these DPS channels, trade channels etc. but frankly I'm too lazy to figure out what it's about. Sorry but I am a casual, and sorry to challenge your definition of what a "casual" is, because casual doesn't mean incapacitated.

    P.S. I can make pictures too. See that 18zen? That's what's left of all the dilithium I've ever made after buying that ship, (the one with that Mk X gear). If this is the screenshot of a "hardcore" player to you then I'm beginning to understand your issue.

    http://i.imgur.com/bcs2r3a.jpg
  • admiralkristovadmiralkristov Member Posts: 325 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    The Onion's infographics are funnier.
  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    The Onion's infographics are funnier.

    Only slightly, and tbh with 0 sources and the numbers this guy came up with I'm having serious trouble believing it. I guess I'm one of those guys that doesn't complain just to complain.
  • silverrain79silverrain79 Member Posts: 98 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Bravo! A huge THANK YOU to the people who put the time, effort, and EXPENSIVE TIME CONSUMING RESOURCES into making this a thing... I esp like the part where you prove experimental upgrades have a 0% chance to proc... It's about time someone used some hard numbers to put PWE/Cryptic in their place. I get that it's an MMO and it's not a "sprint" but looking at these numbers and my current daily play time... with 5 toons?! Buwhahahaha! Years, it would take me YEARS. And with the current state of this game... Extremely unstable graphics, disconnects, crashes, dead queues, horribly unbalanced game play, and the ridiculous time+effort= little to no reward... Nope, not worth the time or the effort.

    I love Star Trek, and I've loved this game even with all it's issues for 3yrs now... I've literally spent 1yr of my life in this game (total play time) but this is the last straw. This entire expansion has been like a stake through the heart of the game and a slap in the face to Star Trek fans such as myself. PWE/Cryptic should be ashamed.

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  • annahannah Member Posts: 201 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I can sort of believe those numbers.

    I recently made myself a set of MK 14 AP beam arrays (7 of them).
    I ended up using approximatly 100 Superior kits to do that, one kit is around 600k on exchange atm. 100 x 600k = 60 mil EC. and then 100k * 1075 = 107.5k dil.

    Rep gear costs a lot more than crafted. IIRC getting my emo beam to 14 alone was 25 kits or so.
    Deflector, engine, warpcore, shields.
    consoles are cheap to upgrade tho.

    I dunno, they don't strike me as unreasonable numbers.
  • sqwishedsqwished Member Posts: 1,475 Bug Hunter
    edited November 2014
    Thanks for the info. As some one who's not short of either ec or dil and after upgrading around 8 pieces of ground gear to Mk XIV very rare. I too believe it's to costly. Until cryptic reduce the cost related to upgrading I certainly won't be touching it again for my space gear.
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  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,223 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I upgraded all my 8 toon’s primary space and ground builds to MK 14 and doubt I bother with the rarity upgrades anytime soon. Yet the recourses were traumatic. Think some 350k dil times 8 so far. Was only doable because of build up recourses over the years and making use of cryptic’s event mechanics. Turn in contraband and BNP & Marks in the hundreds or thousands. You get a mil pretty soonish. I was also forced to be on the creative side a bit like in selling ground upgrades craftable by me because of available materials and buying others for the ec in need but unavailable to me.

    The only sad truth is that for a majority of players in game the whole upgrade process will be a futile effort because it in no way deals with current demands at end game. If u had a weak build b4 the upgrade but which was able to cope with old elite mode u will still have a weak build but will not be able to cope with new advanced.
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  • biersteinbierstein Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    I upgraded all my 8 toon’s primary space and ground builds to MK 14 and doubt I bother with the rarity upgrades anytime soon. Yet the recourses were traumatic. Think some 350k dil times 8 so far. Was only doable because of build up recourses over the years and making use of cryptic’s event mechanics. Turn in contraband and BNP & Marks in the hundreds or thousands. You get a mil pretty soonish. I was also forced to be on the creative side a bit like in selling ground upgrades craftable by me because of available materials and buying others for the ec in need but unavailable to me.

    The only sad truth is that for a majority of players in game the whole upgrade process will be a futile effort because it in no way deals with current demands at end game. If u had a weak build b4 the upgrade but which was able to cope with old elite mode u will still have a weak build but will not be able to cope with new advanced.
    That's kinda the big deal for me, can't decide if I want to continue with my for fun setup of torp boat or go tryhard mode just to be able to clear stuff.
  • ddesjardinsddesjardins Member Posts: 3,055 Media Corps
    edited November 2014
    bierstein wrote: »
    Only slightly, and tbh with 0 sources and the numbers this guy came up with I'm having serious trouble believing it. I guess I'm one of those guys that doesn't complain just to complain.


    Ideally we'd use figures provided by a third-party, verified in some meaningful way. In this case, the sample was small, but if you follow the threads here, on Reddit you find numerous examples where people think we the numbers are too conservative.

    At the end of the day, I know the numbers expressed are accurate and fit the costs I experienced, as well as players I regulatory speak with.

    Since this went live 3 hours ago I've had 2 players contact me with data samples of their experiences similar to the second poster. I think it would fair to say I will be trying out those techniques with LvL 1 gear tomorrow to see if it does make a difference with costs.

