Indeed, small fleet like yours, getting a couple handfulls of doffs or commodities.... easy. Fleet marks are abit easlier but small fleets cna struggle on them.... dil costs are horrendous..... when you have projects that take up to weeks of straight daily refining by a few people to even fill. Having multiple toons in different types of fleets it's east to see.... my toons in big ones, we can fill a 300,000+ dil project in less than a day.... in the small ones it can be open for months.
OP's idea is the equivalent of taking a gun out, putting it to the head of small fleets and just pulling the trigger. If the OP is so concerned about his perceived excess of dil, thn he can ask for an invite to one of our fleets and dump all this spare dill that exists there.
Yes, but anytime someone asks him to put his money where his mouth is, (or even answer simple questions) he pretends he doesn't understand what they mean.
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
People are done with reputations, fleets are done.
In addition to all the demand for buying dil priced equipment, there used to be huge extra dil sinks from fleets.
It is not a lack of demand as there is still much to use the dil on. Especially now that the new crafting system is released, Small fleets that still need to progress, Fleet Gear for players, Fleet requisition projects so that you can buy the fleet consumables from your fleet, Doffs, Resource relief doff project for crafting mats. Not all players are done gearing or leveling rep not all fleets are done progressing. Many casual players and fleets in fact are barely even scratching the surface of the dil requirements it is the cost of the zen that keeps most of the people I know from buying zen just for Dil to complete the many dil sinks that are already there. A sale on Zen that increases the supply of zen is needed more than the new Dil sinks to encourage people to buy the zen to get dil. As it is to me currently my very little extra money is worth more dil than the current rate is but I am not willing to buy zen for much more than 150 dil. My friends are the same way Money is tight for many players which is part of the reason they play this game.
Money is tight and you need dil are you going to go for a quick purchase of dil at 80 dil per zen or are you going to wait for it to get to 150 dil per zen before you put your zen up if there is no discount on the cost of zen. I for one will wait until the dil amount is up to the 150 or higher before I buy any dil no matter the demand for dil as nothing in the game is so important that I have to have it right now at a higher cost to me. So once again without a sale on zen I can not see the rate dropping back down anytime soon no matter how many dil sinks they add.
But I can see it having an adverse affect on the game adding too many dil sinks to the game driving the players away. We already saw many players driven away with the starbase Dil sink. I can only imagine how it would drive more players away adding the sink to the game via the destruction of items. That is part of what I don't like about eve after having tried it. (The destruction of your ship on a death) If you need more Dil sinks yourself deck out more ships, Get more character slots and grind up again, Join or create your own small fleet and grind that up. If it is just looking for the exchange rate to go back to the lower prices then buy up a bunch of Zen and put it up for the lower prices (don't know why anyone would do that)
People have posted a lot of gibberish that is hard to make sense of.
If there was any way I could cause this beneficial change to be put into effect through action, I would do it without even one moment's hesitation. I would put all of my money where my virtuous mouth is.
Please always bear in mind, my passion is for GLOBAL solutions.
Well it good that you are not on the dev team isn't it.
Also I'm calling bs on this "gibberish" that you fail to "make sense of."
I have read this whole thread and any time you pull that excuse, the question asked of you was clear and very easy to understand.
You just want to dodge questions you don't like.
Either way your silly little idea will never be a part of this game, and I thank God and the devs for this fact.
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
People have posted a lot of gibberish that is hard to make sense of.
If there was any way I could cause this beneficial change to be put into effect through action, I would do it without even one moment's hesitation. I would put all of my money where my virtuous mouth is.
Please always bear in mind, my passion is for GLOBAL solutions.
And Global solutions never work. So unless you turn everyone into the Borg which is ethically permissible since it deal the greatest global good in removing hunger, crime, and war while only having a little amount of harm done to them according to your definition, people will always oppose global solutions due to everyone being different.
