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Cryptic: How to make the Crafting system better!
spacebaronline
Member Posts: 1,103 Arc User
Ok so Cryptic has made some changes and we all have had some ranting - now is the time to offer up some ideas on how they can change it for the better.
My Ideas:
Currently for a Level 50 character(98% of us) - there is nothing worthwhile to craft for some time. How can they fix this and let us progress at a reasonable rate?
Well one idea I had would be to put some things in each of the schools that would be useable - mostly that would be consumables.
1)You could craft batteries, temporary "buffs", XP boosts - all kinds of things. Yes I know they are available in other places in the game - but there is nothing wrong adding more places to get things. They also could make some of the consumables special.
2)They could add Large scale projects like a Starships - which you have to build - this would require components from almost all different schools and would be added to the starships construction.
So this would allow stuff not to seem like it was going to waste and would allow you to see progress on something you are crafting at the same time as progressing through the crafting system. Working long-term to produce something like the starbase system is much gives a much bigger sense of accomplishment then just watching your Crafting XP/Level increase.
3) They could increase the XP earned on the 20hr assignment from 6000xp to 10,000xp
So what Ideas do you have?
Al Rivera said that he wants useful feedback that tells them what they can do to make things better. So I think it's time to put our thinking caps on and offer up some idea to make the system better.
If we get some really good ideas that lots of people agree on - I will update the OP with those Ideas for easier Dev reading.
My Ideas:
Currently for a Level 50 character(98% of us) - there is nothing worthwhile to craft for some time. How can they fix this and let us progress at a reasonable rate?
Well one idea I had would be to put some things in each of the schools that would be useable - mostly that would be consumables.
1)You could craft batteries, temporary "buffs", XP boosts - all kinds of things. Yes I know they are available in other places in the game - but there is nothing wrong adding more places to get things. They also could make some of the consumables special.
2)They could add Large scale projects like a Starships - which you have to build - this would require components from almost all different schools and would be added to the starships construction.
So this would allow stuff not to seem like it was going to waste and would allow you to see progress on something you are crafting at the same time as progressing through the crafting system. Working long-term to produce something like the starbase system is much gives a much bigger sense of accomplishment then just watching your Crafting XP/Level increase.
3) They could increase the XP earned on the 20hr assignment from 6000xp to 10,000xp
So what Ideas do you have?
Al Rivera said that he wants useful feedback that tells them what they can do to make things better. So I think it's time to put our thinking caps on and offer up some idea to make the system better.
If we get some really good ideas that lots of people agree on - I will update the OP with those Ideas for easier Dev reading.
Post edited by spacebaronline on
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"Stop ruining the game with your mad lust for money"
As to your ideas SBO, neither are that workable. For starters, anyone at max level probably doesn't need the run-of-the-mill consumables. And the Starships one won't work because Cryptic would rather you spend zen, lobi or gamble on Lockboxes than actually put time and effort into your own ship.
As to my own ideas, i'm not overly disappointed with the system itself. Personally, i'd have dumped the Dilithium costs involved in crafting items altogether (whilst still retaining the Dil Vendors) so crafting could serve as an alternative method of getting good gear for those without the endless reams of Dilithium or money some players have.
As a result, crafting would be cheaper, but wouldn't neccessarily give you what you were really after (with random Mods and what have you) but Dil Vendors would cost more than crafting but you knew what Mods and rarity item you were buying.
As to the fact that since most level 50 players are now having to craft Mk II gear, I would also throw into the mix that your own level, and previous crafting experience, should count for something when it comes to what you can make and how good you can make it.
Oh, and last but by no means least, it shouldn't take eleven months to max it out. Craftsman can make an Aston Martin in about three months. This should be like a rep system. No more than a month, tops, to max a school (or ideally, all of them).
My ideas are more like "Place-holders" I don't consider them overly good - just something to get the topic rolling. Still I think something really needs to be added to the system that you can craft at low levels where it is actually useful. No-one really likes to waste resources creating "vendor-Trash"
So we need to find some other things to create that are actually useful at the lower levels.
And my 3rd point is still a good one I think : Increasing the XP payout of the 20hr from 6k to 10k
Wont matter.
There is a dedicated subforum for people testing new systems on tribble.
It tends to attract relatively thoughtful posts that delve, in detail, into the impacts of new mechanisms.
