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The PvP System
flash525
Member Posts: 5,441 Arc User
Nice, short and simple question here. A lot of players claim that the PvP System is broke. How is it broke? Surely player X enters the zone to fight player Y; whoever is the better officer, or whoever has the better kit/build would likely be the victor.
What exactly needs fixing?
I'm just curious.
And no, I don't PvP myself, not very often anyway.
What exactly needs fixing?
I'm just curious.
And no, I don't PvP myself, not very often anyway.
Post edited by flash525 on
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PvP also has issues in that there should be more objectives to PvP then simply Player A defeating Player B. What most people want is the story and objectives that goes along with the PvP. Capture the bridge, hold the territory, etc. It is not just about defeating someone. They want PvE-like stories/missions, only they want to fight other players rather then the AI.
The Space PVP in this game is so unbalance, that is not even worth it to play it. There are a lot of OP stuff and a lot of useless stuff, and the OP stuff makes the game unplayable.
Then there is the fact that we have the same 2 basic systems games from Open beta with the same basic maps, so it gets boring. The rewards are a joke and there is no motive to play it, just for the fun (but after 4 years is not longer fun) and the challenge (now with all the OP stuff is not even worth it).
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The fact that a fully shielded with no hull loss cruiser can be vaporized in the matter of 1sec, or less. Poof vaporized 2 secs later ship's computer voice "warning hull is at 0%."
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The only thing which needs to be fixed is the PvP'ers impression that this is a PvP-Game.
Or you could just fix every thing from too much damage to too much healing (two wrongs doesnt make it right) thereby breaking PvE really hard.
Its like: we either do the impossible (get PvPers to aknoledge that they are not important) or the hard way with many fixes, manpower and money (e.g. bringing all in line). Or, way 3: we do nothing.
Guess which way Cryptic is going since ages?
US PvPers have been asking for them either to dedicate resources or kill off the whole aspect of the game. As long as they keep PvP in the game they are showing that there is a place for it, maybe way down the list but their is a place.
I do not know if you are trolling we have no impression that this is a pvp game we know its a PvE game with PvP. Personally I think that it is the other way around, I think PvEers think that PvP should be more like PvE where all you have to do is make left turns until the NPC dies and to add variety on the next one just turn right. :rolleyes:
but pvpers are important.As shown on all new games that have success like war thunder ,world of tank and so on PvP is the most important aspect of online gaming.Npcs are for singleplayer games.If this game has no resources invested in PvP is because the game designer has no clue what hes doing or how pvp works .All mmos failed simply because they had no pvp ...all games that had large battles or open pvp had succes.
Also no one cares how is PvE ...after you play it once it doesnt matter and should not matter unless I play the game singleplayer offline.I don't need friends to kill the same npcs 3000 times.
Simply ask what is wrong with the game... and its a laundry list.
PvP and PvE mechanics are the exact same. Therefore they are both equally broken.
Same issues on both sides. Just cruise the PvP forums and you will get the general idea... doffs / boff passives / specific skills / multiple badly balanced items / odd math synergies / different match formulas for one thing over another / many many poor item designs... where a handful of items are quite honest useless (like the rule 62 console is a good example of a console that works on the lesser of the two math formulas for dmg) / and in general just plain bad game design.
What is most frustrating is you will find most of us still here complaining 4 years in because the core game has so much potential.
i would just like to say none of the pvp community would ever want any of that.
what we want is balance and good games....pug stopping is for NOOBS
Very true. Many of the earliest MMOs really didn't have PvP or had very stripped down verisons of. Games like LOTRO existed for a few years I think or so with no pvp at all. The PvP they added later was great though. What those early games had though where dedicated PC gamers who where happy to play games where pretty much all the content required a team... and half of it a massive raid party. These days we pretty much have 2 types of MMOs... theme park and PvP. I think we have seen more PvP MMOs lately because they are simply easier to develop. No need to hire story writters, world creators, teams of level designers, voice over folks... ect ect. I think the market is at a cross roads myself. I don't see any major theme park styles having much success anymore. To expensive to much competition, to much player burnout... and now all those "Lite" gamers theme parks like WOW sucked in are moving to the web junk more and more, or consoles even... I really don't see anyone pulling in the wow crowd. You don't see anyone talking about wow killers anymore. lol
There are only a couple games that have pulled off a good split... GW2 is the only one that comes to mind for me honestly that is both theme park and half decent PvP MMO. Cryptic tried with STO... but after 4 years of really not doing anything with PvP it now feels more like some of the junk PvP that was tacked onto some of those early MMOs. lol
you sir are a ****, have you ever thought that maybe its "the casual player"/your self that is ruining the game for the pvp'ers...
Discaimer: If you want to know why certain powers or combos are ruining the fun, just browse through the PvP forums. We have been they at it since long before F2P.
1) Fun matches
2) Diversity: different ship and player roles fill different needs. instead of one combo to rule them all. There are too many best options in game, both with gear, traits, ships....
3) Balanced matches, disregarding extreme outliers in gear and skill, 3 sci + 2 tac will always beat 3 eng plus 1 tac and 1 sci. Better matchmaking is necessary to have fun games. Oh the joy at the beginning of a queue pop when i realize we have no sci on our side....