Your problem is that dilithium is too high, but not everyone believes that. Therefore, any global solution you come up with will annoy players just like any solution Cryptic comes up with will annoy some players. Lots of us have stated that item destruction will actually raise dilithium prices due to players not using the current dilithium sinks any more. If you think we would risk our equipment that we have spent time on acquiring, then you are gravely mistaken.
Indeed, small fleet like yours, getting a couple handfulls of doffs or commodities.... easy. Fleet marks are abit easlier but small fleets cna struggle on them.... dil costs are horrendous..... when you have projects that take up to weeks of straight daily refining by a few people to even fill. Having multiple toons in different types of fleets it's east to see.... my toons in big ones, we can fill a 300,000+ dil project in less than a day.... in the small ones it can be open for months.
OP's idea is the equivalent of taking a gun out, putting it to the head of small fleets and just pulling the trigger. If the OP is so concerned about his perceived excess of dil, thn he can ask for an invite to one of our fleets and dump all this spare dill that exists there.
Exactly my fleets I have 8 toons in the KDF one and 9 in the Fed one. What ever dil I can make for the day between all the toons 50% to 75% goes into the fleet projects the rest is for my personal rep projects, gear or to convert to zen for services/new ships. I already spend enough dil just trying to keep up with my projects and the fleet as do the other 3 semi active casual members of my fleets to add the replacing destroyed items would just drive us all farther away than just being a casual player.
As it is I spent a fair chunk of money on the game when I could afford it To expect casual players to have to grind even more or spend money to replace gear that was destroyed would ruin the game as I am sure that many the players that choose to play do so for it being a free game that you can still make progress in as a casual player. The goal of a game is too be fun and what fun is it to be stuck grinding for stuff you have already ground out on that toon before?
Sure SWG was fun even with taking durability damage but the gear could be repaired but it got to be stupid with the destroying the gear and then having to have a new one made so they got rid of that feature of the game with very few complaints compared to if the feature was added after. Can you imagine what would happen on say WoW for example (Massive player base MMO) if once your gear reached 0 durability it was destroyed after you spent a few months grinding to get the character all geared up? How many of the 7 mill or so players would keep playing? Only the hardcore players would stick around.
If you did that on a game like STO that has what a few 100K players, how many would stick around Fed side would look like the KDF currently does for queues. oten not having non elite queues being the only things that pop, Fleet Alert queues are nearly non existent at often more than 20 mins to wait for 5 players to enter. I think that the dil sinks are fine as they are. Probably a new rep coming in October giving us around 2 months to get all the Crafting branches to level 20 that you can sink Dil into in the meantime if you have ran out of things to spend dil on yourself. The ship upgrade from T5 to T6 would make for a nice spot to sink dil for many if they go that route instead of the zen module ideal like the fleet ships this time. Too bad no word on that. (Not say that will be the case tho)
Right now the target audience of the game is the casual player and most casual players don't want to bother with a hardcore mechanic like this idea. They just want to jump in and play for their 20 mins to a few hours when they have the time and not worry about losing progress. Casual players generally want to feel like progress was made for what little time that were able to jump on for, and Cryptic knows this so that is what they are catering to. Not the Hardcore group that would make things stressful and near impossible for a casual to get in enjoy and maybe spend money on their game when their wallets permit. My friends and I spend money on games that we find fun at that time not a game that stresses us out makes us feel like we have to spend money to keep advancing.
Your idea leads to the very dangerous pay 2 win model that they are trying to steer away from. The Fleet modules, Lottery ships, Cstore ships are already dangerously close enough, the Item destruction would push it over the edge. Can you just imagine the P2W comments that would come from the destroyed module having to keep replacing all that Fleet equipment with Dil that you would get to the point of having to pay zen to get the dil just to stay competitive? no thank you... I will not have a part of that.
What sto needs most of all is for stakes to be added. When your ship explodes, there should be say a 10% chance that one of your items is destroyed. Items that could be reclaimed for free like prize ship and c store consoles should be excluded from this.
