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Is my Tholian Recluse going to be obsolete in Delta Rising?
cosmicsunwind
Member Posts: 78 Arc User
I just came back to the game after a few years and bought one with lobi, I hadn't even fully got the grips with all the new changes in the game yet and then I recently learnt about T6 and Delta Rising.
I know that it says you can upgrade the Tholian Recluse Carrier, among others, for free (or some not?), people are calling these T5-U ships, right?
Why are they not just T6 ships? if T6 are better, eg; more bridge officers / weapons / console / device slots / better turn rates / hull / shield modifier / etc etc then won't you really be playing with a huge handicap and just making elite missions / stf's harder for yourself?
Edit: I also bought a few other lobi items actually, the hirogen armour (which looks badass by the way, look at this **** it looks like mass effect), some universal consoles, the ground weapons, are those going to scale up their stats too?
Then there are things like, I bought an Elite Tholian Mesh Weaver from my fleet which cost a whopping 100k fleet credits and 45k dilithium - I seriously hope THAT will get upgraded...
I know that it says you can upgrade the Tholian Recluse Carrier, among others, for free (or some not?), people are calling these T5-U ships, right?
Why are they not just T6 ships? if T6 are better, eg; more bridge officers / weapons / console / device slots / better turn rates / hull / shield modifier / etc etc then won't you really be playing with a huge handicap and just making elite missions / stf's harder for yourself?
Edit: I also bought a few other lobi items actually, the hirogen armour (which looks badass by the way, look at this **** it looks like mass effect), some universal consoles, the ground weapons, are those going to scale up their stats too?
Then there are things like, I bought an Elite Tholian Mesh Weaver from my fleet which cost a whopping 100k fleet credits and 45k dilithium - I seriously hope THAT will get upgraded...
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by cosmicsunwind on
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And hangar items as far as we know level with your captain so no worry. Universal consoles will stay as usefull as they are now.
So no worry.
Wow thanks.
I don't suppose you happen to know what type of additional console slot the recluse gets? Is it on Tribble yet?
Tells you everything you need to know about this stuff. Really awesome.
ya that's a nice link.. very informative.. nj on who ever made that.
You're right about that. I don't have entirely top-end gear, but it's very good, and I roll full tetryon weapons so I just turn shields to butter in a single volley combined with elite Meash Weavers. Also coming in first every time I do elite crystalline entity against loads of escorts tells me I must be doing something right.
Just FYI. To the topic at hand, I think the recluse will remain quite useful, even though I don't fly one myself. The stats and the hangar pets and the boff seating mean it will remain useful, especially if you upgrade it (for free).
If you really want to keep it uber in the expansion to come, you might consider getting an orb weaver, and putting the tholian web console on your recluse. That's a pretty good combination, there.
you are running a tet build? can you post it? only reason I'm running disruptors is I'm getting decent bumps with the counter command set.
I've played with the web console and the tet grid console and find them lackluster. maybe i'm not getting it with timing or something but there are more useful consoles out there for my money
T6 ships have 13 BOFF powers, all the various versions of T5 ships have 12. With the exception of the KDF BoP that loses the Ensign.
Both T5U and T6 ships will have 4 levels of mastery and the Intel Officers are not going to be on every T6 ship.
Starship Traits once unlocked can be used by the captain on any ship.
Edit: I meant to say 12, I have no idea how 5 got in there.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Slightly wrong also, dknight. T5 have 12 BOff powers(except that BoP). T6 ships are required to unlock the Starship traits.
Short answer;
No. With or without the upgrade to T5U. It will be just fine.
Longer answer;
T5U and F-T5U will have +1 console from what it currently has and can unlock all 4 of the Starship "passives" in addition to the Hull & Shield boosts,...
T5U and F-T5U ships have everything T6 does except; 1 Boff Power and a Starship trait.
T6 Intel ships, are a different animal and have additional capabilities and bonuses that T5U/F-T5U ships do not get.
