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cajala
Member Posts: 23 Arc User
What is the reason for not being able to move like a real starship in STO? Why can't we make barrelrols loopings etc. A plane or spaceship is able to move in 3 directions, but in sto its only 2, why is it so unrealistic?
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I don't believe this. It means there is a test version where we have a (more) true space flight and I don't believe there is such a version. So I think they created the game as it is from the start. It was surely a point of discussion during developpment, but that was likely the only thing. I myself gets sometimes desorientated when I have to spiral down to get there, turn, turn, turn ... where the hell am I?
A thing to consider is, this game has ground combat, a ground sphere, and space combat, a space sphere. Two total different environments when it comes to movement, yet it has to be handled by one game engine. So an idea is to make space combat/movement something that looks like moving in space, but isn't it.
And another thing. In space there is no up and down. Your space craft defines it for you. Suppose you like your ship more when it is upside down. In a true space simulation you can fly it upside down, while it looks to you the right way is up. It would make the designer silly of course, when a lot of players flip there ship over.
We can conclude. In the STO universe, up is up from the space craft of the leading character.
Frankly it won't take anything at all away from the game to let space craft act like space craft.
Yes there has been a tall ships feeling to the flights of these ships but there are plenty of scenes in the TV series and the movies of ships going inverted to give an angle to fire, the Defiant spiraling like a fighter jet, the Enterprise E inverting to protect its dorsal shield while firing at the underside of a So'na ship, the Alt universe Galaxy going vertical to bring it's phaser lance to bear on a Klingon ship.
Now it might be said that there are no roll controls built in, but there are pitch controls and the artificial limit to pitch angles doesn't need to exist. A ship being able to pitch to inverted then autoleveling out it would not only not detract from the game, it would look damn cool.
There have been plenty of games, space combat or otherwise that have had more freedom of movement and while at first it take a bit of getting used to it adds so much more to a game. Prior to the CGI revolution it simply wasn't practical for a ship on a tv series to have such a dynamic range of motion. Studio models were big and really not that durable. That's why in the later series and movies we see this move from straight in line fighting to all out combat in a more fluid and dynamic means.
They have adjusted the pitch limit before, and if nothing else there is no reason why they can adjust it again so that we can go vertical or near vertical instead of having to "corkscrew" up and down.
If they made it so ships were linked to a size/speed ratio then everyone would end up flying escorts because a ships turn rate is limiting enough already.
No great amount of coding would be needed to change a ships maximum allowable pitch angle, that is a single number that has been arbitrarily chosen.
They did tweak the pitch to increase it over what it was originally at launch, and that's probably the best we'll get.
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Perhaps for the fighters, but aside from a little pitching and yawing (even as evidenced by capital ships in the shows) we will be getting naval warfare.
Or perhaps submarine warfare is more apt.
Aside form small ships on the show (Defiant, Jem'hadar fighters,etc.) I have never seen a large ship loop the loop or do a barrel roll.
I think the space combat feels just fine.
We have however seen a Galaxy pull a flat spin while negotiating an asteroid field. (TNG 3x06, "Booby Trap") But that can be pulled off in-game with judicious use of the throttle and abilities like Aux2Dampeners.
Roddenberry wanted the space combat in TOS to feel like submarine warfare. "Balance of Terror" being based on movies like "The Enemy Below" and "Run Silent, Run Deep" really set the standard, which has been stuck to more or less since.
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I really don't care about doing loops or cartwheels in the game... though the devs claim the engine doesn't allow it but that is an excuse because drones and fighters DO perform loops... so my best guess is that its not allowed because the 'box' space of every space region is too small to allow a ship at full speed to do such maneuvers (height of the 'box').
... but if I could have the following commands:
Roll Left
Roll Right
and have the ship STAY in whatever rolled position I leave it in as I fly it...
well, the tactical options of ships and combat open up as one can truly use ship roll and pitch to maintain broadside rather than the autolevel system forcing you to keep turning.
1, its not the Dev's
2, its not disorientation.
It's CBS the IP (intellectual property) owner, they said no because they didnt like the appearance of upside-down ships etc etc.
been answered many times, and isnt likley to change any time soon either, personally a shame but meh, nowt you can do
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I can imagine the scene in Wrath of Khan where the Enterprise pops up in back of the Reliant replaced with one where the ship slowly circles upwards while Khan and his crew watch in amusement.
"Khan-What is he doing? Joachim-I think he's trying to sneak up behind us sir"
Fine Fine, does it disrupt canon in any way to let ships translate up or down, or to use the submersible analogy, surface or sink?
Cruiser must stay the same, especially with the bigger ones like the Odyssey.
The amount of pitch/roll allowed will increase at Sci-ships, escorts, then shuttles, then fighters.
It should also not be a sudden update and BAM it's here. I feel like it should be worked into a reputation system somehow where players will gradually earn more maneuverability with the final tire 5 awards being shooter mode in space for small-crafts, escorts, and select sci-ships. For the cruisers and most sci-ships, they'll gain some other abilities to balance things out, like manual targeting of beam arrays while your other weapons fires at a locked target.
There should definitely be no upsidedown ships, 85 degree max, just for the sake of visuals.
Also, while strafing would be fun, it should only be limited to one class of fighter per faction.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
Just watch TNG episode 'all good things', we see the gal X enterprise go vertical then roll over.
http://youtu.be/9HXz2oOlN0A?t=9m30s
(attention to the shields ... the effects are very good)
It's safe to say we're beating a dead horse, no DEV has looked at this or at the very least they've never bothered to comment.
Here's what I propose, allow vertical translation, that is the ability rise and lower like a submersible without pitching, if need be make it cost reserve power like reverse does now.
Provide a learnable captains power "Exotic maneuvers" that turns off the pitch limiter and boosts speed and turning for a short period at the cost of reserve power.
This is solely so that captains aren't continually forced to do ridiculous spiraling maneuvers to get at a target that may be just beyond the current arbitrary pitch limitation.
The game is 3 dimensional, our targets are often positioned well above or below our ships starting position, the current pitch limit is simply too shallow.
Thats a pretty good idea even if I do say so myself
It would also make for a nice addition to consoles and impulse engines, add consoles that increase pitch adjustment speed just the same as ones that increase turn rate. top impulse engine could have a turn and pitch modifier. then consoles or engines that provide either or.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek:
15% is nucking futz lol. how long would it take to get to your target if you just corkscrewed to the invisible ceiling in a fight that started 20 kilometers above where yo were going? an hour? put something heavy on the turn key full impulse and go fetch some food?
Chance might be zero but it definatly would be if people dont keep asking.
"I'm drunk, whats your excuse for being an idiot?" - Unknown drunk man. :eek: