Best fed torpedo boat?

pweistheworst · July 2014

I love using the Fleet B'rel as a torpedo boat with my KDF toons because of its ability to fire torps while cloaked, but I haven't managed to find what I consider to be the "best" ship for a torp boat on the fed side.

I think the Vesta does "okay" as a torp boat and the Risian corvette makes a decent "fast attack torpedo boat" despite the lack of GW to hold enemies for torpedo spread, but I'm curious what other ships people think make good torpedo boats on the Fed side.

So, what's your ideal Fed torp boat?

dahminus · July 2014

I was able to parse 15k dps with my charal.

I'm gonna say the xindi scort is #1

pweistheworst · July 2014

dahminus wrote: »

I'm gonna say the xindi scort is #1

What makes the Xindi escort particularly strong as a torp boat?

virusdancer · July 2014

dahminus wrote: »

I was able to parse 15k dps with my charal.

I'm gonna say the xindi scort is #1

pweistheworst wrote: »

What makes the Xindi escort particularly strong as a torp boat?

Hrmmm, even though my initial answer was going to be..."Best fed torpedo boat is one looking at a respawn.

" - this line of discussion has me curious.

I can't picture running a 5/2 Torp boat.

On the other hand, the Hunter - Nicor - and Tempest all came to mind..

jlpgaming13 · July 2014

While the regular Akira class doesn't offer any special powers, I think as a torpedo boat, it has the best design. There are few Fed escorts that have such pronounced torp launchers that flow with the design of the ship.

innuwarrior · July 2014

If you want a pure federation ship and not lockbox I would have to say Fleet MVAM.

The best torp boat is Fleet T'Varo.

ursusmorologus · July 2014

The Armitage/Heavy Escort Carrier is probably the most torpedo-oriented ship in the fed lineup. It has the Torpedo Point Defense console that launches a 6-photon spread at up to 8 targets. Its a console so it doesnt tie up a weapon slot. If you stack a bunch of photon tac consoles, and add in the usual assortment of photon torps, it becomes a 5th photon missile launcher (albeit with a long CD).

Also its a carrier so you can send your pets off to shoot and/or hold the target(s), depending

Its not really a counterpart to the B'rel and T'varo though, pretty different ship.

gerwalk0769 · July 2014

I haven't used all Fed. Sci ships as torp boats but I've enjoyed using a few in PvE.

The Intrepid because I can use many Sci skills for different builds.
The Recon Sci Vessel for the tactical consoles.
The Dyson Science Destroyer w/ the Secondary Deflector and using three Science Deflector Bridge Officer skills. This Deflector allowed me to weaken and drop some vessels shields.

Non-Fed. boats:

The Raider-it is squishy though.
The Risan corvette
The Chel Gret can work also.

mscowboy · July 2014

I'll put in another vote for Armitage. Even if it's gimmicky and and on a long cooldown... that torpedo point defense. Oh my god, that torpedo point defense. On a ship fully kitted out for photon damage, it is sight of profound beauty. When you fly this ship, you LIVE for that moment, every four minutes, when you can press that button again. Torpedoes fly in lines in every direction, you hear the sound effects of a billion torpedoes clip your speakers, and the universe itself explodes around you. It is bliss.

gurugeorge · July 2014

Fleet Sci Recon works well as a full-Aux Sci torp boat with its 4 tac consoles and room for TTI and TSI/II on the bridge.

neomodious · July 2014

I'm thinking of trying the MU Escort Retrofit with the torpedo defense console, the protonic arsenal 3pc, and counter command 2pc with the torpedo and either the tac console, or the turn console.

warmaker001b · July 2014

There are many great Fed Torp Boat candidates. The fact that Science ships can be effective Torp Boats and many of them have very minimal TAC Stations shows how flexible a Torp Boat build can be. Most can be good Torp Boats, it depends on how creative you are and building with that focus in mind.

Anything easily goes. To maximize the offense of Torps though, I'd say anything with a Cmdr TAC Station and 4-5 TAC Consoles are Prime Candidates. That's all you really need, honestly.

Also, do not underestimate the power of Photons even without using a TAC torp ability. With normal fire I've been able to get them to crit anywhere from 12k-over20k, but that takes a very high Photon focused build. With that in mind, if you will rely on Photon Spam to do that, it gives you a bit more playroom in what TAC station you'll require or even to what degree of TAC station you'll need.