    As with anything - especially info graphics - take anything you read with a grain of salt.
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  • mightybobcncmightybobcnc Member Posts: 3,354 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    To be fair, the infographic and antoniosalieri are both correct. You can get some nice early rarity increases and make beaucoup EC by crafting and upgrading batches of Mk II equipment, but the average player is not going to do that, and in fact would probably not even think to do that. The average player is going to hold onto their existing Mk XI or XII equipment and start the upgrade process from there for various reasons that can include gear lock-in*, unwillingness to trash their existing XII gear that they previously shelled out for, and the aforementioned 'would never even think that Mk II upgrading was even a thing that could be done.'

    *there's no such thing as a Mk II Protonic Polaron, Spiral Wave, Andorian Phaser, Gravimetric Photon, etc. etc. etc. with which to attempt batch upgrading for example


    The infographic is well in line with my own research into what is possible with the upgrade system and in fact may even skew a bit conservative. That being said, however, I'd like to see raw data or a more thorough list of explanations and citations of what some of the points mean.
    • For example, in the bottom-left section, were the T5U upgrade tokens purchased with EC or by grinding and converting Dil to Zen?
      • I'm assuming Dil, hence the spike in dil cost
    • The F2P-Only sections are players that flat-out bought all of their upgrade tech from the exchange?
      • Or (ugh) the vendor?
    • For the crafters, how many Rare crafting materials were bought from the exchange instead of earned from doffing and drops (or converting old hoarded particle traces)?
      • How about Very Rare materials?
      • Did anyone eschew component crafting entirely and just buy up the components needed instead of materials to craft components?
    • Of the listed EC costs, how much is just the EC cost to craft upgrades vs the cost to purchase materials? (e.g. regardless of if you get your mats from the exchange or gameplay, it will still cost you 15k EC to craft each superior tech upgrade (crits excluded))
      • Technically I suppose I can answer that myself. An average of 230 superior upgrades would mean 3,450,000 of the EC costs are just from crafting.
    • Were any skip timers ever used?
    • In noting that the EC cost for F2P-only and $-to-Zen are the same, I take it that the $-to-Zen folks didn't craft?
    • Who are these survey participants? (names aren't necessary but like, were they all from one or a handful of specific fleets or frequenters of a specific chat channel?)
    • Did anybody use alts to speed up the earning/refining process?
    annah wrote: »
    IIRC getting my emo beam to 14 alone was 25 kits or so.

    Emo beam? lol? Does it listen to a lot of Fall Out Boy?

    Joined January 2009
    Finger wrote:
    Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
  • shpoksshpoks Member Posts: 6,967 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    Wow! :eek:

    /10 chars.
    HQroeLu.jpg
  • peterconnorfirstpeterconnorfirst Member Posts: 6,223 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    bierstein wrote: »
    That's kinda the big deal for me, can't decide if I want to continue with my for fun setup of torp boat or go tryhard mode just to be able to clear stuff.

    Youp. This is the most sad part about the upgrades. Experimenting with ones builds and tinkering out new ones to hold on the fun.

    All my 8 toons have different builds, DPS, Tanking, Healing, Debuffing, No Win Scenario, and also a Torpedo Boat on one which is so much fun.

    The upgrades work in a strict linear fashion… lets say as in they make you 25% more stronger from XII to XIV. Depending where you started from this can be quiet noticeable or not at all.

    Removing the former elite mode to have a solid mean for comparison and felt progression was the worst call cryptic ever made in my opinion.
    animated.gif
    Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
    felisean wrote: »
    teamwork to reach a goal is awesome and highly appreciated
    Bring it on
    coldnapalm wrote: »
    wishful thinking is not really a reliable source
  • annahannah Member Posts: 201 Arc User
    edited November 2014

    Emo beam? lol? Does it listen to a lot of Fall Out Boy?


    Just a lot of cutting.
  • admiralodanadmiralodan Member Posts: 49 Arc User
    edited November 2014
    This is a near perfect example of something I was trying to explain to one of my fleetmates last night... The cost is just to dang high...

    I appreciate that Cryptic is trying to roll back the clock and have the Dev's engage us and tell us what's going on again but that was only about 33% of the problem. The other 66% we're all the bugs and broken promises/delayed items, etc... and the massive cash grab they started with their Random upgrades/crafting system...

    I agree with him that Cryptic has a right/need to make money but I'm sorry I am not going shell out 80 dollars plus a character nor 100+ hours of my time for each to upgrade. Just not going to happen. I've spent way more on this game then on any game I ever have in the past. But not anymore... I have better things to do with my time than grind and better things to do with my cash then waste it on digital equipment that is way beyond overpriced.

    Again I come back to the suggestions I have made before and I will make again.

    1. Lower the costs in Dil for upgrading/crafting (30 to 50% would be about right) and make the upgrade tokens drop a bit more often or make them a select-able reward in the queues.

    2. Fix your broken game. Fix all/most the bugs, Fix/release the content and upgrades that you've been alluding too/coming soon (TM) before you try to run off and do your next season or half season or whatever...

    3. Stop turning every piece of new content into another cash cow/cash grab. I don't mind giving you my money if I feel like it's earned/something that I want. But I don't like feeling like someone is sticking their hand in my pocket and saying "want this?" gimme your all your money. Me giving you my money is a reward for a job well done... not a given because you say so.

    Until they fix some of the things above that are wrong. My wallet will stay closed. Hopefully others will as well.
    The Costs of Delta Rising Upgrades

    My new sig till Cryptic fixes it....
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