However, according to Mr Rivera in the now infamous STOked podcast, nobody posted anything that he could use as feedback before 9.5 went live.
This, depsite the fact that any one of us can go to that subforum and see what kind of feedback is there.
There is lots.
Al Rivera may have said that he wants feedback, but he clearly doesn't.
It's just something he says from time to time.
However, like his statement that there was no feedback for 9.5, it can not be considered the words of an honest man.
I am seeing off-topic posts in this thread.
If you want to diss the crafting system there are other threads where you can leave that feedback.
Any further off-topic posts will be moderated.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
One way to do that would be an alternate 20hr assignment in each school that's only open to level 50 characters and rewards more XP than the basic research assignment. They could make that assignment go away when you reach a certain level of crafting in that school.
Another way would be to give all level 50 characters a crafting XP boost that would accelerate their progress to level 5 in a single school or could be spread across other schools (like a CXP or Mark boost does).
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Also, good lord is it annoying to crafting a bunch of white components. The projects take like 5 seconds each or something, but you need to craft them one by one. Can't we get like a 10x component craft project to slot? I'm gonna get an ergo injury in a week at this rate.
According to the STOked interview, sounds like that's exactly what they plan to do (active development).
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
This having to do each "school" is just too much. Due to this, I won't be wasting more time crafting until they do something better.
USS Casinghead NCC 92047 launched 2350
Fleet Admiral Stowe - Dominion War Vet.
Reinstate the ability to slot multiple same-school crafting assignments, but with a tweak. Only allow a max of 3 assignments per school, and have them scale down as you run them. Example:
Assignment 1: 20hr, 6k xp (10k crit).
Assignment 2: 20hr (maybe 22), 4k xp (8k crit).
Assignment 3: 20hr (24 if setting assignment 2 at 22), 2k xp (6k crit)
NOTE: Assignment 2 only becomes available after 1 is in progress, and 3 when 2 is in progress.
To me, that feels like a good middle ground. It still progresses kind of slow, but probably tolerable to many (myself included).
Every
Last
ONE
And leave all commodities, bits, bobs, and spindles up to the players to create.
Then create a market interface to sell it all.
Hint: Look at Eve Online. Their system has functioned so well that it's now studied at Oxford and Harvard in a serious way (concerning economies).
The only way Cryptic/PWE games are studies in how NOT to do something, and why the games are still floating.
Oh... I figured it out: It's a tax loophole! A game can loose bucketloads of money and it's used to offset the profits from another project and pay not a cent in taxes.
I've already ran into this problem with tritanium I think it is. It's a green mat and it's hard to find.
This is looking at it from a level 15 toon. It's hard to craft when you dpon't have the mats and no, I'm not throwing cash at low level garbage.
green mats should still drop from normal level queue events.... which most of the fleet ones are, and you can access those at lower levels.
Or - god forbid - you could just do away with timegates altogether and let players progress at a pace that suits each individual player, without endlessly holding out a hand and asking for money/useful currency.
I know, I know - i'm a radical. Give the players what they actually want? Who does that anymore, right?
Oh, great. Another feeble attempt to get people using Gateway - a system which, by my last encounter, resulted in several account hacks due to unsecure connections or some such, no?
Thanks Blue. I know people are upset and I am too. Posting some feedback on how to improve the crafting system might get nothing done, but posting the negative stuff certainly wont.
Of course the devs use "metrics" as their primary tool to tell them to adjust something and if people give up on crafting then they might do something. I would prefer that they be at least some community ideas out there that we can at least point to when that time comes. Some stuff that is not buried in a lot of angry and negativity
We all want the game better. That's why our emotions are so strong about it.
Cheers
Craftable melee weapons like bat'leths and swords.
Species specific designed looks. Fed phasers, Klingon disruptors, RR plasmas.
If you have 100% purple for success, You get to pick the mods. (I find it funny crafting a turret that helps steer the ship.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I like the way you think!
Adding a function where you could pick the mods for a piece of gear would certainly make crafting appeal to a LOT more people.
Being able pick mods for a piece of gear is probably the number one thing people want from a crafting system.
Right now since it is starting off - they need to do one of 2 things VERY SOON
1) Increase the amount of XP you get from the 20hr or from crafting vendor trash - or
2)add some stuff - right quick - which can be crafted at low crafting levels but is USEFUL to Level 50 players.