Also, if you intend to live off the tried and true Grav Well + Torp Spread + Dyson Torp, you will need at the bare minimum the following:
Lt TAC Station: Torp Spread 2, but 3 preferred, which would then require LtCdr TAC
LtCdr SCI Station: Required for Gravity Well 1
3-4 SCI Consoles: You need very high Particle & Graviton Generator Skill for effective Dyson Grav Torp strength of pull and damage from the rifts

Science Vessels have been able to pull off amazing as amazing Dyson Grav Torp ships due to generally speccing high Particle & Graviton Generator Skill. An Escort can do the same and then some.

You have a lot of playroom and playstyles for a "Torp Boat." You could be a very fast moving "Bomber" or "Mine Layer." You could be a weapons platform standing off at 9.9km range spamming torps with minimal torp abilities. You could be a Transphasic Boat.

It all depends on how creative you are.

lowy1 · July 2014

Not saying it's the best, but the Tal Shiar Adapted Battle Cruiser packs a punch, plus has the versatility of a Uni CDR Slot.

http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=coupedeville_5104

rodentmaster · July 2014

lowy1 wrote: »

Not saying it's the best, but the Tal Shiar Adapted Battle Cruiser packs a punch, plus has the versatility of a Uni CDR Slot.

http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/index.php?build=coupedeville_5104

That MAY be true... but it's still ugly as sin!

lowy1 · July 2014

rodentmaster wrote: »

That MAY be true... but it's still ugly as sin!

Lol very true. I took a long to to think about this ship because it looks like something Cooter came up with in the barn.

pottsey5g · July 2014

The Avenger is pretty good. Its consoles its based on torps as well.

rodentmaster · July 2014

I was wondering about that. You have 5/3 loadout, good for torps up front, right? You have good hull, more so on the fleet version. You have LtCDR and ENS tactical boffs, with a uni that you can make tactical as well (that's a lot of torp spreads, THYs, dispersal patterns, etc).

Oh, and you can slot a cloaking device on it. Not an EBC, to be sure, but it would still allow you to place yourself as you like and give you a decloak attack bonus, etc.

If one were to do a 4 or 5 torp setup, what would you use?

One torp is easy to answer, but with 4/5 you get conflicting cooldowns. I imagine gravtorp, superplas, are must-haves. What about these high-damage undine photorps? What about TCDs or Chronitons, etc? What's the rule of thumb for multi-torp setups?

dahminus · July 2014

Hyper rom plasma is a must have for reset cooldowns. It's either the first you fire or the last.

Pure plasma torps have the hyper go first. Hybrid with photons due to gravimetric has it going last.

If I figure out how to post a video I can demo how to set torpedo firing priorities..out essential thing when using a torp boat

ursusmorologus · July 2014

I would look at the typical damage type from the avenger console and start with that. If you cant build around it, not much to offer.

rodentmaster · July 2014

The VATAS? It's useless TRIBBLE. Throw it away and put on normal consoles. You can use whatever type you want that way.

EDIT: I say this because I have it. I tried it a few times and keep throwing it back in the bank -- if even there. I can delete it and get it whenever I need to by re-purchasing the ship. The cloak console from Gal-X is far more helpful, tactically speaking.

rodentmaster · July 2014

Okay, how about this:

http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=avengertorptest1_5549

No skill points spec'd out, feel free to fill those in because I have some ideas but have never done a true torp build before. I've played with multiple torps of different types but never seriously.

Biomolecular photon because they have hella high damage, short reloads, oh and I have a couple banked because they were too good to recycle.

AP Omni + FAW is for "oh s$&#" moments involving targetable torps and so forth. I suppose you could use Target Shields subsystem instead to help with your offense.

Mines are dependent on the situation. Tractors for immobilization, TCDs for Beeg BaddaBoom, and Webs "because, awesome"...

The idea I was thinking of was that of a stand-off attacker that would use superior mobility/agility (hence the redundant speed boosts) to get into position OR out of trouble. Using EWP, tractor mines, and Theta Vent, would root/immobilize targets so you could then rush back to max distance and pound away at them. Healing is light, I admit it. You're relying on miracle worker an rotate shield frequencies as an ENG on this one. That also fits with my eng toon for whom I was considering this build. Cloak facilitates getting into your desired position unharrassed, bypassing aggro moments, etc. Also possible to use superior mobility to get out of range and cloak to lose aggro and buy yourself some breathing room to heal/reposition. Also: Decloak bonus.

That's it, in a nutshell. This is entirely academic and I have no idea how it would actually fare. Please modify the build and give me your ideas via a new link. I'm genuinely interested.

dahminus · July 2014

No experimental proton/proton stabilizer for the amazing photon 3p

Omni is fore...

Dispersal mine pattern instead of apb...