What I mean is, if your ship blows up, you should have a 10% chance of losing at random one of your weapons, consoles, engine, deflector, etc.
This loss should be permanent and require purchasing a new one from fleet or rep stores.
I also think that in PvP the chance of an item being destroyed on death should be much higher, as high as 30%.
PvP is obnoxiously boring in STO because there are no stakes at all involved.
Stakes make games compelling and immersive because they increase by a large factor the excitement of playing.
Since the game sorely needs new dil sinks, this would also help with dil inflation by forcing people who failed in combat to purchase new dil-cost items.
This is a terrible idea for several reasons, but the main one is the fast that they would have to completely redo the entire combat system. Think about this; say you're fighting the borg and your ship gets blown up, AND YOU LOSE YOUR ENGINE. You CANNOT MOVE WITHOUT AN ENGINE! MISSION OVER.
If you lose your warp core You CANNOT GO ANYWHERE. You would need to carry all sorts of spare parts to keep from getting stranded. And even if you do, what is you respawn in the middle of the combat zone, say, without shields? Once you're on red alert you can't modify your ship in combat. It give spawn spammers major ammo in PvP.
The only way I could see this being interesting is if the items are not destroyed, but just damaged. Then you could be able to repair them in or out of combat, but even then, I do not think that would go well with this game; It's just not STO's style.
Think about this; say you're fighting the borg and your ship gets blown up, AND YOU LOSE YOUR ENGINE. You CANNOT MOVE WITHOUT AN ENGINE! MISSION OVER.
If you lose your warp core You CANNOT GO ANYWHERE.
You would need to carry all sorts of spare parts to keep from getting stranded. And even if you do, what is you respawn in the middle of the combat zone, say, without shields?
Then maybe if Cryptic implements the OP's dumb idea, people would stop saying how utterly easy PvE is. And how Elite STFs are so friggen easy you can do 'em in shuttles.
Then maybe if Cryptic implements the OP's dumb idea, people would stop saying how utterly easy PvE is. And how Elite STFs are so friggen easy you can do 'em in shuttles.
Last time I checked you couldn't bring a shuttle into ESTFs.
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
Do what? I cannot create a dil sink by deleting my own items.
I am not asking anyone to delete his own items.
It is almost impossible to draw any connection between this line of gibberish you and others keep repeating, and the point of this thread.
Your OP shows that the dilithium sink issue is merely secondary while the primary purpose of your thread is about "Stakes make games compelling and immersive because they increase by a large factor the excitement of playing." So if you are not willing to show us that destroying our items increases by a large factor the excitement of playing, then why should we do anything you say?
Deleting your items when you die shows dedication to your idea that item destruction somehow leads to fun and lower dilithium costs. Words are meaningless. The only thing that actually counts in this world is action.
The thing is that you can't create a dilithium sink through any action. Only the devs can create a dilithium sink and their most recent dilithium sink is Crafting. There are a bunch of people that sunk dilithium into crafting so they could craft level 15 items.
Do what? I cannot create a dil sink by deleting my own items.
I am not asking anyone to delete his own items.
It is almost impossible to draw any connection between this line of gibberish you and others keep repeating, and the point of this thread.
no you do not understand what others have been saying is you do what you are talking about lead by example and show them what you are talking about something you don't understand and call as gibberish it is called lead by example show everyone what you are talking about and since you don't lead by example then they will never do what you are talking about. So as others are saying to you over and over show them proof of what you are talking about lead by example and since you refuse to lead by example then shut the hell up about your idiotic idea until you show everyone with proof what you are talking about
Do what? I cannot create a dil sink by deleting my own items.
I am not asking anyone to delete his own items.
It is almost impossible to draw any connection between this line of gibberish you and others keep repeating, and the point of this thread.
Winston Churchill was once reported to have asked a lady would she sleep with him for a million pounds. She said yes. He then asks if she would for ten pounds. Her response was she was not that sort of woman. Churchill responded with "My dear, we have established what sort of woman you are, we are just negotiating on the price."
The story is most likely untrue/exaggerated, or refers to a different person and not Churchill, but it does have a point - that is, what is the difference between a million pounds and ten pounds, or, one person deleting their kit after a loss, and everyone deleting kit after a loss.
Your suggestion is telling everyone to delete their equipment after losing - fact is, everyone loses at some point, so you are telling people to delete their own items.
What sto needs most of all is for stakes to be added. When your ship explodes, there should be say a 10% chance that one of your items is destroyed. Items that could be reclaimed for free like prize ship and c store consoles should be excluded from this.
What I mean is, if your ship blows up, you should have a 10% chance of losing at random one of your weapons, consoles, engine, deflector, etc.
This loss should be permanent and require purchasing a new one from fleet or rep stores.
I also think that in PvP the chance of an item being destroyed on death should be much higher, as high as 30%.
PvP is obnoxiously boring in STO because there are no stakes at all involved.
Stakes make games compelling and immersive because they increase by a large factor the excitement of playing.
Since the game sorely needs new dil sinks, this would also help with dil inflation by forcing people who failed in combat to purchase new dil-cost items.
So, go to your local hobby store and buy a d10. If it comes up on "0" (or whatever number(s) you want) destroy your item. Then you can have your high stakes without imposing your lil "hardcore" mindset on the rest of us.
Then maybe if Cryptic implements the OP's dumb idea, people would stop saying how utterly easy PvE is. And how Elite STFs are so friggen easy you can do 'em in shuttles.
Yes, if you change the difficulity of PvE, the difficulty of PVE would change. Crazy, isn't it?
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
A dil sink is by far the primary objective. The trick is figuring out an ethically permissible sink and also one that adds to the game rather than subtracts.
Adding a compelling new factor to gameplay on a global scale is a GLOBAL solution to this widespread problem.
These "neener neener" troll posts don't contribute anything except grasping at shame and piling it up all around. Out of simple decent concern for my brothers and sisters, I have to criticize them in a clear voice.
I am one of the people, by the way, who sunk dil into fast tracking crafting.
just going to point out as much as even normal mk 12 cost.
my stuff starts disappearing when I die I'm gone. and that coming from a "cryptic defender".
and your posting like a politician talks. I would stop before someone else finishes that line of thought.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.
Comments
Yes, but anytime someone asks him to put his money where his mouth is, (or even answer simple questions) he pretends he doesn't understand what they mean.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
It is not a lack of demand as there is still much to use the dil on. Especially now that the new crafting system is released, Small fleets that still need to progress, Fleet Gear for players, Fleet requisition projects so that you can buy the fleet consumables from your fleet, Doffs, Resource relief doff project for crafting mats. Not all players are done gearing or leveling rep not all fleets are done progressing. Many casual players and fleets in fact are barely even scratching the surface of the dil requirements it is the cost of the zen that keeps most of the people I know from buying zen just for Dil to complete the many dil sinks that are already there. A sale on Zen that increases the supply of zen is needed more than the new Dil sinks to encourage people to buy the zen to get dil. As it is to me currently my very little extra money is worth more dil than the current rate is but I am not willing to buy zen for much more than 150 dil. My friends are the same way Money is tight for many players which is part of the reason they play this game.
Money is tight and you need dil are you going to go for a quick purchase of dil at 80 dil per zen or are you going to wait for it to get to 150 dil per zen before you put your zen up if there is no discount on the cost of zen. I for one will wait until the dil amount is up to the 150 or higher before I buy any dil no matter the demand for dil as nothing in the game is so important that I have to have it right now at a higher cost to me. So once again without a sale on zen I can not see the rate dropping back down anytime soon no matter how many dil sinks they add.