Legend:
T5U - T5 Upgraded
F-T5U - Fleet T5 Upgraded
"There... are... four... lights!" ~Jean Luc Picard
Considering that the Tholian Orb Weaver is going for 160M+ on the exchange at the moment i'd say people like the ship and console.
I considered buying one when it was 145-150M, but without access to tribble and redshirt i would have no way to safely test the ship and with that risk the cost is simply too great for me.
I'm just saying what i experienced. the Weaver by itself is a fine ship, though it would be much nicer in a 4/3 configuration.
as i said before maybe I'm not employing those consoles properly but there is no set bonus, and the specials are lackluster IMHO. that does not detract from the two thoilian ships being extremely flexible, and perhaps the best ships of their respective classes.
T5U ships can get an 11th Console, plus additional Hull and Shields.
T5U and T6 both get the 4 passive buffs as you level.
T5U and T6 both get access to Ship Traits. The only difference is that when you buy a T6 ship it comes with a free Ship Trait whereas T5U ships must earn the Ship Trait from other sources: Delta Rep, Exchange, C-Store, etc.
T6 ships have special Intel Boff stations. The Intel Class ships have 2 such stations. Regular T6s have 1.
T5 and T5U does not get access to space Intel Boff abilities, only ground abilities.
They have already said they will not. None of the ships on the test server that have the T5U update gain a BOFF station.
T5U ships get a 10th Console (Edit: And yes there is one ship that gets a T5U upgrade and has no Fleet version. That is the KDF Nausican Garumba)
Fleet T5U ships get a 11th Console
Essentially Fleet adds a Console and T5U adds a Console so when you upgrade a Fleet ship you get two Consoles. Most of the time these consoles are different. There are exceptions to what I'm about to say. In T5U, FT5U and T6 Cryptic have said only Cruisers will have 5 Eng Consoles, Escorts 5 Tac Consoles and Sci Vessels 5 Sci Consoles. So we're not going to see Cruisers with 5 Tac Consoles other than the Bortasq and the Scimitar.
Remember the current 10 Console T6 ships are not yet Fleet Level... Man I'm hoping Fleet Level T6 don't need to be remastered. Cryptic have announced Fleet level T6 ships are coming too. I think we can all assume +1 Console and 10% more shields and Hull.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
But I will repeat something I said a few weeks ago: someone who spends money on an Upgrade Token for a 9-Console T5 is just wasting their money as all it does is turn a 9-Console ship into a T5 Fleet ship. No one should T5U any ship that is not at least Fleet quality, IMO.
Something not many people pay attention to or notice, but the Weaver's console does Proton Damage, and on a Dyson Science Destroyer with a full Proton damage set bonus is *extremely* powerful.
And a merry freaking Christmas to you too, Ebenezer.
-jonsills, 'Cryptic Why the sales..instead of Fixing XP leveling and this game?'
This is not fully correct. There are T5-U ships that will get an 11th console that are not fleet T5-Us. Ships which can be upgraded which have 9 or 10 consoles will receive +1 console slot. There are C-store ships and lobi ships which have 10 consoles slots which will be upgradable.
No, it just means there are not many of it avaiable. If it were avaiable in numbers like recluse, JHDC, Nicor, Narcine and such, it would cost no more then 30mil because of its performance.
Bingo. I got an Orb Weaver for like 40 mil when supplies on them were high. Nobody's popping Tholian boxes, so the ship's going for a lack of supply premium...
Right now, you have 9 console "T5+1" ships like the iconic retrofits, Armitage, etc. Then there's T5.5 "Fleet" grade ships, which obviously include all "fleet" ships, along with the lockbox stuff and most lobi stuff (lockbox has to be "fleet" grade because otherwise nobody would want those ships)...
The difference between a T5+1 and a T5.5 is 10% bonus hull, 10% bigger shields, and +1 console slot (the 10th console). Being that the T5U process gives:
Scaling hull & shields
+1 more console
+4 starship passives
Ability to equip starship trait once earned
and you have a fairly powerful ship...