Tachyon beam of always bad

Gravity doff doesn't work with the gravimetric torp

Obelisk core? Why not a fleet core with amp?

http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=torpcruiser_0

That's how I'd run it
VD did a math write up on critd vs crith for torps and the critd actually came out on top

Cheers

Omni ap would be omni disruptor if SA had it

rodentmaster · July 2014

EDIT: I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just explaining my thinking "at the time" as to why those choices.../EDIT

No experimental proton because of limited arc. It won't defend you if you have any targetable torps coming from behind and I didn't want to sacrifice an aft slot to run a second beam.

Omni is up front because you can't put a mine up there. Originally had it placed aft but wanted that third mine. I suppose you could ditch it and run point defense system or torp defense system, but I have neither for my fed. Plus this thing will FAW in the full 360-degree arc, so I figured it's a good defensive weapon.

No APB for the same reason no plasmonic leech: Warheads don't get as much from it as energy weapons. DPB because it spits out 2 TCDs and web mines, it spits out a lot more normal mines (inclulding tractors). The thought was while repeatedly using speed buffs to run at target and blanket it with something to hold it still, soften it up and retreat to pound it. Nothing says lovin' like EWP and 2x TCD/web mines, eh? I doubled up because of the long CD on it.

Tachyon isn't set in stone but I figured it would help lower shields. Better than TR for a torp loadout, I figured. Could have gone for defensive (Sci Team? TSS?) but was hoping to add a little offensive power.

Are you sure gravity doffs don't work? Because I've been reading other folks say the aftershocks are quite nice on that torp. How else do you achieve them?

Fleet core with amp: Well no plasmonic and all weapons power diverted elsewhere means the AMP core won't deliver consistently. Obelisk is a good core. Not great. Readily available, though. The build isn't set in stone, naturally.

I wasn't really aware of the protonic set bonus. I must have read it previously and glossed over it. Good catch. I didn't put the lobi consoles onbecause I don't think the price is worth it. However, I did debate putting Rule 62 on there for the torp/mine damage boost. Nothing to sneeze at!

Your build is interesting, but seems more of a beam loadout that happens to run a few torps. I know, that's splitting hairs. I just figured the best way to use torps would be to use mostly torps, load boff abilities that maximized torp special skill uptime, etc. It is very enlightening so far and I'm getting some interesting ideas. If you ever put up that video about firing order, let me know. I'd love to see it.

dahminus · July 2014

Using beams gives leech sucking ability thus supplementing amp cores

Beams help decimate shields get to the hull. Apb may be hull only...but that's where torps do their nasty stuff

Pretty positive the grav doff doesn't affect the gravimetric torp. Never seen aftershocks from the torp.
.multiple rifts are caused by the multiexplosion of a torp spread

Rule 62 is base damage...definitely something to sneeze at

rodentmaster · July 2014

There are doffs to cool down beam and cannon special skills, even for basic subsystem targetting. Are there any that are specific to torp/mine skills?

Something that cools down torp spread faster, maybe?

warmaker001b · July 2014

rodentmaster wrote: »

There are doffs to cool down beam and cannon special skills, even for basic subsystem targetting. Are there any that are specific to torp/mine skills?

Something that cools down torp spread faster, maybe?

The only things that I know of to reduce TAC torp ability cooldowns are:

A2B builds
MACO / Adapted KHG 2 piece bonus

That's it, unless I've missed something.

Projectile Weapon Officer DOFFs only reduce the weapon recharge, not the BOFF abilities.

I have run A2B Torp Builds for the very reason of getting HYT/TS much sooner.

dahminus · July 2014

warmaker001b wrote: »

The only things that I know of to reduce TAC torp ability cooldowns are:

A2B builds
MACO / Adapted KHG 2 piece bonus

That's it, unless I've missed something.

Projectile Weapon Officer DOFFs only reduce the weapon recharge, not the BOFF abilities.

I have run A2B Torp Builds for the very reason of getting HYT/TS much sooner.

Also the temporal warefare 3p bonus, the wells back step console, and tactical initiative

thibash · July 2014

The Xindi reptillian boff also lowers the recharge by 5%.

dahminus · July 2014

thibash wrote: »

The Xindi reptillian boff also lowers the recharge by 5%.

But is bugged and replaces rom embassy boffs...just not even worth a consideration

nervehammer1004 · July 2014

I use a Tempest class Patrol Escort Refit as a pure transphasic torpedo boat and it works very well. The Breen set, obelisk warp core, 2 cluster torpedos, rapid reload transphasic consoles, the adaptive anti-borg transphasic torpedo all work very well together, plus you get to use the Nadion saturation bomb.

Set weapons power to 15, use the Nukara aux to offence ability and you get a ship that does well in PvP as well as PvE. It's fun to fly too!

Best fed torpedo boat?

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