4) short matches and queue wait times. Waiting 30+ min on my kdf toons for a match is no fun. 45min+ arena matches can be fun, but only if they are exceptions. 20 min until the first kill is not fun.
5) Less freedom of players to create builds that exceed expectations( based on dev quote from a few months back). Almost every value in game can be super charged: burst, defense and resists, healing, .... it's no fun. Less extremes more balance
6) Free or much cheaper respecs, i want to tweak my builds often
7) either pvE that caters to the different roles that abilities, ship and player classes have in the game, or a very quick and unobtrusive way to switch roles. Having 5 recluse healers in an ISE pug is fun once because it is rare, but it isn't really fun. Because there is nothing for them to heal, that advances the mission or helps the team.
8) Better UI, less spam.
9) SKill, timing, coordination should become more influential, while gear and items should be less so.
10) less forced PvE grind to stay competitive, i m fine with rewarding pve grind via good gear for pvp, but the ratio is off
11) better rewards for actually pvp'ing, maybe through access to non pve gear that is conpetitive, but different.
12) Better documentation, and QnA, too many bugs around for too long. Too many trade secrets
13) A new wallpaper or game mode would be nice,
14) There are too many ultra rare items, with unique effects, that only matter an pvp, and that when stacked can ruin the fun for everyone. These mostlry doff abilities need to be reigned in badly.
a history of sto pvp: 2010 - 2011
a history of sto pvp: 2012 - 2013
Its broke in a fashion that new toys, spam, consoles, etc dominate the early days essence of this game back in the old days, where flight, teamwork, steering, timing, maintaining arc, throttle control precision, etc was more important then a click on a button or some idiotic passives.
There is no skill involved anymore. Everything has been made easy for anyone to pull off. Lookat vaping, it used to be an art where strict timing was needed, nowadays you can just stack all the possible daamge buffs, add some pay2win consoles on it and you can **** a single guy with only 1/3 of the damage potential your ship can put out.
Also easy play builds like FaW have gone through the roof, whats the fun in any game if everyone just spams an ability to damage everyone at the same time with idiotic powercreep? Just fly in the middle of the battlefield and there we go. How fun.
Furthermore there is zero conrol on how much spam you can bring in a match as well, stuff like consoles etc have no limit on their use, you can stack your whole 10 slots full of toys without any implications, you can endlessly spam it one a single guy, especially if the whole team does it. Other MMO's have limits on these kind of abuses.
Pets that have gone nuts like Pets that basically give you multiple tractor beams for free, TB with multiple copies where a single beam does better then a fully specced TB3 with Grav gens on 9, pets that have about the same hull as you or me these days, and people love spamming them. No idea why, I guess they like their pets to do all the work for them
STO's PvP in the high tiers has been almost unreachable by the massive amount of grind you have to do, and its STILL increasing, it was a very steep learning curve back 2 years ago, its just inconceivable right now on how much you actually have to do in order to go up against someone else who has been keeping their toons up to par with the latest grind.
STO has become a casual game, and PvP is just a troll fest now. I think this is how Chinese MMO companies see PvP as vital and fun, add more and more. Sure some people still find it fun, some newcomers probably think the game in this state is as balanced as it can possibly be. And they probably find spamming toys with black holes, rifts, etc is awesome.
You want more reasons? I have plenty left
To each their own, some people want fun, others see fun as spamming the latest toys, others see fun when these toys are ditched from the game, I personally like challenges, and this game no longer provides me challenges.
If the only thing PvPers wanted was to shoot each other in an empty room, well, they could have been doing that happily for the last 4+ years.
dunno, still have to try something like that. I agree STO is a PvP game, and premades are actually coordinating themselves calling buffs and debuffs accordingly. It's a good thing they split queues because of this.
I don't think it's broken, if people look like to bend space-time on their own willing in PvP, probably it's because they learnt how to do it.
and doffs. doffs interact with abilities and change their effect or remove the need to double skills up for full up time. but there's to much arbitrary UP and OP doffs, they all need a rebalance, an effectivness benchmark needs to be set. in my opinion, everything else needs to be brought up to the level of tech doffs, but for all the rest, 1 purple not 3 should be all you need for max effect on all the rest of the doffs. also no chance rolls on cooldown reduction ether.
I certainly wouldn't mind a PvP territory control system, where fleets would fight for control of a system, with rewards attached, and the longer a certain fleet holds control of a certain system, the larger the reward would be for both the streak of the fleet that is holding it, and for the fleet that can finally take them down. They could hold the challenges once a week so everyone knows when to be there to defend and/or attack with a max of 1 attack on a system per week with a max of 2 defenses required to hold a system.
I feel this would grow the pvp community across the board. The top-level PvP fleets would be fighting over the high reward systems trying to take each other down, while there would still be plenty of systems for fleets newer to PvP to fight over between themselves. If one of the newer fleets get good enough they will start a streak on one of the systems and draw the attention of other PvP-oriented fleets that may want to challenge for that system. It's almost like a match-making system without having to create a match-making system.
@DevolvedOne
those are part of the all energy res from neutronium and the skill tree. the skill tree skill that increases kinetic armor even adds resistance to physical, but the consoles don't but should.
beyond that, you cant spec specifically for proton or electric or physical with armor consoles, not that really anyone uses eng consoles for stuff like that anymore anyway.