Meanwhile, T6s "baseline" hull compares to the T5+1s supposedly, and the scaling process they have is "theoretically identical" to the T5.5 - so there's gonna be at least a +10% hull & +10% shield benefit to the T5U11 (taking the "fleet" T5.5 and upgrading it to T5U), and the 11th console vs 10 on the T6s, but T6s are getting the 13th BOff slot (of Lt Cmdr strength) and most ships will have access to intel specialization powers - Intel ships get it on their Cmdr and at least one other slot...
And sadly, existing universal seats don't get to use intel powers...
So is the Recluse automatically obsoleted? Nope... But then again, it might show it's "T5.9" status when compared to a straight up T6...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Not to whine, but that 1 Boff Power is a Lt. Cmdr.,its not like its an ensign, thats a pretty big deal.
For an Engineer it allows Aceton Beam 1 or Eject Warp Plasma 1, beyond that it is just rank 2 or 3 of existing abilities the character can already use.
For a Science it is Viral Matrix 1 or Photonic Shockwave 1; beyond that it is just rank 2 or 3 of existing abilities the character can already use.
For a Tactical it is Attack Pattern Omega 1; beyond that it is just rank 2 or 3 of existing abilities the character can already use.
That is not to say there is not some interesting stuff there, but depending on cooldown and rotation it might not be all that useful.
An 11th Console, plus 10% more Hull and Shields, could easily be worth any of those 5 potential new abilities or upgrading an existing ability to rank 2 or 3. It really comes down to build, play-style, and necessity.
The only real wildcard is the Intel Boff - as we do not have the full scope of what all their space ability choices are.
Just rank 2 or 3 of existing abilities? Oh, if that's all.... wait, wuh? That seriously ups the level of anything that they have. I don't know about you, but if I was an ship that got an extra Lt. CMdr.eng , I would be more than happy to move my Aux2Bat to up to that and have other skills at the lower level. If that Lt. CMDR goes to tactical on most Tactical LT maxed cruisers, they dramitcally jump in their ability to dish damage out. ANd dont foget adding a LT CMDR to a ship that has no high level science gives them Gravity Well or similar level skills. I really believe that you are ignoring jump in the level of capability that it makes.
If a person ranks out the level of the ability (Ens. =1, LT = 2, LTCMD =3, CMDR =4) thats an additional three points for that "one" extra skill.
As far as cooldown goes, you mean I have to worry that if I activate a power I have to chose which one to wait for now, when I may have had only one copy before? Gee, I think I'm hitting the button for the new Lt. Cmdr. power, that three point one, over a lesser one. And there a doffs that can drop the cooldown time dramatically, so colldown really isnt that much of an issue
If a person ranks out the level of the ability (Ens. =1, LT = 2, LTCMD =3, CMDR =4) thats an additional three points for that "one" extra skill.
When it comes down to it, very few T5U's will be competitive against honest to goodness T6 ships. Honestly, the T6's should be that much better, but for Cryptic to sell the T5U's as competitive is a misstep, in practice and reality. The T%U's really shouldn't be competitive, but the players shouldn't be drawn in to believing it either.
Apologies I missed that.
Lobi/Lockbox and 3 Pack ships are all Fleet Equivilent from the get go. Lobi/Lockbox ships are getting the upgrade for free.
As far as I know the Guramba is the only ship that has no Fleet version so no 11 Console Upgrade option.
While I could buy the Galaxy X and upgrade it to T5U, I'd be an idiot not to get the Fleet Galaxy X first.
I think the Guramba should require a FSM and a SUT and go straight to 11 Console Fleet level. In fact I think any Ship that needs a T1 Shipyard should have the option to buy both FSM and a SUT and go straight to Fleet T5U. Over time, they increase the Shipyard. And yes if you want to upgrade to a Fleet ship and don't have the C-Store version for the Discount you should need to buy all the FSMs.
FSM = Fleet Ship Module
SUT = Ship Upgrade Token
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.