But I can see it having an adverse affect on the game adding too many dil sinks to the game driving the players away. We already saw many players driven away with the starbase Dil sink. I can only imagine how it would drive more players away adding the sink to the game via the destruction of items. That is part of what I don't like about eve after having tried it. (The destruction of your ship on a death) If you need more Dil sinks yourself deck out more ships, Get more character slots and grind up again, Join or create your own small fleet and grind that up. If it is just looking for the exchange rate to go back to the lower prices then buy up a bunch of Zen and put it up for the lower prices (don't know why anyone would do that)
Well it good that you are not on the dev team isn't it.
Also I'm calling bs on this "gibberish" that you fail to "make sense of."
I have read this whole thread and any time you pull that excuse, the question asked of you was clear and very easy to understand.
You just want to dodge questions you don't like.
Either way your silly little idea will never be a part of this game, and I thank God and the devs for this fact.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
And Global solutions never work. So unless you turn everyone into the Borg which is ethically permissible since it deal the greatest global good in removing hunger, crime, and war while only having a little amount of harm done to them according to your definition, people will always oppose global solutions due to everyone being different.
Your problem is that dilithium is too high, but not everyone believes that. Therefore, any global solution you come up with will annoy players just like any solution Cryptic comes up with will annoy some players. Lots of us have stated that item destruction will actually raise dilithium prices due to players not using the current dilithium sinks any more. If you think we would risk our equipment that we have spent time on acquiring, then you are gravely mistaken.
I don't know if that would solve the problem OP is trying to fix
Exactly my fleets I have 8 toons in the KDF one and 9 in the Fed one. What ever dil I can make for the day between all the toons 50% to 75% goes into the fleet projects the rest is for my personal rep projects, gear or to convert to zen for services/new ships. I already spend enough dil just trying to keep up with my projects and the fleet as do the other 3 semi active casual members of my fleets to add the replacing destroyed items would just drive us all farther away than just being a casual player.
As it is I spent a fair chunk of money on the game when I could afford it To expect casual players to have to grind even more or spend money to replace gear that was destroyed would ruin the game as I am sure that many the players that choose to play do so for it being a free game that you can still make progress in as a casual player. The goal of a game is too be fun and what fun is it to be stuck grinding for stuff you have already ground out on that toon before?
Sure SWG was fun even with taking durability damage but the gear could be repaired but it got to be stupid with the destroying the gear and then having to have a new one made so they got rid of that feature of the game with very few complaints compared to if the feature was added after. Can you imagine what would happen on say WoW for example (Massive player base MMO) if once your gear reached 0 durability it was destroyed after you spent a few months grinding to get the character all geared up? How many of the 7 mill or so players would keep playing? Only the hardcore players would stick around.
If you did that on a game like STO that has what a few 100K players, how many would stick around Fed side would look like the KDF currently does for queues. oten not having non elite queues being the only things that pop, Fleet Alert queues are nearly non existent at often more than 20 mins to wait for 5 players to enter. I think that the dil sinks are fine as they are. Probably a new rep coming in October giving us around 2 months to get all the Crafting branches to level 20 that you can sink Dil into in the meantime if you have ran out of things to spend dil on yourself. The ship upgrade from T5 to T6 would make for a nice spot to sink dil for many if they go that route instead of the zen module ideal like the fleet ships this time. Too bad no word on that. (Not say that will be the case tho)
Right now the target audience of the game is the casual player and most casual players don't want to bother with a hardcore mechanic like this idea. They just want to jump in and play for their 20 mins to a few hours when they have the time and not worry about losing progress. Casual players generally want to feel like progress was made for what little time that were able to jump on for, and Cryptic knows this so that is what they are catering to. Not the Hardcore group that would make things stressful and near impossible for a casual to get in enjoy and maybe spend money on their game when their wallets permit. My friends and I spend money on games that we find fun at that time not a game that stresses us out makes us feel like we have to spend money to keep advancing.
Your idea leads to the very dangerous pay 2 win model that they are trying to steer away from. The Fleet modules, Lottery ships, Cstore ships are already dangerously close enough, the Item destruction would push it over the edge. Can you just imagine the P2W comments that would come from the destroyed module having to keep replacing all that Fleet equipment with Dil that you would get to the point of having to pay zen to get the dil just to stay competitive? no thank you... I will not have a part of that.