My character Tsin'xing
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
2. Like one of the above posters said...be able to slot more in a queue type system.
The best idea I've read, and then thought about, was to refocus crafting on to what it actually is in Star Trek. It's less about making new things and more about improving and tuning the things you have. Retrofit, refit, remake, refurbish... it fits into the system. Instead of making a class XI item, why not make a crafting fit where I can create the item I'd like, and then upgrade and make it again. Why not let me refine those green lasers with the stats I'd like to more "rare" versions.
Put in the ability to tune and tweak your gear, rather than just dice rolling and seeing what happens. You can even do the (terrible) thing of putting in money gates for certain properties or bonuses.
More than that, I just wish they'd focus the crafting and DOFF system outside of the combat sphere. Let us make more than weapons and consoles. Let us build decoration and appearance stuff, or let crafting to certain levels customize gear in new ways. But ultimately, just make the stuff that comes out of crafting as useful, or in parity, with the other gear you can grind out.
Oh, and add tricorders to the game as an actual piece of equipment. I'd craft a lot more to make those.
Basically, take something apart and put it back together a different way to make it work a little bit different to solve a specific problem.
Admittedly, the concept was a bit vague even referencing examples like Kirk building a primitive mortar to defeat a Gorn captain, Geordi modifying the Enterprise's deflector dish, etc.
I'd love to see Cryptic create a mission that actually featured Crafting to do something like that. Maybe an optional if your level in a particular school was high enough or something.
With this new crafting system, I see an opportunity to come closer to achieving my original vision of 'kitbash on the fly' in some small way.
I have some different thoughts about how to do that.
Method One:
We now have a recipe of components that have to be put together in order to create our desired gear.
All that's required now are some missing pieces of the puzzle:
Not near as simple to do as it sounds, I'm sure, but this would be my ideal.
When gear is broken down into components, the components are marked as 'Used' and can't be used for normal crafting assignments. However, they can be re-used and re-combined to make reassembled gear. There might be a chance that disassembling gear sometimes results in a destroyed component.
The reassembled equipment could be marked 'Experimental' or 'Prototype' to distinguish it from normal crafted gear and might be unreliable somehow.
Experimental gear would be easier to craft than normal R&D gear as one of the tradeoffs for not being reliable. Thus, it would be more feasible to create at lower levels.
This could be added on to the current Crafting system at any point in the future. But it's a lot of work, I think, and not very likely to happen.
Method Two:
Add in a new kind of crafting assignment that creates a "Modification Kit". There would be a variety of Modification Kits available for various kinds of gear.
Add "Modify" assignments to the crafting system that allows the player to combine an appropriate Modification Kit to standard gear.
These Modify assignments would create Experimental gear with specific characteristics that is temporary in nature.
Depending on what it is, it would allow a set number of uses or activations after which the gear is broken and disappears from the slot. This would be fine for ground or ship devices, but not for something like ship engines or ship weapons.
Or, this Experimental gear could be unreliable in some way (chance for failure, longer cooldowns, etc.)
Method Three:
Add modular gear to the Crafting system. Depending on the quality, each piece of modular gear would have one to three (or even four) slots that could be filled with a module that could be crafted.
Each module would have one specific ability, either a modifier, a proc, or a click power. Modules could be swapped out of combat and swapping would trigger the normal cooldown for slotting gear.
Because modular gear is more complex, it would take comparatively longer to craft than normal crafted gear, require more materials overall, and be more difficult to craft. The tradeoff is a piece of gear that can be reconfigured 'on-the-fly' and ultimately cost less in time and resources than crafting multiple pieces of gear to get the same flexibility.
None of these methods necessarily require scrapping the Crafting system and starting over, but each would have challenges for the Devs to implement them.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
You should be crafting for the purpose of actually crafting. Not to grind out an exp bar. This is the heart of the problem.
So what does the crafting system offer for useful things to craft? We have components, items, and consumables.
Crafting the components alone should be something desirable to do. Even if you merely sell them on the exchange to higher end crafters. To that effect all components should take at least one hour to craft and offer the highest exp vs time reward. This will provide an actual purpose to unlocking more 'slots' and create an extra role for a player if they choose.
More consumables should be introduced that provide a reasonable exp vs time reward plus something actually useful for the player to use. Even if they were just large shield batteries they would be infinitely more useful than the 50th shield array mk 6 that would promptly be vendored.
They actual did a good job on the item part.
My character Tsin'xing