It won't be p2w because you going to not buy purples you will never actually use.
Sidenote, wow lost 1 million people since february
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/world-of-********-loses-800-000-subscribers-in-thr/1100-6421529/
This is a terrible idea for several reasons, but the main one is the fast that they would have to completely redo the entire combat system. Think about this; say you're fighting the borg and your ship gets blown up, AND YOU LOSE YOUR ENGINE. You CANNOT MOVE WITHOUT AN ENGINE! MISSION OVER.
If you lose your warp core You CANNOT GO ANYWHERE. You would need to carry all sorts of spare parts to keep from getting stranded. And even if you do, what is you respawn in the middle of the combat zone, say, without shields? Once you're on red alert you can't modify your ship in combat. It give spawn spammers major ammo in PvP.
The only way I could see this being interesting is if the items are not destroyed, but just damaged. Then you could be able to repair them in or out of combat, but even then, I do not think that would go well with this game; It's just not STO's style.
Then maybe if Cryptic implements the OP's dumb idea, people would stop saying how utterly easy PvE is. And how Elite STFs are so friggen easy you can do 'em in shuttles.
Last time I checked you couldn't bring a shuttle into ESTFs.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
I exaggerate a lil but you get it.
Also, not to mention the hundreds of threads started against Non-Fail Missions and how there is no challenge in STO any more.
Oh you gotta link me that!
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Cant find it now, youtube is presenting all manner of random stuff when you search for it...
Sorry OP but this has to be the most terrible idea I ever read on the STO forum - developer ideas included
Your OP shows that the dilithium sink issue is merely secondary while the primary purpose of your thread is about "Stakes make games compelling and immersive because they increase by a large factor the excitement of playing." So if you are not willing to show us that destroying our items increases by a large factor the excitement of playing, then why should we do anything you say?
Deleting your items when you die shows dedication to your idea that item destruction somehow leads to fun and lower dilithium costs. Words are meaningless. The only thing that actually counts in this world is action.
The thing is that you can't create a dilithium sink through any action. Only the devs can create a dilithium sink and their most recent dilithium sink is Crafting. There are a bunch of people that sunk dilithium into crafting so they could craft level 15 items.
no you do not understand what others have been saying is you do what you are talking about lead by example and show them what you are talking about something you don't understand and call as gibberish it is called lead by example show everyone what you are talking about and since you don't lead by example then they will never do what you are talking about. So as others are saying to you over and over show them proof of what you are talking about lead by example and since you refuse to lead by example then shut the hell up about your idiotic idea until you show everyone with proof what you are talking about
Winston Churchill was once reported to have asked a lady would she sleep with him for a million pounds. She said yes. He then asks if she would for ten pounds. Her response was she was not that sort of woman. Churchill responded with "My dear, we have established what sort of woman you are, we are just negotiating on the price."
The story is most likely untrue/exaggerated, or refers to a different person and not Churchill, but it does have a point - that is, what is the difference between a million pounds and ten pounds, or, one person deleting their kit after a loss, and everyone deleting kit after a loss.
Your suggestion is telling everyone to delete their equipment after losing - fact is, everyone loses at some point, so you are telling people to delete their own items.
So, go to your local hobby store and buy a d10. If it comes up on "0" (or whatever number(s) you want) destroy your item. Then you can have your high stakes without imposing your lil "hardcore" mindset on the rest of us.
Yes, if you change the difficulity of PvE, the difficulty of PVE would change. Crazy, isn't it?
just going to point out as much as even normal mk 12 cost.
my stuff starts disappearing when I die I'm gone. and that coming from a "cryptic defender".
and your posting like a politician talks. I would stop before someone else finishes that line of thought.
if I stop posting it doesn't make you right it. just means I don't have enough rum to continue interacting with you.